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Originally Posted by jmac00 you seem to forget, Chinese Communist Party is subsidizing their EV market. If the CCP deems it necessary, they will give EV cars away, just to hurt Musk, and the rest of the world. I watched a couple EV videos of a guy comparing his Tesla to a Toyoda and they money came out to virtually the same. the surprising part was he completely left out how long charging took. It seems he always charged over night, at home. At no time did he say "im out of charge, and need to find a supercharger" which tells me, he never tried to push the limits of the Tesla/ I suspect the EV is a great city car, not a great distance, cross country car. OR... the person that made the video... Thinks of him/her self... as a: Social influencer A SI (see above)... is a new, cool, occupation... Where all you do is make videos, post on forums, and post on social media... Pushing a narrative! There are literally thousands of folks across the USA... Making a living ($$$) doing this... Now if anyone really thinks those videos and posts are voluntarily 100% accurate... I have some lakeside property in SE Georgia (state) I would like to sell you!
Originally Posted by jmac00 you seem to forget, Chinese Communist Party is subsidizing their EV market. If the CCP deems it necessary, they will give EV cars away, just to hurt Musk, and the rest of the world. I watched a couple EV videos of a guy comparing his Tesla to a Toyoda and they money came out to virtually the same. the surprising part was he completely left out how long charging took. It seems he always charged over night, at home. At no time did he say "im out of charge, and need to find a supercharger" which tells me, he never tried to push the limits of the Tesla/ I suspect the EV is a great city car, not a great distance, cross country car. (1) You’re not seeing the big picture which is Tesla has disrupted the Auto industry leading to an accelerated adaption to BEV vehicles thus fulfilling their mission statement which again is……. “Our mission is to accelerate the world’s transition to sustainable energy.“ If the Chinese government discounts BEV ownership then this will reduce ICE vehicles which again align with Tesla’s mission. I don’t think you have to worry about Tesla hurting from competition but rather the legacy manufacturers like GMC will face a challenging future. (2) Please share the video of the comparison of total cost of ownership Tesla vs Toyota. My personal BEV experience is that I stand to save enough money on petroleum fuel to pay for my electric motorcycle outright but I do get a part subsidy from my employer by being allowed to charge at work.
Originally Posted by ESokoloff We’ll seeings how Tesla's mission statement is [“to accelerate the world's transition to sustainable energy.” This mission reflects the company's commitment to helping lead a global shift away from fossil fuels and towards renewable forms of energy] I would say Tesla wins in the long run even if they fall behind. you seem to forget, Chinese Communist Party is subsidizing their EV market. If the CCP deems it necessary, they will give EV cars away, just to hurt Musk, and the rest of the world. I watched a couple EV videos of a guy comparing his Tesla to a Toyoda and they money came out to virtually the same. the surprising part was he completely left out how long charging took. It seems he always charged over night, at home. At no time did he say "im out of charge, and need to find a supercharger" which tells me, he never tried to push the limits of the Tesla/ I suspect the EV is a great city car, not a great distance, cross country car.
Thank god it didn't land in the water. Originally Posted by jmac00 amazing, still not buying one, LOL thank god it ended up on its wheels. Thats a plus
Originally Posted by ESokoloff Let’s look at a real world example of Tesla safety. https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/03/us/te...cec/index.html [SPOILER ALERT] There was no fire ball at the end like an ICE likely would have produced. amazing, still not buying one, LOL thank god it ended up on its wheels. Thats a plus
Originally Posted by jmac00 after watching the videos, I am still not convinced anyone would survive a 100+ mph head on crash like ours, in a EV. A young lady* crossed a double yellow line, into our lane and hit us in a "offset front end crash" Our pick-up truck did exactly what the engineers designed it to do, push the frontend down and away from the passengers. If there had been no engine, I have no doubt we would have died. Your video shows the offset crash at what? 40 mph? now lets pretend that 'block of cement' it crashed into was another vehicle going 55mph? that would be an impact of 95mph. Do you honestly believe, you would survive that impact in EV of a offset front end crash and rolled three times? What happens if the EV then catches fire............your toast even if you survive the crash. *lady* = about a year later we found out the *lady* was convicted of drug possession, check writing fraud, illegal possession of a firearm, tax evasion and counterfeiting. We now assume she was running from someone when she lost control and plowed into us. I was doing 55mph, The police estimate she was over 55mph at impact. Let’s look at a real world example of Tesla safety. https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/03/us/te...cec/index.html [SPOILER ALERT] There was no fire ball at the end like an ICE likely would have produced.
Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech I read about a year ago... That Musk is privately working on a hydrogen ICE engine... So even Musk knows pure EV's are not practical... Rather... a fad... I read it on the Internet…… It HAS to be true.
Originally Posted by Poodle Head Mikey Well; that's not MY point. <g> We have people, Americans, living in tents and under bridges and begging on the streets - in America. They all need jobs That They Can Do - which would make Their lives a whole lot greener. That's my primary green-interest. PHM ------- come across the southern border, and you will "have it made". Free everything, Plus, an illegal can carry a firearm? NOT KIDDING. the big bonus of course is the free health care.
Well; that's not MY point. <g> Although electric city-cars, trucks, and buses Would make living, working, and visiting cities much 'greener'. In the sense that all the smoke, smell and dirt provided by ICE vehicles wouldn't be assaulting me every time I'm there. <g> My answer to 'how to charge them' is to start mining and burning coal. <g> Because, ahead of all this green stuff, save the planet! stuff, and etc. is my interest in supplying jobs for people who need them. Most especially the stupid - of which there are many. 10% of Americans are naturally too stupid to function anywhere in the US military. That's about 35,000,000 people. And that number is greater when we include those who become stupid and/or disabled in that regard by various means. The first group, or those who join them via a developed disability, aren't going to "learn to code" or "be re-trained for new technology" or any of the other mealy-mouthed horseshet that gets said when the question is asked. We have people, Americans, living in tents and under bridges and begging on the streets - in America. They all need jobs That They Can Do - which would make Their lives a whole lot greener. That's my primary green-interest. PHM ------- Originally Posted by Fla.HP The point is all this EV garbage is supposed to be much greener... And I don't see that at all... How is it supposed to make things better? You have to dig holes in the ground to get the lithium and the cobalt... Then you have to worry about the disposal of such after its life is over. And you still have to charge the damn things... Where are we supposed to get all of this energy to charge all these EVs from?? And the grid is no where near ready for loads like that. I don't hate EV cars... I hate the lithium within them. We can do a lot better.
Originally Posted by Space Racer True, once the battery pack gets dented, the car is totaled. But when it comes to safety, Teslas are terrific. Tesla Safety Rating: Everything You Need to Know Nov 29, 2020 . As you browse cars for sale, safety is likely on your mind. But which makes and models offer the safest driving experience? Well, you definitely can’t lose by looking at Tesla, especially their Model S. Their cars are so safe that the crash testing gear breaks before they do. . Why Tesla's Model 3 Received A 5-Star Crash Test Rating https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=il2jmMRgFV8... Is Tesla the Safest Car? Tesla definitely makes some of the safest cars on the road today. Since 2013 when the Model S broke the crash test equipment, they have been earning top ratings from the NHTSA. Beyond that, the IIHS gave the 2019 Model 3 its Top Safety Pick+ award for its excellent crash test performance. Why is Tesla So Safe? Tesla vehicles are safe because of their rigid structure and high-tech safety equipment. The lack of a combustion engine at the front helps as well by maximizing its crumple zones. The forces then go through the car instead of its occupants to help prevent injuries. https://www.vehiclehistory.com/artic...u-need-to-know after watching the videos, I am still not convinced anyone would survive a 100+ mph head on crash like ours, in a EV. A young lady* crossed a double yellow line, into our lane and hit us in a "offset front end crash" Our pick-up truck did exactly what the engineers designed it to do, push the frontend down and away from the passengers. If there had been no engine, I have no doubt we would have died. Your video shows the offset crash at what? 40 mph? now lets pretend that 'block of cement' it crashed into was another vehicle going 55mph? that would be an impact of 95mph. Do you honestly believe, you would survive that impact in EV of a offset front end crash and rolled three times? What happens if the EV then catches fire............your toast even if you survive the crash. *lady* = about a year later we found out the *lady* was convicted of drug possession, check writing fraud, illegal possession of a firearm, tax evasion and counterfeiting. We now assume she was running from someone when she lost control and plowed into us. I was doing 55mph, The police estimate she was over 55mph at impact.
The point is all this EV garbage is supposed to be much greener... And I don't see that at all... How is it supposed to make things better? You have to dig holes in the ground to get the lithium and the cobalt... Then you have to worry about the disposal of such after its life is over. And you still have to charge the damn things... Where are we supposed to get all of this energy to charge all these EVs from?? And the grid is no where near ready for loads like that. I don't hate EV cars... I hate the lithium within them. We can do a lot better.
To me they made, and make, perfect sense inside a city's limits. Baker Electric was making cars for pretty much that use 125 years ago. Today a 40-50 mph top speed and a 120V charging system on-board would suit an awful lot of urban dwellers. Parking meters are mostly electric now - make each one a 120V charging station in cities. Baker also built trucks up to 10,000 lb. capacity - which would suit small in-town buses and delivery trucks just as well. Originally Posted by BBeerme Did you notice how many people were driving them around in the past 100 yrs?
Did you notice how many people were driving them around in the past 100 yrs? Originally Posted by 71CHOPS Except that EVs have been around in one form or another since the early 1900's!��
Except that EVs have been around in one form or another since the early 1900's!😋
I read about a year ago... That Musk is privately working on a hydrogen ICE engine... So even Musk knows pure EV's are not practical... Rather... a fad...
Originally Posted by jmac00 NOT HATE, just very, very skeptical about many things. one of which is the cost of insurance. The other is the remarkable speed at which the .gov is FORCING people into something they really don't want, can't afford, and the entire system is not ready for. You tell me, nay, demand, that I buy something I don't want, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT IT IS, I am a natural resister. I will automatically resist being forced to do anything. Thats why I was self-employed. I DO NOT PLAY NICE WITH OTHERS ( sometimes ) If you get me a EV that goes 600+ miles, can be recharged in 10 minutes, AT ANY PLACE IN AMERICA, and cost under $50 Grand. I'll consider it buying it. But if I have an EV and I'm 500 miles into Podunk,(pick a state) and there is no charge station that can get me moving in 10 minutes, NO Im not buying it. period I don't hate EV's. I hate being forced into this mirage that they are the (near) future. When even you guy know, they won't be ready for at least 10 years. That's kinda my point.....nobody has forced anyone to buy an electric car. Yes the industry is being pushed toward electric, but the big 3 have proven they completely suck at innovation, and forward thinking.....to the point that their money has pushed back against gov'ment money, and slowed the process. Whether we like it or not, "fossil" fuels (a misnomer at best) are on the way out. The world is an ever changing place. We can embrace change or simply stand around yelling "get off my lawn".....regardless, the future is an exciting place, as there is an insane amount of innovation, and new technology, barreling at us like a freight train.
Originally Posted by Poodle Head Mikey Tesla's approach is the only workable one: skim off the top of the market first. Their business model has always been to start with expensive, hard to produce models, and then refine the process to make everything cheaper and faster. The upcoming model 2 will be the fruit of that labor.
There's a few states to choose from: "There's a Podunk in Connecticut, one in New York, Vermont, Massachusetts. The Connecticut Podunk is well-known (OK, not that well-known) for an annual bluegrass festival." "Podunk was a place name long before it became a punchline. Podunk is an Algonquian word. Quick explanatory comma: Algonquian languages are a family of indigenous languages spoken from New England to Saskatchewan to the Great Plains. Those languages include Fox, Cree and Ojibwe. There are a bunch of words in English that have Algonquian roots: skunk, moose, caribou. . . . But beyond its Algonquian roots, much of the linguistic history of Podunk is kind of murky." And here I thought I was going to get through the whole day without learning anything. Originally Posted by jmac00 NOT HATE, just very, very skeptical about many things. one of which is the cost of insurance. The other is the remarkable speed at which the .gov is FORCING people into something they really don't want, can't afford, and the entire system is not ready for. You tell me, nay, demand, that I buy something I don't want, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT IT IS, I am a natural resister. I will automatically resist being forced to do anything. Thats why I was self-employed. I DO NOT PLAY NICE WITH OTHERS ( sometimes ) If you get me a EV that goes 600+ miles, can be recharged in 10 minutes, AT ANY PLACE IN AMERICA, and cost under $50 Grand. I'll consider it buying it. But if I have an EV and I'm 500 miles into Podunk,(pick a state) and there is no charge station that can get me moving in 10 minutes, NO Im not buying it. period I don't hate EV's. I hate being forced into this mirage that they are the (near) future. When even you guy know, they won't be ready for at least 10 years.
Tesla's approach is the only workable one: skim off the top of the market first. Originally Posted by ksefan Maybe in 10-15 years there will be enough competition that EVs will be 10-20k and last 5-10 years. Doubt it.
I would happily trade a $100K 2.3 sec. to 62 mph acceleration for 15 seconds to 60 mph along with a 2000 lb. payload, 7500 lb. tow capacity, and a 400 mile range for $50K Originally Posted by ksefan I would definitely buy a model S plaid instead of a Nissan GTR for close to the same money. 2.3 sec to 62mph, hard to beat that for around 100k. I will never have that much money to spend on a vehicle.
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