Lennox XP16 or York Affinity 8T?

[ggcampbell]

Have narrowed it down to these two, both 4 ton:

1. Lennox XP16 heat pump. CBX32MV-068 handler. ComfortSense 7000 t-stat. 10yr parts, 1 yr labor warranty.
About the dealer/installer: Service & repair techs have consistently impressed me. Sales guy seemed mostly knowledgeable but suggested a few screwy air handler combos.


2. York Affinity 8T. MC62D3XH1 handler (if the handwriting is correct). Honeywell digital/programmable t-stat. 10 yr parts, 1 yr labor warranty.
Would include new build of air handler stand as well as new drywall behind handler (water damage from current system). Lennox XP16 would only replace the top of stand, only cleaning of wall and remainder of existing handler).
About the dealer/installer: Sales guy seemed quite knowledgeable. Many A-ratings on Angie's List. Not sure of service/repair techs -- no experience.

York is less expensive by almost $ after rebates and tax credits accounted.

[mofotech]

I just got the york 8t affinity system installed. the system kinda of loud but it did drop my electric bill by a large margin. If the unit came with a york touchscreen t-stat which has dehumidifying feature also. overall not bad. Isn't Lennox made by Carrier also? Will both units have variable speed in them? I think that's a must if you changing and also if you can get a 2 stage compressor.

[tigerdunes]

gg

what have the quoting dealers said about qualifying for tax credit?

It looks to me that the York has much better performance/efficiency numbers than the Lennox and does qualify for the tax credit.

someone on this board can doublecheck this.

TD

[mofotech]

The unit I purchased came with the $1500 rebate and also a $1000 rebate from York. I got the 18 seer 2 stage unit.

[jerryd_2008]

The unit I purchased came with the $1500 rebate and also a $1000 rebate from York. I got the 18 seer 2 stage unit.

Came with "the $1500 tax credit", no?

[ggcampbell]

I just got the york 8t affinity system installed. the system kinda of loud but it did drop my electric bill by a large margin. If the unit came with a york touchscreen t-stat which has dehumidifying feature also. overall not bad. Isn't Lennox made by Carrier also? Will both units have variable speed in them? I think that's a must if you changing and also if you can get a 2 stage compressor.

The loudness concerns me... I saw you posted about vibrating and such on another thread. Do you think yours is just not set up properly? Both my handler and outside unit share walls with a bedroom. My 18 y.o. system that died recently was loud and I hated that. I could feel the walls move and see the pictures shake. I want quiet!

[jerryd_2008]

The loudness concerns me... I saw you posted about vibrating and such on another thread. Do you think yours is just not set up properly? Both my handler and outside unit share walls with a bedroom. My 18 y.o. system that died recently was loud and I hated that. I could feel the walls move and see the pictures shake. I want quiet!

The York Affinity DFHP runs much of the time in stage 1 for both AC and heat. Unless you have some duct problems for size of unit or an out of plumb unit, IMO noise shouldn't be a problem.


I just got the york 8t affinity system installed. the system kinda of loud but it did drop my electric bill by a large margin. If the unit came with a york touchscreen t-stat which has dehumidifying feature also. overall not bad. Isn't Lennox made by Carrier also? Will both units have variable speed in them? I think that's a must if you changing and also if you can get a 2 stage compressor.

Was your system an Affinity which is top-of-the-line York? Are you confusing Luxaire with Lennox? Believe that Lennox is not Carrier and the Luxaire is made by York or maybe more correctly Johnson Controls. How long have you had the system? I figure with the ups and downs of temp a yearly average may be needed to determine savings. Even then, you need to look at energy used and not cost since electric and NG costs vary whereas usage should be the measure.

[ggcampbell]

The York Affinity DFHP runs much of the time in stage 1 for both AC and heat. Unless you have some duct problems for size of unit or an out of plumb unit, IMO noise shouldn't be a problem.


DFHP is duel fuel, which is related to gas heat, right? My system would be a straight heat pump... living in tropical conditions does not necessitate additional heating! Would that make a difference with noise?

[jerryd_2008]

DFHP is duel fuel, which is related to gas heat, right? My system would be a straight heat pump... living in tropical conditions does not necessitate additional heating! Would that make a difference with noise?

Yes. Lucky you, GG. Just a HO, but I imagine that your HP would have some heat strips for the exceptional cool or cold nights. Maybe not if the HP can supply enough heat even at your extreme cool temps. That's a design issue for your contractor to decide. Without NG or propane you certainly won't hear any gas lighting noises but you still need an air handler inside to distribute the HP cooling/heating. So you still have a blower that will make noise. A VS blower on the air handler and 2 stage HP should run at a low speed most of the time especially at night when it's cooler (sun's not shining at least, right) which can mean (much) less noise.

[CynicX]

Do you have the full model number of the Lennox outdoor unit? Or at least how many tons it is?

Usually when you see like what you mentioned the "few screwy air handler combos" is because they are trying to get you the tax rebate and using X air handler with Y outdoor unit gets it but Y and Y wont. I dont know why...

I would go with the company you feel will provide you with better service though. No sense of having the York dealer install something if you need to call the Lennox guy to fix it.

Oh and keep in mind. Variable speed is quite until that electric heat kicks in, then you'll notice the same sounds you do with your current heat pump. Dont let that surprise you.

[Au-en-boy]

To the OP - Have your York contractor quote you the AVY air handler. It has a VS blower and can be set up for the best performance in your home. I will assume that you will go with the AVY indoor and the YZH outdoor unit - I have installed many of these, and you have to be sure to set them up correctly, but when you do they are great. The only complaint I have had was the night before last, house not recovering quickly enough, and it was my fault completely - I corrected it and the customer is happy again. Overall, I have only had excellent reviews, with added comfort and energy savings being at the top of the list after asking generic questions like "favorite thing about your new system".

Above all else, if I could give you one bit of advice it would be compare like equipment from any manufacturer that a contractor is proposing - it would do you no justice to compare a Ford Pinto to a Ferrari if you were buying a "go fast" car.

[mofotech]

The loudness concerns me... I saw you posted about vibrating and such on another thread. Do you think yours is just not set up properly? Both my handler and outside unit share walls with a bedroom. My 18 y.o. system that died recently was loud and I hated that. I could feel the walls move and see the pictures shake. I want quiet!

Ya, I'm sorry it qualified for the $1500 tax credit. Yes the Air handler blower does vibrate and is kinda of loud. I adjusted the blower speed down and it kinda of helped. But I think it has to do with the installation because before my old air handler was mounted on 2x4's plywood and was flushed against the wall. The new system is on a stand and not flushed completely against the wall. Or it maybe my old system had was pushing out less air. Anyways I am getting it checked out by my contractor, plus I think they didn't configure my unit correctly to take full advantage of the system. But overall like it I said it dropped my electric bill. My kwh usage in summer was a little over 3100 a month. As it got cold in miami, fl my usage dropped to around 2800. But when I got the new system installed it dropped to 2300 and it may have been lower but I had some relatives over the past month, so I haven't really seen the full effect of the system. The York system with the tax credit and rebate you might say is the best bang for your buck. Check them out and get quotes for them also. Make sure the contractor gives you a AHRI# to check if the system qualifies for tax credit. p.s. my arhi # is 3361567,

[mofotech]

The York Affinity DFHP runs much of the time in stage 1 for both AC and heat. Unless you have some duct problems for size of unit or an out of plumb unit, IMO noise shouldn't be a problem.



Was your system an Affinity which is top-of-the-line York? Are you confusing Luxaire with Lennox? Believe that Lennox is not Carrier and the Luxaire is made by York or maybe more correctly Johnson Controls. How long have you had the system? I figure with the ups and downs of temp a yearly average may be needed to determine savings. Even then, you need to look at energy used and not cost since electric and NG costs vary whereas usage should be the measure.

Ya I'm sorry. I'm just a consumer but I am very technically inclined in matter of electronics. Well my outside condenser says in big letters "8T Affinity" on it. hehe. Yes my energy usage in November dropped from 2800 to close to 2300. I had the system installed in beginning of November.

[gary_g]

Have narrowed it down to these two, both 4 ton:

1. Lennox XP16 heat pump. CBX32MV-068 handler.

2. York Affinity 8T. MC62D3XH1 handler

What is the AHRI Reference# for each system?

[jerryd_2008]

... Make sure the contractor gives you a AHRI# to check if the system qualifies for tax credit. p.s. my arhi # is 3361567,

Just remember that the IRS wants you to retain a signed certificate from the manufacturer as proof of tax credit eligibility. It is true that the manufacturer will probably also quote the AHRI cert. But there is other info that the IRS wants on the cert also.


See my earlier thread on IRS Form 5695 heads up that talks more extensively on the required cert.

[mofotech]

Just remember that the IRS wants you to retain a signed certificate from the manufacturer as proof of tax credit eligibility. It is true that the manufacturer will probably also quote the AHRI cert. But there is other info that the IRS wants on the cert also.


See my earlier thread on IRS Form 5695 heads up that talks more extensively on the required cert.

It has to be signed? In what way? I was given a certificate of AHRI with all the model numbers of my unit on it and saying it fulfills the EER 13 standard and its 18 seers. I will read your thread on that.

[gary_g]

It has to be signed? In what way? I was given a certificate of AHRI with all the model numbers of my unit on it and saying it fulfills the EER 13 standard and its 18 seers. I will read your thread on that.

You are good-to-go with that AHRI Certificate.

If you are audited, the Feds can come look at your system themselves. Tell them to bring coffee and donuts.

Take care.

[ggcampbell]

To the OP - Have your York contractor quote you the AVY air handler. It has a VS blower and can be set up for the best performance in your home. I will assume that you will go with the AVY indoor and the YZH outdoor unit - I have installed many of these, and you have to be sure to set them up correctly, but when you do they are great. The only complaint I have had was the night before last, house not recovering quickly enough, and it was my fault completely - I corrected it and the customer is happy again. Overall, I have only had excellent reviews, with added comfort and energy savings being at the top of the list after asking generic questions like "favorite thing about your new system".

Above all else, if I could give you one bit of advice it would be compare like equipment from any manufacturer that a contractor is proposing - it would do you no justice to compare a Ford Pinto to a Ferrari if you were buying a "go fast" car.

What is the difference between the MV air handler and the AVY? The one I've signed up for is the MV, but it's not set in stone yet. Is the AVY better?

Also, I noticed you recommended a particular t-stat to mofotech on another thread. Does the Affinity 8T run better with that particular t-stat?


So..... yes folks, it's nearly official (still have to sign on the dotted line, but I've called to let them know)... I will soon be the (hopefully) proud owner of a York Affinity 8T! Yay! Thanks for all of your help in making this decision. Mwah.

[CynicX]

What is the difference between the MV air handler and the AVY? The one I've signed up for is the MV, but it's not set in stone yet. Is the AVY better?

Also, I noticed you recommended a particular t-stat to mofotech on another thread. Does the Affinity 8T run better with that particular t-stat?


So..... yes folks, it's nearly official (still have to sign on the dotted line, but I've called to let them know)... I will soon be the (hopefully) proud owner of a York Affinity 8T! Yay! Thanks for all of your help in making this decision. Mwah.

Yuck, you should have gotten a Lennox...

I keed I keed :) ...I hope you enjoy the system and the savings...

[mofotech]

What is the difference between the MV air handler and the AVY? The one I've signed up for is the MV, but it's not set in stone yet. Is the AVY better?

Also, I noticed you recommended a particular t-stat to mofotech on another thread. Does the Affinity 8T run better with that particular t-stat?


So..... yes folks, it's nearly official (still have to sign on the dotted line, but I've called to let them know)... I will soon be the (hopefully) proud owner of a York Affinity 8T! Yay! Thanks for all of your help in making this decision. Mwah.

Make sure before they install ask them to check the duct work and after install check static pressure. Tell them to setup the profile of the air handler for Humid Mode, if you like to have humidity control. (Which in florida I think will be good). The T-stat just make sure they gave you a t-stat with humidity control and that it REALLY connects to the humidistat terminal on the air handler. (not like what my dealer did , loll ) Are you getting a system with the 2 stage compressor? And also please check the ARHI# just in case beforehand.

[jerryd_2008]

You are good-to-go with that AHRI Certificate.

If you are audited, the Feds can come look at your system themselves. Tell them to bring coffee and donuts.

Take care.

Really? Guess you haven't read IRS Notice 2009-53, huh, Gary? Not that it is enjoyable.:rules:

IMO, this notice places the responsibility for certification squarely on the manufacturer by requiring that they state what was bought, the energy parameters, their place of business, and a signature of a responsible employee that certifies the tax credit eligibility. And, yes, they also quote AHRI, but AHRI didn't configure and sell you the system and issues can arise. In my case, I had a 3rd party coil that had parameters reduced by a possibly arbitrary AHRI policy decision. Still made the Energy Star requirements as well as AHRI, but I too wanted that coil manufacturer to sign in blood, $1500 is $1500.

If your contractor or distributor isn't willing to perform this required certification, what else isn't he going to do for you? This cert is available on-line sometimes.