Trane Com4 to AX integration problem......

[ControlY0urMind]

I've got a building where I'm using the IFC com4 driver for Tridium on. I'm integrating some Voyager units along with some UCM's in a VTT configuration. There were originally CCTs (I think that's what they're called) that controlled these systems, that we ripped out.

There are UCM controllers for the terminal units, and they're also used for the bypasses.

I have found that if the bypass UCM's are set up as a bypass.....it will read static pressure, but I am not able to override the damper position via MaxFlow%.

On the flip side, if I set the UCM up as a Varitrac VAV, I can command the damper position, but it will no longer read static pressure.

All in all, I have static pressure control set up in my JACE, and I wanted to use it to control the bypass.

As a hail mary, I opted to try dual UCM's with one set up as a bypass that reads the static, and the second set up as a Varitrac VAV which is wired to the damper acuator, in which I control the damper position....

Half the time, the UCM that reads static will actually read it and the other half, it will read zero. I've verified that air IS moving when this occurs. (This is another problem I'm working on.)

I'd rather use only one UCM, and my question is, has anyone ever done/heard of an integration like this? I'm by far not a Trane guy, and want to keep it that way, but want to make this system work.

I'm also bound to com4. If I could, I would have thrown in another brand actuator and tied it to my Tridium I/O module and called it a day.

Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated!

[scrooloose]

What changes to make it read and not read? Is it random, or does it go to zero in certain situation?

Do you have it set as static or velocity. (Maybe that is just in the older systems when its not a communicating bypass)

[willf650]

I did exactly what you are talking about 2-3 years ago. I will see if I can find my backup to see what I did. I have to warn you my computer has died two or three times since then and my backups got corrupted on my backup drive when I needed a station back up.

Something makes me think there was a function block in the Com4 palette called bypass damper command. The driver I used was not from infocon. When I talked with the infocon guys and mentioned my previous issues with a com4 driver they said that they bought the driver from the company and rewrote/fixed it. That function block my very well be in your pallete.

I remember for a fact that the bypass remained configured as a bypass and I was commanding the damper position directly.

[ControlY0urMind]

I did exactly what you are talking about 2-3 years ago. I will see if I can find my backup to see what I did. I have to warn you my computer has died two or three times since then and my backups got corrupted on my backup drive when I needed a station back up.

Something makes me think there was a function block in the Com4 palette called bypass damper command. The driver I used was not from infocon. When I talked with the infocon guys and mentioned my previous issues with a com4 driver they said that they bought the driver from the company and rewrote/fixed it. That function block my very well be in your pallete.

I remember for a fact that the bypass remained configured as a bypass and I was commanding the damper position directly.

This driver does not have anything other than the driver, Comfour Device Folder and a ComFour Point Folder in the palette. Everything else is built in. There's a "Flow Override" Enum point that can be found in the bypass, but it doesn't seem to work. Changing the "MaxFlowSpt" % also doesn't seem to work, but it does when the device is set to an application other than bypass.

I have not contacted who I got the driver from, simply because I believe the use of the driver is intended for people with a decent knowledge of Trane's proprietary stuff, which fairly new to their stuff.

I think I will end up saying the hell with it and asking for some assistance.

[dlhvac]

when you bring the points into niagara before you name it look at the facets it says which enum you must write for each voyager function use the ax communtiy jar found online
because you need to write 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 i believe if i remember 6, 7 are stage 1-2 heat
3,4 are cool 1-2 1, fan off 2 fan continuos but when you bring the point in from being discovered it gives you the facets you need to do a boolean to enum switch setup to get all the functions took me alittle while the first time

[dlhvac]

also if you cant read the temp sensors try bringing the voyager in as a different voyager either 1, 2 or3 1 is for old style single board 2, and 3 are reliatel boards

[dlhvac]

ps on the serial port setup in the intermessage delay set it to 20 milliseconds on all infocon drivers ( did the beta testing on the comm3 driver works great)

[dlhvac]

I've got a building where I'm using the IFC com4 driver for Tridium on. I'm integrating some Voyager units along with some UCM's in a VTT configuration. There were originally CCTs (I think that's what they're called) that controlled these systems, that we ripped out.

There are UCM controllers for the terminal units, and they're also used for the bypasses.

I have found that if the bypass UCM's are set up as a bypass.....it will read static pressure, but I am not able to override the damper position via MaxFlow%.

On the flip side, if I set the UCM up as a Varitrac VAV, I can command the damper position, but it will no longer read static pressure.

All in all, I have static pressure control set up in my JACE, and I wanted to use it to control the bypass.

As a hail mary, I opted to try dual UCM's with one set up as a bypass that reads the static, and the second set up as a Varitrac VAV which is wired to the damper acuator, in which I control the damper position....

Half the time, the UCM that reads static will actually read it and the other half, it will read zero. I've verified that air IS moving when this occurs. (This is another problem I'm working on.)

I'd rather use only one UCM, and my question is, has anyone ever done/heard of an integration like this? I'm by far not a Trane guy, and want to keep it that way, but want to make this system work.

I'm also bound to com4. If I could, I would have thrown in another brand actuator and tied it to my Tridium I/O module and called it a day.

Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated!

This is what the 20 ms intermessage delay fixes

[gmcmickle]

I am preparing to do a similar project. Can you give an update on how yours ended up working?

[dlhvac]

worked well have done a bunch since then 12 or 13

[dlhvac]

I am preparing to do a similar project. Can you give an update on how yours ended up working?

worked very well have done 12 to date

[gmcmickle]

worked very well have done 12 to date

Thanks for your reply dllhvac. I am looking at how to tackle a job that has 4 CCPII VVT systems and one Reliatel/TCI card RTU all tied into one BCU. Two of the CCPs have 6 VAVs each, the other two CCPs have 4 VAVs each. My thought was to use a Jace 2 with I/O and Comm4 driver to replace each CCP. Then pull the stand alone RTU into a nearby Jace2. If you have done something similar, would you be willing to send an AX backup station file so I could look at it?

I sent an information request to ControlsPlus Solutions who appears to now own the infotech Comm4 driver. I have not yet heard back from them. Have you dealt with this company since they took over the driver?

[dlhvac]

Maxline drivers owms the comm4 driver infocon sold the driver division go them but has a contract for 10 years to provide support

[dlhvac]

Sorry but i dont give away stations that ive done but it is doable to integrate all that you stated

[gmcmickle]

Sorry but i dont give away stations that ive done but it is doable to integrate all that you stated

Thanks again for your help. I'm thinking the Jace 2 with comm4 driver may be the best solution. So if I needed support for the driver after purchase, I would contact infocon?

[gmcmickle]

dll, does the comm4 driver allow the jace to see all the points the customer would be accustomed to seeing through their old Tracer Summit front end? For example, the fan status of the RTU on a CCP?

[gmcmickle]

dllhvac, can you tell me what the range and output is of the Trane Velocity/Static pressure sensor is? I realize the sensor can output either velocity or static pressure based on a 90 degree rotation. I just can't find the voltage and velocity or static range. I tried searching around with no results.

[dlhvac]

the sensor has the output rating right on it i cannot recall offhand but the bypass damper cannot be controlled by the jace you must replace this controller with another the ccp panel previously controlled the bypass the new touch screen tracker has a comm4 communicating bypass damper that can be discovered and set

[dlhvac]

the sensor has the output rating right on it i cannot recall offhand but the bypass damper cannot be controlled by the jace you must replace this controller with another the ccp panel previously controlled the bypass the new touch screen tracker has a comm4 communicating bypass damper that can be discovered and set

i use an infocon easyio 30p or a spyder micro

[gmcmickle]

i use an infocon easyio 30p or a spyder micro

My CCP system is the older CCPII which uses a remote discharge air temp sensor, duct static sensor, and bypass damper actuator. I believe it's the newer CCPIII that has the communicating UCM (Trane VAV UCM) controlling the bypass and reading the sensors. My thought was I would just pick up the signal from the existing static sensor, but I couldn't find a spec sheet on it, so I will probably just install my own.