UAW - GM - Chrysler - Ford?

[sarge]

Well, I won't be buying an "American" vehicle again if these losers need you and me to bail them out. :rolleyes:

When is Toyota comming out with a 3/4 ton van?

[k-fridge]

Toyota makes a heck of a full size pick-up, I gots one.

[mustardman]

I have a Tundra 2008 but I prefer my wifes 04 F150

[k-fridge]

I have a Tundra 2008 but I prefer my wifes 04 F150
I've got an 08 Tundra Limited. Loaded with 4WD and the big motor. Sucker will go.

[ga-hvac-tech]

IMO if Toyota or Nissan brought out a full sized 3/4 ton van, GM And Ford probably would have to seriously scale back their production.

And as soon as the bugs were out of it, I would buy one!

[k-fridge]

Nissan won't even be making the next Titan, it will be a Dodge Ram underneath.

[mustardman]

I've got an 08 Tundra Limited. Loaded with 4WD and the big motor. Sucker will go.

Yep I agree the motor is phenomenal 381 hp even loaded with my tools it hauls a@@. I just find the material used in the interior gets scratched if you breathe on it ground clearance is low and I and another guy at work are having erratic issues with the tranny that have not been resolved as of yet. I suspect that next years model will be better. You can play baseball in the cab I have a reg cab as it is my service truck and can fit a fully loaded suitcase behind the seats easy. Ford has had so much practice they just make a great truck IMO. Lots more maintenance on the Toyota too just look at the suggested intervals for everything compared to a ford you will be suprised.

[k-fridge]

Yep I agree the motor is phenomenal 381 hp even loaded with my tools it hauls a@@. I just find the material used in the interior gets scratched if you breathe on it ground clearance is low and I and another guy at work are having erratic issues with the tranny that have not been resolved as of yet. I suspect that next years model will be better. You can play baseball in the cab I have a reg cab as it is my service truck and can fit a fully loaded suitcase behind the seats easy. Ford has had so much practice they just make a great truck IMO. Lots more maintenance on the Toyota too just look at the suggested intervals for everything compared to a ford you will be suprised.
I'm not crazy about the dash material, they could have done better on that. Mine is the double cab and 4wd, so it's got some more ground clearance. Ony 10'000 miles, so no serious problems so far. I did notice the maintenance schedule, but most of it is BS.

[superheatrman]

Toyota will buy part of one of big 3 makes before 2010..non union workers in the USA will make more units again next year, the uaw will contiue to rust away, like a chevy truck..

[mustardman]

Its like anything new Toyota has made industry leading trucks in the tacoma for years and there isn't a ford that can touch a tacoma in quality I think being their first real try on a full size there is a little room for improvement but overall its a good truck. I also have a 4wd but I am at 45000 kms I got it in may. I do lots of driving. The one major positive I forgot to mention is the gas mileage is far superior to the ford while outputting more power. My 03 f150 my old service truck would do about 475kms for 100 litres I get almost 600 kms for 80litres. Same amount of weight in the truck. My tools.

[jmac00]

to bad perception and Detroit's lack of response have hurt the big 3.

Ford & GM (Chrysler/dodge IS cheap crap) both make excellent vehicles. There quality is easily equal to the rest of the market.

Look at Fords New service truck with a built-in computer.........who else sells a Van with a built in computer?

My Chevy '00 G2500 has been (for the most part) trouble free. The thing does eat front break pads, but I can change them in 15 minutes (literally). And with 118,000 miles on it, I have changed the spark plugs once at 99,000 miles and had the transmission lines replaced along with the fuel pump and water pump.

There are other minor issues. Otherwise I have been happy with the truck.

If the Sprinter wasn't made by Dodge, I would by one. But as Far as I'm concerned, Chrysler/Dodge can fold up the tent and die a painful death, they are the Goodman of the auto industry

[k-fridge]

If the Sprinter wasn't made by Dodge

It's a Mercedes

[zzonko]

Well, I won't be buying an "American" vehicle again if these losers need you and me to bail them out. :rolleyes:

When is Toyota comming out with a 3/4 ton van?

Ford is not seeking any funds from the government. They also make a damned good truck

[jmac00]

It's a Mercedes

The engine is a 5 cylinder Mercedes, the rest of the truck is Dodge.........

It really doesn't make a difference to me, the thing will have to go to a Dodge Stealer to be *fixed*:mad:

[JRINJAX]

IMO if Toyota or Nissan brought out a full sized 3/4 ton van, GM And Ford probably would have to seriously scale back their production.

And as soon as the bugs were out of it, I would buy one!
If Toyota or Honda came out with a full size van with decent brakes and a good front-end, I would buy a fleet of them. The reason they don't is that it would impact their "Fleet" CAFE standard average. The Sequoias already hurt Toyota's.

[coolwhip]

Out of a job yet?

Keep buying foreign sheit.

[JRINJAX]

Out of a job yet?

Keep buying foreign sheit.Both Ford and Toyota are customers. Ford is cheap and takes quotes from every one-horse AC company and Toyota is great.

[k-fridge]

Out of a job yet?

Keep buying foreign sheit.

Define "foreign"

My Tundra is built in the US and has a higher percentage of US made components than a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge truck.

Just isn't that simple any more.

[acmanko]

Define "foreign"

My Tundra is built in the US and has a higher percentage of US made components than a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge truck.

Just isn't that simple any more.Yep, it didn't take long for the Japanese and Korean makers, along with German companies to figure out the workforce in the southern US was highly motivated, educated and non union, and could produce their cars not only for the US market but for export as well.

[sarge]

I wasn't knocking the quality of the vehicles, I have 3 GM vans at work. I was making a point that the Big 3 need govt money while the "forgien" companies produce vehicles in the U.S. without it and without overpaid unions and the stringent rules that come with the union.

[acmanko]

I wasn't knocking the quality of the vehicles, I have 3 GM vans at work. I was making a point that the Big 3 need govt money while the "forgien" companies produce vehicles in the U.S. without it and without overpaid unions and the stringent rules that come with the union.
they got government money. the land they built their factories on is basically tax free and Japan has always helped their companies at home.

[Mr Bill]

I wasn't knocking the quality of the vehicles, I have 3 GM vans at work. I was making a point that the Big 3 need govt money while the "foreign" companies produce vehicles in the U.S. without it and without overpaid unions and the stringent rules that come with the union.

Not by no means taking up for the big three losers but Toyota, Honda, Nissan have only been making cars in the US for under ten years, so they don't have retirees to deal with as of yet and all there health care and etc. but someday they will.

[sarge]

What if your company was called "Toyota Air Conditioning" and your competitiors "Chevy A/C", "Ford Comfort" and "Chrysler Cooling" were going under due to bad management decisons and union regulations.

Would you be pissed that those guys went to city hall to get some special treatment to keep their doors open? They don't have to pull or pay for permits anymore or pay payrooll or property taxes anymore, for example.

What if they had a history of hack style work (think 70's and 80's cars) and now they want to continue to compete with you even though you figured out how to manage your labor and other costs?

[jmac00]

I think we should look at pay structure, from top to bottom.

Personally I have come to the conclusion that the problems the big 3 are having are all money related, not quality related.

The Japs/germans/British have all built new plants in the US last 5 years.

It ALL boils down to *follow-da-money* the B3 have the worse pay structure than anyone. From the CEO down to the Janitor.:rolleyes:

[JRINJAX]

I heard yesterday that GM and Toyota both produced roughly 970,000 vehicles last year. General motors lost 37 billion dollars and Toyota made 17 Billion dollars.

So MY tax money will fix GM's problem???

[acmanko]

I heard yesterday that GM and Toyota both produced roughly 970,000 vehicles last year. General motors lost 37 billion dollars and Toyota made 17 Billion dollars.

So MY tax money will fix GM's problem???


What does it mean that the yen is "misaligned"?
Currency misalignment takes place when a country's currency value vis-á-vis other currencies is not consistent with economic fundamentals. Most often, this reflects a policy choice carried out by governments and central banks to artificially set the value of a currency in order to gain an unfair competitive advantage over trading partners. When a country's currency is weak relative to others, its exports become cheaper to purchase in overseas markets, and imports become more expensive.

What is the effect of a misaligned yen on the U.S. auto industry?
The impact of the Japanese government actively maintaining an artificially low yen is a fundamental competitive factor for the entire U.S. auto and auto parts industry. The misaligned yen is giving the average imported Japanese car a $4000 windfall cost advantage over U.S. automakers and other competitors in the U.S. market. This ‘yen subsidy' also crosses over to Japanese vehicles made in the U.S. because of the high level of imported and subsidized auto parts used in their U.S. based plants.

How much of a windfall advantage does the weak yen policy provide for an average Japanese vehicle?
The average windfall cost advantage is $4,000 when the yen is valued at 118¥ to the dollar. The actual windfall varies depending on the model and product range (and the value of the yen). For higher end Japanese imported SUVs like the Toyota Highlander — and for the Lexus line, which is imported from Japan — it can range up to $10,000 per car.

How much of a windfall advantage does the weak yen policy provide Japanese auto manufacturers each year?
An artificially weak yen of 118¥ to the dollar provided a total of $8.8 billion in additional revenue to Japanese automakers on the 2.2 million cars they exported to the U.S. from Japan in 2006. The total yen subsidy provided to Japanese automakers in 2006 was $13.6 billion — $8.8 billion for car & truck exports to the U.S. and $4.6 billion for imported parts used in American-made Japanese cars.

What in your view is the yen's proper value?
Prior to intervention, the yen was valued at close to parity with the dollar, meaning approximately 95-100 yen to the dollar. We agree with the assessment of most economists today that, despite some mild strengthening in early March, the yen is still at least 20 to 25 percent undervalued.

Why would the Government of Japan choose to subsidize their products through a weak yen?
The Japanese government's weak-yen strategy was deliberately pursued as a policy of last resort to boost its economy via 'export-led growth' following ten years of failure to address domestic economic stagnation. Unable to stimulate normal domestic-led demand, the government reverted to its l970's 'Japan Inc.' model of export-led demand, an approach also known as 'beggar thy neighbor' — i.e., growth at your neighbor's expense.

The weak yen makes Japanese goods less expensive to buy in overseas markets like the U.S. The policy has been very successful for Japan; since the government began intervening in currency markets in 2001, exports, led by Japan's auto industry, have bolstered the economy, which is now growing at an annual rate of 4%.

Why is the yen subsidy a competitive challenge to U.S. automakers?
Between 2000 and 2004, the Japanese government spent more than $400 billion in direct interventions in global currency markets, buying dollars specifically to push down the value of the yen. This was the largest single currency intervention ever undertaken by a single country. Nevertheless, the U.S. administration tacitly approved Japan's aggressive moves to secure a weak yen, disregarding the impact on the U.S. economy and in particular the regions and industries most vulnerable to the resulting surge of Japanese exports.

Since 2004, the Japanese government has engaged in "jawboning" — actively talking down the value of the yen through public statements that make it clear to currency traders that they're willing to intervene again if necessary.

In addition, low Japanese interest rates have fostered an enormous "carry trade" by which international investors borrow yen at cheap rates to invest in instruments denominated in higher yielding currencies. The carry trade — estimated by some analysts to be worth up to a trillion dollars — keeps the yen low while creating a source of great potential instability for the global financial system. A stronger yen would undermine the financial underpinnings of the "carry trade."

Why is the yen subsidy a competitive challenge to U.S. automakers?
U.S. auto companies are changing their business models and making the painful but necessary adjustments to compete successfully in today's global market. Ford, DaimlerChrysler and GM produce state-of-the-art autos using the most advanced technologies in the world. However, these companies alone cannot counter the effects of an artificially weak yen that gives their Japanese competitors an unfair and unearned competitive advantage worth thousands of dollars per car.

Aside from hurting U.S. automakers, how does the yen subsidy impact the American economy?
The artificially low yen has helped fuel our trade deficit with Japan. The U.S. trade deficit with Japan has been our largest or second largest bilateral trade deficit for over 25 years. In 2006, the U.S. trade deficit with Japan reached $88 billion, the second largest such deficit we maintain with any trading partner. A full two thirds of this deficit ($54 billion) comes from autos and auto parts.

Why didn't the U.S. government act long ago to halt the Japanese yen subsidy policy if it is so damaging to U.S. interests?
Previous Democratic and Republican Administrations took actions to address the misaligned yen, but unfortunately, the current Administration has for some years now given greater priority to stimulating Japan's economic recovery than to the recovery of its own manufacturing sector. As explained by former Treasury Undersecretary John Taylor in his new book, "Global Financial Warriors", the U.S. deliberately broke long-standing precedent by encouraging the Japanese to weaken the yen in 2000/2001 to spur exports to strengthen its economy. Taylor writes:

"In the past, U.S. administrations had leaned heavily against the Japanese intervening in the markets to drive down the yen. By adopting a more tolerant position toward intervention … we could help to increase the money supply in Japan. … True to their word, intervention did increase; eventually it increased to unprecedented magnitudes, to $320 billion!"

What do you want the Japanese to do about this problem?
The Japanese government should work to reduce the $875 billion in foreign exchange reserves (80% percent in U.S. dollars) it built up in earlier years to stop the yen appreciating. There is no justification for these reserves. Also, Japan should accede to requests by European finance ministers to put the issue of currency misalignment on the table at the next G-7 meeting.

Finally, since the yen has been consistently managed and misaligned for so long, it may be necessary for both the U.S. and Japanese governments to work cooperatively with the governments of other major currencies to realign the value of the yen to reflect its real value.

What do you want the U.S. to do about this problem?
It is time for the U.S. to demand that the Japanese allow the yen to return to its true value at between 95¥ -100¥ to the dollar, thus accurately reflecting the country's economic fundamentals. The U.S. should insist that the IMF convene a special session to reach a multiparty agreement dealing directly with the destabilizing effects of misaligned currencies, excessive foreign reserves and trade balances. Our government must demonstrate its opposition to any country seeking economic advantage through a weak currency.

Should Congress take action?
Absolutely. Congress should considerably tighten current law so that the Treasury Department can no longer deny economic realities by routinely reporting that no U.S. trading partner, including Japan, has taken action to manipulate its currency to gain an unfair trading advantage. Furthermore, changes to this law should incorporate specific U.S. policy actions to be taken when currency misalignment is uncovered, including language stating that the practice of fundamental currency misalignment constitutes an unacceptable unfair trade practice enforceable under U.S. trade law.

How big of a factor is the weak yen in supporting Japanese auto exports?
The Japanese government's policy is to stimulate Japan's economy via export growth. Thanks to the weak yen, more than half (52%) of all automobiles manufactured in Japan in 2006 were produced for export to other countries, exceeding 50% for the first time in 19 years. In fact, even as demand within Japan for new autos declines, Japanese companies are adding production capacity to Japan-based facilities, reactivating assembly lines, adding workers and postponing planned factory closures as they move to export ever greater numbers of vehicles.

Are most Japanese cars sold in the U.S. made in America?
No. While Japanese automakers have built manufacturing facilities in the U.S. since the 1980s, they still export as many vehicles to the U.S. as they did 20 years ago (2.2 million a year). The weak yen has caused a surge of auto exports from Japan to the U.S., its largest market. These exported vehicles are primarily SUVs, trucks and luxury vehicles. In fact, almost half of all Toyotas sold in the U.S. market in 2006 were built not in America, but in Japan by Japanese workers for export directly to U.S. dealerships.

Don't Japanese companies employ just as many U.S. workers as you do?
No. GM, Ford and DaimlerChrysler directly employ some 350,000 U.S. autoworkers compared to 75,000 U.S. autoworkers employed by Japanese companies. Japanese companies not surprisingly have most of their workers in Japan, where they employ 209,000 autoworkers. U.S. auto companies are responsible for over seven million additional jobs, and the U.S. companies purchase 80 percent of all U.S. automotive parts and components. This $171 billion in annual purchases by U.S. companies provides hundreds of thousands of jobs in the automotive supplier and commodity industries, which have facilities in all 50 states.

But don't the Japanese companies' U.S.-based manufacturing plants support additional American jobs by purchasing auto parts made in the U.S.?
Eighty percent of U.S.-produced auto parts are purchased by GM, Ford and DaimlerChrysler. By contrast, on a fleet average, less than 50 percent of the auto parts in Japanese cars sold in the U.S. are domestic. The other 50 percent or more are imported from Japan.

Are others voicing concern about the value of the Yen?
Yes. European finance ministers are now strongly urging the Japanese to strengthen the yen, and leading publications including the Economist and the Financial Times have called for an end to the weak yen policy. While the Bush Administration has yet to take action, there are growing calls in Congress for Japan to address this problem.

Don't all central banks intervene in the markets?
There is an enormous difference between routine central bank actions to control domestic inflation and currency intervention. A recent study by the U.S. Federal Reserve Bank concludes that Japan is the only developed country that actively manages its currency. More telling, the Japanese government only manages its currency in one direction — to weaken the yen. Their government never intervenes, either financially or through official government statements, to strengthen the yen.

[ga-hvac-tech]

I will get flack for this, but here goes:

We need to allow the big 3 to go into bankrupcy... The re-organize.

The result will be broken union contracts, which will allow the companies to become competitive again.

Simple as that.

[jrbenny]

My company's biggest customer is a Tier 1 supplier for Toyota, Honda, and Nissan.

Made in America. ;)

[zzonko]

My company's biggest customer is a Tier 1 supplier for Toyota, Honda, and Nissan.

Made in America. ;)

Big deal

Made in America
By a foreign firm who doesnt play on a level feild:)

[JRINJAX]

Big deal

Made in America
By a foreign firm who doesnt play on a level feild:)I guess you missed the part where the monetary exchange advantage was apx 12 billion and GM lost 37 Billion. If you concentrate, you will realize there is still a wide chasm of 25 billion between the two. Your excuse for this is???? Try global warming, ozone holes, globalization etc..anything except the UAW and complicit management.

[jmac00]

I will get flack for this, but here goes:

We need to allow the big 3 to go into bankrupcy... The re-organize.

The result will be broken union contracts, which will allow the companies to become competitive again.

Simple as that.


I have been saying that for the last 2 months :rolleyes: the B3 need to go Chapter 11, so they can dump unprofitable divisions and cut the legs off the union. BUT!! while doing that, the executives also need to take a 25% (minimum) pay cut.

Let the unions manage there own retirement accounts, isn't that what union dues are for anyway ;)

[acmanko]

if they reorganize the union will still be there to assemble autos, are ya'll to ignorant to know this. just look at the airlines , they go in and out of bankruptcy more than I change underwear, and the unions are still there.

[jmac00]

if they reorganize the union will still be there to assemble autos, are ya'll to ignorant to know this. just look at the airlines , they go in and out of bankruptcy more than I change underwear, and the unions are still there.


probably, but at a reduced rate or at least make the union manage there own retirement accounts.
or better yet, let each union member start there own retirement accounts.

[zzonko]

I guess you missed the part where the monetary exchange advantage was apx 12 billion and GM lost 37 Billion. If you concentrate, you will realize there is still a wide chasm of 25 billion between the two. Your excuse for this is???? Try global warming, ozone holes, globalization etc..anything except the UAW and complicit management.


I am not saying that GM doesnt need to change the way they do business including useless union practices and too many models to choose from. Dodge/Chrysler can go extinct. Ford is not asking for any money. Ford and GM are making good sturdy cars. Why would Americans buy vehicles from a unionized Japanese company but not from an American one?

[JRINJAX]

I am not saying that GM doesnt need to change the way they do business including useless union practices and too many models to choose from. Dodge/Chrysler can go extinct. Ford is not asking for any money. Ford and GM are making good sturdy cars. Why would Americans buy vehicles from a unionized Japanese company but not from an American one?

When I buy a car, it is for good, economical and dependable transportation, not a "Political Statement".

My Wife has been left on the side of the road by newer, expensive Domestic vehicles we have purchased. Since we have been buying Hondas and Toyotas, that has not happened.

I am also an "Early Adopter" who loves all the "bells and whistles". When I buy domestic they never work.....

[jmac00]

I am not saying that GM doesnt need to change the way they do business including useless union practices and too many models to choose from. Dodge/Chrysler can go extinct. Ford is not asking for any money. Ford and GM are making good sturdy cars. Why would Americans buy vehicles from a unionized Japanese company but not from an American one?


the Japs are NOT unionized :p

[jrbenny]

Big deal

Made in America
By a foreign firm who doesnt play on a level feild:)
Ya, it's Ford that pays my wife's retarded cousin $25 per hour plus bennies to screw seats into the floor board of an Explorer. She couldn't hold a job in the real world, but the UAW protects her sorry ass.

:rolleyes:

[zzonko]

Ya, it's Ford that pays my wife's retarded cousin $25 per hour plus bennies to screw seats into the floor board of an Explorer. She couldn't hold a job in the real world, but the UAW protects her sorry ass.

:rolleyes:

She probably says the same about you.:)

[zzonko]

[/color][/u][/b]

the Japs are NOT unionized :p


Well guess your not as smart as you think...741,000 J.A.W. workers say your wrong....lmao

http://www.jaw.or.jp/e/

They are still wondering when the UAW will organize the south and it will happen

Its the south that is not unionized and most of the rest of the industrial world (G7) is

[jrbenny]

She probably says the same about you.:)
I don't need a union to protect me.



And my hourly rate is considerably higher. :)

[ga-hvac-tech]

I have been saying that for the last 2 months :rolleyes: the B3 need to go Chapter 11, so they can dump unprofitable divisions and cut the legs off the union. BUT!! while doing that, the executives also need to take a 25% (minimum) pay cut.

Let the unions manage there own retirement accounts, isn't that what union dues are for anyway ;)

I will go you one better: The top boss of all 3 should work for $1.00 for the year. The massive gain they will get in stock options when they officiate a recovery of the auto industry will more than adequately resolve the pay issue.

Hey, while we are at it: How about requiring every employee to buy stock in the company, and arrange a profit sharing plan. Then every employee will have a stake in a company that makes a profit. And the union will be proven for what it is... somewhere between a parasite and a leech.

[ga-hvac-tech]

if they reorganize the union will still be there to assemble autos, are ya'll to ignorant to know this. just look at the airlines , they go in and out of bankruptcy more than I change underwear, and the unions are still there.

Lessee, the airlines go bankrupt about once a year... you can figure out the rest... :D

[frostman]

It's funny how the southern senators don't want to help out the big three by giving them taxpayer money, yet they come from states that have thrown tax money at BMW, Toyota etc for years. Southerners willing to work for cheap and get squat in the way of health care isn't the only reason they build in the south. If the big 2.25 had more plants in the south they'd be singing a very different tune.

[jrbenny]

Funny...

The ranking Republican Senator is from Kentucky.

Two Ford plants in Louisville.

You were saying?

[frostman]

Funny...

The ranking Republican Senator is from Kentucky.

Two Ford plants in Louisville.

You were saying?

Ford's not in that serious of trouble. And other than those plants and the GM plant that builds those terrible Colorado and Canyon trucks in Louisiana, and the Corvette plant, what other assembly plants do the big 2.25 have in the south?

[the mojo]

Funny...

The ranking Republican Senator is from Kentucky.

Two Ford plants in Louisville.

You were saying?

Well at least Mitch has the hindsight to look to the future.:D

All we get is Mr. Short term Carl Levin.:(

[jrbenny]

Ford's not in that serious of trouble. And other than those plants and the GM plant that builds those terrible Colorado and Canyon trucks in Louisiana, and the Corvette plant, what other assembly plants do the big 2.25 have in the south?
Saturn.

[jrbenny]

Ford closed the Atlanta plant a few years back. I think they made the Taurus there.

[jrbenny]

Ford closed the Atlanta plant a few years back. I think they made the Taurus there.
GM has a couple.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_GM_factories

[ga-hvac-tech]

It's funny how the southern senators don't want to help out the big three by giving them taxpayer money, yet they come from states that have thrown tax money at BMW, Toyota etc for years. Southerners willing to work for cheap and get squat in the way of health care isn't the only reason they build in the south. If the big 2.25 had more plants in the south they'd be singing a very different tune.

The auto plants in the south were given tax breaks to build a plant in their area (remember, there is usually a 'bidding war' between the states to get the plant, so there are lots of states passing out deals). It is entirely a different thing when the entire nation is forced to bail out a poorly managed company. It is a lot more complicated than this tax or that tax.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Ford's not in that serious of trouble. And other than those plants and the GM plant that builds those terrible Colorado and Canyon trucks in Louisiana, and the Corvette plant, what other assembly plants do the big 2.25 have in the south?

GM built minivans in Doraville (north side of Atlanta) until a few months ago.

Labor costs got to high, they shut down the plant...

[glennac]

Ford closed the Atlanta plant a few years back. I think they made the Taurus there.

Lakewood GM plant closed in Aug,1989 over 2,600,000 sq ft of floor area. Atlanta

Ford Taurus plant closed on Oct 27, 2006 in Atlanta

GM sport utility car plant closed in Set. 23, 2008. Atlanta

No more car production in Atlanta.

[JRINJAX]

GM built minivans in Doraville (north side of Atlanta) until a few months ago.

Labor costs got to high, they shut down the plant... I saw that big plant sitting idle while we were at Charles Stanley's Church [First Baptist Atlanta] during the weekend after Thanksgiving. That is a "monument" [might be a grave marker] to the UAW...

We also took a narrated tour of Atlanta too. I never realized the only thing that has happened in Atlanta in the last 150 years was Martin Luther King, to which they have devoted the whole downtown....

[The Doctor]

Here is an article from Bloomberg (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601170&refer=home&sid=a7IwNjIsy8Gw)which tells of the management decisions which got the Medium Three to where they are now.

And labor may choose to continue to arrange the deck chairs as the Titanic sinks. But should they continue to demand the higher wages, they just might not have American cars to build. Maybe they'll be reorganized as a U.N. brand

[ga-hvac-tech]

I saw that big plant sitting idle while we were at Charles Stanley's Church [First Baptist Atlanta] during the weekend after Thanksgiving. That is a "monument" [might be a grave marker] to the UAW...

We also took a narrated tour of Atlanta too. I never realized the only thing that has happened in Atlanta in the last 150 years was Martin Luther King, to which they have devoted the whole downtown....

The interesting thing about Atlanta is that the city is really a small part of the metro area (which covers 15, yes 15 counties). One can live in suburbia and be in a different world than downtown Atlanta where MLK is the idol of the world.

The remarkable thing about Atlanta is that this is probably as diverse a place as any large city in the USA, yet we seem to get along well.

And if one follows politics, one knows that GA broke the potential Dem's stronghold on the Senate last week by re-electing a GOP senator. It appears the rest of the state makes up for downtown Atlanta... (no offense to the folks that live down there).

Speaking of the GM plant in Doraville: That land is going to be developed into another 'Atlantic Station'; the trendy place on the edge of downtown. The developers in town are drooling over what they will do...

[JRINJAX]

And if one follows politics, one knows that GA broke the potential Dem's stronghold on the Senate last week by re-electing a GOP senator. It appears the rest of the state makes up for downtown Atlanta... (no offense to the folks that live down there).

We are definitely proud of your Conservatives turning out to defeat the "Give-mes" in the Urban areas. We have the same problem with the South Florida Snowbirds that vote here and in NY too.


Speaking of the GM plant in Doraville: That land is going to be developed into another 'Atlantic Station'; the trendy place on the edge of downtown. The developers in town are drooling over what they will do...

We stayed at the Hilton in Kennesaw Ga at "Cobb's Place" and enjoyed being surrounded by theaters and places to shop, which was a Godsend due to the weather being so bad I could not take my A-batic flying lessons. In the downtown/Underground area, we were miserable due to all the pan-handlers.