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Topic Review (Newest First)

  • 11-05-2012, 11:08 PM
    Budlight-Electric
    Forgot to mention that I don't have any EOL's mounted at any end because it made things slow and then unstable, and because I'm using a Johnson FX60 as the only master Johnson recommended we use there 24volt powered EOL's which made things worse so somehow it worked out the best open. The furthest wire run on the Belden is 350 feet.
  • 11-05-2012, 11:00 PM
    Budlight-Electric
    So I have that whole system running that started this original thread, the only thing complaint is that the BACnet MSTP speed seems somewhat slow. for example it could take 1-3 minutes to shut a fan down on one of the 6 Johnson freq drives.
  • 04-29-2012, 07:58 PM
    kontrolphreak
    No, Reliable Controls.
    Their new MACH-ProZone and Smart Space Controller.
    Andover has something similar and KMC has auto MAC addressing.

    kontrol out
  • 04-29-2012, 07:44 PM
    xarralu
    Quote Originally Posted by kontrolphreak View Post
    Their latest rev of BACnet controllers don't even require this, took a leaf from the LON world and they default to their serial number until you set a MAC address and device instance, so install, record S#, location and power up, auto-baud as well. The gap is closing.

    kontrol out
    Damn, that is slick. This is KMC your still talking about?
  • 04-29-2012, 04:37 PM
    exwtk
    Quote Originally Posted by lonboy View Post
    No way would I ever consider an archaic technology such as MS/TP
    you must be lucky to have that option.
    I don't have the luxury of deciding which protocol will be used
    i would be out of business if I only consider jobs that have my preferred protocol !!
  • 04-28-2012, 01:23 AM
    kontrolphreak
    What are we wagering and what is the bet?
    That you can implement a LON system better then me -> you win.
    That I can implement a BACnet system better then you -> I win.
    Which system is "better" -> unquantifiable, no one wins.
    How many LON controllers on your largest HVAC network. I have worked on a couple of projects with over 3K BACnet controllers and 90% of them resided on an MSTP bus with no issues.
    Been working with Reliable Controls lately, reverse polarity on a the comm buss and only that controller does not show up, none of this OMG the whole network will crash if you reverse the polarity. Duplicate MAC address, one controller will take it's sweet *ss time coming online (which is a great indication you have duplicate MAC address), none of this OMG the whole network will crash if you have duplicate MAC address. Duplicate device instance same as duplicate MAC address. All running at 78.8kbs. Only difference is I have to address the controllers before they are brought online. Their latest rev of BACnet controllers don't even require this, took a leaf from the LON world and they default to their serial number until you set a MAC address and device instance, so install, record S#, location and power up, auto-baud as well. The gap is closing.

    kontrol out
  • 04-28-2012, 12:41 AM
    BACnet
    It is interesting to me that the one thing that allowed BACnet to become the most widely adopted BAS protocol is the one thing that it is attacked for.

    Rs485 is never going to compare with cat6 gigabit speeds. But then again, rs485 has has been used and accepted by manufacturers for 30 or so years now. Embracing rs485 as one possible method (the slowest by the way) of BACnet communications is arguably what allowed BACnet to become the dominant protocol in just over a decade.

    Of course there are 3 other methods of BACnet comms, all of which are faster than rs485. And yes, rs485 does require color-coded wires because it is polarity sensitive. But let's be honest here. BACnet works on gigabit connections and it also works on 19.2kbps connections. But they all talk together automatically. And that's why BACnet won the protocol wars. Not because it adopted the fastest comms (which it did with BACnet/IP) but because it also adapted the lowly rs485 comms as part of the portfolio.

  • 04-28-2012, 12:14 AM
    lonboy
    Oh and let's not forget ft10 speed and through-put also vastly superior to ms/tp
  • 04-28-2012, 12:09 AM
    lonboy
    Ya, i limit my control networks to fewer issues.
    Plus free topology, noise immunity, and way longer segment lengths
    You wanna have a wager?
    Ft10 vs ms/tp?

    You must love Backnet time and material jobs
    Lb out
  • 04-27-2012, 11:40 PM
    kontrolphreak
    Good that you limit yourself, wouldn't want you getting in over your head, keep to the simple polarity insensitive technology it appears a + and - might confuse you.

    kontrol out
  • 04-27-2012, 11:11 PM
    lonboy
    Sorry to hijack your thread but I couldn't resist...

    Ft-10 is polarity insensitive = electrician friendly! Us Lonboys don't have these issues.

    No way would I ever consider an archaic technology such as MS/TP

    Good luck BACknetters,
    lb
  • 04-25-2012, 06:28 PM
    azzad
    I have just read through this thread and I got caught out with the exact same thing with the modbus card on the Johnson/Eaton VFD. The + and - terminals are back to front.

    I worked it out whils connected directly to it with my laptopo and 485 convertor.

    Dazza
  • 04-24-2012, 04:00 PM
    Budlight-Electric
    It is a breakthough lol but I talked to the techs at Eaton and they said that these are only slaves, I'm looking at the points now in Fx commpro but I can't get any live readings so I still have some work ahead of me, the Walker head end doesn't provide any tool type to work with , commision or live feed any of the points so I've been trying to use Inneasoft but I think might buy the Chipkin product.
  • 04-24-2012, 03:45 PM
    BACnet
    If I understand you correctly, all of your issues have been solved by switching the rs485 polarity? That's great news!

    You can probably take them out of slave mode and put them into master mode, but I don't see any pressing reason to do so. So long as you can read & write to these units your network seems to be healthy and happy.
  • 04-24-2012, 03:32 PM
    Budlight-Electric
    One thing I just noticed is the drawing on the door has the wrong polarity so now I can only talk to the drives with johnsons FX commpro only but still no discovery cuz they are slaves.
  • 04-23-2012, 08:51 PM
    Budlight-Electric
    I have the manuals from Johnson and Vacon they are both really vague and the BACnet portion is new to them
  • 04-23-2012, 06:34 PM
    amigo
    well simsd says that he has worked with these drives before, so may be he can tell us if this thing is a master or slave, so we can put that fact to bed.

    The pic statement of the card says that it implements the master data layer, unless I am reading it wrong. It ceratinly does not seem to be behaving like a master.
  • 04-23-2012, 06:10 PM
    hvac69
    The manual for the BACnet card is vague as hell and the drive manual has no mention of BACnet.
  • 04-23-2012, 04:52 PM
    BACnet
    I hope you didn't see my post as undermining your comments- they are good thoughts!

    I was relying on post #3 where he stated that the diagram was right. But you are absolutely correct to point out that it might not be exactly that way, even if he thinks it to be!

    I'm hoping someone posts a manual soon. I'm dying to know what "message from master missing" (post #14) means to this drive.
  • 04-23-2012, 04:48 PM
    Arpoc926
    Obviously, BACnet, I defer to your expertise. I was concerned that the network architecture might be other than what is represented in the diagram you supplied. If, in fact, the OP had an alternate architecture, but was unaware due to lack of familiarity, reconfiguration of the router to act as a BBMD would both establish connectivity, and diagnose the difference in network architecture from what was expected.

    -http://www.bsubas.com
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