why so many change outs

[jaweberiii]

Ok guys I have a question to run by you, but first a little about me: I was a service tech and a installation tech for a few years each, now I am working for a creamery company working on self-contained and upright freezers all low-temp, in a shop, now when I was a service tech I might have changed a half a dozen suction/cap tube lines, and that was usually for some dramatic reason (snapped cap-tube, etc.) But now it seems that its an everyday occurrence. It seems that whenever I just cant get it down low enough my boss tells me to change out the suction line and sure enough it works. His explaination (and mind you hes about as old as my grandfather and kinda stuck in his ways) is it isnt feeding properly. And he looks kinda shocked that I wouldnt know that:beat:
So im wondering why is it so? Is it really not feeding properly or what?

Also these guys are very anal about changing a txv system to a cap tube system, but from my experience txv's work better? So why would they change all the txv's to cap tubes?

Thanks ahead of time for all the responses!!! And take it easy on me, im still learning:angel::cheers:

[hvac wiz 79]

ASSuming your cap tube is pre-soldered to the suction lines & thats what u mean by changing out suction lines . . . . its possible the cap tube has restriction

[jaweberiii]

some of them are soldered some are not

[Octopus]

So you are removing txv's and putting cap tubes?

[james122964]

You are doing change outs because of clogged condensers and R134a and 404a, I would bet a large amount that every cap tube you changed is on a 404a or 134a system.

I have had many, many r12 units using r12/409a/401a/402a that have had clogged condensers, cleaned the condenser and only had 1 change out that was on r22 that and the cap tube was clogged at the very end of the cap tube in the evap, I alway try and cut 2 inches off each end before going through the change the cap tube.
Exspecially on the soldered ones. I have fitting that I made which allow me to hook up compressed nitrogen on one end and a gauge on the other after cutting I check for flow, works real good.

Jim

[jaweberiii]

So you are removing txv's and putting cap tubes?

yes! every cabinet that comes in with a txv no matter what i am required to change it to a cap tube

[james122964]

Cap tubes are cheaper, you don't have to know how or take the time to adjust them, cap tubes only have 2 braze connections.

Heard of replacing cap tube with TXV, but never TXV with cap tube.

Not something I would do, but, to each his own.

Jim

[jaweberiii]

yeah ive always changed cap tubes to txv also but this is the way the company wants it, and I understand they are cheaper but doesn't it make sense to use txv's instead of running into the restrictions in the cap tube...unfortunately they do a lot of weird stuff at this place (stacking the cabinets on there side if our warehouse is packed):cliff:

[pdrake65]

A cap tupe has more possibility of getting restricted than a TXV.

[Octopus]

yes! every cabinet that comes in with a txv no matter what i am required to change it to a cap tube

At lest your not leaving sensing bulbs hanging in the breeze.

[rayr]

yes! every cabinet that comes in with a txv no matter what i am required to change it to a cap tube

That is totally INSANE. What do you do with the receivers, what do you do if it is controlled by a LPCO? Sounds like a lot of work with good possibility of bad results down the road to me. How long has your boss worked in the field??

[HvacStudentWTI]

That is totally INSANE. What do you do with the receivers, what do you do if it is controlled by a LPCO? Sounds like a lot of work with good possibility of bad results down the road to me. How long has your boss worked in the field??

ive asked myself that question about many companies, alot of practices many companies use make no sense, im a student of 7 months and i even know a txv is better than a cap tube any day, another thing that bugs me is alot of contractors in my area train people to goto peoples houses and tell them theirs compressor failure when it could be a cap or contactor just to sell a new unit, practices like these are what makes business fail , how ever strange enough some can be successful this way w/o ruining their reputation but they dont ever compare to the ethical companies, also ive seen guys charge with "the beer can cold method" where they feel the compressor and when its as cold as a frosty beer the system is charged lol,and ive even tested it with a coors rockey mountain color changer on the liquid line and had a serious under charge, some things remain a mystery :deadhorse:

[VTP99]

[QUOTE=HvacStudentWTI;7565132],and ive even tested it with a coors rockey mountain color changer on the liquid line and had a serious under charge
That is a good one :bsing: Of course you should have tried the suction line to see what you would get.

[HvacStudentWTI]

[QUOTE=HvacStudentWTI;7565132],and ive even tested it with a coors rockey mountain color changer on the liquid line and had a serious under charge
That is a good one :bsing: Of course you should have tried the suction line to see what you would get.

liquid line = suction line of course the discharge would be 2 hot lol:yes:

[pdrake65]

[QUOTE=VTP99;7565242]

liquid line = suction line of course the discharge would be 2 hot lol:yes:

The liquid line is not the suction line.

[jaweberiii]

That is totally INSANE. What do you do with the receivers, what do you do if it is controlled by a LPCO? Sounds like a lot of work with good possibility of bad results down the road to me. How long has your boss worked in the field??

Well the ice cream company i work for has been around since 1894, and my boss has been here for 31 years and the head refrigeration tech has been here 19 years, the receivers are cut out, the ones that have them, like today I am working on MasterBilt DD-88 from 2003, it has a txv no receiver, no LPCO, compressor is a Copeland HAGB-007E-IAA-800, and another thing my company does, is that any K-body compressor over 3 years old no matter if it works or not, it gets replaced no questions asked.

[jaweberiii]

A cap tupe has more possibility of getting restricted than a TXV.

I understand this, and hence the reason for the thread, I don't understand how the owners justify it, and neither do my boss/shop manager or the head tech or any over my other co-workers

[james122964]

Well the ice cream company i work for has been around since 1894, and my boss has been here for 31 years and the head refrigeration tech has been here 19 years, the receivers are cut out, the ones that have them, like today I am working on MasterBilt DD-88 from 2003, it has a txv no receiver, no LPCO, compressor is a Copeland HAGB-007E-IAA-800, and another thing my company does, is that any K-body compressor over 3 years old no matter if it works or not, it gets replaced no questions asked.

Wow, were to begin. They junk TXV's, recievers, etc for cheap cap tubes, but buy compressors that cost nearly a grand each for no apparent reason, who is paying for them? the customer? or is your shop a ice cream distributer that repairs and ships out equipment on lease to retailers selling your ice cream.

Compressors last a long freaking time if they are installed correctly and the condensers are kept clean.

Jim

[jaweberiii]

Wow, were to begin. They junk TXV's, recievers, etc for cheap cap tubes, but buy compressors that cost nearly a grand each for no apparent reason, who is paying for them? the customer? or is your shop a ice cream distributer that repairs and ships out equipment on lease to retailers selling your ice cream.

Compressors last a long freaking time if they are installed correctly and the condensers are kept clean.

Jim

Unfortunately I dont know the business set-up we have going all to well, I know that we manufacture the ice cream and that we have branches all up and down the east coast that we ship that ice cream to, and these branches have salesmen who find accounts and those accounts are where my cabinets go, the store has to sell so much ice cream a year for us to put our cabinets in there, and when a cabinet breaks down they send out a service tech from the area (private companies) and if that person cant fix it for a reasonable price then our salesman then swapps out the cabinet and it gets sent back to us, we then clean it, repair it, and re-decal it and send it out to a new location.

I agree compressors last alot longer than 3 years, but we have to replace them if they are older than that....dont ask me why!!! I know there are a couple of things that lower our price for the compressors 1) we buy in bulk, like by the hundreds at a time!!! 2) Most of the K-bodies are refurbished Copelands that we get from a distributor.

and I asked why we change the txv's to cap-tubes and the shop manager said "it takes to long to get the txv's running right" I wasnt sure what he meant so i let it go.

[james122964]

Unfortunately I dont know the business set-up we have going all to well, I know that we manufacture the ice cream and that we have branches all up and down the east coast that we ship that ice cream to, and these branches have salesmen who find accounts and those accounts are where my cabinets go, the store has to sell so much ice cream a year for us to put our cabinets in there, and when a cabinet breaks down they send out a service tech from the area (private companies) and if that person cant fix it for a reasonable price then our salesman then swapps out the cabinet and it gets sent back to us, we then clean it, repair it, and re-decal it and send it out to a new location.

I agree compressors last alot longer than 3 years, but we have to replace them if they are older than that....dont ask me why!!! I know there are a couple of things that lower our price for the compressors 1) we buy in bulk, like by the hundreds at a time!!! 2) Most of the K-bodies are refurbished Copelands that we get from a distributor.

and I asked why we change the txv's to cap-tubes and the shop manager said "it takes to long to get the txv's running right" I wasnt sure what he meant so i let it go.

I bet I do work for you guys.

Jim

[VTP99]

[QUOTE=HvacStudentWTI;7565692]

The liquid line is not the suction line.

Not my quote. And this is not the quote I'm talking about. I'm talking about post #15

[VTP99]

Anyhow was at a euro specialty store yesterday. New store and owner says he's tripping the breaker. So i take a peek and find he's pulling 20+ amps on a 20 amp breaker :eek2: So I'm looking at 3 deli cases & 2 ice cream dip chest on one circuit. Start adding up amps on cases and when i get to the Hussman freezers no visible tags. Yet the cases look like new. Peek once again down at the c/u and what do i see. The old style steel tube condenser.:yes: and it looks like new. At least paint wise. So someone is out there reconditioning these old cases. These were for Hershey's ice cream.

[joemach]

Unfortunately I dont know the business set-up we have going all to well, I know that we manufacture the ice cream and that we have branches all up and down the east coast that we ship that ice cream to, and these branches have salesmen who find accounts and those accounts are where my cabinets go, the store has to sell so much ice cream a year for us to put our cabinets in there, and when a cabinet breaks down they send out a service tech from the area (private companies) and if that person cant fix it for a reasonable price then our salesman then swapps out the cabinet and it gets sent back to us, we then clean it, repair it, and re-decal it and send it out to a new location.

I agree compressors last alot longer than 3 years, but we have to replace them if they are older than that....dont ask me why!!! I know there are a couple of things that lower our price for the compressors 1) we buy in bulk, like by the hundreds at a time!!! 2) Most of the K-bodies are refurbished Copelands that we get from a distributor.

and I asked why we change the txv's to cap-tubes and the shop manager said "it takes to long to get the txv's running right" I wasnt sure what he meant so i let it go.

Otherwise it would not be done. Someone in management has seen the TXV as a problem. Could be the private companies were incorrectly adjusting the TXV.

Sounds like you need to ask some more questions until you get the full understanding as to why it is being done.

[VTP99]

[QUOTE=joemach;7573232
Sounds like you need to ask some more questions until you get the full understanding as to why it is being done.[/QUOTE]

If they tell him that they will have to kill him.:CU:

[joemach]

If they tell him that they will have to kill him.:CU:

Oh, well!

[VTP99]

The bean counters did the math. What do we no ?

[jaweberiii]

So basically what im getting from you guys is that it doesnt make sense to you either.....interesting

[jaweberiii]

I bet I do work for you guys.

Jim

Well Jim, i work for Hershey Ice Cream in Harrisburg, Pa and I know we have a branch down there I just don't know where exactly

[jaweberiii]

Oh, well!

oh well..... dang kinda harsh on me :cheers:

[HvacStudentWTI]

[QUOTE=HvacStudentWTI;7565692]

The liquid line is not the suction line.

when i said liquid line = suction line i meant i made a typo

[knewguy]

It doesn't have to make sense.

The first service company I worked for the owner demanded

that if you replaced a compressor in a unit you also replaced the txv

even if it worked.


I thought that was strange.

[pdrake65]

[QUOTE=pdrake65;7566152]

when i said liquid line = suction line i meant i made a typo

Gotch ya! Just making sure.