Starting Training for a Second Career

[tedwasright]

I will begin an HVAC/R program on March second. I've been a high school teacher for thirteen years but feel like it's time to move on. I make a good salary now: about 90k. Teaching has just turned into something I'm not interested in being a part of.

My question is simple: will I ever be able to make a similar salary? I dont mean to be rude or ask a silly question here. I just want to know what people in the business think. Am I crazy?

The program seems intensive. I'll be leaving with an EPA Universal Cert.

ANY ADVICE ABOUT LEARNING OR POTENTIAL WILL BE APPRECIATED.

Thanks in advance for your response.

[beenthere]

I will begin an HVAC/R program on March second. I've been a high school teacher for thirteen years but feel like it's time to move on. I make a good salary now: about 90k. Teaching has just turned into something I'm not interested in being a part of.

My question is simple: will I ever be able to make a similar salary? I dont mean to be rude or ask a silly question here. I just want to know what people in the business think. Am I crazy?

The program seems intensive. I'll be leaving with an EPA Universal Cert.

ANY ADVICE ABOUT LEARNING OR POTENTIAL WILL BE APPRECIATED.

Thanks in advance for your response.

You won't be getting summers off anymore.

Despite what you think you will learn in school, it will barely scratch the surface of what you need to know. So you'll be an apprentice/newbie/beginner for several years. So how much you'll make depends on the area and company you work for, along with how many hours of overtime you work.

5,7 11 years down the road, after your making 30 bucks an hour, it will only take about 12 hours of overtime a week for 52 weeks straight to make what your making now, only working what, 36 to 38 weeks a year.

So just ask yourself. Do you like working in attics when its 135 degrees in the attic. Do you like working in attics when its -5 in the attic. Same for working on roofs servicing roof top units.

Do you think you'll like smelling like fuel oil?
Your hands often looking dirty for most of the year.
Getting out of bed at 1 AM to fix the heat for someone.
Leaving a cook out on a Sunday to fix the A/C some one.
Working on Holidays.

[timebuilder]

I will begin an HVAC/R program on March second. I've been a high school teacher for thirteen years but feel like it's time to move on. I make a good salary now: about 90k. Teaching has just turned into something I'm not interested in being a part of.

My question is simple: will I ever be able to make a similar salary? I dont mean to be rude or ask a silly question here. I just want to know what people in the business think. Am I crazy?

The program seems intensive. I'll be leaving with an EPA Universal Cert.

ANY ADVICE ABOUT LEARNING OR POTENTIAL WILL BE APPRECIATED.

Thanks in advance for your response.

Crazy? No. I taught an advanced class in aviation science at a community college. I could not believe how students have changed since I was in a college classroom as a student. I don't think you could pay me enough to teach in a public school environment.


Within a couple of years, you might make 50k, as the amount of OT Beenthere mentioned is generally not available.

You'd be better off writing a textbook.

[tedwasright]

Wow. This sounds pretty bad. Is the profession as bad as it seems? I don't expect to live the same way I did as a teacher but Im surprised because it just seems like a bad switch. I have a genuine interest in the profession. I am really looking forward to learning. It's not about the money so much, really. I was just curious because people outside the profession generally believe it's a good profession to practice.

Any more advice is appreciated.

[ericb45696]

our "top" tech, which is our service manager, makes 60-70k . but he has been with us over 10 years and in the business for almost 20.
the other techs range from 22-45k depending on how long they have been with us, level of skill, and if they sell units or not.
and we are a fairly small HVAC company. 10 employees at the moment.
hope that helps.

[beenthere]

Its a good profession for some, not for others. Its one of those point of view things.

If you learn how to install, you will learn about construction in general, which is always a good thing to know.

[tinner73]

you will be sorely disappointed...a huge step backwards.:.02:

[fiscalito71]

I just came out of school in July/2010, and I have not be able to find a job in the field because I don't have experience. So you really have to think twice what are you going to do because is hard for new techs to get a job, unless you have very good contacts.

[flange]

This business is peerceived to be a high wage earning business due to many factors. If you look at an average hourly service rate for say a commercial contractor up there, it might be say 125 bucks per hour. building owners, managers, etc, think the techs make that money. The reality is that they probably make a quarter of that in pay, and then there are things like benefits, tools, training, downtime(unbilable hours), overhead (office space, secretary), taxes, and after all that, hopefully some profit for the owner.

The perception of us overcharging people is far from the truth, and in fact, if a person who understood how to run a business looked at many HVAC contractors books, they would call us names. Thnik about this....your local pizza shop may need four bucks to make a pie considering all costs. they sell it for say sixteen to make the math easy. An average HVAC company might have a total direct cost of say fifty bucks to keep it easy, meaning their sell price should be two hundred bucks an hour to keep pace with the pizzza shop owner. very few can getthat kind of money.
Now on to you. Be prepared to take a serious pay cut, at least for the next ten years. you will learn a lot about thnings like electrical, mechanical, physics, etc. you will work in hot places in summer, and cold places in winter. you will be run ragged at times, but if you work for the right company, might have a whole lot of fun with the guys. you will work alongside other tradesmen, who may or may not get along, but working alongside them, you will learn about general construction, and be able to fix a lot of different things. people may think you are a ripoff artist at times, disrespect you at times, etc.

Ever see an expose' on sixty minutes about them changing the math formulas in a textbook purposely to see if you catch it? every year, they do "feature stories" about hvac techs, purposely breaking systems to see if they can find the problem. if after reading all of this you still want in and want to work all year....come on in, the water is JUUUST fine.

[sprmktrefertech]

Wow. This sounds pretty bad. Is the profession as bad as it seems? I don't expect to live the same way I did as a teacher but Im surprised because it just seems like a bad switch. I have a genuine interest in the profession. I am really looking forward to learning. It's not about the money so much, really. I was just curious because people outside the profession generally believe it's a good profession to practice.

Any more advice is appreciated.

IMO...If your looking forward to 'learning and have a genuine interest in this profession',then you should do what's right for you...think about it, you make teaching sound like a bad switch, which I always thought as a good profession.
...I love what I do, every day is a different challenge, yes you could work 10 and 12hrs a day,but don't forget I could do 4-5 service calls,depending on the situation and 3-4 hrs are driving. i believe why the others made it sound so bad was based on the 90k/yr...ive been doing hvac/r for 25yrs and did not make 90k...close... but no cigar. What subject did you teach?I hope it was shop:grin2:lmao

[jiffypop]

If you can get into a union at least up here I have had the last 4 yrs over 90k. Average is about 75k for a slow yr.

[sciencefreak614]

One of the things that I found I do not like about this profession is the urgency of the work. Things need to be done NOW. If a customer calls up when their furnace or AC is not working, the longer the wait is for them, the more chance they will call another company. This means that your employer will be trying to cram in as many calls as possible each day. When you go to work, you are there until they say you can go home. You will most likely not have a job where you work until say 5pm every day. When you are busy (and if you get with a good company you will be busy most of the time), you can easily be getting home at 7, 8, or 9 each and every night. There is not much around this, it is just how the industry has to be in order to keep up with the demand of the customers.
Not trying to discourage you, but it is something that you really want to think about, because this type of job is not for everyone. Before I did this type of work I was a field technician in a field where the work was not so urgent, and I had a lot more freedom and work was must less stressful. Moving into the HVAC field was a serious change.

[tedwasright]

Thanks for all the responses. I appreciate any advice. I am at a strange place in my life, not unlike many Americans. I need to provide and teaching doesn't have much of a future in my area.

[MUNC]

good luck with your change. i did a sim. change many years ago and the cut in pay cost me half of all my "stuff". still dont forgive that b...h. now as the years have gone by i've never been happier, work is a challenge i enjoy. never the same place time after time. new people every day ect. just hope you can work in the field as you go to school so you can apply as you learn. i did 3 1/2 years of night school before out in the field and the stuff was slow in coming back what was learned, but when it clicked it clicked. just remember in general this is a feast or famine trade even with good companys

[Tiger93rsl]

There are technicans working for a local company who won 2009 contractor of the year award making over $140,000.

[Snoring Beagle]

High school to the real world?

You've been spoiled for real work.

Money?... become a bankster

[tedwasright]

Real work? Teaching your kids is real work. Good thing someone believes your kids are worth REAL work.

[tinner73]

Real work? Teaching your kids is real work. Good thing someone believes your kids are worth REAL work.
we need good teachers..stay put.:grin2:

i have a senior in H.S, he's pretty smart (33 ACT) he will be going to Ill State Univ..he wants to be a teacher.

the trades were a good living years ago and i'm union so i make close to what you do. i don't want any of my kids to do this for a living. there are a lot of easier ways to make a living than this. the trades now seem to be a "plan B"..at best.

i tell my kids that they can make more money with their brains than they ever could with their backs.

[Snoring Beagle]

Real work? Teaching your kids is real work. Good thing someone believes your kids are worth REAL work.

I'm sorry, I just know too many teachers...

[tedwasright]

I appreciate everyone's responses. My program starts on March 2nd. I was already committed to the program before I posted here. I will be working as a teacher during the day and taking classes at night.

My situation is this:

I have been teaching for thirteen years. My district is being squeezed by outside influences. My job will soon be cut. (Within 2 years) I need a Plan B because there is no way any district will hire me at my present salary. Most districts are cutting so they hire only new teachers. Teachers are also bombarded with constant criticism from people who don't know any better. I am tired of this as well.

I chose HVAC because I have always been interested in it. Thanks, again, for your responses.

Any advice is appreciated.

[Roddy73]

You can always go back to teaching right! This a good trade for the easily-educated, lots of different areas to specialize in. With rising energy costs and more complex equipment there is plenty of room for book smart guys.

I have a friend who passes trades exams with incredible marks, his practical skills are way below mine but he's over 100k a year now and only had his hands on the tools for a couple of years.

Good luck, and wear knee pads.:grin2:

[tedwasright]

You can always go back to teaching right! This a good trade for the easily-educated, lots of different areas to specialize in. With rising energy costs and more complex equipment there is plenty of room for book smart guys.

I have a friend who passes trades exams with incredible marks, his practical skills are way below mine but he's over 100k a year now and only had his hands on the tools for a couple of years.

Good luck, and wear knee pads.:grin2:

Thanks alot. I've gotten many responses so far. Im looking forward to learning. Heres to ya, cheers.

[sprmktrefertech]

another good thing to remember is you have us here at hvac-talk....It's ironic really... now we will be the teacher and you will be the student:spitball: ha,ha ,ha...w/ that said,there are other perks,to this field,like taking a truck home...uh no gas no wear and tear on your vehicle,oh don't forget you wont have to pay for service people to come and fix anything. best of luck in your endeavors and looking forward to any new posts you may have...:grin2:


:cheers:

[osiyo]

Thanks alot. I've gotten many responses so far. Im looking forward to learning. Heres to ya, cheers.

Well, I sometimes do a part time teaching gig at a state technical college here. And have had ex-teachers in my classes. As well as ex- whatever. They have varied stories as to how they came to be there.

Often enough, either they came to find out that the job they had gotten using their college degrees wasn't what they thought it was going to be like and they didn't like it.

Or their fields of expertise was glutted with excess folks wanting work, driving wages and opportunity down.

Or changes had come about so that there was a much smaller demand for their former expertise. So getting a job at all was an issue.

Etc.

<Shrug> Myself, I have 3 degrees. A 2 year in computer technology, 4 year in marine engineering, and a Master's in Sociology. Also have tech school certificates in a number of fields, mechanical and electrical. With appropriate licensing.

I have not yet decided what I wanna do when I grow up. Seeing as how I've passed my 60th birthday, I guess that sooner or later I'll have to make a decision about that. :-)

As concerns your issue. I'll give you my take on it.

Years ago, both my grandfather and my father counseled me that whatever else I ever did in life .... learn a trade, one where you could make something, fix something, operate something, or grow something real, tangible, and that folks were always likely to need or have done.

Two reasons. One, you'd learn how to use tools and physical skills and how things really worked and got done. At the worst, learning how to adequately do any of the skilled trades meant you would learn how to do at least some of the common, ordinary things other people must rely upon someone else to do for them. There is a sense of accomplishment in this, and a certain pride. It can also save you some money, get you out of a bind, etc.

Secondly, you never know what life will toss your way. Learning a skilled trade is like a safety net. You have something to fall back upon. You're not a one trick pony. If you pursue some other career, and things take a dump on you for whatever reason, you've something to fall back upon that'll put food in your mouth and a dry roof over your head.

This happened to a number of my relatives.

ie My own father. After being a number of things in life, he started his own business. Did okay, then well, then made some mistakes, lost it all. He went out to the garage where he kept his tools, had kept his skills up, and went back to work at a blue collar job. Saved up, and later restarted his business, this time learning from his mistakes, and made good.

An uncle was doing well as a research physicist, working on a number of projects for Uncle Sam as a contract type. Then the DOD cut back drastically on a number of projects. Uncle went back, for a while, doing his "other" trade. He was also a licensed master electrician. Had been an electrician before going to college, and worked his way through college as an electrician. He had a PhD in Physics. But the research field was an on and off thing. Feast or famine. In the end as he got older, he got a professor position at a college, teaching prospective electrical engineers.

My next thought on the subject.

At one point in my life, thinking it was the thing to do, I worked my way up into a management position. Not an engineering position ... management. Nice title, even nicer pay.

Did that for several years. Just to find out I really disliked my daily work. Meetings, meetings, meetings. Glad handing folks I didn't even like. Constant personnel problems to be dealt with. Constantly looking at reports, editing reports, browsing spreadsheets, etc.

I was actually pretty good at it. Rose in position, got pay increases, got plenty of little pieces of paper to hang on my "I love me" wall, which declared how great a guy I was.

But I wasn't particularly happy. Not nearly as much as I had expected to be. In fact, eventually I came to despise the work. Hated going to work.

Finally it dawned on me. My true love in life, besides my wife and kids, was making stuff, or fixing stuff, etc. Yeah yah can have miserable days. Making, building, or fixing stuff can mean you're hot sweaty and tired, or freezing your a** off. Also means burns, cuts, scratches; bumps, lumps, and bruises. Etc.

But there is just something about standing back when all is said and done, and watching something work like it should ... and knowing "I did that", which just ... makes me happy. I feel like I DID something ... REAL.

So, at that management job, I turned in my papers, made sure all my licensing was current, and picked up my tools and went job hunting again.

Yep, I took a pretty deep pay cut. But nothing we couldn't deal with. Had to tighten belt for a while. Could afford to "go out on the town", or take vacation trips somewhere nice a whole lot less often.

But the fact is, we learned to not miss that stuff very much. More frequently instead of going somewhere and spending money, we invited family and friends over for a barbecue. Rented movies and had everyone gather around for "movie night". I actually had more time on my hands so I did a number of home projects, started up my large vegetable garden again (I was born on a farm, and have always loved growing good stuff to eat). Fishing doesn't cost much, not around here. And I love to fish, especially when I bring along long time friends and/or family. Etc.

AND ... I found myself looking forward to going to work again. What challenges today? Where will I be working? What kind of projects?

Worked hands on with HVAC and electrical systems. Then moved into controls full time. These days I do strictly DDC control systems.

And can't say I'm sorry for leaving that upper management position. I LIKE doing what I'm doing. I LIKE look on customer's face when yah make things work right for them. I LIKE it when salesman hands me piece of cr*p specs he's agreed to, and I have to figure out how to make things work anyway.

Next thought.

Grandpa, dad, and others in my clan always stressed upon me that I should always learn as much as I could, never pass up an opportunity to learn something new. Because, as they put it, "A person never, ever knows when a piece of knowledge or a skill might come in handy."

I've found this to be true more times than I can possibly remember.

You want to be prepared for an eventuality, that you may lose the teaching job. That's a good thing. Even if you end up just working in the HVAC field as a tech for a few years. That gives you more opportunity. And knowledge.

You already have one degree. So it wouldn't take that much to work up an engineering degree. Or, learn the engineering part without a degree in engineering. You could get into the engineering part of the HVAC work.

Or go back to teaching, tech courses.

Or whatever.

As concerns how much money can be made. Well, I don't know what the pay rates for HVAC are in your area. Around here, a licensed journeyman with 5-10 years experience makes as much as the average teacher. Can make more, depending on how good he is, his areas of expertise, etc. Commercial/industrial work pays more than residential, union or non-union.

A licensed/certified, experienced controls specialist ... well, around here none of them are unemployed or likely to be so for years to come. Oh, may lose a job for whatever reason, but they don't stay unemployed if they're any good, for longer than a couple or 3 weeks unless they just feel like sitting home for a while.

That my thoughts.

[tedwasright]

Thanks osiyo. I appreciate the time and thought you put into your response. I have always felt that learning anything is always going to make you better. I don't look at this decision as a negative one, or a "step down." I look at it as another way I will be able to provide for my family. You have made me feel better about my decision. Many people at this site have been very helpful and I thank you all.