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Bonding of the different systems in a building are done close to the electrical service. A gas appliance that utilizes electrical is a crossing point for two of the systems that are required to be bonded to the service. I have seen techs bond the furnace to the gas pipe but I really think it a problem for two reasons. If one of the systems does become accidentally energized there will be a parallel path to the electrical grounding system. When the system is not energized the bonding jumper from the electrical bond in the furnace to the gas piping system will provide a path for circulating currents between the two systems... these currents can cause problems in the long term. In the event of an energized gas piping system the current will flow to the system with the least impedance which more than likely will be the electrical system... thereby, sending the current from the gas pipe to the electrical system at the connection point in the furnace which will have less amperage capacity than the main bonding jumper that will be sized for the size of the service entrance cable. Odds are the ground/bonding wire that is sized for the breaker that is feeding the furnace will be damaged and could go undetected causing safety issues and other problems at a later date. I have done services in commercial buildings where the gas comes in one end of the building and the electrical service comes in the other end of the building... with a 600 amp service it gets expensive running a 1/0 bare copper wire the length of a 300 foot building just so you can get from the gas meter to the electrical service.

Originally Posted by WyrTwister

Where I live , in the southern USA , it is not done . The gas utility does not allow it .

The old " cold water ground " is often not used , for fear of electrolysis .

Years and years ago , we had an inspector that was happy if all you had was a ground rod . He did not care about anything else . He has long past on to his reward .

On commercial work , you had better read the specifications .

God bless
Wyr

Gas bonding is required throughout the country. The underground gas piping can not be used as a grounding electrode. T prevent this the main gas cock at the meter is a dielectric fitting isolating the underground line from the structure.
250.104
(B) Other Metal Piping. If installed in, or attached to, a building or structure, a metal piping system(s), including gas piping, that is likely to become energized shall be bonded to the service equipment enclosure; the grounded conductor at the service; the grounding electrode conductor, if of sufficient size; or to one or more grounding electrodes used. The bonding conductor(s) or jumper(s) shall be sized in accordance with 250.122, using the rating of the circuit that is likely to energize the piping system(s). The equipment grounding conductor for the circuit that is likely to energize the piping shall be permitted to serve as the bonding means. The points of attachment of the bonding jumper(s) shall be accessible.

250.52 (B)
(B) Not Permitted for Use as Grounding Electrodes. The following systems and materials shall not be used as grounding electrodes:

(1) Metal underground gas piping systems

(2) Aluminum

Where I live , in the southern USA , it is not done . The gas utility does not allow it .

The old " cold water ground " is often not used , for fear of electrolysis .

Years and years ago , we had an inspector that was happy if all you had was a ground rod . He did not care about anything else . He has long past on to his reward .

On commercial work , you had better read the specifications .

God bless
Wyr

Sufficient for bonding the furnace, but not sufficient for the CSST.

I'm sure that's what you meant.

Originally Posted by maniak

When we change out furnaces I used to see the electrician bond the gas line to either the water line or back to the panel. Lately they haven't been doing it.
1. Why would they not do this anymore?
2. Is bonding of steel gas lines still required if the utility service line is plastic coming out of the ground?

Thanks.

250.104(B)
(B) Other Metal Piping. If installed in, or attached to, a building or structure, a metal piping system(s), including gas piping, that is likely to become energized shall be bonded to the service equipment enclosure; the grounded conductor at the service; the grounding electrode conductor, if of sufficient size; or to one or more grounding electrodes used. The bonding conductor(s) or jumper(s) shall be sized in accordance with 250.122, using the rating of the circuit that is likely to energize the piping system(s) The equipment grounding conductor for the circuit that is likely to energize the piping shall be permitted to serve as the bonding means.[/COLOR] The points of attachment of the bonding jumper(s) shall be accessible.

The equipment grounding conductor for the circuit that is likely to energize the piping SHALL BE PERMITTED TO SERVE AS THE BONDING MEANS. This will eventually be removed due to new testing of the bonding methods for CSST showing that the # 14 grounding wire is insufficient for bonding the furnace.

Originally Posted by jtrammel

Probably because its more difficicult and more expensive to get the proper permits in Canada lots of work is done without a permit, like in the US.

But who is doing the work? Since ALL of the electricians, gas fitters, HVAC guys have to be pulling permits, or lose their licenses?

Are all of those homes that Holmes takes apart built by itinerant "first nation" gypsies, homes built without inspections?

Naaaah.

Originally Posted by timebuilder

Which is why I posted what I did.

In the US, grounding and bonding are ELECTRICAL standards. In Canada, all bets are off.

Somehow, with all of the licensing and difficulty in gaining permissions from the government to do various jobs, Mike Holmes still gets hundreds of letters a month with plumbing, electrical, HVAC, and a host of other issues. With all those licensing and permit folks working on the provincial level, all of the work in every home should be 100%.

Right?

Probably because its more difficicult and more expensive to get the proper permits in Canada lots of work is done without a permit, like in the US.

Originally Posted by turkey

In Ontario it's not the electricians responsibility it's on the gas tech to do it

Which is why I posted what I did.

In the US, grounding and bonding are ELECTRICAL standards. In Canada, all bets are off.

Somehow, with all of the licensing and difficulty in gaining permissions from the government to do various jobs, Mike Holmes still gets hundreds of letters a month with plumbing, electrical, HVAC, and a host of other issues. With all those licensing and permit folks working on the provincial level, all of the work in every home should be 100%.

Right?

In Ontario it's not the electricians responsibility it's on the gas tech to do it

Originally Posted by maniak

Just checked my own house (5 yrs old) and the gas line is not bonded. Thanks for the info guys, looks like I'm going to have a chat with an electrician.

Some of that is going to depend on when the plans were approved.

However, you are in Canada, and Canada has a very nationalistic bent, which I know well, being my dad was a Mountie.

Canada without any doubt has developed their OWN standard for electrical installation, and while some of it may mimic the US-based NEC, published by the NFPA, there are very different approaches to be taken in each country to accomplish the desired results.

For that reason, I would research the parallel standards used in the Dominion and your particular Province, and THEN talk to an electrician.

It just may be that bonding gas lines is not one of the things they do in your area, so do the homework first.

Just checked my own house (5 yrs old) and the gas line is not bonded. Thanks for the info guys, looks like I'm going to have a chat with an electrician.

Check out article 250. Gas lines are considered to be "other piping." They must be bonded.

Bonding is still required.

Bonding Gas Lines

When we change out furnaces I used to see the electrician bond the gas line to either the water line or back to the panel. Lately they haven't been doing it.
1. Why would they not do this anymore?
2. Is bonding of steel gas lines still required if the utility service line is plastic coming out of the ground?

Thanks.