classmates not catching on

[adamste81]

Ok just venting a little, not patting myself on the back or anything, but I don’t understand this. We are in our last 2 weeks of classes this semester and we had a “pop” quiz. It was 12 questions long and everyone failed except for 6 of us (class of 17).
The questions consisted of “what part of an AC unit rejects heat”. (condenser, metering device, compressor, evap) “what part restricts refrigerant flow before entering the evap” (condenser, filter drier, metering device, compressor).
If you have 275 PSI on a r410a system what is the corresponding temperature? (we all were provided P/T charts). Then the next one was, if you were anticipating 10-15 degrees subcooling based on the P/T chart what temperature would you expect?
I mean these questions were like cake, he couldn’t have made it easier and yet these people are not getting it. It scares me that these guys may go onto the next class (towards the end of the program) not knowing how to calculate subcooling or what a metering device does.

[76olds]

Don't worry about what your classmates do. Focus on your education. When I was in school, there were also people in there who just took up space. It's their loss. Some people are just slackers.

[Octopus]

You just wait until your standing in front of a unit at 1am after putting in 120 hours of OT sun burnt,hungry,head ache, bones hurt,on 0 hours of sleep, and have two more calls. and then see what you can remember from "class",


By the way theres school then theres the school of hard knocks.:D

You just wait, By the way it wouldn't have it any other way, I love my job.

[hvaclover]

I can relate.

The fact these guys flunked a simple test like that tells me they aren't taking the class serious.
Are these guys paying their own tuition or are they state subsidized?

Place I taught had ex-cons and students who were court ordered to attend (on the state's tab) or go to jail.

On the day of Finals, my youngest son came to the class with me.

He was I think 13 at the time. With no study he took the Final and scored a "C".

The other students who didn't care what they got and it showed.

[adamste81]

You just wait until your standing in front of a unit at 1am after putting in 120 hours of OT sun burnt,hungry,head ache, bones hurt,on 0 hours of sleep, and have two more calls. and then see what you can remember from "class",

thanks for the comment but i sure hope even after all those hours and having a headache and sunburn i can remember what part of the system rejects heat and how to calculate subcooling and which parts are included in the "high end" of the system.
i know NOTHING is a substitute for hard work and hands on. BTW the lab we have at school is top notch amazing, they have so many things to work on and the latest tools and machines. it is a good place to learn.

[Tool-Slinger]

Are these guys paying their own tuition or are they state subsidized?

Sort of my thought.

High school vo-tech? If students don't know that stuff then they are not even trying to learn, they are just goofing off and wasting time/money.

[adamste81]

Are these guys paying their own tuition or are they state subsidized?

Georgia has the HOPE grant funded by the lottery. It is for 4 year schools as well as 2 year degrees such as HVAC/R.
I cant tell you about anyone else in the class but I am on the HOPE grant myself, paid $40 out of pocket for this past semester.

[hvaclover]

Georgia has the HOPE grant funded by the lottery. It is for 4 year schools as well as 2 year degrees such as HVAC/R.
I cant tell you about anyone else in the class but I am on the HOPE grant myself, paid $40 out of pocket for this past semester.

My school was paid for by VA benefits.

Let's just hope the guys who flunked pop quiz don't make it a habit.

But I gotta tell 'ya, back when I was taking classes by the end of the second week all of us had the refer cycle and components down pat. One solid year of intense training... we only dropped four guys out of thirty. All of them went on to hvac careers.

Some of them are on this board but just don't know it.

Who remembers DEI?

[Some Dude]

Adam, your school is a cross section of America, on a larger scale those who worked hard, payed attention and applied themselves will become good technicians .
Reminds me of a story.

A university of Berkley student was getting ready to graduate and was home visiting her dad, a stanch conservative.
She was in the middle of a heated discussion with her father when he stopped her and asked about her grades.

She replied she maintained a 4.0 and worked very hard for it.

Her father asked about her roommate and how she was doing.

She replied that her roommate had a 2.0 but was having a blast , drinking and partying etc, but was not doing well with school.

So her father asked her, why not take one point from your grade point average , speak to the dean and add it to her roommates, that way there would be a fair and equal distribution of grade point average?

The daughter became indignant saying, why should give up one point from my average when i worked so hard for it and give it to her while all shes done is play.

Her fathers reply was,,,,,,,,,,,,,,welcome to the republican party.

Keep up the good work and learn the trade, if you end up loving it so much the better.

[adamste81]

A university of Berkley student was getting ready to graduate and was home visiting her dad, a stanch conservative.
She was in the middle of a heated discussion with her father when he stopped her and asked about her grades.

She replied she maintained a 4.0 and worked very hard for it.

Her father asked about her roommate and how she was doing.

She replied that her roommate had a 2.0 but was having a blast , drinking and partying etc, but was not doing well with school.

So her father asked her, why not take one point from your grade point average , speak to the dean and add it to her roommates, that way there would be a fair and equal distribution of grade point average?

The daughter became indignant saying, why should give up one point from my average when i worked so hard for it and give it to her while all shes done is play.

Her fathers reply was,,,,,,,,,,,,,,welcome to the republican party.


I will be telling that story for years to come. It is hard to make people see the point of conservative values when everyone is complaining about how unfair the world is, and with all the liberal politics out there, but this story does a great job of putting it in perspective.
Not to say those who are poor or unemployed are spending all their time partying and goofing off, but I think the point of the story is the same.

[mrpogo]

Dont sweat the small stuff so they don't want to learn its their loss. I for one learn something new every day even if I'm not in school at the time. I have gone as far as to read a chapter ahead in my text book, stayed after class when time allows to use the simulators and even helped work on some of the small appliances we get to work on. Every little thing helps. Today I stayed after class to learn how to charge a 410a heat pump that was low on juice. You never know what you might need to know at least something about later on.

[Texas-Tech]

Pass them all up and never look back. Do what you can for good ole #1. Later on when your knees and back are always sore, the cuts on your fingers stinging you'll be the lucky one.

[beenthere]

Brain lock. Some people get it when taking a written test.

There was a guy that couldn't pass the Type III epa test. took it 3 times, and failed everytime. He'd only been doing low pressure for 40 years.

The company he worked for. Told him, don't worry about it. We need you to teach the young guys how to work on low pressure chillers. You will always have an apprentice with you. Just leave him do what ever requires a type III cert, and you can teach these young guys until you retire.

The guy just never did well at written test. But there wasn't anything he couldn't tell or teach you about low pressure.

Well, except for how to pass the EPA test. :) LOL

[Tool-Slinger]

Brain lock. Some people get it when taking a written test.

There was a guy that couldn't pass the Type III epa test. took it 3 times, and failed everytime. He'd only been doing low pressure for 40 years.

The company he worked for. Told him, don't worry about it. We need you to teach the young guys how to work on low pressure chillers. You will always have an apprentice with you. Just leave him do what ever requires a type III cert, and you can teach these young guys until you retire.

The guy just never did well at written test. But there wasn't anything he couldn't tell or teach you about low pressure.

Well, except for how to pass the EPA test. :) LOL
I doubt it. Questions were too simple. Something else going on here IMO.

[Joe Harper]

Adam, your school is a cross section of America, on a larger scale those who worked hard, payed attention and applied themselves will become good technicians .
Reminds me of a story.

A university of Berkley student was getting ready to graduate and was home visiting her dad, a stanch conservative.
She was in the middle of a heated discussion with her father when he ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Her fathers reply was,,,,,,,,,,,,,,welcome to the republican party.

Keep up the good work and learn the trade, if you end up loving it so much the better.

Hey! someone spilled some ARP on my shoe!

[beenthere]

I doubt it. Questions were too simple. Something else going on here IMO.


Well, he retired a few years ago. And he always had an apprentice. And was still one of the highest paid guys at his company.

If something else was going on. He still made out.

[Tool-Slinger]

Well, he retired a few years ago. And he always had an apprentice. And was still one of the highest paid guys at his company.

If something else was going on. He still made out.
I could be wrong. There is no calculator that can calculate my mistakes, too many digits.

A lot of guys I went to school with just did not care. In HS it was just a class.. In college mom and dad paid. On the job, some were there juswt to collect a paycheck and did not care to learn. They were just goofing off in all cases. There is a weeding process.

[Music Seeker]

I can agree and disagree with some points here.

First off, I just started my second year of schooling, going into it with a 3.71 cumulative GPA. The sad thing is that some of these people f*** off, miss at least 10-20 days a term, and still manage to get an A. I don't know what they are doing outside of class to keep doing this, but I know I'm busting my hump, and I'm even getting a free ride because of NAFTA. But I'm doing this because it's either HVAC or Veterinary Assistant...while I like pets, I can't do that whole fetching stuff thing. I like the hands on of this field. This summer, I had some rough times where what I learned in the classroom was tossed out on it's ass and I had to find my way through the thicket, but I wouldn't trade it for anything. I can't stand people who say that just because someone is on state money that they don't bust their hump. I have five people in my class as well as I that will disagree with you. One dropped out only because he got a state job he'd been on the list for, for three years. $20/hr, all the good bennies, and state retirement package. I can't blame him at age 56.

Next, I do feel for you. My instructor drilled the components into our heads from day one. Every week we had a quiz on them, and every week we'd study more information about components and lines. Then the next quiz would include more information, until we could do it without looking. Seriously, there were a few people who still don't get it, but that's because of either a learning block (one guy in our class is taking night classes for English, while learning how to do HVAC, and I'm impressed by him!), or because of their own attitude.

Bottom line, college study: You get out of it what you put in. If you study hard, test harder, and keep your mind in it, and practice your tail off, you can get anywhere.

These people either don't get it, or don't want to get it, so don't sweat it. This field, as I've learned during my internship, is ALL about #1. Don't forget it. Sure, get the customer up and running, but don't forget to CYA!

:payattention::anyone::ghug::spitball:

[Tool-Slinger]

I can agree and disagree with some points here.

First off, I just started my second year of schooling, going into it with a 3.71 cumulative GPA. The sad thing is that some of these people f*** off, miss at least 10-20 days a term, and still manage to get an A. I don't know what they are doing outside of class to keep doing this, but I know I'm busting my hump, and I'm even getting a free ride because of NAFTA. But I'm doing this because it's either HVAC or Veterinary Assistant...while I like pets, I can't do that whole fetching stuff thing. I like the hands on of this field. This summer, I had some rough times where what I learned in the classroom was tossed out on it's ass and I had to find my way through the thicket, but I wouldn't trade it for anything. I can't stand people who say that just because someone is on state money that they don't bust their hump. I have five people in my class as well as I that will disagree with you. One dropped out only because he got a state job he'd been on the list for, for three years. $20/hr, all the good bennies, and state retirement package. I can't blame him at age 56.

Next, I do feel for you. My instructor drilled the components into our heads from day one. Every week we had a quiz on them, and every week we'd study more information about components and lines. Then the next quiz would include more information, until we could do it without looking. Seriously, there were a few people who still don't get it, but that's because of either a learning block (one guy in our class is taking night classes for English, while learning how to do HVAC, and I'm impressed by him!), or because of their own attitude.

Bottom line, college study: You get out of it what you put in. If you study hard, test harder, and keep your mind in it, and practice your tail off, you can get anywhere.

These people either don't get it, or don't want to get it, so don't sweat it. This field, as I've learned during my internship, is ALL about #1. Don't forget it. Sure, get the customer up and running, but don't forget to CYA!

:payattention::anyone::ghug::spitball:
Good post.

You guys in school, don't sweat too much what the other guys do. Don't even fret over the grades too much. You can have the best grades and learn little. That sounds wrong, but it is not. You are going to have to learn how to fix stuff, not pass a test. The school is just going to give you a foundation upon which you can build your actual experience. If your grades aren't what you had hoped, whatever the other guys are doing, don't worry about it. Just get as much as you can out of your class.

Your real learning experience comes in the field.

[adamste81]

thanks for the kind words, i am planning on keeping up the good work. i dont doubt any of my classmates abilities or want to learn but these were things we just reviewed for 2 weeks and the results from the test floored me, but ya I am happy I nailed it.

one of the people in the class is an apprentice and told us the guy he worked with a few months back would vent refrig into a bucket of water from the system and then dump the bucket out into the lawn.....:LOL::LOL::LOL:

i still cant believe anyone actually does that but he swears it happened.

[bdclark]

I can agree and disagree with some points here.

First off, I just started my second year of schooling, going into it with a 3.71 cumulative GPA. The sad thing is that some of these people f*** off, miss at least 10-20 days a term, and still manage to get an A. :


If we miss one day of class, our pay raises are set back two weeks. If we miss two days our raises are set back a total of 4 weeks. Miss the third class, and your raise is pushed back 6 months. Miss a fourth and you will be suspended from apprenticeship school as well as your apprenticeship, which means you lose your job. But that's the way it has to be so that our Local can weed out those guys who just want to goof off. We have a reputation to uphold and you can't do that with a bunch of slackers.

[Music Seeker]

Indeed. I couldn't agree more. I have damn good grades as far as I'm concerned. But the transition into field work was a rocky one. Because all I'd really learned was on paper or in a lab condition. A 95 degree day, with 85% relative humidity is WAAAAAAAAAAY out of design conditions.

[Some Dude]

Well, he retired a few years ago. And he always had an apprentice. And was still one of the highest paid guys at his company.

If something else was going on. He still made out.

Beenthere.........................was that low pressure guy,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,you???? :yes:

[beenthere]

Beenthere.........................was that low pressure guy,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,you???? :yes:


LOL... No, what I know about low pressure, wouldn't fill a thimble.

[Some Dude]

LOL... No, what I know about low pressure, wouldn't fill a thimble.

Sorry couldnt resist, bwahahaha

[hvaclover]

LOL... No, what I know about low pressure, wouldn't fill a thimble.
FILL 'ER UP!

http://www.alvr.com/p/products/thimble350.jpg

[adamste81]

FILL 'ER UP!

http://www.alvr.com/p/products/thimble350.jpg

never seen a thimble decorated with turquoise before, then again the only one i have ever seen is the crappy monopoly playing piece. :yes: