Is Goodman good brand?

[uva0224]

I found very little info about this brand, but one contractor recommends it.
It has 10 yr warranty, and good price etc.
Should I even consider this brand?

Thanks,

[easygoer]

There are more Goodman units installed out there than anything else. Do you think it is because they are the best? No, they out number the rest because they are the cheapest thing you can install. Can they still do a good job? Yes if they are installed correctly and the system is sized correctly. But even if you get the right size unit and have a good install it is still a Goodman. They use a lighter grade material and cheap components like capacitors that are made in Mexico and they install the filter drier on the inside of the condenser. That doesn't make them bad it is just a pain in the ass for me when I am making one of the many repairs I always have to do on them. Their coils leak prematurely and over all they just don't stand up when you compare them to say a Trane or Lennox. Yes, Goodman has what is supposed to be a better system the Amana which has a higher seer and two speed compressors but that is just more problems to deal with and you will have problems with a complicated system like that. I would take single speed non variable motors Goodman system over any two speed variable Amana system.

[Airmechanical]

There are more Goodman units installed out there than anything else. Do you think it is because they are the best? No, they out number the rest because they are the cheapest thing you can install. Can they still do a good job? Yes if they are installed correctly and the system is sized correctly. But even if you get the right size unit and have a good install it is still a Goodman. They use a lighter grade material and cheap components like capacitors that are made in Mexico and they install the filter drier on the inside of the condenser. That doesn't make them bad it is just a pain in the ass for me when I am making one of the many repairs I always have to do on them. Their coils leak prematurely and over all they just don't stand up when you compare them to say a Trane or Lennox. Yes, Goodman has what is supposed to be a better system the Amana which has a higher seer and two speed compressors but that is just more problems to deal with and you will have problems with a complicated system like that. I would take single speed non variable motors Goodman system over any two speed variable Amana system.

:nopity:



.

[Stamas]

There are more Goodman units installed out there than anything else. Do you think it is because they are the best? No, they out number the rest because they are the cheapest thing you can install. Can they still do a good job? Yes if they are installed correctly and the system is sized correctly. But even if you get the right size unit and have a good install it is still a Goodman. They use a lighter grade material and cheap components like capacitors that are made in Mexico and they install the filter drier on the inside of the condenser. That doesn't make them bad it is just a pain in the ass for me when I am making one of the many repairs I always have to do on them. Their coils leak prematurely and over all they just don't stand up when you compare them to say a Trane or Lennox. Yes, Goodman has what is supposed to be a better system the Amana which has a higher seer and two speed compressors but that is just more problems to deal with and you will have problems with a complicated system like that. I would take single speed non variable motors Goodman system over any two speed variable Amana system.


Now we've got rant that out of the way, maybe we can move on.

[simplyrollin]

Your going to catch heat for the Goodman bashing. The Goodman lovers tend to come out in droves.:pop:

[big sky hvac]

Wouldn't be my first choice. I like Lennox. Trane is also good. The main thing is the quality of the install. You can have the best equipment money can buy, have it installed poorly, and it's no better than the cheaper equipment. Just because the manufacturer has a "great" warranty doesn't mean it's great equipment, although having a good warranty isn't a bad thing.

[captube]

Research your contractor would be my advice, if he recommends Goodman it won't be because he has major problems with the brand.
You stated 1 reason a lot of people choose Goodman, 10 year warranty and a good price. I would ask about the upgrade to cover labor also.

[AvantGarde]

.............................

[gary_g]

I found very little info about this brand, but one contractor recommends it.
It has 10 yr warranty, and good price etc.
Should I even consider this brand?

Thanks,

Search "Goodman" on this site.

You'll find hundreds of posts, along with opinions, arguing, bashing, fighting, swearing, chest-thumping, and food fights. OK, no real food fights.

Good luck.

[beshvac]

Goodman is as good of a brand as all the other builder grade units out there.

Is your "installing contractor" the best?

Installation makes the difference.

There are "installation contractors" in my area that sell top name brands (or their own brand equipment) I wouldn't recommend.

[uva0224]

You guys didn't tell me anything :oops:

OK, maybe I can make my quesiton easier.
Is Bryant Preferred or Evolution safer bet than Mr.goodman??

Anyone working in DE area ?



Search "Goodman" on this site.

You'll find hundreds of posts, along with opinions, arguing, bashing, fighting, swearing, chest-thumping, and food fights. OK, no real food fights.

Good luck.

[JKSERVICES]

Get what you pay for. They have stepped up there game lately, Copeland scroll compressors, 10 year warranty (cheap caps still) . as far as filter drier location same as the old Rheems. :munching:

[beshvac]

double post

[JAH0983]

if installed properly, goodman will last you just as long as any other brand. I have 8 year old goodman units ive installed that have yet to break down.

[beshvac]

You guys didn't tell me anything :oops:

OK, maybe I can make my quesiton easier.
Is Bryant Preferred or Evolution safer bet than Mr.goodman??

Anyone working in DE area ?


That is not easier.....Is some dumb A** going to put it in?

This is a skilled trade. You can buy a fridge at lowes or home depot and it does not matter if their delivery charge is different, but it does in HVAC installation:patriot:

[easygoer]

It funny how obvious it is that the weather is so mild right now. We got all these hvac contractors (myself included) sitting around fighting about whether or not Goodman makes good equipment. Man , I cant wait for the weather to heat up. So I can get off of the computer and get out there fixing the thousands of Goodman systems I repair every year.:argue:

[sammy37]

It funny how obvious it is that the weather is so mild right now. We got all these hvac contractors (myself included) sitting around fighting about whether or not Goodman makes good equipment. Man , I cant wait for the weather to heat up. So I can get off of the computer and get out there fixing the thousands of Goodman systems I repair every year.:argue:

Oh lord, another Goodman basher!

I guess you dont repair anything else down there, huh.

Like I said in another post, it has to be bad installs.

We have thousands of Goodman package units here, both new and old. We have many houses here with Goodmans still sitting on them from 20 years ago.

I have installed many of them and I have said this over and over, I have yet to get a phone call for a breakdown.

[dash]

Research your contractor would be my advice, if he recommends Goodman it won't be because he has major problems with the brand.
You stated 1 reason a lot of people choose Goodman, 10 year warranty and a good price. I would ask about the upgrade to cover labor also.

Not to dunk the OP's contractor, s/he may be the best of the best,but many Goodmans we work on the homeowner can't find the contractor,plus they claim they we never told to register the warranty,so tough luck there.

[KeyResults]

I found very little info about this brand, but one contractor recommends it.
It has 10 yr warranty, and good price etc.
Should I even consider this brand?

Thanks,

1. Rank the installers (experience, time in business, overall professionalism, whatever you think is important...if they're not willing to help you get comfortable move on to one that wants your business...we're out there!)

2. Rank the total cost of ownership of the equip (EER / SEER) proposed - the tech will probably do this for you and help you understand the trade-offs between efficiency and cost for various brands and models.

3. Rank the warranties (labor and parts) over time - if something does go wrong what happens exactly and who pays for what?

Don't forget to factor in cost of annual checkups, service calls, maintenance plans, etc.

Even the best brands fail prematurely if improperly installed or function poorly if incorrectly sized.

Just like the family doctor, everyone should have a trusted HVAC tech you trust. Once you've got that problem solved go, with the equipment they trust and have confidence in...you can't go wrong. In the unlikely event something does break, you'll know exactly who to call.

K

[Stamas]

Their coils leak prematurely

I have less Goodman A coil failures than the other brands mentioned here, one of which is my main brand.
And we have a lot of Goodman equipment here.
OP, I service the lower DE area and there are some other contractors in here that do to.

[Twilly]

Twilli says Coleman

[captube]

Not to dunk the OP's contractor, s/he may be the best of the best,but many Goodmans we work on the homeowner can't find the contractor,plus they claim they we never told to register the warranty,so tough luck there.

Research your contractor would be my advice.

[Pete3]

Well said, much better reply than the brand bashers!

[crayx4]

Are Amana's components different from Goodman's? Is it worth the price difference?
Amana makes 1 stage units too, are they any better than equivalent Goodman's or are they jus the same thing?

I have been recently told by a contractor that Goodman and Amana are "builder grade", which I assume from his scorn, was his way to say they are bad... He says he installs only Am Stan as he says that's the best... Didn't totally convinced me.. When I told him that the Amana unit had the same warranty as Am Stan. (and half the price for the labor warranty), he said most Goodman/Amana installers never register the warranties, so you get scr*** anyway.. He said that in Houston's weather, you don't want anything like that cheap stuff... He had similar comments for other brands, including Maytag, which would be my first choice.







There are more Goodman units installed out there than anything else. Do you think it is because they are the best? No, they out number the rest because they are the cheapest thing you can install. Can they still do a good job? Yes if they are installed correctly and the system is sized correctly. But even if you get the right size unit and have a good install it is still a Goodman. They use a lighter grade material and cheap components like capacitors that are made in Mexico and they install the filter drier on the inside of the condenser. That doesn't make them bad it is just a pain in the ass for me when I am making one of the many repairs I always have to do on them. Their coils leak prematurely and over all they just don't stand up when you compare them to say a Trane or Lennox. Yes, Goodman has what is supposed to be a better system the Amana which has a higher seer and two speed compressors but that is just more problems to deal with and you will have problems with a complicated system like that. I would take single speed non variable motors Goodman system over any two speed variable Amana system.

[seatonheating]

Are Amana's components different from Goodman's? Is it worth the price difference?
Amana makes 1 stage units too, are they any better than equivalent Goodman's or are they jus the same thing?

I have been recently told by a contractor that Goodman and Amana are "builder grade", which I assume from his scorn, was his way to say they are bad... He says he installs only Am Stan as he says that's the best... Didn't totally convinced me.. When I told him that the Amana unit had the same warranty as Am Stan. (and half the price for the labor warranty), he said most Goodman/Amana installers never register the warranties, so you get scr*** anyway.. He said that in Houston's weather, you don't want anything like that cheap stuff... He had similar comments for other brands, including Maytag, which would be my first choice.

A contractor should be ranking himself. Not the equipment.

[HPGui]

Are Amana's components different from Goodman's? Is it worth the price difference?
Amana makes 1 stage units too, are they any better than equivalent Goodman's or are they jus the same thing?

I have been recently told by a contractor that Goodman and Amana are "builder grade", which I assume from his scorn, was his way to say they are bad... He says he installs only Am Stan as he says that's the best... Didn't totally convinced me.. When I told him that the Amana unit had the same warranty as Am Stan. (and half the price for the labor warranty), he said most Goodman/Amana installers never register the warranties, so you get scr*** anyway.. He said that in Houston's weather, you don't want anything like that cheap stuff... He had similar comments for other brands, including Maytag, which would be my first choice.

Amana has two lines, the cheaper of which is called Distinctions. That one is more or less the same as Goodman's equipment. The higher-end Amana units have better features and a better warranty, which you can register yourself by mail or online. Many manufacturers have different brands and/or different levels of quality within a given product category. This offers customers the choice to select a different mix of price and performance. Goodman/Amana is no exception. Neither is American Standard/Trane.

[MLeonhardt]

Goodman is a very good brand. They have also improved their product in the last few years and compete with Lennox and Trane. Amana seems to be the same product , made and assembeled in the same plant. They have been in business for many years and have a really good warranty.

I replaced my 18 year old units with new Goodman units 2 years ago. Only a few install problems. Took the tech 2 hrs to fix. They have been working great in the Texas 100 degree heat.

I dont believe you can go wrong with the units.

[Shamoke]

I believe, and I know that I will be corrected if wrong, that Goodman makes Amana. I have been installing Goodman units for about 5 or 6 years now and have not had any problems with them. They have improved their cases greatly over those years which was my only complaint with the brand so now I don't even have that to complain about.

[the dangling wrangler]

There are more Goodman units installed out there than anything else. Do you think it is because they are the best? No, they out number the rest because they are the cheapest thing you can install. Can they still do a good job? Yes if they are installed correctly and the system is sized correctly. But even if you get the right size unit and have a good install it is still a Goodman. They use a lighter grade material and cheap components like capacitors that are made in Mexico and they install the filter drier on the inside of the condenser. That doesn't make them bad it is just a pain in the ass for me when I am making one of the many repairs I always have to do on them. Their coils leak prematurely and over all they just don't stand up when you compare them to say a Trane or Lennox. Yes, Goodman has what is supposed to be a better system the Amana which has a higher seer and two speed compressors but that is just more problems to deal with and you will have problems with a complicated system like that. I would take single speed non variable motors Goodman system over any two speed variable Amana system.

http://i49.tinypic.com/28lq6mt.jpg

[HPGui]

Many manufacturers use identical components sourced from third party OEM's. Others distinguish one line from another by offering extras as standard equipment, like compressor sound blankets, copeland scrolls, nicer cabinets, or unit replacement vs. part replacement warranties. It's not like each company's product is unique to that company, so why the big deal over who is best? I think it's because when things go wrong, most homeowners have no idea why. Attributing their problems to the manufacturer gives them the feeling of having sorted things out, but that perception is illusory. Just look at those websites that offer comparative reviews of HVAC equipment. Under EVERY brand, you'll find folks saying "Ill never buy such and such brand again." How can they all be right? For the same reasons, homeowners also focus on equipment and purchase price rather than airflow balancing, static pressure, refrigerant charging, and other esoteric but important installation issues.

And by the way, when you check the user ratings on those comparison sites, you'll find that the highest overall scores belong to ....Goodman and Amana. Regardless of brand name, you can buy a system with all the bells and whistles or one that's more basic. But none will make you happy unless the contractor gets the system to run the way you'd like. So guess which side of the equation we should all be focusing on?

[freonjohn]

Equipment brand is only a part of the total job. Contractor quality is the most important part. Call STAMAS, he works your area and will be able to sit down and explain to you everything you need to know before spending a lot of money. It's very hard to rate equipment against other equipment, so you are not likely to get the simple answer you were looking for.

[dash]

You guys didn't tell me anything :oops:

OK, maybe I can make my quesiton easier.
Is Bryant Preferred or Evolution safer bet than Mr.goodman??

Anyone working in DE area ?

Yes

[seatonheating]

Yes


dumb statement and really unnecessary!!

[Twilly]

Twilli says Goodmans are ok, if you can't afford a nice unit.

[crayx4]

Are the Goodman and Amana 2 stage units EXACTLY the same, apart from the outside looks of the condenser?


I believe, and I know that I will be corrected if wrong, that Goodman makes Amana. I have been installing Goodman units for about 5 or 6 years now and have not had any problems with them. They have improved their cases greatly over those years which was my only complaint with the brand so now I don't even have that to complain about.

[hvaclarry]

cray....the amana will have a lifetime unit replacement 14 seer or above the goodman just has a lifetime compressor warranty

[crayx4]

But EQUIPMENT is the same? Then when you buy Amana you are buying the SAME Goodman with a longer warranty?? :whistle:


cray....the amana will have a lifetime unit replacement 14 seer or above the goodman just has a lifetime compressor warranty

[hvaclarry]

What seer are you buying? the amana 16 seer is 2 stage the goodman is not, the 13 and 14 single stage the amana has a 2 speed condenser motor that has an ambient sensing relay, the goodman does not. that and the warranty is the only difference

[HSI]

I have install Goodman/Amana for four to five years. There good units if installed correctly. All units have problems make sure your contractor has good support from the dist. and parts are easy to get. Most Goodman dist. have parts in stock. Most Goodman parts are standard stock. Some other company have parts problems. If you have the best equipment and cannot get parts it will be broke until it comes in. So it could be bad if you have a problem.

[crayx4]

You sure??
So DSXC16 + GMVC8 is DIFFERENT from ASXC16+AMVC8??
I thought they were the SAME rebadged units..



What seer are you buying? the amana 16 seer is 2 stage the goodman is not, the 13 and 14 single stage the amana has a 2 speed condenser motor that has an ambient sensing relay, the goodman does not. that and the warranty is the only difference

[hvaclarry]

sorry yeah the dxc is the same the ssx is the single stage

[I_bend_metal]

I found very little info about this brand, but one contractor recommends it.
It has 10 yr warranty, and good price etc.
Should I even consider this brand?

Thanks,

Does brand matter?? NOPE....I can make any brand equipment do anything possible. Why? Because I know my stuff and equipment is equipment. My company installs Goodman / Amana exclusively....I offer 2 years...YES 2 YEARS of a money back guarantee....and I have NEVER had to give anyone their money back.

Everyone loves to come on here and bash Goodman....should I mention the Carrier heat exchangers or the Lennox evap coils, or the numerous parts "made in Mexico" that all of these units use??? Nah, I won't do that because I am a technician.....and EVERYTHING BREAKS.....and I fix EVERYTHING....

Don't worry about the brand....worry about the company you are buying....you know, the company putting your system in, the company that will be there 24 hours a day, the company that doesn't treat you like a number, the company that sends a tech out who already knows your name......yeah, that one.......

;)

[I_bend_metal]

Twilli says Goodmans are ok, if you can't afford a nice unit.

I'm a little disappointed with this statement Twilli.....

I'm placing a call to Judge Judy as we speak.....

;)

[crayx4]

You got me thinking... I went and checked their websites.
IT seems that the two furnaces I listed below differ only in the type of heat exchanger??

Goodman
Aluminized steel, dual-diameter tubular heat exchanger

Amana
MillionAir® stainless-steel, dual-diameter tubular heat exchanger


I wonder if there's any difference at all or if it's just marketing to show them as different.... and if they are different, if there's any added value in the Amana's..



sorry yeah the dxc is the same the ssx is the single stage

[I_bend_metal]

dumb statement and really unnecessary!!

I agree........

[garya505]

You got me thinking... I went and checked their websites.
IT seems that the two furnaces I listed below differ only in the type of heat exchanger??

Goodman
Aluminized steel, dual-diameter tubular heat exchanger

Amana
MillionAir® stainless-steel, dual-diameter tubular heat exchanger


I wonder if there's any difference at all or if it's just marketing to show them as different.... and if they are different, if there's any added value in the Amana's..

The furnaces are the same except for the heat exchanger and warranty (and badges).

[seatonheating]

I find it really disturbing that 2 pros I really respect on this site, Twilly and Dash, basically bashed Goodman.



I'll put in anything, anytime, anywhere....AND IT WILL PERFORM!!!!!!


I agree with you "I Bend Metal".


Back up those statements you made, Twilly and Dash!!!

[tedkidd]

Get the gmvc with communicating control. Ask to have the return insulated or it may be a little noisy.

The evolution is also communicating so long as you get the right control, and will be quieter out of the box.

Don't get a non-communicating furnace.

[garya505]

I'll put in anything, anytime, anywhere....AND IT WILL PERFORM!!!!!!


I had a girlfriend in college that always said that. :D

[psychopunk42069]

yes goodman is very good,, i have been to their plant in houston and all they build is A/C 's and Heaters, unlike many other brands like carrier etc... who have all their money and assets tied up in other things like elevators and things not pertaining to A/C. never had no problems with goodman in the last 6 years

[mrfixit61]

If Goodman/Amana is that bad, Why do they continue to give a 10 yr warranty? Seems to me that companys that can't stand behind their equipment, tend to move on down the road because of to many claims. Combine a good warranty with good installers and you end up with a satisfied customer for years to come!

[garya505]

If Goodman/Amana is that bad, Why do they continue to give a 10 yr warranty? Seems to me that companys that can't stand behind their equipment, tend to move on down the road because of to many claims. Combine a good warranty with good installers and you end up with a satisfied customer for years to come!

Goodman is probably the best selling brand out there. I think they have a bad reputation for two reasons - 1) some of their older equipment was poor quality, and 2) it's the most common brand installed by DIYers and hacks, and as a result may have more problems.

IMO it's about as good as any other brand.

[tedkidd]

Nicely put!



1) some of their older equipment was poor quality,
2) it's the most common brand installed by DIYers and hacks, and as a result may have more problems.


Add to #2 for clarification:
... that are install related rather than the equipment related.

I don't think it's always clear to homeowners that the furnace is just PART of their heating system, and a lot goes into getting that system properly matched and installed.

[cory]

I have two goodman ac's. My 2 ton upstairs unit just runs non-stop in the summer, can't ever catch up except for 4 AM.

My 3 ton downstairs unit recently broke a motor mount. The $5 part was covered under warranty and the $140 installation fee was not.

[garya505]

I have two goodman ac's. My 2 ton upstairs unit just runs non-stop in the summer, can't ever catch up except for 4 AM.

My 3 ton downstairs unit recently broke a motor mount. The $5 part was covered under warranty and the $140 installation fee was not.

An improperly sized unit is not the fault of the manufacturer, and manufacturers don't set labor rates.

[hvacvegas]

An improperly sized unit is not the fault of the manufacturer, and manufacturers don't set labor rates.
Pretty much.

Nor have I seen a part that cheap. Cory, quit talking out of your arse, and remove your pricing.
Sounds like you should have gotten a labor warranty.

[I_bend_metal]

I have two goodman ac's. My 2 ton upstairs unit just runs non-stop in the summer, can't ever catch up except for 4 AM.

My 3 ton downstairs unit recently broke a motor mount. The $5 part was covered under warranty and the $140 installation fee was not.

LMAO!! I know how much labor warranties are for Goodman.....

You could have covered everything for this price....:beat:

Labor costs are not set by Goodman.....

Think before you post.....:censored:

[dash]

If the only car franchise I can get is Kia, I'm likely to tell you it's all about my dealership, and my Kia is as good as any car. Get my point, research it a little more on the internet. Not everyone has access to name brands , at a price that is competitive in the market.

[tedkidd]

I have two goodman ac's. My 2 ton upstairs unit just runs non-stop in the summer, can't ever catch up except for 4 AM.

My 3 ton downstairs unit recently broke a motor mount. The $5 part was covered under warranty and the $140 installation fee was not.


My hair gets wet when it rains. Is it my hairs fault it doesn't stay dry, or is it because my roof has holes in it.

Treat symptoms or cure the disease. Fix your house and your equipment will no longer be undersized.

[dash]

An improperly sized unit is not the fault of the manufacturer, and manufacturers don't set labor rates.

True, but isn't it their choice of who they sell to. Don't see many high end car dealers with poor practices!!

[czkidd]

I

[cturman]

I have two goodman ac's. My 2 ton upstairs unit just runs non-stop in the summer, can't ever catch up except for 4 AM.

My 3 ton downstairs unit recently broke a motor mount. The $5 part was covered under warranty and the $140 installation fee was not.

Last time I checked heat rises. Why do you have a smaller unit upstairs?

[classical]

True, but isn't it their choice of who they sell to. Don't see many high end car dealers with poor practices!!

I have access to all brands and at exceptional pricing, I dumped Bryant picked up Lennox and still sell Goodman and it is not because I or they are cheap.

The devil is in the details equipment is only as good as the contractor that installs it.

FYI Goodman/Amana is about to introduce a zoning product that will rival the Infinity and Harmony III system which means I will be selling even more Goodman.

[RoseRx]

FYI Goodman/Amana is about to introduce a zoning product that will rival the Infinity and Harmony III system which means I will be selling even more Goodman.

What's this new zoning system that Goodman/Amana will be offering?

[dash]

My hair gets wet when it rains. Is it my hairs fault it doesn't stay dry, or is it because my roof has holes in it.

Treat symptoms or cure the disease. Fix your house and your equipment will no longer be undersized.

Got your PM, but reply won't go through, says you choose not to recieve PM's.

[dash]

I have access to all brands and at exceptional pricing, I dumped Bryant picked up Lennox and still sell Goodman and it is not because I or they are cheap.

The devil is in the details equipment is only as good as the contractor that installs it.

FYI Goodman/Amana is about to introduce a zoning product that will rival the Infinity and Harmony III system which means I will be selling even more Goodman.

First , you will be selling or Wellhome will be selling,since Wellhome wouldn't be your choice?

Will Goomans zoning rival Infinity to the same extent their communicating systems do? If so, lol!


If only you knew what's coming out ,in the near future. We'll see who has the last laugh.

As to the OP's question, no it's not even a good brand.

[classical]

First , you will be selling or Wellhome will be selling,since Wellhome wouldn't be your choice?

Will Goomans zoning rival Infinity to the same extent their communicating systems do? If so, lol!


If only you knew what's coming out ,in the near future. We'll see who has the last laugh.

As to the OP's question, no it's not even a good brand.

I am aware of what is coming out since I am still a Bryant dealer and am kept up to date on what is coming down the pike. The reason I do not sell Bryant anymore is because of the controls failures specifically the Evolution controls. I have had issues with about 50% of the ones I installed as well as others that I did not install.

I have had zero controls problems with Goodman’s controls in the last seven years and I cannot say that about any other brand out there. Emerson builds Goodman’s communicating equipment and it works very well thank you.

Get a life Dash and quit bashing products you know nothing about.

For the OP if you choose a Goodman and it is installed properly sized correctly and properly maintained you will never regret your decision. I will say the same thing about all products although with Carrier/Bryant be sure and get the extended warranty because you will need for the electronics.

I also strongly suggest you get an extended warranty on any brand just to be prepared anything can happen.

[RoseRx]

Got your PM, but reply won't go through, says you choose not to recieve PM's.

Dash,

The Site Admin restricts PM's to Professional Members only, for some reason.

[Airmechanical]

Get a life Dash and quit bashing products you know nothing about.

he does a lot of babbling when it comes to Goodman

something bad must of happen to him and a grudge was formed

if he knows something bad about Goodman, he should spit it out!

otherwise, as he knows from being a Carrier sucka$$, they have their problems just like all manufacturers

he could get a life, or atleast change his life long ordeal of goodman bashing, and concentrate on something positive



.

[classical]

he does a lot of babbling when it comes to Goodman

something bad must of happen to him and a grudge was formed

if he knows something bad about Goodman, he should spit it out!

otherwise, as he knows from being a Carrier sucka$$, they have their problems just like all manufacturers

he could get a life, or atleast change his life long ordeal of goodman bashing, and concentrate on something positive



.

So true so very true, I have sold and serviced virtually every brand made and they all have issues and most of those issues are installer related. That is except fpr electronics and installation has very little impact on them.

[tedkidd]

Air, Dash is right, Goodman is a square peg in a round hole if you want zoning.

Dash, Goodman are really nice bread n butter communicating furnaces for low and mid range value homes. For example, to get communicating in Trane/AS you have to invest 50% more.


Last time I checked heat rises. Why do you have a smaller unit upstairs?

Hmmm. Building science 101 says heat goes to cold. When you last checked, where did you find that information? Can I see your source?

[Airmechanical]

Air, Dash is right, Goodman is a square peg in a round hole if you want zoning.

TED HOW MANY ZONE SYSTEMS HAVE YOU INSTALLED

i bet it's none;

i never installed the ductwork part of a zone system

but i sure wired, setup, and dialed in probably 30 zone systems

so your blanket square peg in round hole analogy is showing your lack of knowledge

Ted, don't be a commerce48 when it comes to equipment

ted your a buiding expert, stick to that, or learn more about the equipment



.

[zzonko]

Jeez...the lack of understanding the theories that make our profession possible on this site is appalling

Hot goes to cold

Heat rises

Its the law

http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/thermo2.html







Air, Dash is right, Goodman is a square peg in a


round hole if you want zoning.

Dash, Goodman are really nice bread n butter communicating furnaces for low and mid range value homes. For example, to get communicating in Trane/AS you have to invest 50% more.



Hmmm. Building science 101 says heat goes to cold. When you last checked, where did you find that information? Can I see your source?

[tedkidd]

Jeez...the lack of understanding the theories that make our profession possible on this site is appalling

Hot goes to cold

Heat rises

Its the law

http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/thermo2.html

In space, which way is up? Guess heat must be pretty confused when it gets to space. "Heat rises" is NOT a law of thermodynamics.

It IS a misconception that causes homeowners to ignore problems in their basements. "Why bother with the basement, after all heat rises and we want to cut our heating bill." It frustrates me to see "professionals" saying this stupid stuff as it perpetuates the homeowners preconceptions.

Rob, building science includes all the systems of the building. Clearly this concept eludes you. Still stuck in the old school hvac guy perspective of "Just throw some heat at it, who cares about doing it efficiently, energy is cheap" right?

As your mind often seems closed and resistant to absorbing new ideas, this won't be a discussion - it'll be an argument. Rather than argue with you as to why bypass dampers and non-communicating zoning is an equipment longevity and energy efficiency problem, I think maybe I'll let DASH run over you. All this has been very clearly sorted in some of his threads.

[RoseRx]

I would like to hear more about the Amana/Goodman zoning system.

[seatonheating]

TED HOW MANY ZONE SYSTEMS HAVE YOU INSTALLED

i bet it's none;

i never installed the ductwork part of a zone system

but i sure wired, setup, and dialed in probably 30 zone systems

so your blanket square peg in round hole analogy is showing your lack of knowledge

Ted, don't be a commerce48 when it comes to equipment

ted your a buiding expert, stick to that, or learn more about the equipment



.



:pop: :couch:



Dash, Ted, Airmechanical, this thread has it all :).


Rose, I like the EWC zoning stuff which will work with any manufacturer. Just make sure that the equipment has a variable speed fan and that the condensor is 2 stage.

http://www.ewccontrols.com/whatiszone.htm

[garya505]

I hear Josh likes to install Goodman because he loves to embarrass all the DIYers and hacks who do such crappy installs with their hardware. :whistle:

[zzonko]

In space the temp is just shy of absolute zero, meaning that there is very little heat. Just shy of a perfect vacuum also, so no molecular heat.

Heated air is energy, and it is lighter and less dense than colder air. thus "floating" on colder air".

You start your argument in space, and in the next breath your in a basement.

There is very little heat in space. And as we know it on earth at our level, heat goes straight through the roof. Ever hear of F.L.I.R ?



In space, which way is up? Guess heat must be pretty confused when it gets to space. "Heat rises" is NOT a law of thermodynamics.

It IS a misconception that causes homeowners to ignore problems in their basements. "Why bother with the basement, after all heat rises and we want to cut our heating bill." It frustrates me to see "professionals" saying this stupid stuff as it perpetuates the homeowners preconceptions.

Rob, building science includes all the systems of the building. Clearly this concept eludes you. Still stuck in the old school hvac guy perspective of "Just throw some heat at it, who cares about doing it efficiently, energy is cheap" right?

As your mind often seems closed and resistant to absorbing new ideas, this won't be a discussion - it'll be an argument. Rather than argue with you as to why bypass dampers and non-communicating zoning is an equipment longevity and energy efficiency problem, I think maybe I'll let DASH run over you. All this has been very clearly sorted in some of his threads.

[seatonheating]

I hear Josh likes to install Goodman because he loves to embarrass all the DIYers and hacks who do such crappy installs with their hardware. :whistle:


Now you're getting it!!!


Look into it further Gary, you might be surprised at what you find out :).

[garya505]

Now you're getting it!!!


Look into it further Gary, you might be surprised at what you find out :).

I usually do, and sometimes I am. :cool:


BTW, thanks again for confirming my sizing.

[seatonheating]

I usually do, and sometimes I am. :cool:


BTW, thanks again for confirming my sizing.


No problem, so easy a caveman can do it :).


BTW, nights starting to get chilly down there?

[garya505]

No problem, so easy a caveman can do it :).


BTW, nights starting to get chilly down there?

Yup, the low was about 48F last night. No heat on yet and the house is still 70F inside. WTF?

Supposed to hit low 40s tonight. I think I have to move the cooler damper tomorrow.

[classical]

Air, Dash is right, Goodman is a square peg in a round hole if you want zoning.

Dash, Goodman are really nice bread n butter communicating furnaces for low and mid range value homes. For example, to get communicating in Trane/AS you have to invest 50% more.



Hmmm. Building science 101 says heat goes to cold. When you last checked, where did you find that information? Can I see your source?

I would stay away from aligning myself with Dash if I were you.

I am very well versed in zoning far greater than you are I am sure and I am well versed in building science. Currently Goodman/Amana is behind on zoning technology but as I said a new zone control system to rival the Infinity/Evolution system is in the wings. I have installed Evolution, Harmony, Arzel, EWC and Honeywell in residential applications. Currently the Harmony III and Infinity would be my choice however the Infinity/Evolution has a high component failure rate that others do not. The Lennox Harmony II worked great and was durable but they obsolete some components which rendered them irreparable but this problem seems to have been rectified with the new Harmony III.

[commerce48]

however the Infinity/Evolution has a high component failure rate that others do not.

Classical, your mention of a Carrier high component failure today is the first I've seen in the residential forum. You mentioned the controller failing earlier - a 50% rate in your experience. What was the failure mode and what did Carrier identify as the issue? Did the replacement controllers also fail? Are there other Carrier components that fail more often than other makers furnaces do, and if so, what?

I'm suspecting a statistical fluke, or a bad batch of controllers. Those things are expensive and I don't think Carrier could afford a 50% failure rate. I would have expected to hear more in the last five years about such a failure rate. I have heard of some software revisions, but that is to be expected.

I'm open minded though and would really like to hear more.

[dmd-marc]

Goodman are usually cheaper than the rest but it really depends on the install and the contractor doing the job. Goodman has had a bad rep over the years. They offer a great warranty and have seemed to back it up. 10 year parts and make sure you get 10 yr labor warranrty with it. They have a heat exhanger replacement program. If the heat exchanger goes, they'll replace the furnace. But like others have said it really doesnt matter what you put in, its the quality of the install. Go with whomever your gut tells you to.

I prefer Trane but thats me. I hate how Goodman/Amana make you install the TXV's outside the coil with the stupid boot on it. Just looks tacky.

[classical]

Goodman are usually cheaper than the rest but it really depends on the install and the contractor doing the job. Goodman has had a bad rep over the years. They offer a great warranty and have seemed to back it up. 10 year parts and make sure you get 10 yr labor warranrty with it. They have a heat exhanger replacement program. If the heat exchanger goes, they'll replace the furnace. But like others have said it really doesnt matter what you put in, its the quality of the install. Go with whomever your gut tells you to.

I prefer Trane but thats me. I hate how Goodman/Amana make you install the TXV's outside the coil with the stupid boot on it. Just looks tacky.

The heat exchanger problem was on ther GMNT and GMP models which have not been made for years and even they were only a problem because of low airflow installs.

Goodman has the second best heat exchanger on the market only surpassed by the Amana heat exchanger.

The TXV issue is going away as they fully convert to all Aluminum evaporator coils. Goodman and Amana are also converting to a new 5MM condenser tubing reportedly the only 5MM tubing on the market.

[classical]

Classical, your mention of a Carrier high component failure today is the first I've seen in the residential forum. You mentioned the controller failing earlier - a 50% rate in your experience. What was the failure mode and what did Carrier identify as the issue? Did the replacement controllers also fail? Are there other Carrier components that fail more often than other makers furnaces do, and if so, what?

I'm suspecting a statistical fluke, or a bad batch of controllers. Those things are expensive and I don't think Carrier could afford a 50% failure rate. I would have expected to hear more in the last five years about such a failure rate. I have heard of some software revisions, but that is to be expected.

I'm open minded though and would really like to hear more.

The problem has been the Infinity/Evolution controller and the model chips.I have had no problems with the replacements. I have not installed a Bryant.Carrier product in almost two years.

[commerce48]

The problem has been the Infinity/Evolution controller and the model chips.I have had no problems with the replacements. I have not installed a Bryant.Carrier product in almost two years.

Thanks for the reply, that is helpful.

[dmd-marc]

The nice thing about the 5mm tubing is that it starts to brong the concensers down to old 10 seer sizes in physical dimensions instead of these tanks everyone else is manufacturing. Also love Amana's comfortnet. make wiring /setup a breeze

[sammy37]

The nice thing about the 5mm tubing is that it starts to brong the concensers down to old 10 seer sizes in physical dimensions instead of these tanks everyone else is manufacturing. Also love Amana's comfortnet. make wiring /setup a breeze

I watched them make some of those 5mm coils when I was at their factory, pretty interesting setup.

[cturman]

What compressor models use these new 5mm coils?

[tedkidd]

The TXV issue is going away as they fully convert to all Aluminum evaporator coils. Goodman and Amana are also converting to a new 5MM condenser tubing reportedly the only 5MM tubing on the market.

When?

[classical]

When?

Air Handler coils are almost completely converted and have been out for just over a year. The remainder of coils both "A" and slab will be converted before Spring. The 5MM condensers are being manufatired now and will be showing up in the supply line at any time, I am not sure which CONDENSERS will be 5MM but I suspect the higher SEER units 18 and 16 SEER 2-stage first.

[tedkidd]

Mean txv is included? Remembering to price idiosyncratic items when considering Goodman is a pita.

[mrbenz7]

The split systems are much better than the package systems, but Goodman appears to be the brand of choice when the customers first consideration is price! Goodman package systems, especially the heat pumps have been falling apart a lot here in Arizona. Cracked tubing, breaking braze joints and serious leaks with R-410 A have been a real problem!

We are seeing 5 units so far this year that I have had to repair and some of these, 3 times already! :gah:
The split systems do not seem to be having these same problems. Split system biggest problems are the rapid failure of Chinese condensor fan motors.

I would keep looking and seriously consider a Bryant product which includes Payne and Day & Night as well as Rheem.

[RoseRx]

When will the mfr have info on their web site or literature available on this new zoning system?

[classical]

The split systems are much better than the package systems, but Goodman appears to be the brand of choice when the customers first consideration is price! Goodman package systems, especially the heat pumps have been falling apart a lot here in Arizona. Cracked tubing, breaking braze joints and serious leaks with R-410 A have been a real problem!

We are seeing 5 units so far this year that I have had to repair and some of these, 3 times already! :gah:
The split systems do not seem to be having these same problems. Split system biggest problems are the rapid failure of Chinese condensor fan motors.

I would keep looking and seriously consider a Bryant product which includes Payne and Day & Night as well as Rheem.

I would question why you would have to repair the same system three times, what did you do wrong that did not fix it right the first time.

Payne units are much cheaper built than the Goodman products, all manufacturers are using Chinese built products, motors, capacitors and contactors not just Goodman. I have zero condenser fan motor failures on a Goodman in five years.

Goodman is no longer a cheap alternative, Bryant cost me the same as Goodman and Payne is about 15 % less than Goodman. Goodman is built in the US Texas and Tennessee where Carrier/Bryant is built largely in Mexico even Lennox products are assembled in Mexico.

[classical]

When will the mfr have info on their web site or literature available on this new zoning system?

I wish I knew, I just know it is in the development stages.

[mrbenz7]

I would question why you would have to repair the same system three times, what did you do wrong that did not fix it right the first time.

Payne units are much cheaper built than the Goodman products, all manufacturers are using Chinese built products, motors, capacitors and contactors not just Goodman. I have zero condenser fan motor failures on a Goodman in five years.

Goodman is no longer a cheap alternative, Bryant cost me the same as Goodman and Payne is about 15 % less than Goodman. Goodman is built in the US Texas and Tennessee where Carrier/Bryant is built largely in Mexico even Lennox products are assembled in Mexico.

First of all I did fix it right 3 TIMES! It cracked refrigerant lines in 3 different places and I came back to weld all of them up.

Second, not all manufacturers are using Chinese products in their manufacture! Day & Night, Rheem, Ruud and Bryant are not and I will still take a Payne over a Goodman anytime.
The above models I mentioned all have capacitors made in Mexico, much better than their Chinese counterparts.
Built in the USA is not the same as assembled in the USA of chinese parts.:LOL:
Goodman split systems do not seem to develope the same problems their package systems do. All the problems I've encountered have been with the package systems-5 failing units this summer and 3 have been repaired more than once from blowing welds and capillary tubes venting the entire charge of R-410A. :nopity: :deadhorse::limb::confused:

[mrbenz7]

I got a service call on another one today! Broken refrigerant line going into Reversing valve at valve body. All refrigerant vented. Unit not sent out from factory with inline fuse protecting low voltage circuits! Faulty board burned out low voltage transformer. Chinese condensor fan motor squeals at startup. Chinese run capacitor leaking oil out of top seal when mounted sideways.

Unit less than two weeks old! :eek2: :LOL:::DD::payattention:

Feel sorry for customer. Not my install or sale and will no longer sell Goodman package systems. 6 units this year all less than a year old with major problems.

[fearlessfurnace]

something that warps the pro's feelings about goodman is a lot of them are installed by DIT's and fly-by-nights. so the pro's are fixing a lot of messes caused by bad instals.
even the legitimate equipment failures the trane and lennox dealers are fixing the stuff they put in.
and the stuff 5 fly-by-nights and 20 DIT's put in (goodmans)
every brand has its problems.
sounds like goodman package units are having coil problems.
we do almost no residential package units around here

[fearlessfurnace]

my Chevy is not as nice as my old bosses BMW
there is a reason for price
his upfront and lifetime costs a higher
he feels it is worth it

[mrbenz7]

I have not encountered these same problems on the Goodman split systems, only packaged units. But the package units have been a real pain! A lot package units down here are on the ground.

[conditionedhvac]

something that warps the pro's feelings about goodman is a lot of them are installed by DIT's and fly-by-nights. so the pro's are fixing a lot of messes caused by bad instals.
even the legitimate equipment failures the trane and lennox dealers are fixing the stuff they put in.
and the stuff 5 fly-by-nights and 20 DIT's put in (goodmans)
every brand has its problems.
sounds like goodman package units are having coil problems.
we do almost no residential package units around here

True. True.

I will say that from experience I haven't been impressed with the Goodman product due to factors such as premature breakdowns that WERE NOT related to installation issues.

One supply house rep at a supply house in middle TN told me that they had been having trouble with TXV's, indoor coil leaks, and reversing valves. But of the 5 or 6 Ruud units we put in over the last year we've had to replace 2 Txv's (one package, one split). They blamed Emerson that manufactured the TXV but I don't know. Haven't had issues with the other units TXV's that we've put in.

Goodman's large market share is do to the fact that their stuff is cheaper to purchase, and they sell to almost anyone. If you look for new AC units on a search engine, guess what brand you'll find? And as most contractors know, a unit bought online will not be backed with a warranty from the local supply house

[mrbenz7]

True about the poor installs, but the problems I've had to deal with have nothing to do with the install! It has everything to do with product quality issues!!!!

[fearlessfurnace]

yeah
and I'm sure the gnp and gnm heat exchangers liked to split
but the newer tube heat exchanger furnaces seem OK
(based on the fact I do not see many of them-and I know they are out there)
and a lot of 10-15 year old CK condensers are needing freon top-ups and capacitors replaced.
normal stuff

[seatonheating]

I finally had to drop Coleman. Too many issues with poor QC on their furnaces. It was a becoming a crap-shoot on whether or not they would start up without a hitch on, I'd say, 1 out of 3. Bad odds.


Every manufacturer has issues, let's face it. The days of things being built solidly are over.


I've repaired stupid things on just about every major manufacturer this year. They all suck!!

[Jopopsy]

Twilli says Coleman

Twilli used to say Ruud/Rheem !! ???

[rmartinez]

I have been installing Goodman/Amana equipment for the past 4 years and have not had a call back for any reason so far. I think they also have the best warranty along with no hassells on returns, if any.:yes:

[Milk man]

I have been installing Goodman/Amana equipment for the past 4 years and have not had a call back for any reason so far. I think they also have the best warranty along with no hassells on returns, if any.:yes:

That's amazing. How many systems a year do you install.