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The only problem is as long as this person is in your organization your backs going to hurt. Because your going to have to carry him for the next 5 years or so. I just wish bosses would suck it up and pay their experienced personnel what there worth!!!!

Ask yourself one question:

Given the opportunity to hire other candidates, would hire this person. Unfortunately you're not sellin' me on this one. With that in mind, you can only do so much as the rest will be up to him.

Originally Posted by simux

Hey chris the only problem with your statement is people without controls experience think that more bodies equal more work. They think if they put someone with you that the magical controls dust will rub off on them.

Working for a Mechanical with a Controls division now and believe me I can relate to what you are saying..... Now if I could only find that Easy Button that they talk about, life would be mo better.

I don't think it's possible to train this guy in a year. There's just no way. Even someone with the necessary drive and intelligence would have a hard time being competent in only a year. 2 to 3 years depending on the person.

Totally understand that KontrolPhreak, bosses think that someone's going to walk off the street and be good to go. I've seen people leave a company and the boss tries to convince everyone that were better off without them. At that point I'd like to help the boss "Get run over by a bus"

When the boss asks me this I tell him he better catch the bus driver as he will probably looking for a job after running me over.

kontrol out

Hey chris the only problem with your statement is people without controls experience think that more bodies equal more work. They think if they put someone with you that the magical controls dust will rub off on them.

Originally Posted by simux

Totally understand the eye twitch and chest pains. I've been told that were going to give you some bodies to install control systems. Then they expect that these newbies are going to automatically make you more productive. "Well you have two more guys so you should be getting twice as much work done now." You'll never be able to explain how long it takes to train a controls guy?????

When asked "How long is this gonna take?" I always answer with it depends on what your giving me this time

I would rather be ran over by the bus some days. I am thinking it would hurt less.

Totally understand the eye twitch and chest pains. I've been told that were going to give you some bodies to install control systems. Then they expect that these newbies are going to automatically make you more productive. "Well you have two more guys so you should be getting twice as much work done now." You'll never be able to explain how long it takes to train a controls guy?????

at least you got a guy to carry your stuff around

Thanks for the input guys, it confirms why my eye began twitching and the tightness in my chest after the meeting.

Originally Posted by simux

When it applies to Control Technicians I always use the 80 - 20 rule. In my experience only 20% of the people who try to make it in controls have the desire. It takes a smart, driven, obsessive, and motivated person who hates to be defeated. The type of person who feels like the real learning starts after they get off work. The person who has a complete mock control system in their garage. Someone who reads multiple books on motors and motor controls, electrical fundamentals, refigeration, boilers, etc...Someone who reads HVAC-TALK

Couldn't have said it better !!!

When it applies to Control Technicians I always use the 80 - 20 rule. In my experience only 20% of the people who try to make it in controls have the desire. It takes a smart, driven, obsessive, and motivated person who hates to be defeated. The type of person who feels like the real learning starts after they get off work. The person who has a complete mock control system in their garage. Someone who reads multiple books on motors and motor controls, electrical fundamentals, refigeration, boilers, etc...Someone who reads HVAC-TALK

Wow training? My first day I was given some books, an ancient laptop and a set of drawings with an address.

I agree that letting him get is hands on this stuff is the best approach. I remember when I was in training, the guy that trained me just wanted me to sit over his shoulder and watch and I would get so bored that I would start getting sleepy and would have to get up and walk around to stay awake but when he started letting me drive is when I really started to learn. I also think it is a good idea to let him spend a few weeks on a construction site helping guys pull wire so that he can get a feel of how the wiring is done because there is nothing worse than facing a communications issue and not knowing how these things are wired up. All that being said it is also going to take some initiative on his part, controls is not a 8hr a day job, it is a 24hr 7 days a week job. When I was training someone I would let them drive up until I realized I better get in there if we wanted to go home on time that day.

Originally Posted by exwtk

i can tell you right now that you were given the wrong candidate !!

The successful, candidate, will spent thousands of hours of personal, unpaid time trying to learn the trade on his own and will use you, his mentor, only in case he gets stuck and needs to know which way to go.

Anyone who has to be spoon fed to this trade will fail very quickly once on his own !!

My thoughts and feelings exactly. The learning curve on this stuff is more like cliff climbing, sometimes you go up and backwards at the same time.

Thanks guys for your input so far. The 10,000 foot view is a different way of starting. In the past, the training and mentoring I have been involved in always started at the bottom with install basics and up from there. It has always been hard for me when things start coming off the rails and deadline are coming up fast to not just grab the wheel and drive. I guess it was about 2-3 years before they would “turn out”, but that included structured training in-house and offsite. A point I tried to make to everyone involved is getting someone to do what I do is a matter of time, commitment, and passion. I believe it is a career change, a new trade. At least if the goal is to do my job and not just understand controls. Another concern is resources both in-house and external were not consulted before this got rolling or even thrown out on the table. We may not be dealing with reality on reality’s terms here.

i can tell you right now that you were given the wrong candidate !!

The successful, candidate, will spent thousands of hours of personal, unpaid time trying to learn the trade on his own and will use you, his mentor, only in case he gets stuck and needs to know which way to go.

Anyone who has to be spoon fed to this trade will fail very quickly once on his own !!

The Boss "what if you get hit by a bus"

Me "Heres a list of guys on HVAC-Talk I would recommend"