More on Obama's Birth Certificate

[Hugh B]

Now if you want Obama to produce his birth certificate you are a racist! This link brings to light some aspects of the issue that are new to me. We need to keep this issue before the public eye, the media and our own officials until we get some real answers.

I had to edit out the link as it was incorrect. I will find it and post it again correctly.

[Hugh B]

I can't get the link to work so here is the article.


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Is the biggest political crime in American history taking place right before our eyes? Is the man in the White House Ineligible, according to the Constitution, to sit in the Oval Office... is he a Fraud... is he a Usurper?

At first the liberal elites in Washington and in the media tried to ignore the question or ridicule those who dared to ask the question.

But - thanks to your efforts - the question will not go away... and now liberals are getting frantic... unhinged... and downright nasty.

Now, liberals are personally attacking those who dare ask Barack Hussein Obama ("Mr. Transparency") to produce a valid birth certificate and verify to the American people that he is a natural-born citizen - and eligible under Article 2, Section 1 of the Constitutionto be President.

American music legend Pat Boone is finding that out the hard way. When Boone dared to ask that very question, the left-wing political blog Wonkette implied that Boone is a racist:



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"What happens when you're super angry about a Negro somehow becoming president, but there are no longer specific laws against a Negro becoming president? Make up something else.... And guess who just joined the 'Birther' club? Once-famous right-wing [profanity deleted] and talentless fruitsack Pat Boone, who made a living half a century ago stealing the black man's music, that's who."
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But no amount of name-calling can change the fact that 58% of respondents to an AOL on-line poll said that Obama should produce his actual birth certificate.

And no amount of ridicule will change the fact that 49.3% of the respondents to a scientific Wenzel poll found the question to be legitimate (41.5% said Obama should release his records and 7.8% expressed concern over the issue), even though only 51.3% of the respondents were even familiar with the birth certificate controversy.

And no amount of ridicule will change the fact that close a a half-million people have signed petitions calling on Barack Hussein Obama to release his birth certificate.

The plain and simple truth is that approximately half of the American people believe, as you believe, that Obama should produce his actual birth certificate and validate that he is not a fraud or a usurper.

Don't let anyone convince you otherwise.... When half of the American people want a question answered... it is no conspiracy theory. You were right to press the issue then and you're within your rights to press the issue now.

And the liberal elites know it too. But more than that, they fear that more people will dare to demand that Obama produce a valid birth certificate as more people become aware of this controversy.

That's why liberal elites are ridiculing you. That's why they're issuing personal attacks. That's why they're calling people racists or nuts. That's why they're trying to marginalize you.

Don't let them get away with it because one more thing is becoming apparent. The more you press them, the more desperate and unhinged they become. If you keep pressing the issue, the American people will win. If you stop - and the liberal elites are hoping and praying that you do - the American people lose. It's that simple.

That's why we can not let up now. That's why we must continue to press the liberal elites... particularly those in the media. That's why we must continue deluging their newsrooms - their inner-sanctum - with faxes demanding that they stop distorting and start reporting.

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Use the button below and help the Western Center for Journalism flood the fax machines of Barack Hussein Obama and the editors of the Top Newspapers in the United States (USA Today, the New York Times, the Washington Post, the Los Angeles Times, the Wall Street Journal, the New York Daily News, the Chicago Tribune, the New York Post, and Long Island Newsday) - and the producers at ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX News, MSNBC and CNN.

Tell them that no amount of arrogant or derisive laughter on their part is going to make the issue go away. Article 2, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States specifically states that the President of the United States must be a natural-born citizen and that Barack Obama has moved heaven and earth to block the release of his actual Birth Certificate - the one document that could prove his eligibility under the Constitution to occupy the office.

Admonish them for distorting, instead of reporting. Admonish them for their conscious and biased efforts to assist Barack Hussein Obama in obscuring the truth from the American people.



If the button does not function, use this hyperlink.

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Myth: Obama Release His Birth Certificate Long Ago?

Liberal elites continue to perpetuate the myth that Obama has released his birth certificate. But that's not true. Obama has not released his actual birth certificate.

The document that Team Obama released is a Certification of Live Birth; and aCertification of Live Birth and a Birth Certificate (A Certificate of Live Birth)... [notice the difference in the words "certification" and "certificate"] are two totally different documents.

A Certification of Live Birth- the document that Team Obama produced - supplied below on the left- is a "short form" document... a print out of information that has been entered - at some point in time, by someone - into a computer database.

A Certificate of Live Birth(an actual birth certificate) - on the other hand contains more information.

Produced at the time a person is actually born (meaning it can not be changed or altered simply by accessing a computer database), it gives the specific location of birth, the hospital, the time of birth, the attending physician... the names of witnesses to the birth....

The image on the right is a redacted copy of an actual Certificate of Live Birth(an actual Birth Certificate) from the State of Hawaii from approximately the same time that Obama was born.

Obama's Certificationof Live Birth (Click on the Image to Enlarge)

Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth (Click on the Image to Enlarge)



So what's the big deal? For starters, the Certification of Live Birth is totally inadequate when it comes to validating that Obama is eligible under Article 2, Section 1 of the Constitution to be President.

The State of Hawaii provide an concrete example, as to why.

Hawaii maintains programs to encourage property ownership for native Hawaiians. The Hawaii Department of Home Lands (DHHL), a government agency, oversees these programs and, among other things, must validate that applicants for these programs are, in fact, native Hawaiians.

Pursuant to the administration of these programs, DHHLstates the following on its website:



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"In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate of Live Birth, which is either black or green. This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout). Submitting the original Certificate of Live Birth will save you time and money since the computer-generated Certification requires additional verification by DHHL."

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If the State of Hawaii does not accept the Certification of Live Birth as singular proof that an individual was actually born in Hawaii, why should we.

Of course, Barack Hussein Obama could put the issue to rest right now by simply releasing his actual birth certificate.

But he won't release his actual birth certificate. In fact, he is actively resisting efforts to compel him to release his actual birth certificate.

He's dug in his heels. Teams of lawyers are actively fighting efforts to get him to release his actual birth certificate,while his underlings look down their noses at the American people and call these legitimate requests "garbage."

If Barack Hussein Obama has nothing to hide, what's the problem? The more he resists, the more you have to wonder.

It's time for you and me to weigh in and force the issue.Let's call-out the liberal media. Let them know they must report this story and that there is nowhere to run or hide.

So what's the big deal?



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Use the button below and help the Western Center for Journalism flood the fax machines of Barack Hussein Obama and the editors of the Top Newspapers in the United States (USA Today, the New York Times, the Washington Post, the Los Angeles Times, the Wall Street Journal, the New York Daily News, the Chicago Tribune, the New York Post, and Long Island Newsday) - and the producers at ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX News, MSNBC and CNN.

Tell them that no amount of arrogant or derisive laughter on their part is going to make the issue go away. Article 2, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States specifically states that the President of the United States must be a natural-born citizen and that Barack Obama has moved heaven and earth to block the release of his actual Birth Certificate - the one document that could prove his eligibility under the Constitution to occupy the office.

Admonish them for distorting, instead of reporting. Admonish them for their conscious and biased efforts to assist Barack Hussein Obama in obscuring the truth from the American people.



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Why Should It Matter Where Obama Was Born....

Article 2, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States, states in part, "No person except a natural born citizen of the United States, at the time of adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President."

That means neither Arnold Schwarzenegger nor George Soros can be President of the United States. Not ever. Neither can Osama bin Laden.

That also means, that if Barack Obama was born outside the United States, he is not eligible to be President of the United States.

On this matter, the law is very clear. Obama's father was not an American citizen and Obama's mother was only 19-years-old when Obama was born - too young to confer her citizenship on young Barack. Obama's mother could be as American as "Apple Pie" and it would not matter (more on that later).

Absent a parent that could confer citizenship on Obama at birth, in order for Obama to even claim he is a natural-born citizen, he had to be born on United States soil (although even that point is in dispute, as some claim that dual citizenship, which would have been bestowed on him courtesy of his father, is a disqualifier).

And Obama's paternal grandmother said, she was present at Obama's birth, which took place in Mombasa in what is now Kenya.

So where was Obama born?

Only an actual birth certificate can answer that question (not the Certification of Live Birth that Obama produced) - and Obama has multiple teams of lawyers dedicated to the proposition that nobody - but nobody - gets to see the one document that can clear up this controversy. That's insane.

[garya505]

Now if you want Obama to produce his birth certificate you are a racist! This link brings to light some aspects of the issue that are new to me. We need to keep this issue before the public eye, the media and our own officials until we get some real answers.

I had to edit out the link as it was incorrect. I will find it and post it again correctly.

Is this it?
http://www.westernjournalism.com/

[retired btc]

Now if you want Obama to produce his birth certificate you are a racist! This link brings to light some aspects of the issue that are new to me. We need to keep this issue before the public eye, the media and our own officials until we get some real answers.

I had to edit out the link as it was incorrect. I will find it and post it again correctly.

Every try the search engine here? I think someone even posted a pic about beating a dead horse :D

[mrs reb77]

Isn't a dead horse one that's actually been proven?

This hasn't and would be so easy....so so easy to just prove it once and for all. Unless it cannot be proven. ;)

[Hugh B]

Isn't a dead horse one that's actually been proven?

This hasn't and would be so easy....so so easy to just prove it once and for all. Unless it cannot be proven. ;)


Perhaps BTC has actually seen the birth certificate. If so he can put this issue to bed for all of us. I am unaware that any conclusion has been reached in this matter.

[retired btc]

Perhaps BTC has actually seen the birth certificate. If so he can put this issue to bed for all of us. I am unaware that any conclusion has been reached in this matter.


Dude get over it already, If they thought you were important enough you would have recieved the memo, but seeing as you didn't, Guess they don't think as much of you as you do of yourself !

Oh By the way I didn't recieve the memo either and I know I am much more Important to this country then you are lol

[retired btc]

Isn't a dead horse one that's actually been proven?

This hasn't and would be so easy....so so easy to just prove it once and for all. Unless it cannot be proven. ;)

Oh its been proven that this subject has been over and over and over on this board.

As far a proving once and for all, the jury is still out, maybe we should all just travel to Hawaii and demand to see the document for ourselves, oh wait that has been tried, guess we will all wait with baited breath for the courts decision, maybe they will get to it before his term is up :D

[Hugh B]

Oh its been proven that this subject has been over and over and over on this board.

As far a proving once and for all, the jury is still out, maybe we should all just travel to Hawaii and demand to see the document for ourselves, oh wait that has been tried, guess we will all wait with baited breath for the courts decision, maybe they will get to it before his term is up :D

It is my understanding that they have never produced an actual birth certificate but instead a certification of live birth. From what I have read these are two very different documents.

Why is producing a birth certificate such a problem anyway? I have mine, my wife's, and those of my children. I even have originals of my parents who passed away years ago. Certificates far older than our president.

Why is this a problem? I don't get it. I don't even need to see it personally. I trust a number of authorities and other organizations to do the verification for me. I really am a trusting individual.

[jpsmith1cm]

Simply put, it is a problem only because he cannot present one.

If he could, I see absolutely no reason that he would not have by now.

[retired btc]

It is my understanding that they have never produced an actual birth certificate but instead a certification of live birth. From what I have read these are two very different documents.
.

Hmm I don't have a birth certificate but rather a certification of live birth, so what your saying is that unless it is a birth certificate then its invalid, whoops guess they should not have issued me a passport then huh :)

[k-fridge]

Simply put, it is a problem only because he cannot present one.

If he could, I see absolutely no reason that he would not have by now.

^This^

The fact that he won't release his actual birth certificate and put this to rest concerns me more than anything.

I'm not the smartest guy in the world, but I know when something doesn't smell just right.

[Hugh B]

I also can't understand those who not only have no interest in verfication of a birth certificate but are willing to oppose those who do. Now that is difficult to figure out.

[retired btc]

Simply put, it is a problem only because he cannot present one.

If he could, I see absolutely no reason that he would not have by now.

Seems to me that in some of those previous post concerning this, those individuals that had the requirements to view them have and made statements as to the authenticity of the documents.

Now whether you can believe those individuals is another matter, after all they work for the same government.

[Hugh B]

Hmm I don't have a birth certificate but rather a certification of live birth, so what your saying is that unless it is a birth certificate then its invalid, whoops guess they should not have issued me a passport then huh :)

From what I understand a certification of live birth can be generated, created and dispensed with a few computer key strokes by a state worker. I bet if someone wanted to get one from each state of the union it could be done. Sort of like collecting driver's licenses from each state. That I have seen done.

Why are you so opposed to those of us who want the real deal? Such a simple request results in such a storm of protest.

[k-fridge]

Hmm I don't have a birth certificate but rather a certification of live birth, so what your saying is that unless it is a birth certificate then its invalid, whoops guess they should not have issued me a passport then huh :)

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/vol06_ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.HTM


[§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State. (a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child, the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child. (b) Proof of legal residency shall be submitted to the director of health in any manner that the director shall deem appropriate. The director of health may also adopt any rules pursuant to chapter 91 that he or she may deem necessary or proper to prevent fraudulent applications for birth certificates and to require any further information or proof of events necessary for completion of a birth certificate.
(c) The fee for each application for registration shall be established by rule adopted pursuant to chapter 91. [L 1982, c 182, §1]


Any more questions?

[retired btc]

^This^

The fact that he won't release his actual birth certificate and put this to rest concerns me more than anything.

I'm not the smartest guy in the world, but I know when something doesn't smell just right.

The fact is he doesn't have to present it to you or anyone else here, The state of Hawaii has stated time and time again who is eligible to view it and we didn't make the list.

[k-fridge]

The fact is he doesn't have to present it to you or anyone else here, The state of Hawaii has stated time and time again who is eligible to view it and we didn't make the list.
Wrong. The fact is that the Constitution says only a natural born citizen can be POTUS, and there are legitimate questions concerning Obama's status in that area.

As American citizens we have a right to those answers. If he is indeed a natural born citizen, why won't he release the proof and put it to rest?

[retired btc]

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/vol06_ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.HTM



Any more questions?

I guess if I had been born in Hawaii then I would have a problem now wouldn't I.

Hmmm I think if you check back you can even find the document and what it says birth certificate or certifcation of live birth.

[retired btc]

Wrong. The fact is that the Constitution says only a natural born citizen can be POTUS, and there are legitimate questions concerning Obama's status in that area.

As American citizens we have a right to those answers. If he is indeed a natural born citizen, why won't he release the proof and put it to rest?

Like I said you or I didn't make the list, if you have a problem with that take it up with the state of Hawaii, they validated his statements.

[k-fridge]

I guess if I had been born in Hawaii then I would have a problem now wouldn't I.

Hmmm I think if you check back you can even find the document and what it says birth certificate or certifcation of live birth.

Easy cheesy


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/06/13/bobirthcertificate.jpg

[retired btc]

Easy cheesy


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/06/13/bobirthcertificate.jpg

And now what the state says concerning the matter.

On Oct. 31, 2008, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii Department of Health, issued this statement: "There have been numerous requests for Sen. Barack Hussein Obama’s official birth certificate. State law prohibits the release of a certified birth certificate to persons who do not have a tangible interest in the vital record.

"Therefore I, as director of health for the state of Hawaii, along with the registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama's original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.

"No state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, has ever instructed that this vital record be handled in a manner different from any other vital record in the possession of the state of Hawaii."

Even the governor of Hawaii, Linda Lingle, a Republican who at the time was stumping for John McCain, said it was on the up-and-up.

The Health Department says the "Certification of Live Birth" is Hawaii's version of a birth certificate. Calling it by other names — Certificate of Live Birth, Certification of Live Birth — is just semantics. WorldNetDaily may be right that the original birth certificate wasn't posted, but if Hawaii says the the document Obama posted can rightly be called Obama's birth certificate,


As stated before their ball park their rules, if anyone has a problem with that take it up with them.

[k-fridge]

And now what the state says concerning the matter.

On Oct. 31, 2008, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii Department of Health, issued this statement: "There have been numerous requests for Sen. Barack Hussein Obama’s official birth certificate. State law prohibits the release of a certified birth certificate to persons who do not have a tangible interest in the vital record.

"Therefore I, as director of health for the state of Hawaii, along with the registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama's original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.

"No state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, has ever instructed that this vital record be handled in a manner different from any other vital record in the possession of the state of Hawaii."

Even the governor of Hawaii, Linda Lingle, a Republican who at the time was stumping for John McCain, said it was on the up-and-up.

Barack Obama can obtain a copy of his birth certificate from the state of Hawaii. If he was truly interested in being the president of all citizens, and if he has nothing to hide; what reason could he possibly have for not releasing his actual birth certificate?

Furthermore, the information I provided above clearly states that a "certificate of Live Birth" is for children born out of state. If Obama was born in Hawaii, why would he have a certificate that is for children born out of state.

In addition to this, there are serious questions concerning the time line of obama and his parents and there are verified statements from Obama's own grandmother that he was born in Kenya. These are legitiamate questions concerning his birth and the American people have a right to answers.

The fact is; if he is found to not be natural born, everything he has done since being in office is illegitimate. This would be a constitutional crises and if this is a potential problem it's better settled sooner than later. And frankly, I'm not crazy about the thought of a President Biden. Nice guy, but dumber than a box of rocks.

This needs to be settled, and now.

[retired btc]

Why are you so opposed to those of us who want the real deal? Such a simple request results in such a storm of protest.

No Protest, Simply stated the obvious there Bubba, this subject has been hashed over and over and over, you can waste all the time you want trying to convince yourself of the " Truth " but bottom line is your just not important enough to see the real article so guess you'll have to wait just like the rest of us, but I would not hold your breath on that.:D

[retired btc]

[QUOTE=k_fridge;3854452 This needs to be settled, and now.[/QUOTE]

Write your representive's then and demand to know the truth, maybe they will jump right on it but I would not hold your breath on that either !

As stated time and time again their rule's, don''t like them then change them

The Health Department says the "Certification of Live Birth" is Hawaii's version of a birth certificate. Calling it by other names — Certificate of Live Birth, Certification of Live Birth — is just semantics

Here is a link to info yourself I am tired of third wheeling it here.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2009/jul/01/obamas-birth-certificate-final-chapter-time-we-mea/

[geerair]

Barack Obama can obtain a copy of his birth certificate from the state of Hawaii. If he was truly interested in being the president of all citizens, and if he has nothing to hide; what reason could he possibly have for not releasing his actual birth certificate?He has released the documents that are accepted by the State of Hawaii and the U.S. Federal government as confirmation of Obama's U.S. citizenship.



Furthermore, the information I provided above clearly states that a "certificate of Live Birth" is for children born out of state. If Obama was born in Hawaii, why would he have a certificate that is for children born out of state. Hawaii issues the same birth certificate to those born in the state as well as those born outside the state to Hawaii residents. The document is the same for both situations.

The only difference would be that the place of birth line would list the birthplace as outside of Hawaii.






In addition to this, there are serious questions concerning the time line of obama and his parents and there are verified statements from Obama's own grandmother that he was born in Kenya. These are legitiamate questions concerning his birth and the American people have a right to answers.I doubt if these alleged serious questions amount to much; a court in Virginia found the evidence less than compelling at best.







The fact is; if he is found to not be natural born, everything he has done since being in office is illegitimate. This would be a constitutional crises and if this is a potential problem it's better settled sooner than later. And frankly, I'm not crazy about the thought of a President Biden. Nice guy, but dumber than a box of rocks.Obama is considered a legal citizen by the State of Hawaii and the Federal Government.


This needs to be settled, and now.It has been settled for sometime now.

The only people keeping it alive are conspiracy nuts and sore losers.


.

[the mojo]

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


Sorry k but its really a dead issue.;)

[trane]

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html


Sorry k but its really a dead issue.;)


Fukino said she has “personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."

If they took the time to look at the original for all of us since we are not allowed then why no mention of what we really wanted to know. Where was he born?

Barack Obama is the one thats fueling this debate by not releasing the original. Why?

[geerair]

Fukino said she has “personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."

If they took the time to look at the original for all of us since we are not allowed then why no mention of what we really wanted to know. Where was he born?The original and the official copy (which both the State of Hawaii and the Federal government accept for citizenship confirmation) both list the place of birth as Hawaii.






Barack Obama is the one thats fueling this debate by not releasing the original. No, it is the conspiracy nuts and sore losers fueling this nonsense. Everybody else, including the State of Hawaii and the Federal government regards the offical document presented as valid.

[k-fridge]

The original and the official copy (which both the State of Hawaii and the Federal government accept for citizenship confirmation) both list the place of birth as Hawaii.



A non-binding and partisan congressional vote. I wouldn't put a lot of stock on that.

[trane]

When all of this started getting attention I thought what a bunch of idiots to think that there is any chance Obama had a problem with his birth certificate and it would be cleared up in a few days. Now my thoughts have changed since for some reason he decided not to prove everyone wrong and is spending money and time fighting it for some unknown reason.

I am not going to spend time arguing about this with some that are not smart enough to see there is a problem of some kind or it would have been dealt with long ago.

[geerair]

A non-binding and partisan congressional vote. I wouldn't put a lot of stock on that.No doubt you wouldn't, your candidate lost.

However, I was referring to the State of Hawaii, the U.S. State Department, various municipal and state agencies and authorities in Illinois, the Federal Election Commission, and all agencies and officials that require a birth certificate.


All of these entities regard Obama's documents and U.S. citizenship as valid.

[geerair]

When all of this started getting attention I thought what a bunch of idiots to think that there is any chance Obama had a problem with his birth certificate and it would be cleared up in a few days. Now my thoughts have changed since for some reason he decided not to prove everyone wrong and is spending money and time fighting it for some unknown reason.But in fact he has already proven his citizenship.

The reason is not unknown. If a party does not contest a law suit, a default judgement for the plaintiff is entered.

Whacko's and sore losers keep filing these lawsuits which so far have either been thrown out for lack of standing or ruled in favor of Obama due to a lack of credible evidence.






I am not going to spend time arguing about this with some that are not smart enough to see there is a problem of some kind or it would have been dealt with long ago.Wise decision as there is no problem and any questions have been dealt with long ago.

[chas]

Ya and the CIA never lies to congress ...............I believe none of what I hear and half of what I actually see...................Show the damn BC and get own with it..........

[geerair]

Show the damn BC and get own with it..........He has shown it and rational people are in fact getting on with it.

[mrs reb77]

Well, actually he's never shown the document that will 'document' exactly where he was born.

The Hawaiian authorities have testified as to his citizenship. Not where he was actually born. That's the whole crux of the matter. He can still be a United States citizen but NOT a 'natural born' citizen.

If he is a 'natural born' citizen it shouldn't be any problem at all providing the document. Hawaii and their laws on certificates of birth at the time are a major ssue. Had he been born in... Idaho at the same time of the same parents this wouldn't be coming up.

[k-fridge]

More on this certificate of live birth. Some "experts" have claimed that it's fake. Seems that the format is not the one that was used at the time.

This is the certificate he released

http://www.wnd.com/images/misc/shortform.jpg

And this is the format used at the time

http://www.wnd.com/images/misc/longform.jpg

The whole thing stinks.

[trane]

More on this certificate of live birth. Some "experts" have claimed that it's fake. Seems that the format is not the one that was used at the time.

This is the certificate he released

http://www.wnd.com/images/misc/shortform.jpg

And this is the format used at the time

http://www.wnd.com/images/misc/longform.jpg

The whole thing stinks.

I believe the bottom one to be what is called the long form and an original. What Obama is showing like the top picture above is not being presented as a document from his time of birth but an updated computer generated version that has less information but is now used by the state. There are some that believe even it is a fake but it doesn't matter we need to see the original with ALL the information.

[bwalley]

Here are a few questions to ponder.


Q: Did Obama travel to Pakistan in 1981, at age 20?


A : Yes, by his own admission.



Q: What passport did he travel under?

A: There are only three possibilities.
1) He traveled with a U.S. Passport,
2) He traveled with a British passport, or
3) He traveled with an Indonesia passport.



Q: Is it possible that Obama traveled with a U.S. Passport in 1981?


A: No. It is not possible. Pakistan was on the U.S. State Department's "no travel" list in 1981.


Conclusion: When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a British passport or an Indonesian passport.

If he were traveling with a British passport that would provide proof that he was born in Kenya on August 4, 1961, not in Hawaii as he claims. And if he were traveling with an Indonesian passport that would tend to prove that he relinquished whatever previous citizenship he held, British or American, prior to being adopted by his Indonesian stepfather in 1967.

Whatever the truth of the matter, the American people need to know how he managed to become a "natural born" American citizen between 1981 and 2008

[corny]

Here are a few questions to ponder.


Q: Did Obama travel to Pakistan in 1981, at age 20?


A : Yes, by his own admission.



Q: What passport did he travel under?

A: There are only three possibilities.
1) He traveled with a U.S. Passport,
2) He traveled with a British passport, or
3) He traveled with an Indonesia passport.



Q: Is it possible that Obama traveled with a U.S. Passport in 1981?


A: No. It is not possible. Pakistan was on the U.S. State Department's "no travel" list in 1981.


Conclusion: When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a British passport or an Indonesian passport.

If he were traveling with a British passport that would provide proof that he was born in Kenya on August 4, 1961, not in Hawaii as he claims. And if he were traveling with an Indonesian passport that would tend to prove that he relinquished whatever previous citizenship he held, British or American, prior to being adopted by his Indonesian stepfather in 1967.

Whatever the truth of the matter, the American people need to know how he managed to become a "natural born" American citizen between 1981 and 2008

The pakistan travel restriction was an internet hoax....Id say the indonesian citizenship thing was too....because it is extremely difficult for a parent to get thier childs citizenship revoked........ Doesnt even matter if Indonesia granted barry citizenship.... we would still recognize him as a US citizen till Barry himself said he wanted to give it up. There would also be records of this...

Here is the thing.... We were under a republican controlled administration....and Im sure that our government has people in place....who must be satisfied that someone is a natural born citizen before they are allowed to run...and surely before they are allowed to be sworn in.

Never heard a peep from Bush, never heard a peep from Mccain or Palin....never heard a peep from any other elected official or government official about the citizenship thing...... It was all an internet movement that never made it off the internet because there simply was no proof of him being anything but a natural born citizen.... Id say that Bush, McCain....and any other republican bigwig knew the truth and saw the relevant documents.


Why Barry wont release the info to the public.....who knows..... I wouldnt... if everyone who needed to see the documents had seen them and was satisfied....I would give a stiff middle finger to internet wack jobs like Phil Berg...and his followers....

Just a few more years....hopefully the country will not be completely gutted and skinned before he is ousted from office.....but it may very well be...

Just got to pray....hope for the best....

[glennac]

The pakistan travel restriction was an internet hoax....Id say the indonesian citizenship thing was too....because it is extremely difficult for a parent to get thier childs citizenship revoked........ Doesnt even matter if Indonesia granted barry citizenship.... we would still recognize him as a US citizen till Barry himself said he wanted to give it up. There would also be records of this...

Here is the thing.... We were under a republican controlled administration....and Im sure that our government has people in place....who must be satisfied that someone is a natural born citizen before they are allowed to run...and surely before they are allowed to be sworn in.

Never heard a peep from Bush, never heard a peep from Mccain or Palin....never heard a peep from any other elected official or government official about the citizenship thing...... It was all an internet movement that never made it off the internet because there simply was no proof of him being anything but a natural born citizen.... Id say that Bush, McCain....and any other republican bigwig knew the truth and saw the relevant documents.


Why Barry wont release the info to the public.....who knows..... I wouldnt... if everyone who needed to see the documents had seen them and was satisfied....I would give a stiff middle finger to internet wack jobs like Phil Berg...and his followers....

Just a few more years....hopefully the country will not be completely gutted and skinned before he is ousted from office.....but it may very well be...

Just got to pray....hope for the best....


Wow corny you sure will go all out on a limb with all kind of improbable make believe stories and scenarios to protect your boy Obama. A travel ban is what it means and you cannot use an American passport and go to a banned country without getting in trouble.

There is probably noting in the realm of reality and truth one could say about Obama which casts a bad light on him and his legitimacy that you would not defend with a spin, stretch, falsehood or yarn. What a true believer you must be there corny. Truly amazing.

[corny]

Wow corny you sure will go all out on a limb with all kind of improbable make believe stories and scenarios to protect your boy Obama. A travel ban is what it means and you cannot use an American passport and go to a banned country without getting in trouble.

There is probably noting in the realm of reality and truth one could say about Obama which casts a bad light on him and his legitimacy that you would not defend with a spin, stretch, falsehood or yarn. What a true believer you must be there corny. Truly amazing.

Barry isnt my boy Glenn.. if he was...he would be out back mowing right now....lol

Anyhow.... All it takes is a little research Glenn..... these stories have been proven false.

If Barry had ever traveled on an indonesian passport as an indonesian citizen then there would be a record of his US citizenship being terminated.

Why nobody has checked that out is beyond me.

The simple fact is that if Barry were not qualified to be president....he simply would not be president...... doesnt matter how many wild tales are out there... there are people in the US government ....in the Bush administration who would have made GD sure he was qualified.

I doubt he could have even have gotten the Dem nod to run against McCain if they were not damn sure he was not going to be disqualified at the last minute.

Cant you guys see that.....

McCain had to have proof or he would have been spewing that indonesian and kenyan crap at every whistlestop...... Bush would have said something.....

Somebody would have said something....lol

Thats all Im saying Glenn....it does not good to keep on rehashing all this internet stuff because whether we like it or not.....Barry is president...and he will be for at least a few more years....

Hes not my boy Glenn.... I believe he is gutting this country.....I dont believe he will do a GD thing to help the average wage earning working man...and I dont believe he will do a GD thing to help small business..... I believe he is just like any other politician....he is going to help industry and big business fatcats.. oh...and the unions...and secure a very well paid post presidential future for himself.

But glenn..... we gotta live with him.....for at least a few more years.... all I can say is get down on those hands and knees at night and pray for this country.... pray he makes some decent decisions.....

I hope he does well Glenn....I dont want to see this country go into the toilet any farther than we already are.....

I just dont think he was born in Kenya...I dont think he was ever a citizen of Indonesia.... He might have gotten by as a naturalized or whatever citizen by the skin of his teeth... but I believe if the US government had even an inkling of doubt as to whether or not he should have been sworn in then I dont believe they would have allowed it.

[glennac]

Barry isnt my boy Glenn.. if he was...he would be out back mowing right now....lol

Anyhow.... All it takes is a little research Glenn..... these stories have been proven false.

If Barry had ever traveled on an indonesian passport as an indonesian citizen then there would be a record of his US citizenship being terminated.

Why nobody has checked that out is beyond me.

The simple fact is that if Barry were not qualified to be president....he simply would not be president...... doesnt matter how many wild tales are out there... there are people in the US government ....in the Bush administration who would have made GD sure he was qualified.

I doubt he could have even have gotten the Dem nod to run against McCain if they were not damn sure he was not going to be disqualified at the last minute.

Cant you guys see that.....

McCain had to have proof or he would have been spewing that indonesian and kenyan crap at every whistlestop...... Bush would have said something.....

Somebody would have said something....lol

Thats all Im saying Glenn....it does not good to keep on rehashing all this internet stuff because whether we like it or not.....Barry is president...and he will be for at least a few more years....

Hes not my boy Glenn.... I believe he is gutting this country.....I dont believe he will do a GD thing to help the average wage earning working man...and I dont believe he will do a GD thing to help small business..... I believe he is just like any other politician....he is going to help industry and big business fatcats.. oh...and the unions...and secure a very well paid post presidential future for himself.

But glenn..... we gotta live with him.....for at least a few more years.... all I can say is get down on those hands and knees at night and pray for this country.... pray he makes some decent decisions.....

I hope he does well Glenn....I dont want to see this country go into the toilet any farther than we already are.....

I just dont think he was born in Kenya...I dont think he was ever a citizen of Indonesia.... He might have gotten by as a naturalized or whatever citizen by the skin of his teeth... but I believe if the US government had even an inkling of doubt as to whether or not he should have been sworn in then I dont believe they would have allowed it.

I respect your point of view there corny but have you considered this. Who has he had to worry about challenging him? No one from the say no evil about Obama from the wimpy Bush and McCain. McCain went out of his way to stop any and all negative campaigning against Obama by his staff and even state and local Republican campaigns. The press sure has and will continue to carry water for him.

You have had challenges by private individuals but they can't get to first base with the district court judges who won't "rock" the boat and get in trouble and have the danger of being smeared like Clarance Thomas was. The way our system is set up with the press, liberal judges, leftists running most of the branches of the government and a socialist in the WH there will not be any serious inquires into Obama's past or actions count on that. Thank you very much

[trane]

Barry isnt my boy Glenn.. if he was...he would be out back mowing right now....lol

Anyhow.... All it takes is a little research Glenn..... these stories have been proven false.

If Barry had ever traveled on an indonesian passport as an indonesian citizen then there would be a record of his US citizenship being terminated.

Why nobody has checked that out is beyond me.

The simple fact is that if Barry were not qualified to be president....he simply would not be president...... doesnt matter how many wild tales are out there... there are people in the US government ....in the Bush administration who would have made GD sure he was qualified.

I doubt he could have even have gotten the Dem nod to run against McCain if they were not damn sure he was not going to be disqualified at the last minute.

Cant you guys see that.....

McCain had to have proof or he would have been spewing that indonesian and kenyan crap at every whistlestop...... Bush would have said something.....

Somebody would have said something....lol

Thats all Im saying Glenn....it does not good to keep on rehashing all this internet stuff because whether we like it or not.....Barry is president...and he will be for at least a few more years....

Hes not my boy Glenn.... I believe he is gutting this country.....I dont believe he will do a GD thing to help the average wage earning working man...and I dont believe he will do a GD thing to help small business..... I believe he is just like any other politician....he is going to help industry and big business fatcats.. oh...and the unions...and secure a very well paid post presidential future for himself.

But glenn..... we gotta live with him.....for at least a few more years.... all I can say is get down on those hands and knees at night and pray for this country.... pray he makes some decent decisions.....

I hope he does well Glenn....I dont want to see this country go into the toilet any farther than we already are.....

I just dont think he was born in Kenya...I dont think he was ever a citizen of Indonesia.... He might have gotten by as a naturalized or whatever citizen by the skin of his teeth... but I believe if the US government had even an inkling of doubt as to whether or not he should have been sworn in then I dont believe they would have allowed it.

You think, if he was not qualified for president he would not be the president but can you show me where anyone checked? Not one of the 50 states asks for birth certificates or long-term residency documents to prove that a candidate qualifies for a spot on the ballot. They are only required to certify to the party that he or she meets the requirements of the office. He was pressured into showing the certificate of live birth but legally didn't even have to do that. Trying to find out if he is qualified is failing because all are said to not have standing. So who checks? If there was a legal requirement for checking this why would a bill such as HR 1503 even be needed? There is nobody that checks this period and if you can find a link showing its required and has been done I will forget the issue. You assume it has been checked and I know it hasn't or this wouldn't even be an issue.

[corny]

The gist of what I am saying is surely to almighty god.....someone in the United States government had to confirm to someone....lol that he was ok to swear in.

He might be a canadian for all we know.....lol... but someone in a position of authority...or some panel......or some body of people.... gave the official okie dokie for him to become prez.

It doesnt matter anymore.... if someone in government were to find proof that Barry was indonesian...or kenyan...or british...or even canadian....lol

do you think it would come out.....

It would rip this country in half...

It would be the F up of the last millenia....maybe even the biggest screw up in written history.....

Barry is here till the end of his first term.... I dont think he wll get a second one..... I think at the end of the first term even the african americans and poor and working class folks will realize that Barrys policies... if you can call them that....are not going to do anything to help them.

[Hugh B]

The gist of what I am saying is surely to almighty god.....someone in the United States government had to confirm to someone....lol that he was ok to swear in.

He might be a canadian for all we know.....lol... but someone in a position of authority...or some panel......or some body of people.... gave the official okie dokie for him to become prez.

It doesnt matter anymore.... if someone in government were to find proof that Barry was indonesian...or kenyan...or british...or even canadian....lol

do you think it would come out.....

It would rip this country in half...

It would be the F up of the last millenia....maybe even the biggest screw up in written history.....

Barry is here till the end of his first term.... I dont think he wll get a second one..... I think at the end of the first term even the african americans and poor and working class folks will realize that Barrys policies... if you can call them that....are not going to do anything to help them.

It matters because this is the United States of America where we do things fairly and honestly. It does matter and the people want to know the truth.

If this was not an issue people would not be asking for proof. If there was no problem then why are we not presented with the evidence that would settle the matter so those who keep this issue going would be silenced. Why is it that we don't hear from Obama himself?

[coolwhip]

"Why is it that we don't hear from Obama himself"?

I see him blabbering all the time on the glass teet, but I cant understand ebonics.:confused:

[corny]

I dont know why Barry doesnt show the proof.... but I do know this...and Im not taking up for Barry.... but if I knew I was right....and nobody could do absolutely anything to prove me wrong.... I wouldnt offer any proof up

just to piss people off......lol

But seriously.... think about it.... this is the united states of america..... we have one of the biggest..if not the biggest government bureacracys in the world.... Surely someone in some position was appointed to check out these allegations...and someone in this government had to see the proof and be satisfied by it.....

He wouldnt have been allowed to run ...he wouldnt have been allowed to be sworn in if our government was not absolutely 101 percent sure that he was qualified.... they knew the consequences of him being found ineligible after he was sworn in....and I dont think anyone would want to see that.


All I know for sure is that Barry is prez....Barry aint going anywhere till he gets voted out....our government approved of his being sworn in....and they are not going to reverse that decision even if they have solid videotaped and notarized and witnessed by a thousand preachers evidence of Barry saying he is not eligible..... it just isnt going to happen..

I mean seriously...even Hillary didnt bring it up.....and you know when he was taking that nomination that she would have done anything to get him knocked out of the race....not a peep.

~:>

[trane]

I dont know why Barry doesnt show the proof.... but I do know this...and Im not taking up for Barry.... but if I knew I was right....and nobody could do absolutely anything to prove me wrong.... I wouldnt offer any proof up

just to piss people off......lol

But seriously.... think about it.... this is the united states of america..... we have one of the biggest..if not the biggest government bureacracys in the world.... Surely someone in some position was appointed to check out these allegations...and someone in this government had to see the proof and be satisfied by it.....

He wouldnt have been allowed to run ...he wouldnt have been allowed to be sworn in if our government was not absolutely 101 percent sure that he was qualified.... they knew the consequences of him being found ineligible after he was sworn in....and I dont think anyone would want to see that.


All I know for sure is that Barry is prez....Barry aint going anywhere till he gets voted out....our government approved of his being sworn in....and they are not going to reverse that decision even if they have solid videotaped and notarized and witnessed by a thousand preachers evidence of Barry saying he is not eligible..... it just isnt going to happen..

I mean seriously...even Hillary didnt bring it up.....and you know when he was taking that nomination that she would have done anything to get him knocked out of the race....not a peep.

~:>

Would you do it just to piss them off even if it cost you almost a million dollars in attorney fee's? Even after you claimed your Presidential administration will be the most transparent in history.

You need to do some reading on this subject because your belief that someone had to verify this is wrong. The only one that can give permission to look at the original is Obama.

[chas]

corny watch this and see if you get it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bVzoNjKbEo

[garya505]

http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/story/776335.html

[k-fridge]

http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/story/776335.html

Can't say I approve of the soldier's tactics, but it will be interesting to watch.

[Hugh B]

I dont know why Barry doesnt show the proof.... but I do know this...and Im not taking up for Barry.... but if I knew I was right....and nobody could do absolutely anything to prove me wrong.... I wouldnt offer any proof up

just to piss people off......lol

But seriously.... think about it.... this is the united states of america..... we have one of the biggest..if not the biggest government bureacracys in the world.... Surely someone in some position was appointed to check out these allegations...and someone in this government had to see the proof and be satisfied by it.....

He wouldnt have been allowed to run ...he wouldnt have been allowed to be sworn in if our government was not absolutely 101 percent sure that he was qualified.... they knew the consequences of him being found ineligible after he was sworn in....and I dont think anyone would want to see that.


All I know for sure is that Barry is prez....Barry aint going anywhere till he gets voted out....our government approved of his being sworn in....and they are not going to reverse that decision even if they have solid videotaped and notarized and witnessed by a thousand preachers evidence of Barry saying he is not eligible..... it just isnt going to happen..

I mean seriously...even Hillary didnt bring it up.....and you know when he was taking that nomination that she would have done anything to get him knocked out of the race....not a peep.

~:>


Or, if you knew you were wrong and knew nobody could prove otherwise you might keep quiet and not have to concern yourself with getting removed from office.

It is not up to others to prove he is not a US born citizen it is up to him to prove he is. However, by remaining quiet and not showing his proof of birth in the US he is actually reversing the burden of proof.

[trane]

Like I said before I thought this would be over in a matter of days after everyone that doubted had been shown they were wrong but that didn't happen. All we have as far as proof that he can be President is the following.

http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/7166/obamay.png

Now if you are willing to believe Pelosi would tell no lie good for you but I believe there is something that they don't want us to see which only makes it all the more important to find out what it is. There is no other reason to hide all the information and pay that much money to protect it.

[garya505]

Well, if the DNC thinks he's qualified, then I guess that's it!

[mrs reb77]

the DNC thought Jimmah Carter was qualified too....:o

[corny]

What ive been trying to say.... is that someone in the Bush admin had to approve him..... they wouldnt have sworn him in of someone in the present administration....before he was elected had been satisfied that Barry was eligible.

Maybe if enough people demand proof then maybe he or the government will provide proof..... but its going to take a mainstream non internet movement...

A lot of people are going to have to demand proof......

I did see on the news today where some army major is refusing to go to afghanastan because he is saying Obama is not a legitiamte prez.

Thats the first time Ive ever seen this issue mentioned off the web...... so maybe there will be more and more folks who demand proof..

But again......someone had to be assured....without any doubts... that he was eligible before they swore him in.

Someone needs to research that...... who makes the final decision that he is allowed to be sworn in.....then go after that person....

[trane]

What ive been trying to say.... is that someone in the Bush admin had to approve him..... they wouldnt have sworn him in of someone in the present administration....before he was elected had been satisfied that Barry was eligible.

Maybe if enough people demand proof then maybe he or the government will provide proof..... but its going to take a mainstream non internet movement...

A lot of people are going to have to demand proof......

I did see on the news today where some army major is refusing to go to afghanastan because he is saying Obama is not a legitiamte prez.

Thats the first time Ive ever seen this issue mentioned off the web...... so maybe there will be more and more folks who demand proof..

But again......someone had to be assured....without any doubts... that he was eligible before they swore him in.

Someone needs to research that...... who makes the final decision that he is allowed to be sworn in.....then go after that person....

I guess you just read what you want and ignore the rest. I told you how it works but you seem to think our government wouldn't let this happen. Why don't you do some research and prove me wrong?

All candidates for President and Vice President of the United States shall be qualified for inclusion on the general election ballot under either of the following procedures:

(1) In the case of candidates of political parties which have been qualified to place candidates on the primary and general election ballots, the appropriate official of those parties shall file a sworn application with the chief election officer not later than 4:30 p.m. on the sixtieth day prior to the general election, which shall include:

(A) The name and address of each of the two candidates;

(B) A statement that each candidate is legally qualified to serve under the provisions of the United States Constitution;

(C) A statement that the candidates are the duly chosen candidates of both the state and the national party, giving the time, place, and manner of the selection.

Notice B above says a statement and not proof.

[glennac]

What ive been trying to say.... is that someone in the Bush admin had to approve him..... they wouldnt have sworn him in of someone in the present administration....before he was elected had been satisfied that Barry was eligible.

Maybe if enough people demand proof then maybe he or the government will provide proof..... but its going to take a mainstream non internet movement...

A lot of people are going to have to demand proof......

I did see on the news today where some army major is refusing to go to afghanastan because he is saying Obama is not a legitiamte prez.

Thats the first time Ive ever seen this issue mentioned off the web...... so maybe there will be more and more folks who demand proof..

But again......someone had to be assured....without any doubts... that he was eligible before they swore him in.

Someone needs to research that...... who makes the final decision that he is allowed to be sworn in.....then go after that person....

I guess you also beleive that the tooth fairy will protect you at night too as long as you are a good boy. The world is not perfect and neither is the US, corny. Get a grip.:)

[glennac]

I found this link which appears to cover it all on the massive cover up of his birth certificate. Can't beat this for the whole story.

http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/obamas_birth_certifcate_forgery/

[air2spare]

A twist I have not seen before regarding the Obama birth issue.

Paul Hollrah over at FSM believes the issue can be resolved by
Obama answering one simple question:

What passport did he use when he was shuttling between
New York , Jakarta , and Karachi ?

So how did a young man who arrived in New York in early June 1981,
without the price of a hotel room in his pocket, suddenly come up
with the price of a round-the-world trip just a month later?

And once he was on a plane, shuttling between New York , Jakarta , and
Karachi , what passport was he offering when he passed through
Customs and Immigration?



The American people not only deserve to have answers to these questions,
they must have answers. It makes the debate over Obama's
citizenship a rather short and simple one.

Q: Did he travel to Pakistan in 1981, at age 20?
A : Yes, by his own admission.

Q: What passport did he travel under?

A: There are only three possibilities.
1) He traveled with a U.S. Passport,
2) He traveled with a British passport, or
3) He traveled with an Indonesia passport.

Q: Is it possible that Obama traveled with a U.S. Passport in 1981?
A: No. It is not possible. Pakistan was on the U.S. State
Department's "no travel" list in 1981.


Conclusion:

When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a
British passport or an Indonesian passport.

If he were traveling with a British passport that would provide proof
that he was born in Kenya on August 4, 1961, not in Hawaii as he claims.
And if he were traveling with an Indonesian passport that would tend to
prove that he relinquished whatever previous citizenship he held, British or
American, prior to being adopted by his Indonesian step-father in 1967.

Whatever the truth of the matter,the American people need to know
how he managed to become a "natural born" American citizen between
1981 and 2008.

[mrs reb77]

That exact argument is covered in this exact thread....I'm beginning to think nobody reads before posting...

[glennac]

That exact argument is covered in this exact thread....I'm beginning to think nobody reads before posting...

True but sometimes it probally doesn't hurt to repeat a few things which are real hot once in a while.:)

[mrs reb77]

Whatever. Would be different if the poster didn't preface with

"A twist I have not seen before regarding the Obama birth issue. "

Pretty much self-explanatory that the rest of the thread wasn't read.

[trane]

Another twist that I hope hasn't been posted yet :)

Just learned about this today and have not done any research on it but it was signed on his first day in office.

http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2009/pdf/E9-1712.pdf

[chas]

wow CNN lou dobbs maybe starting to get it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0eY8CW9744o

[trane]

I don't know what to believe but Gibbs is an arrogant idiot. They don't want or ask for DNA and $15 could be spent on his side and make this all go away. Its a simple question with a simple way to provide an answer but they instead choose to dance around the subject.

http://www.politico.com/politico44/perm/0709/gibbs_takes_on_birthers_b405db7d-0337-4520-ad1a-0b46fae4fcaa.html

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-07-27-obama-hawaii_N.htm

[chas]

3 things that scare a State run Media News Person......Birth Certificate, Sarah Palin, The Truth, They live in denial....