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I am a dealer for daikin if you want a really good class go to the one in California. More info is provided and its more in depth.

Originally Posted by tech45

Maybe it's just who we deal with but the Mitsu service tool is like 300 bucks and the Daikin was some incredible dollar ammount.

The Daikin service tool also works as a stand alone data logger, comes with an external rechargeable battery pack, and has a variety of plugs for testing any of the sensors in the system.
For $300, I'm guessing the Mitsubishi one is just an interface between the equipment and a PC.

I'd rather Daikin made one that is just a PC to equipment interface. I don't really need the sensor test functions, and I can just leave a cheap laptop on site to data log for a couple of days. I've got a netbook paperweight that would be perfect for that.

Fujitsu has the right idea. Their PC to equipment interface is just a cable and some software, very slick looking software.

For real. But reading the litterature for the equipment would be no fun if these were US products , lol.

Always entertaining...

I'm pretty good at translating Engrish to English in real time, but I do occasionally have to stop and reread stuff.
I haven't installed any of the equipment from actual Chinese manufacturers, but I've read the installation and service manuals for some, and found it WAY worse than the ones from the Japanese manufacturers.

Originally Posted by ryan1088

Mark, have you been to the Daikin service class in Dallas? Boss was researching sending us to it.

It's only a 30-45 minute drive for me, so I've been to the installation and troubleshooting classes for everything but the Altherma system.

Originally Posted by mark beiser

As opposed to what?
The maybe 5-7 years you get out of most of the usual light commercial equipment before it starts going to crap?

If US residential and light commercial HVAC equipment manufacturers were doing much more than just adding fancy controls to 50+ year old technology, based on nearly 100 year old design principles, this thread probably wouldn't have a picture of Japanese made VRF outdoor units in it...

X2

Mark, have you been to the Daikin service class in Dallas? Boss was researching sending us to it.

Maybe it's just who we deal with but the Mitsu service tool is like 300 bucks and the Daikin was some incredible dollar ammount.

If US residential and light commercial HVAC equipment manufacturers were doing much more than just adding fancy controls to 50+ year old technology, based on nearly 100 year old design principles, this thread probably wouldn't have a picture of Japanese made VRF outdoor units in it...

For real. But reading the litterature for the equipment would be no fun if these were US products , lol.

As opposed to what?
The maybe 5-7 years you get out of most of the usual light commercial equipment before it starts going to crap?

If US residential and light commercial HVAC equipment manufacturers were doing much more than just adding fancy controls to 50+ year old technology, based on nearly 100 year old design principles, this thread probably wouldn't have a picture of Japanese made VRF outdoor units in it...

in ten years those p o s units will be junk . support the usa.

Originally Posted by grkmano

I Dont work on them enough to buy the tool yet.. but if more calls come in for them I have to lay out the money for it.

On Daikin systems you can do sort of a gheto service tool with one of their navigation controllers(programmable thermostat).
It won't do much, or look at the whole system at once of there are multiple groups of indoor units on the same system, but you can at least see the saturated temperatures of the refrigerant, and thermistor readings for all of the indoor units within the group you have it connected to.

If Mitsubishi has a similar thermostat, its worth a couple hundred bucks to get you by until you are ready to spend >$2000 for the service tool and software.

I'm guessing you have already figured out that there is little to nothing to be learned from hooking gauges up to one.

I Dont work on them enough to buy the tool yet.. but if more calls come in for them I have to lay out the money for it.

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Originally Posted by grkmano

Mark got it. System is amazing

I just wish Daikin and Mitsubishi didn't charge so damn much for the service tool to interface between the equipment and a laptop.
I'm not sure what all the Mitsubishi service tool can do, but for the price someone mentioned to me, I'm guessing it can be left connected, without a computer connected, to data log like the Daikin Service Checker can.
Does it also have plugs to test sensors and such?

Fujitsu just recently came to the US market with their VRF systems. No service tool needed, you use a special cable to connect a laptop directly to the communications buss, and the software automatically shows a graphical layout of what is connected to the system!

Mark got it. System is amazing just sucks how building engineers take care of there things .. I asked him who and why it was put there and he said cause he didn't want to put it against the wall.. he said beside the unit has warranty of anything happens. I said not after these pictures.. he got so mad at me.

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I've had to replace the outdoor coil on a Daikin VRV II system because the grounds keeping crew decided the equipment corral was a good place to store stuff. A shovel got tossed over the fence into one.
I'm guessing Mitsubishi doesn't charge any less for theirs than Daikin does, and that it is just as much of a PITA to replace.

Originally Posted by fenian

Whose condensers are those? Never seen them before. Are they twinned together normally?

They are Mitsubishi City Multi VRF units.

They are 3 individual variable capacity machines, each with multiple indoor units.
Each system has a single piping system, that runs from the outdoor unit to a box inside, that then has piping to the indoor units.
If they are heat pump systems with heat recovery, they can do simultaneous heating and cooling of different zones by using the heat absorbed to cool some areas to heat other areas. The outdoor coil will run in either heating or cooling to make up the difference in what is needed.

I don't know the Mitsubishi system that well, but like Daikin VRV systems, I believe the outdoor units can be manifolded together to make one larger system.

Whose condensers are those? Never seen them before. Are they twinned together normally?

nothing new about a load of crap being stored around the condensers, that isn't bad compared to......

So sad to

See this marble crushing the condenser coil..


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