What kind of brazing rod to use

[546kerry]

Iam changing over compressor on refrigerator.
The low pressure line is copper,that is not a problem.
The high pressure line that goes to the condensor is steel.
What would you guys use to braze or soilder it with .
The steel line is 1/4 inch.
Its not in a tight spot easy to get to.

>Kerry

[ct2]

I would recommend using the same type of rod that they used in tech school

[akdan747]

use 45% silver and flux

[ct2]

site rules:Do-It-Yourselfers - not here.

This site is for industry professionals and folks seeking HVAC/R advice and knowledge. Please do not ask for step by step instructions on purchasing, installing or repairing your own HVAC equipment, that is our job and our livelihood. We are generous, but not to a fault

[Dad]

well... glad we got that straight :D

45% and flux is the correct answer just don't burn down the house using it.

[hvacmd2002]

45% as was said by others or 56% works great too.

Hey guys, maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think he's a do-it-yourselfer. Sounds like he's started doing appliances. Maybe we should cut him some slack?

[Dad]

Originally posted by hvacmd2002
45% as was said by others or 56% works great too.

Hey guys, maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think he's a do-it-yourselfer. Sounds like he's started doing appliances. Maybe we should cut him some slack?

He's fine... been messing around with us for a while now.

[ct2]

OK, it just seemed like that question is something that is taught at a very early stage in school, even before learning how to change a compressor in a refrigerator

we used silflos and purged with nitrogen- used flux on anything but copper.

[Wild Leg]

Originally posted by ct2


...we used silflos and purged with nitrogen- used flux on anything but copper.

Can't use silphos on steel, even though it will stick.
The phosphorus will make the steel brittle, and you will wind up with a cracked discharge line.

[mattm]

I put a $150 dollar compressor in a 10 year old fridge once. Then a week later the defrost timer went out while we were out of town, that caused it to freeze up solid and ruined my 2 slabs of baby backs, 3 chickens, a few packs of chops, and some steak, my beer got warm and the milk soured and the lunch meat was bad. The beer getting warm was the bad part. So then my loving Italian wife goes and buys the biggest damn side by side they offered at the time and had to move all our wall cabinets to the left 6". That left a spot on the wall and she decides I have to paint the whole f'n kitchen. Now the ceiling fan don't look right with the new fridge and niether does the dishwasher. So back to Sears she goes. Ends up with a new dishwasher, cieling fan and freak'n faucets.

Now I'm all depressed cause all these old bad memories are stirred up. I think I'll have a beer. A cold one.

[546kerry]

Thanks to all of ya.
No Iam not a DIY I do work on appliance when Iam not working as a builder. Iam just getting to old to build anymore so I thought I would work on appliance.
And no I did not go to any school to learn.
Just read alot but realy never read about brazing steel to steel.
The refer is one that I went to work on and it had a bad compressor.I told the people To buy a new refer becouse it would be cheper for them that way.
I hauled the old one home to fix becouse it is a good looking fridge.
Iam just going to put another used compressor in the fridge.
Thanks again
>Kerry

[Edmund Forsthe]

go to the harris site plenty of info for you there.

[snewman24]

ct2,
You're starting to get paranoid.......get over it :rolleyes:

[pabull]

Originally posted by 546kerry
Iam changing over compressor on refrigerator.
The low pressure line is copper,that is not a problem.
The high pressure line that goes to the condensor is steel.
What would you guys use to braze or soilder it with .
The steel line is 1/4 inch.
Its not in a tight spot easy to get to.

>Kerry With a name like Kerry, just put a high-dollar Band-aid on it....thats what liberals do..... :O

[pabull]

If you're in the trade, use 45% and flux...heat the copper..not the steel.... :D

[546kerry]

Originally posted by Edmund Forsthe
go to the harris site plenty of info for you there.
How do I get to the harris site,
What is it and where is it.
I typed in http://www.harris.com but nothing in there for me unless Iam missing something,unless your joking with me
NO YOU GUYS WOULDNT DO THAT
OK just wondering where it is at if its about refrigeration or brazing I would like to check it out.

[Wild Leg]

Originally posted by 546kerry

Originally posted by Edmund Forsthe
go to the harris site plenty of info for you there.
How do I get to the harris site,
What is it and where is it.
I typed in http://www.harris.com but nothing in there for me unless Iam missing something,unless your joking with me
NO YOU GUYS WOULDNT DO THAT
OK just wondering where it is at if its about refrigeration or brazing I would like to check it out.

http://www.jwharris.com

[ct2]

bwal2



Can't use silphos on steel, even though it will stick.
The phosphorus will make the steel brittle, and you will wind up with a cracked discharge line.


so they are referring to silversolder @ 45% ?
is it true that flux is not needed on a copper to copper connection ? or was that bad info also

[Wild Leg]

Originally posted by ct2
bwal2



Can't use silphos on steel, even though it will stick.
The phosphorus will make the steel brittle, and you will wind up with a cracked discharge line.


so they are referring to silversolder @ 45% ?
is it true that flux is not needed on a copper to copper connection ? or was that bad info also


45% is what most refer to as "silver solder".
It is, in fact, a brazing alloy, sold by the ounce. No spool like solder would have.

Flux on copper to copper is not required, when brazing with silphos (around 6 to 15% silver) or phos copper (0% silver that looks the same).

Silphos is a flat stick, usually, sold by the pound.

The phosphorus "kinda" takes the place of flux.
It doesn't hurt anything to use brazing flux on copper joints, but most people don't bother.

Go read through http://www.jwharris.com

They have a free braze training video available through their wholesalers.
It's worth the time to hunt one down.

[ct2]

Bwa12 : thank you, i am off to read the link now

[R12rules]

when you brase one of theose steel discharge lines .. be sure to find the seam. There is a line down the tubing which, when sanded, will show up dark.

That's because the seam is recessed into the line.
It must be sanded, scraped, gouged if necessary ... but whatever you do .... CLEAN IT UP!

Othersie ... you WILL live to regret ever touching that joint in the first place!

I take a torch, lite flame and SS toothbruch and scrub the joint while applying just a lite flame to it.

This is AFTER I have sanded the area.
This pertains only to the steel pipe, not the copper. Copper will be seamless, while steel is with seam.

45% or 56% is the way to go.

Take it slow and when the flux "glasses over" ... it is now time to insert the silver brazing wire.

And the joint will not require much silver solder. So go sparingly.

[ct2]

the seam is recessed into the line.
It must be sanded, scraped, gouged if necessary ... but whatever you do .... CLEAN IT UP!

Othersie ... you WILL live to regret ever touching that joint in the first place!


so how about cleaning the joint with a little muratic acid before assembling the jointand then applying the flux?

[dgfergie]

Hi Kerry, please note that Sil-Flos is designed only for copper to copper joints and uses no flux. It can be used with copper to brass but flux would be required.

Never, never use Sil-Flos to try and braze copper to steel even if you use flux. Eventially the joint will fail if it does'nt leak from the start.

For brazing copper to Brass or steel use siver solder with silver solder flux. This is the only way you will get a reliable joint on these types of metals. I am against using any type of soft solder on refrigeration systems. They are more difficult to use and not reliable.

Dan
Seattle, WA

[Twilly]

Twilli says 50/50 solder

[HHC1505]

use safety-silv 45%silver solder and white paste flux. good for steel/copper/brass. use soft flame.

[vmc1161]

I put a $150 dollar compressor in a 10 year old fridge once. Then a week later the defrost timer went out while we were out of town, that caused it to freeze up solid and ruined my 2 slabs of baby backs, 3 chickens, a few packs of chops, and some steak, my beer got warm and the milk soured and the lunch meat was bad. The beer getting warm was the bad part. So then my loving Italian wife goes and buys the biggest damn side by side they offered at the time and had to move all our wall cabinets to the left 6". That left a spot on the wall and she decides I have to paint the whole f'n kitchen. Now the ceiling fan don't look right with the new fridge and niether does the dishwasher. So back to Sears she goes. Ends up with a new dishwasher, cieling fan and freak'n faucets.

Now I'm all depressed cause all these old bad memories are stirred up. I think I'll have a beer. A cold one.


Next time call a pro...:( ;)

.

[hvacpope]

here what you need

http://www.handy-one.com/htmdocs/products/gen_purpose_filler_metals/braze560.html

[Tool-Slinger]

Twilli says 50/50 solder
Or JB-WELD

[Twilly]

Or JB-WELD


Twilli didn't think of that

[Swampfox]

He has probably figured it out within the last 3 1/2 years since this thread was started lol