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  1. #27
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,376
    How are the motor windings on this machine cooled? Via refrigerant? If so I'd be looking at the low charge perhaps contributing to the problem. Any record of discharge superheat taken?

    Surging is murder on a chiller comp and motor. What were the causes behind low chilled water flow?
    • Electricity makes refrigeration happen.
    • Refrigeration makes the HVAC psychrometric process happen.
    • HVAC pyschrometrics is what makes indoor human comfort happen...IF the ducts AND the building envelope cooperate.


    A building is NOT beautiful unless it is also comfortable.

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    East coast USA
    Posts
    1,000
    Here what i have been told from the vendor who installed the new panel.

    The panel comes from the Trane factory designed and programmed for the particular chiller on which it is placed. So, all the programming was in place and was pre-configured.

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    366
    Quote Originally Posted by dlove View Post
    Here what i have been told from the vendor who installed the new panel.

    The panel comes from the Trane factory designed and programmed for the particular chiller on which it is placed. So, all the programming was in place and was pre-configured.
    On that I will have to disagree.

    I have installed quite a few Adaptiview upgrades and there is field programming to be done.

    I will agree that the panel comes for your particular application.

    Your motor cooling could be as simple as plugged orfice on motor cooler line.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Prattville, Alabama
    Posts
    2,132
    Quote Originally Posted by triggerhappy View Post
    On that I will have to disagree.

    I have installed quite a few Adaptiview upgrades and there is field programming to be done.

    I will agree that the panel comes for your particular application.

    Your motor cooling could be as simple as plugged orfice on motor cooler line.
    Yeah, I've never heard of that either. I'm not saying it is impossible to do it. It would at the very least involve some off site building of the entire control package and then programming it, and then ensuring all pre-bound, or pre-labled devices are installed in their correct locations. The possibility of error is so high I would not try it. Even if this was done, without a laptop (with Trane's software) used to start it and verify proper operation, it was not properly commissioned, which in my opinion means it was not properly installed. Of course, this my opinion which is based on what I've read here, which I still think is not all the story.

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Prattville, Alabama
    Posts
    2,132
    Quote Originally Posted by dlove View Post
    Here what i have been told from the vendor who installed the new panel.

    The panel comes from the Trane factory designed and programmed for the particular chiller on which it is placed. So, all the programming was in place and was pre-configured.
    Does this mean the installer is not Trane Service? If so, was Trane at least involved in commissioning the panel after it was installed? Also, see my last post.

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    La.
    Posts
    284
    The motor went bad because there was less than 1 psi of difference between the evap pressure and the condenser press. The motor was not being cooled by refrigerant liquid, and the controls did not see the motor heating up because of what I would assume to be an improperly installed panel. You need to investigate the motor sensors, and if they are wired into the panel correctly. Then in the future, add tower controls to regulate the water temperature so that there will be the correct amount of refrigerant flow to the motor..

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    101
    Loss of comm with all three motor temp sensors points to a failed LLID. I had a burn out on a motor that sent high voltage back to the LLID on the sensor wire and fried the LLID. That diag. is labeled remote reset so maybe not so serious in Trane's view. What failed first the sensor or the motor?

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    East coast USA
    Posts
    1,000
    I like what Nuclrchiller said in his first post, which i saw myself and had the same thought.

    First thing I see is the "motor winding temperature sensor" diagnostics. Under UC800 it shows that for "Motor Temperature Protection Type", "75 Ohm RTDs" was selected, but under "Motor Report" there is a blank reading for all 3 "Motor Winding Temp" readings.

    So the question is. If we don't show actual winding temps, What temp would the 75 Ohm RTDs Motor Temperature Protection cut out on, at 200degs 500degs?

    But the high temp eventually did cut it off, because we did receive a latched alarm. several times.

    But i also agree with Spinning wheel, i hope to find out what the pressures, and water temps were during the last few hours it was running. If may be pressures were all out of whack, the Freon may have not been able to flow correctly. I have been told the purge count was high so from that we had air in the system.


    It is possible like Triggerhappy said, a plugged office or something preventing flow.

  9. #35
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    101
    Cut out is 265F. Your diag. is not for high temp. but for loss of comm. hence the dashes for motor temp. readings. The UC800 can't see the winding temps. I don't agree this unit tripped on high motor temp. Get someone qualified to open the data log.

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    2,088
    With all due respect to everyone in this thread...

    This is not a DIY forum and I see a lot of information being given that is most likely getting a tech tossed under a bus.

    I for one cringe at the thought of a customer that has been 'schooled' on something he has no idea about then second guessing me on a tough project.

    The original poster needs to apply for professional status if he wants to understand the ins and outs on a specific piece of machinery.

    This is obviously my opinion and opinions are like a$$holes. Take it as you see it.

  11. #37
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    East coast USA
    Posts
    1,000
    Quote Originally Posted by deltap10 View Post
    Cut out is 265F. Your diag. is not for high temp. but for loss of comm. hence the dashes for motor temp. readings. The UC800 can't see the winding temps. I don't agree this unit tripped on high motor temp. Get someone qualified to open the data log.
    Thanks deltap, I'm working on getting the data log

  12. #38
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Prattville, Alabama
    Posts
    2,132
    Your original three questions have been answered, again and again. You are wasting time, and risking further equipment damage, by attempting to diagnose the problem(s) over the internet. You should get someone qualified on site to resolve this. It also does not help that you appear to answer questions selectively.

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    East coast USA
    Posts
    1,000
    Yes you have answered my questions and thanks for that.

    I thought this was a open forum, discussing ideas? I do plan to have a Trane rep work on the issues. I would be crazy not to.

    My goal was to gather ideas to help steer me in the right direction, and everyone"s advice helped. But don't think for a minute i would take all this to the bank and from all this I'm now a chiller tech.. we all have our limits in what we know. Every now and then we need advice.

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