N2 USB to Serial Connection?

[Chris_Worthington]

Its been forever since I have had to connect to an FX control and am having an issue connecting, here's what I got...

232-485 converter from Johnson and a generic USB to serial adapter I just picked up.

I installed the software for the adapter, I have changed com ports, etc. and every time I open N2 Com Pro it sees no serial connection.

Any clue, gotta be missing something stupid here :D

[s2sam]

Its been forever since I have had to connect to an FX control and am having an issue connecting, here's what I got...

232-485 converter from Johnson and a generic USB to serial adapter I just picked up.

I installed the software for the adapter, I have changed com ports, etc. and every time I open N2 Com Pro it sees no serial connection.

Any clue, gotta be missing something stupid here :D

Good day Chris,

Are you saying that the FX software does not show a COM port that you can communicate on? If so, then the FX software you have is dated. I have heard of this issue before and the customer I spoke with had to call JCI for an update. For some reason the FX software does (did) not see the virtual COM ports that are generated by the USB based converters... To me this tells me that they are (were) not enumerating the COM ports via the correct (Windows) methods...

As a secondary test, open up Device Manager and see if you can see the COM port(s) under the "Ports (COM & LPT)" section. If you can see them there, then the problem is with the FX software.

Cheers,

Sam

[BACnet]

As a secondary option- you may want to reduce the sheer number of converters involved.

RS485 to USB adapters are all over the web. A quick google search brought up over 10 links to places selling them for less than twenty bucks each, some well cheaper than that...

Your mileage may vary of course- with cheap parts you can often get bad results. But for next to nothing you might want to pick one up just to play with as you try to figure out the weak link in your chain.

[s2sam]

As a secondary option- you may want to reduce the sheer number of converters involved.

RS485 to USB adapters are all over the web. A quick google search brought up over 10 links to places selling them for less than twenty bucks each, some well cheaper than that...

Your mileage may vary of course- with cheap parts you can often get bad results. But for next to nothing you might want to pick one up just to play with as you try to figure out the weak link in your chain.

Good day BACNet,

Indeed, one can try this... However, if it is the problem I have heard of then the effort will be futile. The first check would be to see if the COM port exists in Device Manager. The second thing would be to test this port using Hyperterminal, HVACPro, etc and see if it works. If so then you know the USB adapter is working correctly under Windows and the problem then has to be the FX software.

Cheers,

Sam

[Chris_Worthington]

I can see it under ports and have tried changing the port assignment a few times, rebooting, this and that, notta :-(

Still the same thing "No Serial" when I open up Comm Pro,,,, don't even get a chance to select a port?

Could be the adapter quality? Staples was across the street, so that's what I got...

FX Builder version 5.3.104

[Chris_Worthington]

Sam,

I think you nailed it, wouldn't happen to have an upgraded version by chance :D

[thefreezerguy]

I have had this same issue with Com-Trol. The upload / download kit they sell has to interface with a serial port.
I have found very few USB to SERIAL converters that will work.The one that will work is the IOGEAR model GUC232A. Good Luck!

[s2sam]

Sam,

I think you nailed it, wouldn't happen to have an upgraded version by chance :D

Good day Chris,

Sadly, I don't... I worked with one of my customers on this and he was the one that had the software. Sorry!

Did you try the test with Hyperterminal, HVACPro, etc to confirm that the converter works? Do this test just to be sure.

Cheers,

Sam

[s2sam]

I have had this same issue with Com-Trol. The upload / download kit they sell has to interface with a serial port.
I have found very few USB to SERIAL converters that will work.The one that will work is the IOGEAR model GUC232A. Good Luck!

Good day,

Given the evidence I have seen, I do not think that it is converter specific. All USB based converters create virtual COM ports which seems to be the issue. I suspect that the FX software is not enumerating the ports through conventional and/or standard methods as if they were virtual ports would be found (Window COM Port APIs do not care if the port is virtual or hardwired... they work the same).

Cheers,

Sam

[thefreezerguy]

Good day,

Given the evidence I have seen, I do not think that it is converter specific. All USB based converters create virtual COM ports which seems to be the issue. I suspect that the FX software is not enumerating the ports through conventional and/or standard methods as if they were virtual ports would be found (Window COM Port APIs do not care if the port is virtual or hardwired... they work the same).

Cheers,

Sam

I am not familiar with this FX software. But I do know from experience that not all usb to serial adapters that create a virtual port work the same. Like I said, very few that I tried were able to operate as if it were a true serial port, even when all com ports are set up correctly. Anyway, just my two cents. I just wanted to throw out my experience with them so it didn't get overlooked as a possible issue. Again, Good Luck!

[s2sam]

I am not familiar with this FX software. But I do know from experience that not all usb to serial adapters that create a virtual port work the same. Like I said, very few that I tried were able to operate as if it were a true serial port, even when all com ports are set up correctly. Anyway, just my two cents. I just wanted to throw out my experience with them so it didn't get overlooked as a possible issue. Again, Good Luck!

Good day,

You are indeed correct here:


<snip>But I do know from experience that not all usb to serial adapters that create a virtual port work the same. Like I said, very few that I tried were able to operate as if it were a true serial port, even when all com ports are set up correctly.

However, this statement needs a comment:


<snip>Like I said, very few that I tried were able to operate as if it were a true serial port, even when all com ports are set up correctly.

To me a true serial port is one that is hardwired... meaning that it is physically connected to the documented and known hardware addresses (i.e. 0x3f8, etc). USB based serial ports can never be "true" by my definition, as they physically do not exist at the known hardware addresses. It is true that one could write a specific device driver to mimic the responses at these hardware addresses, but this would only work if the calling program tried to access the hardware addresses via the operating system API. If an application was to access the hardware directly (which is a no-no and highly frowned upon by Windows), then accessing the addresses would reveal nothing physically present. In the DOS and early Windows (and although rare even now), that is how applications would access the serial ports and hence why these programs will not work with a USB based Serial port. The FX software is not like this, or perhaps it wasn't on earlier versions and so the likely hood that they went to the very old style of serial port access is very low. Hence my comment about their enumeration procedure.

Anyway, place do not take my responses as slights, but rather me just sharing some information. Indeed, comments and suggestions by everyone is extremely helpful and insightful!

Cheers,

Sam

[Chris_Worthington]

Got word from tech support this morning that the "only" USB to Serial adapter that will function with N2 Com Pro is the Digi edgeport_1 http://www.digi.com/products/model.jsp?lid=EN&pgid=38&pfid=25&mtid=207&amtid=207&pm=Y having one overnighted :eek2:

Will report back once I get it :D

[GT Jets]

Got word from tech support this morning that the "only" USB to Serial adapter that will function with N2 Com Pro is the Digi edgeport_1 http://www.digi.com/products/model.jsp?lid=EN&pgid=38&pfid=25&mtid=207&amtid=207&pm=Y having one overnighted :eek2:

Will report back once I get it :D


I believe you also need a software patch to run the Digi on Johnson stuff...Version 808b I believe, I have it if you need it....

GT

[Chris_Worthington]

I believe you also need a software patch to run the Digi on Johnson stuff...Version 808b I believe, I have it if you need it....

GT

If you could send it, that would greatly appreciated and thank you!!! :D

Email in profile

[s2sam]

Got word from tech support this morning that the "only" USB to Serial adapter that will function with N2 Com Pro is the Digi edgeport_1 http://www.digi.com/products/model.jsp?lid=EN&pgid=38&pfid=25&mtid=207&amtid=207&pm=Y having one overnighted :eek2:

Will report back once I get it :D

Good day Chris,

If this is indeed the case, then JCI is crippling (i.e. doing it on purpose) their software to only work with this device... I have just sent an e-mail to my customer who had this issue to see what he did to resolve it. I, too, will report back.

If JCI is indeed doing this, then I will be writing some software to overcome this juvenile attempt by JCI and/or the FX Software developers.

Cheers,

Sam

[GT Jets]

If you could send it, that would greatly appreciated and thank you!!! :D

Email in profile

Sent...:putergreet:

GT

[Chris_Worthington]

Sent...:putergreet:

GT

Got it, Thank you!!!

[s2sam]

Got word from tech support this morning that the "only" USB to Serial adapter that will function with N2 Com Pro is the Digi edgeport_1 http://www.digi.com/products/model.jsp?lid=EN&pgid=38&pfid=25&mtid=207&amtid=207&pm=Y having one overnighted :eek2:

Will report back once I get it :D

Good day Chris,

I just received the e-mail from my customer that was having issues a while ago. Here is his response:



I have ComPro version 5.3.41 this may be a version are two behind, but I have never had a problem with your device. As a matter of fact it is the only device of this type that I have never had a problem with.


You mentioned you were at version .104 and so they either "crippled" their software or they have a problem. I am curious which it is. Anyway, please post your results with the Digi Adapter... as this will determine if I need to do some software magic :)

Cheers,

Sam

[foyler]

Chris,

You have mail.

[s2sam]

Got word from tech support this morning that the "only" USB to Serial adapter that will function with N2 Com Pro is the Digi edgeport_1 http://www.digi.com/products/model.jsp?lid=EN&pgid=38&pfid=25&mtid=207&amtid=207&pm=Y having one overnighted :eek2:

Will report back once I get it :D

Good day Chris,

Any news on how the Digi works?

Cheers,

Sam

[Chris_Worthington]

Good day Chris,

Any news on how the Digi works?

Cheers,

Sam

The Digi worked once :eek2:

Opened and closed N2 Com Pro and no more worky. The lappy I was working with was an old one laying around the shop that had XP, mine is Vista.

Called tech support and they stated that it must be a software conflict and that I believe because there was a bunch of hacked/unlicensed programs, including windows.

Picked up another lappy with an internal serial port connection and called it done for now ;-)

Gonna reformat the other one and try it again, will let you know how it pans out.


Chris

[s2sam]

The Digi worked once :eek2:

Opened and closed N2 Com Pro and no more worky. The lappy I was working with was an old one laying around the shop that had XP, mine is Vista.

Called tech support and they stated that it must be a software conflict and that I believe because there was a bunch of hacked/unlicensed programs, including windows.

Picked up another lappy with an internal serial port connection and called it done for now ;-)

Gonna reformat the other one and try it again, will let you know how it pans out.


Chris

Good day Chris,

Thanks for the update. Sadly, given that there were other issues with the laptop, I would say that the Digi test is indeterminate... alas...

Once you sort out that old laptop it will be interesting to see the results.

Thanks again for your efforts to inform us!

Cheers,

Sam

[quadonice]

I think I've finished pulling all my hair out trying to get this USB to Serial converter to work and come to find out I need to patch my HVACPro 8.08. Could someone please send me the patch for HVACPro 8.08?

Thank you

[Cagey57]

You've got mail ! Follow the inst though !

[quadonice]

I'll give it a try

[s2sam]

Good day All,

I just received a call from a fellow that is having issues with FX CommPro version 5.4.1 . In his case, no ports are shown/available within CommPro... even hardware serial ports. Interestingly, his COM port is shown in device manager (hardware port) and works fine with HVACPro and so the hardware is fine.

I checked with a few of my customers and so far the latest version that has been known to work fine (with hardware and USB serial devices) is 5.3.104. Is there anyone on here that is using version 5.4.1 and can report if there are any issues using this release? If not, then there maybe something amiss with the fellow's system... otherwise it is the CommPro version problem.

Thanks in advance!

Cheers,

Sam

[Cagey57]

Running Commpro N2 on 2 different Laptops at 5.4.1. Old LT has serial port and internal modem. Cannot get Edgeport/1 to work at all and Comm pro 5.4.1 will not find available connection. Called Tech Support and did everything they said still no luck with CommPro N2.

Newer laptop has serial port (no internal modem) and works with both Edgeport/1 and direct serial on Rev 5.4.1. No clue why or why not.

I'll keep screwing around with older LT and let you know if I can get it to work. Older LT has (had) multiple dialup Ax connections. Removed them but that made no difference.

I am wondering if the modem has anything to do with it.

I am stumped but I think it is either CommPro or OS but I am not savy enough to find out which one it is..........Yet !

[s2sam]

Running Commpro N2 on 2 different Laptops at 5.4.1. Old LT has serial port and internal modem. Cannot get Edgeport/1 to work at all and Comm pro 5.4.1 will not find available connection. Called Tech Support and did everything they said still no luck with CommPro N2.

Newer laptop has serial port (no internal modem) and works with both Edgeport/1 and direct serial on Rev 5.4.1. No clue why or why not.

I'll keep screwing around with older LT and let you know if I can get it to work. Older LT has (had) multiple dialup Ax connections. Removed them but that made no difference.

I am wondering if the modem has anything to do with it.

I am stumped but I think it is either CommPro or OS but I am not savy enough to find out which one it is..........Yet !

Good day CCIKelly,

Thanks for response and the info! Your two laptop situation is similar to the fellow who called me earlier.

However, it does look like the 5.4.1 works... sort of... or is somewhat cranky with some older systems... weird. To me it would appear that their serial driver is buggy and/or not well tested, as this would explain why this version will work on some systems and not others. Given these results, it would appear that their driver does not use standard Windows serial port APIs/Libraries... which is odd and problematic, as the standard Windows APIs/Libs minimize these type of compatibility issues...

Cheers,

Sam

[mallot999]

I believe you also need a software patch to run the Digi on Johnson stuff...Version 808b I believe, I have it if you need it....

GT

Could I also bother you for that by chance? I too am having problems talking to N2 with USB-Serial adapter!

[ctremblay]

If using Windows 7, you should try using XP Virtual machine to run Comm Pro N2. We have stopped trying to connect with Comm Pro directly (an our PCs have true DB-9 serial port...)

XP Mode of Windows 7 accept to pass throught the serial port inside the VM (have to configure it in the options)

[mechdorn]

I've tried several off the shelf adapters, none of them work with JCI. Some might work a little here and there, overall just a waist of time. Sam won't say it, but I will, his works perfectly on all JCI products plus every other product I had to use for. Now, his doesn't cost 30 bucks, (add the cost to the next 5 customers), we have three, all running on several different platforms without a hassle. Thanks Sam!

[freddy-b]

I/O gear works great and you would still have enough leftover to buy a couple dozen T-Tappers.

[Mark817]

This is an old post but for what it worth I use a belkin converter and it works fine but only on XP.

Also don't forget you cant have another PC on the network running at the same time.