New Trane Install

[mayguy]

http://ww2.imagewiz.net/images/hvac/9603_Williamson.jpg

http://ww2.imagewiz.net/images/hvac/9604_will1.jpg

This was the old Williamson Temp-O-Matic, it was installed by my Dad in 1977, the furnace was way under sized for the addtion 2 story home that was added on. (Furnace was 62k A/C was 1 1/2ton) So, a wood furnace was added on, and my parents burned wood for almost 15 years(lot of wood cutting and hauling in my young days). They only used the gas for back up. You can see my hand mark from touching the hot duct work from the wood stove at one time!

http://ww2.imagewiz.net/images/hvac/9606_willac.jpg
This was the outdoor unit.. It worked well, but under sized for the added 2 story home, so couldn't keep up on our hot summer days upstairs. The paint peel on the top was from the unit sitting in the box outside for 3 years befoe dad installed it. (Don't know why dad didn't install this right away? We did the whole house pretty much oursleves)

http://ww2.imagewiz.net/images/hvac/9608_trane1.jpg

http://ww2.imagewiz.net/images/hvac/9609_trane2.jpg

New (this was done 2 years ago) Trane furnace installed, dealer cleaned the duct work (Lots of dust, and stuff from wood burning, and remodel.. Sorry no pix) Dealer told Dad best to keep the wood furance for back up and still was in good shape.. My parents hasn't fired up the wood furance since the new furnace was put in.

The return was cut into the return drop to allow better air flow since the duct was popping in when it turned on

http://ww2.imagewiz.net/images/hvac/9610_exhaust.jpg

Exhaust vent. I like the ideal Trane done. sure not an eye sore like some of the other guys do.

http://ww2.imagewiz.net/images/hvac/9607_traneac.jpg
New XL12 outdoor unit. 2 1/2 ton w/ TXV valve, The house has been very comfortable after this was installed. electric bill went down half!

[Edited by mayguy on 01-12-2004 at 10:47 AM]

[bryantman]

Good looking job,did you do the sheet metal fab yourself?

[mayguy]

Bryant,

I'd love to take the credit.. But, no I didn't do the job. My parents had a Trane Dealer in my Hometown do the project. they did a good job, and hear lot of good words from other people how good of a job they do.

[smokeeater 38]

I like the vent. Do you have any info on it, cost, part number or what it takes to install? I’ve always hated the look of the two PVC pipes sticking out the side of the house.

[Boiling Point]

Originally posted by smokeeater 38
I’ve always hated the look of the two PVC pipes sticking out the side of the house.




Ditto!!

[mayguy]

"Do you have any info on it, cost, part number or what it takes to install"

I didn't install this, the Trane Dealer did. So, I don't have any info.. Sorry. :-(

I think this is part of Trane's set up. All of the new Trane I've seen installed around here has that type of exhaust vent hood.

Install of this seems easy. Drill your hole though the wall for the fresh air, and exhaust PVC pipe.

Then slide a supprt bracket over the pvc, and screw it to the house.

Cut the pipes flush to the bracket, then install the cover on top of pvc.

Fresh air comes in around the back side of the first plate.. about an 1" all around between the first plate, and wall.. And exhaust blows out on the opening you see.

There is 4 sets of screw on the corners, so you can unscrew the cover to get behind to clean out the pipes if you had to.

[billygoat22]

The lozenge vent cover is a bayvent200a, if I recall correctly. High eff gas furnace, my favorite changeout.
I've noted that the insatll instructions spec 3' spacing on vent pipe hangers to prevent sagging, which I had been guilty of not doing in times past.

[hardstart]

The vent termination kit is a Bayvent 200B. It works with either 2" or 3" PVC. If you are running 2" PVC, you will need to increase to 3" about a foot before the side of the house. Dealer cost is about $20. We've only used it with Trane furnaces. I don't know about using it with other brands.

[Jultzya]

Nice vent termination, but what's the off ground clearances.

Most manufactures require that the vent termination is 12" above ground or normally expected snow accumulation levels.

Not trying to be negative, but where is the gas shut off, condensate trap, & cleanout?

Other wise it looks like a nice install, even the old one looked good for being a 1977 install.

[extremeair]

its nice.Hey any self respecting contractor will give u a job like that far as im concerned.P v c vent looks a little out of whack and the condensor doesnt seeem 100& level but id say nice job.

[BaldLoonie]

I'm sure it's not approved by other brands but I've used it on a Rheem 90. Only problem we have is coming out of the basement, we have to go up above the snow line so doing it like this job would be a problem.

[mayguy]

"Most manufactures require that the vent termination is 12"

This one is about 8" off of the ground. They haven't had any trouble of the 3 years they had it here in Minnesota's winter snow.

I think these don't have to be as high cuz air is drawn in around the back side, not a pipe stuck into the snow bank sucking up the snow.


" where is the gas shut off, condensate trap, & cleanout?"

The gas shut off was just back of the furnace where the copper line was taken off of the old black pipe.

The gas line was shortly updated after the picture was taken with the yellow flex, so the shut off now right next to the furnace... They redid the whole house since my parents added a gas burning fireplace/stove in the basement, and ready for a furture gas place in the old wood burning fireplace on the main floor.

There is no traps. it all runs free down to the floor drain.

"old one looked good for being a 1977 install."
Yeah, I was pretty proud of my dad's work. He doing the work then. He used to work for a sheetmetal shop who sold Williamson then. Took him some time to finish off the job! :-( We used the wood burning fireplace for a whole winter! A few cold mornings tho!

"P v c vent looks a little out of whack and the condensor doesnt seeem 100"

OUt of whack? Not sure what you mean? If you are meaning it's too low from the ceiling, then it cuz the return duct is coming around back to the furnace. and there is no clearnace between the ductwork, and joist. This end of the home was built in '54 and was a Modular type home then. They used 2 by 4 for floor joist then.

The Condensor is level, just the angle of the camera.

[duckman373]

[New XL12 outdoor unit. 2 1/2 ton w/ TXV valve, The house has been very comfortable after this was installed. electric bill went down half!

Check to see that they paid for an XE 1200 and not an XL1200. The condensor is the less expensive XE model. I do agree that the installers have taken pride in their work on this job.

[BaldLoonie]

Never heard of an XL12. The one shown is an XE1200. There was the XL1200 with the Lexan top, and now the XR12 which has the new cabinet.

[mayguy]

My bad, it is a XE1200.

[bmf]

nice job looks clean

[mayguy]

They were very clean guys.. Dad told them it was no big deal if they did anything to the carpet on the back steps from the back door, cuz they were going to replace that a few weeks later.. They still laid drop cloths down the whole steps. When the project was done, they went behind with the vac.

[sadlier]

Nice job. The A/C drain should be trapped, though.

[mayguy]

THis Bayvent deal, is it only for Trane Dealers, or is it for anyone?

[chadman]

I am interested in obtaining a couple of the bay vents. Can somebody give me a web site ,or a supplier that these are available from.
Thanks,
Chad

[Stamas]

Is the prefix for alot of Trane/American Standard part #'s. You can get it from ether brands distributers but if your A/S distributer's is like our's here you shouldn't have any problem getting the part or equipment they'll sell to anybody and they can't spell EPA.

[nehps]

You taking some return from the grille on cold air drop.

[mayguy]

"You taking some return from the grille on cold air drop."


I am not sure what you mean by this?

The dealer put this in for a reason. The return duct was popping in when the blower kicks in. So they installed that to stop the popping sound.

[Diceman]

Is that a copper gas line I see??

[mayguy]

Yes, that is copper line you see there for gas.. They can be used around here.. I know they say some areas you can't use them cuz of the content in the gas casue the copper to go bad.

That was a "temp" line untill my parents got the new gas burner gas fireplace/stove in, then they came back a week later and updated the gas line in the whole house with the yellow flex lines.

[Diceman]

Gastite, huh?
Good, copper ain't good no matter what.

[prcrboy]

The bayvent 200B is available at any trane parts store. I noticed that nobody mentioned a concentric termination. Do you guys not use them?

Also, mayguy according to NC state code (don't know about others) but condensate on positive type coils (after the blower) does not require a trap. The trap is there to allow proper water flow, not needed on this system. I agree that I would have put one, but its not required.

[tech]

Hope this basement isn't a "tight" room with that return register. Is there a supply register open in the basement? Is the natural draft water heater venting properly. There are other ways to keep ductwork from "popping".

[mayguy]

No, this is not a tight basement, that end of the house was built in '54. There is a fresh air pipe brought in behind the wood stove. Also there is a a floor vent just above the furnace/stove that allows heat to rise out of the room when the wood stove is going.

The Water has no problems or issues with venting.

What other ways can they stop the "popping" of the duct?

[tech]

Have a CO analysis done on your equipment. You may be surprised what you find.

[mayguy]

CO on what? Furnace is sealed system using 100% outside air, and water heater is getting fresh air from the fresh air pipe behind the furnace.

[tech]

CO from water heater. Just because furnace is sealed doesn't mean it would not be producing high levels of CO. High levels of CO in your exhaust air could mean loss of efficiency. Only way to tell is with analysis. Most furnaces need checking out in the field. Factory settings are made for perfect world situations, not actual situations. Have one done then be skeptical.

[ricm]

Agreement all the way 'round it seems... nice work on the heating. I'm not a huge fan of 'line sets' on A/c.. as it's hard to get them to look like they belong. Typically use ACR and fittings. And ofcourse there is the old addage... no fittings- no leaks... I know the truth should lie with "function over Form"... but if piped carefully with refrigeration principals... You can have the best of both worlds.

I know it's the least of concerns in A/C operation. But it's nice if one takes that wee bit extra care... and then NO person can have a negative word.

Sounds like the people that did this whole project are finest kind. Glad to see they take pride in their work.

:o)

[mayguy]

"Sounds like the people that did this whole project are finest kind. Glad to see they take pride in their work. "

They do take pride in thirr work. My parents just sold thier house a few weeks ago... Now in the process of builing a new home.. The builder is using a Bryant dealer from out of town (30miles out). Dad managed to twist the builder's arm to let him go w/ the Trane dealer who he felt comfortable w/.

I'll post pix of the new home that they are going to build.. Sounds like my parents are going to go w the XV90..

[ricm]

Although I work for a Trane dealer... I find this product pretty good... but I also support the qualities in many of the other brands... My Boss shudders each time I tell customers of the virtues of the quality of the 'other' brands. But we get more repeat customers because we are honest with them. NO ONE BRAND is SUPERIOR to ALL others!!! PERIOD!!!

Consider installing ACR piping with the A/C if they go that route... use the Copeland piping manual to instill good refrigeration principals... Size the lines right... make the joint's perfect... (I learned the best brazing technique is... take the time to make the welded joint look exactly like the rounded shoulder of the joint...

I know I'm spouting first year gak... but even the 'super tech's' never get tired of hearing this... really.

If the lines are important on solid oak cabinets that house the family airlooms... should take back seat to the beauty of properly installed and neat A/C copper lines. Make Renoir Jealous...

I live in Central Alberta Canada... for a six pack and a good meal - and ofcourse the excuse to ride the old Harley down to the States... I'd come and do it for THAT.. :)

[mayguy]

"for a six pack and a good meal - and ofcourse the excuse to ride the old Harley down to the States... I'd come and do it for THAT.. "

hehe I"ll keep you in mind.

Speaking of Harley, My uncle was over sea doing his service. he been over there for awhile, and kinda got home sick. One of his member brought a Harley from someone there.. My uncle is an die hard Harley guy.. He asked the guy if he could take it for a spin. Took it out, and guess where he went? He went riding on the runway!! Kuwait Govement kicked him out really fast!! He was sent home... Now everyone else asking for the bike! LOL