This Change Is Great!

[conky]

After one week of being "President Elect" Supreme Ruler Of The World Obama;

The Changes are great.

Let's See:

Yesterday was Thursday, Change - Today is Friday.
It rained yesterday, Change - Today is Sunny.

Will the sheets in the Lincoln Bedroom be Changed after Bill Ayers (Bed Wetter) sleeps there, Be Changed?

You Betcha,

Stay Gold,
Conky

[fixacr]

I hope the "change" he talks about doesn't end up being what is left of the pay checks of people who actually work for a living..

[acmanko]

Oil and gas prices are falling like a rock. Someone do a search and find where I predicted lower fuel prices as soon as a Democrat was elected.:D

[k-fridge]

Oil and gas prices are falling like a rock. Someone do a search and find where I predicted lower fuel prices as soon as a Democrat was elected.:D


Ummmm, it was falling before Obama was anywhere near elected. In part because the stock market has taken a massive dump. And the recent drops are partly because Obama was elected.

Sooooo, if you're saying that gas prices are falling because the market is craping out because Obama was elected.....then I might agree with you. :D

[acmanko]

Ummmm, it was falling before Obama was anywhere near elected. In part because the stock market has taken a massive dump. And the recent drops are partly because Obama was elected.

Sooooo, if you're saying that gas prices are falling because the market is craping out because Obama was elected.....then I might agree with you. :D You could just agree with me cause you know I'm right, and that it would be uncharacteristic of you:rolleyes:

[k-fridge]

You could just agree with me cause you know I'm right, and that it would be uncharacteristic of you:rolleyes:

Someday when you are right, I will agree with you.

I promise....pinky swear. :p

[Roscoe]

After one week of being "President Elect" Supreme Ruler Of The World Obama;

The Changes are great.

Let's See:

Yesterday was Thursday, Change - Today is Friday.
It rained yesterday, Change - Today is Sunny.

Will the sheets in the Lincoln Bedroom be Changed after Bill Ayers (Bed Wetter) sleeps there, Be Changed?

You Betcha,

Stay Gold,
Conky

heh.....well done..................;)

[smokin68]

After one week of being "President Elect" Supreme Ruler Of The World Obama;

The Changes are great.

Let's See:

Yesterday was Thursday, Change - Today is Friday.
It rained yesterday, Change - Today is Sunny.

Will the sheets in the Lincoln Bedroom be Changed after Bill Ayers (Bed Wetter) sleeps there, Be Changed?

You Betcha,

Stay Gold,
Conky

Works for me as opposed to eight years of screwing the country up......like the present clown.

[RoBoTeq]

I have to "change" my underwear more often these days. Everytime I read the latest thing President Obama is planning on doing, I crap my pants again.

[k-fridge]

I have to "change" my underwear more often these days. Everytime I read the latest thing President Obama is planning on doing, I crap my pants again.

http://www.depend.com/images-new/fitted_280x280.jpg

[jpsmith1cm]

Works for me as opposed to eight years of screwing the country up......like the present clown.

Yeah, now that Obama is president-elect, the world is right. The trains will run on time, gas will be free, nobody will be out of work, healthcare will be free...

...And then you all woke up.

Taxes will go up, more jobs will disappear due not only to the higher taxes, but to the increased union jobs thanks to card check and union thugs, higher oil prices when we put oil drilling permanently off limits.

And all we're left with is CHANGE!

[whec720]

Lets bail out everyone with taxpayer money who wants it. Lets open the floodgates and allow anyone who wants to live in America in. Lets all do what the @#$k we want when we want and let the government pick up the tab. MP3 players for everyone! Now that is some change we can believe in.;)

[5 star]

Works for me as opposed to eight years of screwing the country up......like the present clown.A person who fights producing proof he is legally eligible to reside in the office of the presidency is OK with you?

The Constitution and laws of this land do not mean much to you do they?

[Pneuma]

A person who fights producing proof he is legally eligible to reside in the office of the presidency is OK with you?

The Constitution and laws of this land do not mean much to you do they?

5 star you might want get off this "legally eligible" band wagon for a while just see how it pans out. The guy making the claims is a total nut job.

http://www.pr-inside.com/anti-obama-attorney-philip-j-berg-faces-r912739.htm

"Mr. Berg has previously claimed that the U.S. Government blew up the World Trade Center, again without shred of evidence to support his nonsense."

in case you don't want to read the link, just take in the above gem, Berg is the one pushing this illegal crap. 5 star come clean did you send this guy money? If not why don't you...send alot...for the good of the country!

[desto1]

A person who fights producing proof he is legally eligible to reside in the office of the presidency is OK with you?

The Constitution and laws of this land do not mean much to you do they?

Unfortunately they dont mean much to anyone anymore in this country.............. And it saddens me to see tyrrants' looting this country and it seems a vast number of americans have their heads in the clouds and are allowing it to happen

[rango]

Oil and gas prices are falling like a rock. Someone do a search and find where I predicted lower fuel prices as soon as a Democrat was elected.:D


Did you also predict the continuing fall of the markets?

[desto1]

Oil and gas prices are falling like a rock. Someone do a search and find where I predicted lower fuel prices as soon as a Democrat was elected.:D
I will find this post once hyper inflation sets in and then i will want to see how you defend that......thats right,you will blame it on the other puppet bush and his policies and say that barrack bin laden inherited some one elses mess, right?

[jpsmith1cm]

5 star you might want get off this "legally eligible" band wagon for a while just see how it pans out. The guy making the claims is a total nut job.

http://www.pr-inside.com/anti-obama-attorney-philip-j-berg-faces-r912739.htm


Is Bill Richardson a nut? He proclaimed Mr Obama an "immigrant".

This whole business is too fishy for me. If the accusations are totally false, why not refute them immediately, provide the proof, and make the guy look stupid. Instead, Obama's legal response is to countersue?

If Obama has nothing to hide, then why the big issue. If he had provided a legal birth certificate, this story would have been a kook by-line, instead, we are still talking about it because he has chosen NOT to produce the information.

Sounds to me like there is merit to this claim, simply because Obama is hiding and not being forthcoming with the information.

[Pneuma]

I will find this post once hyper inflation sets in and then i will want to see how you defend that......thats right,you will blame it on the other puppet bush and his policies and say that barrack bin laden inherited some one elses mess, right?

The fed and paulson are flooding the system with cash. Hyper inflation has been widely predicted to be the result. Some people can't figure out why it has not happened yet. The seeds are sewn right now. It could start after Barack is sworn in, as a matter of coincidence, but the seeds of that are out there right now. Can you refute that?

[desto1]

im sure that and a lot more unfourtunately.http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article5158569.ece
the point is paulsen and "kash-n-carry" are former goldman-sachs guys and they are robbing us blind. and the point is bush,obammy and the rest of the crooks in d.c. are puppets of the global bankers.

[Pneuma]

Bill Richardson endorsed Obama and may be in his cabinet. Is there some other Bill? I don't know what you are talking about, sorry.

[Pneuma]

im sure that and a lot more unfourtunately.http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article5158569.ece
the point is paulsen and "kash-n-carry" are former goldman-sachs guys and they are robbing us blind. and the point is bush,obammy and the rest of the crooks in d.c. are puppets of the global bankers.

Your condemning all of washington adn it's real hard for me to argue with you over that point :D I just hope we someohow survive.

[jpsmith1cm]

Bill Richardson endorsed Obama and may be in his cabinet. Is there some other Bill? I don't know what you are talking about, sorry.

The same guy. It was the day after the election. He said it once and it disappeared.

The quote was something to the effect of "it's great that an immigrant was elected as president".

If memory serves, he was talking to a group of spanish speakers because he repeated himself in spanish.

[smokin68]

A person who fights producing proof he is legally eligible to reside in the office of the presidency is OK with you?

The Constitution and laws of this land do not mean much to you do they?

Even if Ronald Reagan witnessed his birth and acknowledged it in his memoires,it still wouldn't be enough proof.

http://www.ihavenet.com/Barrack-Obama-Its-Official-Obama-Born-In-The-USA.html

[jpsmith1cm]

Even if Ronald Reagan witnessed his birth and acknowledged it in his memoires,it still wouldn't be enough proof.

http://www.ihavenet.com/Barrack-Obama-Its-Official-Obama-Born-In-The-USA.html

Then why did he countersue? Its stupid. Just show the birth certificate and move on.

Something still smells here.

Either Obama has no problems wasting other people's money, or he is hiding something.

[skwsproul]

Could the current market failure be because the wealth redistribution has scared anyonone who has built wealth into moving their money overseas, or maybe it is the 401k investors pulling their money that they have worked hard to save out so that they can still call it their own when he nationalizes the 401k funds as he promissed. I think possibly both are a major influence as well as the current economical status that was created by the democrats in the first place. kind of makes you think that they knew it was going to happen so they planned an economic dissaster shortly before the moron cheated his way to becoming the pres elect. HMMM why are so many ameircans getting up in arms by buying guns now in a record pace? This unqualified natzi is going to screw us hardworking americans royaly and most will not even know how or why it happened. Jobs are leaving my state faster than you can count them since the election and many of us here in Ohio are considering getting out of here while we still can and the idiot has not even taken office yet. THROW OUT THE FRAUDULANT VOTES AND RECOUNT NOW PLEASE, PLEASE. I love my country and will stand up to overthrow this idiot if neccasary but I do not know how long we are going to be able to hold on to the edge of the funnel in this ever quickly flushing toilet bowl that they have created.

[x-wrenchturner]

I love my country and will stand up to overthrow this idiot if neccasary ...
Yea what he said!
Who started all this democracy stuff anyway!
It's unpatriotic I tell you, it's unpatriotic...

Now attempting to overthrow the democratically elected government of the United States of America may be committing an act of treason, but my guy lost so it's okay.
:rolleyes:



THROW OUT THE FRAUDULANT VOTES AND RECOUNT NOW PLEASE, PLEASE.
I mean voting and all is fine with me, but can't we just have all republicans running instead of all these other people?


Jobs are leaving my state faster than you can count them since the election ..
Everything was going along just fine until all this election stuff happened!
:rolleyes:



kind of makes you think that they knew it was going to happen so they planned an economic dissaster shortly before the moron cheated his way to becoming the pres elect.
You know all this thinking and stuff also makes you wonder if they don't have a double secret plan to get this country back on economically stable ground after BO actually gets sworn in,
now wouldn't that be a real scam!

If he brings us to much economic prosperity I say he should be impeached!




...many of us here in Ohio are considering getting out of here while we still can

You know I keep hearing about all these jobs being sent down to Mexico.
You may want to try down there.


.

[smokin68]

[QUOTE=skwsproul;2044666] THROW OUT THE FRAUDULANT VOTES AND RECOUNT NOW PLEASE, PLEASE. QUOTE]


Why? They didn't throw out the ones that got Bush elected, with the deciding state run by his BROTHER. Can't get any more questionable than that. It'll take YEARS to clean up BUSH's mess.

[jpsmith1cm]

[QUOTE=skwsproul;2044666] THROW OUT THE FRAUDULANT VOTES AND RECOUNT NOW PLEASE, PLEASE. QUOTE]


Why? They didn't throw out the ones that got Bush elected, with the deciding state run by his BROTHER. Can't get any more questionable than that. It'll take YEARS to clean up BUSH's mess.

Quit whining already. By every recount, Bush won that election, fair and square. Even using the Al Gore standard, Bush won.

I think that it was Washington Post, had several private recounts done using the various standards proposed in 2000. Bush won them all.

Since they were trying to prove that Al should have won, it was a little tiny by-line.

You Dems have it ALL now, so we should all be rolling in gold within a year or so, right? Sh***ing diamonds and wiping with Benjimans?

Give me a break!

Socialism never prospers. Never has, never will. Obama, Reed, and Pelosi won't make it work any more than Stalin, Marx, or Lenin did.

[smokin68]

[QUOTE=smokin68;2044931]

Quit whining already. By every recount, Bush won that election, fair and square. Even using the Al Gore standard, Bush won.

I think that it was Washington Post, had several private recounts done using the various standards proposed in 2000. Bush won them all.

Since they were trying to prove that Al should have won, it was a little tiny by-line.

You Dems have it ALL now, so we should all be rolling in gold within a year or so, right? Sh***ing diamonds and wiping with Benjimans?

Give me a break!

Socialism never prospers. Never has, never will. Obama, Reed, and Pelosi won't make it work any more than Stalin, Marx, or Lenin did.

Uh, the ONLY ones WHINING are you Republicans. You should read the post I was answering before blurting out stupidity. BTW, Gore WON the popular vote....enough said.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0876793.html

[ga-hvac-tech]

The fed and paulson are flooding the system with cash. Hyper inflation has been widely predicted to be the result. Some people can't figure out why it has not happened yet. The seeds are sewn right now. It could start after Barack is sworn in, as a matter of coincidence, but the seeds of that are out there right now. Can you refute that?

You and I disagree on some things, but this post is right on!

Folks, we are in a temporary deflationary cycle, which will be followed by price, wage, and stag flation... and get ready for bracket creep... that is, your wages go up and you get bumped into a higher tax bracket... guess what... you pay a higher % of income in taxes (to pay for all that free stuff you were promised), and end up with less $$$ to spend. And lets not forget that EVERY country in the world with government funded healthcare has horror stories about quality and availability... they just do not make it to the evening news...that kind of story does not make ratings and profits.

No, the solution is LESS government, not more handouts... remember, those handouts have to be paid by someone, and that someone is the taxpayer.

Remember Jimmy Carter (I would rather not)... he proposed similar policies... and look what happened... why will it be any different this time???

[ga-hvac-tech]

Then why did he countersue? Its stupid. Just show the birth certificate and move on.

Something still smells here.

Either Obama has no problems wasting other people's money, or he is hiding something.

Just my opinion here: Folks that grew up and became lawyers do not have much respect for being UNDER the authority of the laws they make. I have served on a few juries; and it appears to me that the lawyers job is not to find who is right and wrong--rather to manipulate the system to win the case...

Now lets place someone that does not believe they are responsible to the law, and can make laws to suite themselves, and has not worked an honest day in their lives... place them in the most powerful job in the world... and tell me there will not be corruption on a grand scale (whether the media reports it or not)... Even grade school kids know better than this... :rolleyes:

[ga-hvac-tech]

What I find amazing about this election is that folks seem to vote their wallet with little or no understanding about economics or the business cycle.

Fact: When one lives (higher than they can afford in a cash economy) off credit (cashing out the appreciation of one's home for cash), that is not wise.

Fact: There is this thingy called the business cycle. It goes up and it comes back down... NO politician has ever been able to change that (even before the USA existed).

Fact: Folks think they will get a free-bee from the government... nobody ever thinks about where the $$$ comes from.

So tell me; did folks make wise decisions for the last 8 years? If not, then why is it the fault of the administration their lives are in the tank?

[smokin68]

So tell me; did folks make wise decisions for the last 8 years? If not, then why is it the fault of the administration their lives are in the tank?

I agree as to the not so wise decisions. Some people need guidance. Some don't care about credit ratings etc. The fact remains that sub-prime mortages and low federal interest rates were given to people during the last administration, with noone taking into account the "what if something happens" question on how it will be payed back. Now the card house has fallen....

[x-wrenchturner]

The fact remains that sub-prime mortages and low federal interest rates were given to people during the last administration....

Yea, but you are forgetting that "the buck stops here" does not apply to the last 8 years.

[jpsmith1cm]

[QUOTE=jpsmith1cm;2044968]

Uh, the ONLY ones WHINING are you Republicans. You should read the post I was answering before blurting out stupidity. BTW, Gore WON the popular vote....enough said.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0876793.html

Yes, Gore won the popular vote.

SO WHAT?

This brings me to another point.

How many stupid people didn't understand the electoral college in 2000?

The nation-wide popular vote means exactly nothing, as it should.

Personally, I believe that if a person can't take the time and initiative to educate themselves as to how our system of government works then they should not be eligible to vote.


I believe that we would have less problems with the country if that were the case. If you are educated, you will make a decision based on facts, rather than campaign slogans and rhetoric.

[Snapperhead]

I agree as to the not so wise decisions. Some people need guidance. Some don't care about credit ratings etc. The fact remains that sub-prime mortages and low federal interest rates were given to people during the last administration, with noone taking into account the "what if something happens" question on how it will be payed back. Now the card house has fallen....And who can we thank for the forcing of banks to hand out loans to those who dont qualify ? Who can we thank for threatening banks with " if you dont give Armundo Gonzales a 500,000 loan even though hes broke and jobless , we will sue for racism "

Take a wild guess .....

[Roscoe]

And who can we thank for the forcing of banks to hand out loans to those who dont qualify ? Who can we thank for threatening banks with " if you dont give Armundo Gonzales a 500,000 loan even though hes broke and jobless , we will sue for racism "

Take a wild guess .....


Good one snapper

these people........

New York Times - Clinton Adminstration Pressured Fannie Mae

September 30, 1999

In a move that could help increase home ownership rates among minorities and low-income consumers, the Fannie Mae Corporation is easing the credit requirements on loans that it will purchase from banks and other lenders.

The action, which will begin as a pilot program involving 24 banks in 15 markets -- including the New York metropolitan region -- will encourage those banks to extend home mortgages to individuals whose credit is generally not good enough to qualify for conventional loans. Fannie Mae officials say they hope to make it a nationwide program by next spring.

Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, has been under increasing pressure from the Clinton Administration to expand mortgage loans among low and moderate income people and felt pressure from stock holders to maintain its phenomenal growth in profits.

[ga-hvac-tech]

I agree as to the not so wise decisions. Some people need guidance. Some don't care about credit ratings etc. The fact remains that sub-prime mortages and low federal interest rates were given to people during the last administration, with noone taking into account the "what if something happens" question on how it will be payed back. Now the card house has fallen....

Good point Smokin, and well posted! How about lets take this a little farther:

If the government says it is OK to drink and drive, but says we will bust you BIG time for driving drunk... what do you (not you personally, rather a person) do?

One person says I will just enjoy the party and hope like h*ll I do not get caught or hurt someone... The other consciously practices moderation. And as far as I can tell, no government agency provides a program to tell folks how to do the latter (drink in moderation)... and nobody I know thinks the government should make that decision (how to drink responsibly) for them..

My question: Should it be any different when I choose to manage my $$$?

So I would ask the question: If the root of the sub-prime mess was in the Clinton administration (laws requiring sub-prime loans), and the Bush administration encouraged irresponsible borrowing;
Who is to blame when our lives go down the toilet? The government... or the individual that made poor choices?

I think it is easy to blame someone else, and blaming the government is the easiest one... but the hardest thing is to choose to take responsibility for my choices, learn from them, and make better ones next time...

AND that choice is twice as tuff when candidates for office promise things they know they will not deliver, just to get elected.

[RoBoTeq]

Then why did he countersue? Its stupid. Just show the birth certificate and move on.

Something still smells here.

Either Obama has no problems wasting other people's money, or he is hiding something.
Hiding something? You mean like his being the anti-Christ, born of a jakel sort of hiding something? Maybe he can't provide a birth certificate because he was born in a basement room of an unholy church to a female jakel that died giving birth....ever think of that?:confused:

Then there are all of the alleged family members who die before he becomes the leader of the most powerful nation in the world:eek:. Momma's dead, daddy's dead, grandma's dead, auntie's living in poverty illegally in the U.S., brother's living in poverty in Kenya....yep, I can feel the love coming from this one.

[RoBoTeq]

If the government says it is OK to drink and drive, but says we will bust you BIG time for driving drunk... what do you (not you personally, rather a person) do?

One person says I will just enjoy the party and hope like h*ll I do not get caught or hurt someone... The other consciously practices moderation. And as far as I can tell, no government agency provides a program to tell folks how to do the latter (drink in moderation)... and nobody I know thinks the government should make that decision (how to drink responsibly) for them..


Let's use this issue as an example for my contention that laws create criminals. First off, the opening sentence is an oxymoron because if the government is going to bust you for driving drunk, then the government is not saying it is ok to drive drunk.

However; what if there were no laws restricting driving under the influence, but heavier laws with stronger penalties for being in an accident of in any way adversely affectin another citizen while driving under the influence?

Everyone reacts somewhat differentely to alcohol. Why should everyone be held responsible for the way a smaller group of individuals behave under the influence of alcohol or drugs?

Yes, there is the argument that everyone's abilities are impaired by alcohol. The same affect is true for sleepiness, irratability etc. Should drivers driving under the influence of being tired or angry become illegal? With this argument, SUV's and other larger vehicles are much safer then compact vehicles, so why not make it a law that no unsafe smaller vehicle be allowed on the roads? OH! That interferes with the laws pertaining to the environment. So, we can see how laws beget laws and therefore create more and more criminals.

Reduce laws and reduce crime. Increase penalties on viable laws and reduce crime. Less government control with more government protection.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Let's use this issue as an example for my contention that laws create criminals. First off, the opening sentence is an oxymoron because if the government is going to bust you for driving drunk, then the government is not saying it is ok to drive drunk.

However; what if there were no laws restricting driving under the influence, but heavier laws with stronger penalties for being in an accident of in any way adversely affectin another citizen while driving under the influence?

Everyone reacts somewhat differentely to alcohol. Why should everyone be held responsible for the way a smaller group of individuals behave under the influence of alcohol or drugs?

Yes, there is the argument that everyone's abilities are impaired by alcohol. The same affect is true for sleepiness, irratability etc. Should drivers driving under the influence of being tired or angry become illegal? With this argument, SUV's and other larger vehicles are much safer then compact vehicles, so why not make it a law that no unsafe smaller vehicle be allowed on the roads? OH! That interferes with the laws pertaining to the environment. So, we can see how laws beget laws and therefore create more and more criminals.

Reduce laws and reduce crime. Increase penalties on viable laws and reduce crime. Less government control with more government protection.

MeThinks the poster is pre-occupied with their agenda, while being totally deft of the larger truth within the previous post... (OK, that was my Bill Buckley impersonation).

Seriously Robin; The point I was making in my post was there are responsibilities in life, and folks have to make choices and be accountable to those choices. The laws or our country were originally intended to keep folks from stepping on the toes of others. Now-a-days laws seem to be made to advance the political career of one or another leech... :eek:

I might also point out that a libertarian society only works with a high moral character in the people. Take that away, and it becomes a living h*ll... or a ripe market for a salesperson... :D

[RoBoTeq]

MeThinks the poster is pre-occupied with their agenda, while being totally deft of the larger truth within the previous post... (OK, that was my Bill Buckley impersonation).

Seriously Robin; The point I was making in my post was there are responsibilities in life, and folks have to make choices and be accountable to those choices. The laws or our country were originally intended to keep folks from stepping on the toes of others. Now-a-days laws seem to be made to advance the political career of one or another leech... :eek:

I might also point out that a libertarian society only works with a high moral character in the people. Take that away, and it becomes a living h*ll... or a ripe market for a salesperson... :D
I try to stay away from the labels of specific political influences. Just because less laws is one of the platforms of the Libertarians does not make less laws a Libertarian only agenda. I was against the abundance of laws before I had ever heard of Libertarians. I actually came to my desire for less laws from reading Jesus's accounting of Jewish laws that had so yoked the believers that they could not possibly abide by them.

[ga-hvac-tech]

I try to stay away from the labels of specific political influences. Just because less laws is one of the platforms of the Libertarians does not make less laws a Libertarian only agenda. I was against the abundance of laws before I had ever heard of Libertarians. I actually came to my desire for less laws from reading Jesus's accounting of Jewish laws that had so yoked the believers that they could not possibly abide by them.

What about being accountable for one's choices?

[RoBoTeq]

What about being accountable for one's choices?
That is where heavier penalties comes in. If we choose to commit acts that harm or otherwise adversely affect others, then more stringent penalties for harming others would be our accountability.

Take for instance the fact that there are more vehicular accidents in the U.S. per capita related to driving under the influence then in any other major country in the world. Why? We have all of these laws that put so much money into the government coffers and create so much work for the so called legal system. So why do we have so many drunks hurting so many other citizens?

I would say it is because while we have abundant laws, we are lax on penalties. In Germany, a drunk driver is penalized 10% of his/her annual income. There was a recent article about some millionaire guy who wound up with something like a $130,000 fine. Now "THAT" would get our attention and give us cause to start calling cabs.

[5 star]

Even if Ronald Reagan witnessed his birth and acknowledged it in his memoires,it still wouldn't be enough proof.

http://www.ihavenet.com/Barrack-Obama-Its-Official-Obama-Born-In-The-USA.htmlThrowing up a liberal leaning site really shows proof doesn't it.

His grandmother is on video stating he was born in Kenya, as well as his half brother and sister. I guess human testimony does not count in the eyes of Communists.

The Supreme Court has demanded he show irrefutable evidence by DEC 1, 2008. Then again, it is a Carter appointee who will review it I believe, and we all know what a devout patriot Carter is.

Keep supporting a person who pursued Marxist mentors his whole life. It says a great deal about who YOU are.

[ga-hvac-tech]

That is where heavier penalties comes in. If we choose to commit acts that harm or otherwise adversely affect others, then more stringent penalties for harming others would be our accountability.

Take for instance the fact that there are more vehicular accidents in the U.S. per capita related to driving under the influence then in any other major country in the world. Why? We have all of these laws that put so much money into the government coffers and create so much work for the so called legal system. So why do we have so many drunks hurting so many other citizens?

I would say it is because while we have abundant laws, we are lax on penalties. In Germany, a drunk driver is penalized 10% of his/her annual income. There was a recent article about some millionaire guy who wound up with something like a $130,000 fine. Now "THAT" would get our attention and give us cause to start calling cabs.

Respectfully Robin, I disagree...

Since you are one that follows Scripture, here is my thought:

Jesus told us to "...love your neighbor as you love yourself...".

Now how could I consciously choose to get drunk and risk harming another when I regarded them as an equal to me?

This is, IMO, the heart of the moral code that is necessary to have a free society. When it is not there, folks try to win (get ahead in life) at the other's expense... and the quality of life changes from a positive experience to a dog-eat-dog existence.

So in asking about one's accountability in making choices, I am referring to choosing to follow a higher calling.

And BTW: I think the fine for DUI in Germany is not the issue... here in GA, you go directly to jail for DUI... But the jails are FULL of them...

Goes to show, one cannot legislate morality... it has to come from inside (or a higher power). :)

[5 star]

5 star you might want get off this "legally eligible" band wagon for a while just see how it pans out. The guy making the claims is a total nut job.Is the Supreme Court justice demanding proof a nut job too, or is it just YOU nut jobs who support the downfall of this country?

[BamaCool]

Let's use this issue as an example for my contention that laws create criminals. First off, the opening sentence is an oxymoron because if the government is going to bust you for driving drunk, then the government is not saying it is ok to drive drunk.

However; what if there were no laws restricting driving under the influence, but heavier laws with stronger penalties for being in an accident of in any way adversely affectin another citizen while driving under the influence?

Everyone reacts somewhat differentely to alcohol. Why should everyone be held responsible for the way a smaller group of individuals behave under the influence of alcohol or drugs?

Yes, there is the argument that everyone's abilities are impaired by alcohol. The same affect is true for sleepiness, irratability etc. Should drivers driving under the influence of being tired or angry become illegal? With this argument, SUV's and other larger vehicles are much safer then compact vehicles, so why not make it a law that no unsafe smaller vehicle be allowed on the roads? OH! That interferes with the laws pertaining to the environment. So, we can see how laws beget laws and therefore create more and more criminals.

Reduce laws and reduce crime. Increase penalties on viable laws and reduce crime. Less government control with more government protection.
Very well said. Not to pick on elderly people - I hope to be one - but I saw somewhere (don't remember where) that they are the cause of more traffic accidents than people driving under the influence of alcohol at any BAC level and 10 times more of people with BAC of 0.12 or less.
And one more thing, since unfortunately obama (notice how I didn't capitalize that) will be prez, can we just refer to him by his initials? president obama....po. It's also an abbreviation for what he's going to do to all people that have a job.:mad:

[glennac]

.........However; what if there were no laws restricting driving under the influence, but heavier laws with stronger penalties for being in an accident of in any way adversely affectin another citizen while driving under the influence?..........

Let's modify your case a little and make it more correct and I will agree with you on this one. Let's say that if one was involved in an accident and it was their fault then that would apply but not if you got hit in the rear lets say while driving a normal speed or some other circumstance where you were in reality not at fault then that would not apply.

They way it's handled now if you have a trace of alcohol on your breath and you were involved in an accident a lot of the times you are automatically considered at fault and so charged plus the legal limit of being "legally" drunk is lowered from the standard .08 to .05 or even lower depending on the jurisdiction and or the officers "judgement".

Best advice is not (drive while drunk). It is not to drive while "legally" drunk and they are not necessarily the same. So much for my commentary and O BTY I have had only one DUI in my life and I was "legally" drunk but not drunk over 27 years ago. Learned my lesson, its not drunk driving, its "legally drunk" driving that gets you jammed up and screwed unfairly by our "blind" justice system.

[RoBoTeq]

His grandmother is on video stating he was born in Kenya, as well as his half brother and sister. I guess human testimony does not count in the eyes of Communists.


I am not familiar with this. Can you please post a link or in some way give us verification of this?

[RoBoTeq]

Respectfully Robin, I disagree...
I'd learn nothing if others did not disagree with me, so disagreement is not a problem from those who I have respect for their thoughts and opinions.


Since you are one that follows Scripture, here is my thought:

Jesus told us to "...love your neighbor as you love yourself...".

Now how could I consciously choose to get drunk and risk harming another when I regarded them as an equal to me?
Well, just playing devil's advocate; what if you have a low regard for yourself? Then treating your neighbor the same becomes a convoluted issue, does it not? I actually prefer to attempt to abide by Jesus's command to "love one another as I love you". If we could all actually do this, we would all become perfect.



This is, IMO, the heart of the moral code that is necessary to have a free society. When it is not there, folks try to win (get ahead in life) at the other's expense... and the quality of life changes from a positive experience to a dog-eat-dog existence.
No doubt about it. Unfortunately there is the prevelance of evil that will prevent us from being totally moral no matter how hard we try. We cannot be perfect in this imperfect existance. The best we can do is to live our lives as morally as is possible and prepare ourselves for our spiritual eternity as best we can with the evil influences all around us every day.


So in asking about one's accountability in making choices, I am referring to choosing to follow a higher calling.
Agreed. However, we cannot expect to force those who do not seek higher authority to abide by higher authority to behave morally by taking away the God given ability of choice from everyone by creating laws.


And BTW: I think the fine for DUI in Germany is not the issue... here in GA, you go directly to jail for DUI... But the jails are FULL of them...

Goes to show, one cannot legislate morality... it has to come from inside (or a higher power). :)
You have actually proven my point that we are not truly trying to prevent people from hurting one another by implementing more and more laws. We are obviously using laws to perpetuate the business's related to the system that creates laws. Legalism in the U.S. has become just another big business and citizens are being used as commodoty items. Every law that is passed just puts more citizens in the position of becoming another government commodity item. The government has become our black widow and we are all just humanary stew.

[BamaCool]

They're should no such thing as a breathalyzer. It should be some type of coordination and reaction test. Doesn't seem too fair to lock a guy up for having a couple of beers that's driving just fine, and let a guy go that shouldn't be driving any time. There are people driving out there that shouldn't be but it's legal. Somebody that can drive much better goes to jail. Makes no sense!:confused:

[RoBoTeq]

Is the Supreme Court justice demanding proof a nut job too, or is it just YOU nut jobs who support the downfall of this country?
Once again, please show support for your claims. When and where has the Supreme Court, and which Supreme Court, demanded proof of President Obama's birth certificate?

[RoBoTeq]

Let's modify your case a little and make it more correct and I will agree with you on this one. Let's say that if one was involved in an accident and it was their fault then that would apply but not if you got hit in the rear lets say while driving a normal speed or some other circumstance where you were in reality not at fault then that would not apply.

They way it's handled now if you have a trace of alcohol on your breath and you were involved in an accident a lot of the times you are automatically considered at fault and so charged plus the legal limit of being "legally" drunk is lowered from the standard .08 to .05 or even lower depending on the jurisdiction and or the officers "judgement".

Best advice is not (drive while drunk). It is not to drive while "legally" drunk and they are not necessarily the same. So much for my commentary and O BTY I have had only one DUI in my life and I was "legally" drunk but not drunk over 27 years ago. Learned my lesson, its not drunk driving, its "legally drunk" driving that gets you jammed up and screwed unfairly by our "blind" justice system.
You better sit down Glenn, I am in agreement with every aspect of this post.

[RoBoTeq]

They're should no such thing as a breathalyzer. It should be some type of coordination and reaction test. Doesn't seem too fair to lock a guy up for having a couple of beers that's driving just fine, and let a guy go that shouldn't be driving any time. There are people driving out there that shouldn't be but it's legal. Somebody that can drive much better goes to jail. Makes no sense!:confused:
Agree that breathalyzer tests are just tools to help make citizens criminals. I go a step further and say that unless harm has been done by actions, no testing should be done at all.

Police should still have the ability to, on their judgement, retain a person who the officer does not feel is safe to be on the road. A night's sleeping it off in a cell without the fear of being dragged through the legal system as a criminal would still be a good deterent for those who have not hurt others but have the capabilities of doing so.

There are many things our policing structure can do that does cause us to become criminals. On the other hand, anyone who causes harm to others because they were driving while impaired, needs to be held much more accountable then they are today. This would include driving under the influence, driving while angry or driving when you are just too damned old to do so. If I am killed by a drunk driver or by a crippled up 90+ year old with no reaction time abilities makes no difference in the fact that I will still be dead due to the fact that someone else was behaving irresponsibly.

[corny]

People who consume alcoholic beverages and get behind the wheel should be charged with attempted murder.....

Those folks who die in a wreck in which they knowingly got into a car with someone under the influence of alcohol commited suicide.

Our schools and the media are too full of warnings about drinking and driving for people to plead ignorance..... too many people die as the result of some drunk behind the wheel.....

[BamaCool]

People who consume alcoholic beverages and get behind the wheel should be charged with attempted murder.....This is just plain stupid logic. And I should be arrested for attempted murder because I carry a gun? You voted for obama, didn't you?

Those folks who die in a wreck in which they knowingly got into a car with someone under the influence of alcohol commited suicide.

Our schools and the media are too full of warnings about drinking and driving for people to plead ignorance..... too many people die as the result of some drunk behind the wheel.....
But somone driving with another type of disability, physical or mental, should just be sent home to drive and kill another day?

[RoBoTeq]

People who consume alcoholic beverages and get behind the wheel should be charged with attempted murder.....

Those folks who die in a wreck in which they knowingly got into a car with someone under the influence of alcohol commited suicide.

Our schools and the media are too full of warnings about drinking and driving for people to plead ignorance..... too many people die as the result of some drunk behind the wheel.....
I'll go along with this only if those who get behind the wheel of a vehicle while too tired or too angry to drive affectively are treated the same. Add to this the people who are too physically impaired whether it be from a temporary injury, old age or legally administered prescription drugs.

[5 star]

Once again, please show support for your claims. When and where has the Supreme Court, and which Supreme Court, demanded proof of President Obama's birth certificate?Now you are defending Obama. That makes you a supporter, or would that be a Marxist, just like him.

Google is your friend.

[glennac]

Now you are defending Obama. That makes you a supporter, or would that be a Marxist, just like him.

Google is your friend.

Hey 5 star, robo likes to break ranks, he has never been in the millitary (nothing wrong there just not focused like you would have been otherwise) and sometimes cuts the other side a little too much slack. He means well but some times it can get under your skin.

He tends to distant himself from the "true believers" but he is OK. Cut him a little slack. He wants to deal fair and square with the devil if you know what I mean. Just pulling your chain there a little robo.:):D

[RoBoTeq]

Now you are defending Obama. That makes you a supporter, or would that be a Marxist, just like him.

Google is your friend.
I am defending truth. I only asked you for something to justify your claims. The worst thing we can do is to make up stuff that the other side can claim we are lying about. If you cannot support a claim, you should either verify it is not absolutely wrong or not make that claim.

So far, the facts are that President Obama (the State of Hawaii) has provided a birth certificate of President Obama's birth in Hawaii. A Philidalephia lawyer, Phillip Berg is making an issue over this birth certificate being a forgery and is attempting to file suit with the Supreme Court. So far, all Supreme Courts that have been approached with suits about President Obama's birth certificate have either turned down such requests or are proceeding with minimal authority.

At best, President Obama may need to provide a Supreme Court an actual copy of his birth certificate in December. So far, President Obama has done nothing that can be determined as illegal.

[RoBoTeq]

Hey 5 star, robo likes to break ranks, he has never been in the millitary (nothing wrong there just not focused like you would have been otherwise) and sometimes cuts the other side a little too much slack. He means well but some times it can get under your skin.

He tends to distant himself from the "true believers" but he is OK. Cut him a little slack. He wants to deal fair and square with the devil if you know what I mean. Just pulling your chain there a little robo.:):D
Your accusations of me and your pokes at me are getting a bit old Glenn. Because of my respect for you, I have refrained from getting down in the dirt you have been tossing in my face with you. Please, do not make this a contest between us.

5 star has so far posted like someone who only listens to the opinions of radicals. 5 star does not seem to have the capacity to actually investigate issues himself as you and I do. Just because you are agreeing with 5 star on certain issues should not allow you to become associated with his ignorant rants. Just my opinion my friend.

[glennac]

Your accusations of me and your pokes at me are getting a bit old Glenn. Because of my respect for you, I have refrained from getting down in the dirt you have been tossing in my face with you. Please, do not make this a contest between us.

5 star has so far posted like someone who only listens to the opinions of radicals. 5 star does not seem to have the capacity to actually investigate issues himself as you and I do. Just because you are agreeing with 5 star on certain issues should not allow you to become associated with his ignorant rants. Just my opinion my friend.

Hey robo, perhaps I dug to hard on you there. My point is that you don't have a dog in that fight. The liberals are perfectly capable of arguing there case. Lord knows there are enough of them on this forum lately, so why should you give them a hand. Let them take on 5 star themselves there are enough "opinions" and unbacked comments being posted everyday by them for all of us to be concerned about without having to carry their water for them when in a rare case they may have been "done wrong".

Lighten up there I was just having a little fun anyhow.:) Sometimes you do get a little too serious you know. I have to laugh and joke a little to keep my sanity with the election being showed down or throats every day by our "liberal friends".

[Roscoe]

Damn A Throw Down A-tween Tow Big Hitters...........

I'm Wired Up are you.........shazammmmmmmmmm




Now Let's Git It On





jez kidden guys we all have a lotta spect fer ya........................

:D.:D:D.:D.:D.

[sline-dawg]

Lighten up there I was just having a little fun anyhow.:) Sometimes you do get a little too serious you know. I have to laugh and joke a little to keep my sanity with the election being showed down or throats every day by our "liberal friends".


Funny how having fun is a one way deal with you.....:mad:


Your sanity has been missing in action here...... Just poking fun at your red-neck , bigoted ideas.......:D :D :D :)




























































I know he can't handle it.....:o.......:cool:

[RoBoTeq]

Hey robo, perhaps I dug to hard on you there. My point is that you don't have a dog in that fight. The liberals are perfectly capable of arguing there case. Lord knows there are enough of them on this forum lately, so why should you give them a hand. Let them take on 5 star themselves there are enough "opinions" and unbacked comments being posted everyday by them for all of us to be concerned about without having to carry their water for them when in a rare case they may have been "done wrong".

Lighten up there I was just having a little fun anyhow.:) Sometimes you do get a little too serious you know. I have to laugh and joke a little to keep my sanity with the election being showed down or throats every day by our "liberal friends".
Sorry Glenn. You know I don't have any problem with having discussions with those of different viewpoints. I do have a problem with anyone, leftist, far right or anywhere in between who spouts out bogus information with no intent on educating themselves.

5 star seems to revel in his ignorance. Even when shown he is wrong, he refuses to learn from others or accept he is wrong.....OH MY GOD!!!!! Is James back?

[RoBoTeq]

Damn A Throw Down A-tween Tow Big Hitters...........

I'm Wired Up are you.........shazammmmmmmmmm




Now Let's Git It On





jez kidden guys we all have a lotta spect fer ya........................

:D.:D:D.:D.:D.
I am not going to alienate someone who takes me to good places to eat if I can help it;)

[RoBoTeq]

Funny how having fun is a one way deal with you.....:mad:


Your sanity has been missing in action here...... Just poking fun at your red-neck , bigoted ideas.......:D :D :D :)

I know he can't handle it.....:o.......:cool:
Turd stirrer!;)

[glennac]

Funny how having fun is a one way deal with you.....:mad:
Your sanity has been missing in action here...... Just poking fun at your red-neck , bigoted ideas.......:D :D :D :)

I know he can't handle it.....:o.......:cool:

Funny I didn't recall you being inviting in our conversation. But since you invited yourself in, my ideas do not include commie and anti American thoughts like your president elect has and I nor any other conservatives consider American soldiers who fought in Nam and were ridiculed by the commie press, Democrats and hippies as psychos like you once described us on this forum a few weeks ago.:) I hope you can handle it. :o

[sline-dawg]

Didn't know this was by invitation only..... Enjoy.....:rolleyes:




BTW.... you have NO idea who I voted for....;)





And I still stand by me earlier..... and ALL post.....:D

[Roscoe]

Funny I didn't recall you being inviting in our conversation. But since you invited yourself in, my ideas do not include commie and anti American thoughts like your president elect has and I nor any other conservatives consider American soldiers who fought in Nam and were ridiculed by the commie press, Democrats and hippies as psychos like you once described us on this forum a few weeks ago.:) I hope you can handle it. :o

SHAZAMM
COOL



Quote:
Originally Posted by Roscoe View Post
Damn A Throw Down A-tween Tow Big Hitters...........

I'm Wired Up are you.........shazammmmmmmmmm




Now Let's Git It On





jez kidden guys we all have a lotta spect fer ya........................

.................................................. .................................................. .................
I am not going to alienate someone who takes me to good places to eat if I can help i

Tell ya what I'ff'in we ever meet, and we will someday,..... I'll buy.........;)

[glennac]

SHAZAMM
COOL



Tell ya what I'ff'in we ever meet, and we will someday,..... I'll buy.........;)

Sounds good to me. Maybe I'll take you to "Six Feet Under" a cool restaurant overlooking a large 200 year old cemetery where a lot of good old boys in Grey are resting. The upstairs patio has a large byrd's eye view and we'll toast to better times with some Rebel Yell.

Or maybe better still to the "White Horse" were several years ago some smart ass came in and didn't like the clientele to much and demanded service. He was shot and the word was he was trying to rob the place and case closed.:D

[Roscoe]

Sounds good to me. Maybe I'll take you to "Six Feet Under" a cool restaurant overlooking a large 200 year old cemetery where a lot of good old boys in Grey are resting. The upstairs patio has a large byrd's eye view and we'll toast to better times with some Rebel Yell.

Or maybe better still to the "White Horse" were several years ago some smart ass came in and didn't like the clientele to much and demanded service. He was shot and the word was he was trying to rob the place and case closed.:D

he he hehehe both My kind'a places....I'd look forward to it..........but we'd have ta have Robo.......er a couple others ta make up his size.......:D.....I don't wanna be cheap here..............:D



Sides..................it'd be a B'iness spence.......hey ya gotta get yer monies back some how.............:D

[k-fridge]

Sorry Glenn. You know I don't have any problem with having discussions with those of different viewpoints. I do have a problem with anyone, leftist, far right or anywhere in between who spouts out bogus information with no intent on educating themselves.

5 star seems to revel in his ignorance. Even when shown he is wrong, he refuses to learn from others or accept he is wrong.....OH MY GOD!!!!! Is James back?
He's not James

[Roscoe]

He's not James

Damn wer'e not gett'in soft here are we, folks...........?


I miss james he was one funny somebtch..............

[whec720]

Damn wer'e not gett'in soft here are we, folks...........?


I miss james he was one funny somebtch..............

Yeah, him and geer reminded me of Spy Vs. Spy.:D

[Roscoe]

Yeah, him and geer reminded me of Spy Vs. Spy.:D

Yep

They were amusing...........................:D

[k-fridge]

Damn wer'e not gett'in soft here are we, folks...........?


I miss james he was one funny somebtch..............

Yeah he was.

Who knows what the future will bring?

[jrbenny]

Yeah he was.

Who knows what the future will bring?
No.

[k-fridge]

LOL

[glennac]

Well I have to add my comment on James. He was the sharpest dude ARP at the time in my opinion. I never did notice he say something he couldn't back up and he kept the liberals feet to the fire. He was great. I know he has slid in an out of here a few times back last winter and in the early spring but I am not aware of it since.

Loved the video on the Hitler impersonation on him getting banned but the language was to rough and it was pulled from the site and I got chewed out for that and the fact that I took it off another talk site. Wasn't aware at that time that it was in the address of that link. Oh well win some lose some.:)

[whec720]

Well I have to add my comment on James. He was the sharpest dude ARP at the time in my opinion. I never did notice he say something he couldn't back up and he kept the liberals feet to the fire. He was great. I know he has slid in an out of here a few times back last winter and in the early spring but I am not aware of it since.

Loved the video on the Hitler impersonation on him getting banned but the language was to rough and it was pulled from the site and I got chewed out for that and the fact that I took it off another talk site. Wasn't aware at that time that it was in the address of that link. Oh well win some lose some.:)

Hmmm...maybe ACORN could use their resources to get him back into H-Talk.:D

[5 star]

I am defending truth. I only asked you for something to justify your claims. The worst thing we can do is to make up stuff that the other side can claim we are lying about. If you cannot support a claim, you should either verify it is not absolutely wrong or not make that claim.

So far, the facts are that President Obama (the State of Hawaii) has provided a birth certificate of President Obama's birth in Hawaii. A Philidalephia lawyer, Phillip Berg is making an issue over this birth certificate being a forgery and is attempting to file suit with the Supreme Court. So far, all Supreme Courts that have been approached with suits about President Obama's birth certificate have either turned down such requests or are proceeding with minimal authority.

At best, President Obama may need to provide a Supreme Court an actual copy of his birth certificate in December. So far, President Obama has done nothing that can be determined as illegal.I heard Justice Suter has requested proof by DEC 1, 2008.

Go research some, and quit defending a Communist who has not freely shown evidence. Why hasn't he signed permission for the media to have copies of the original if it is real?

Think man think.

[BamaCool]

Robo defending obama...I don't think so. From everything I read, he is simply seeking hard facts to back up claims, so he doesn't sound like a mud slinging idiot if they're not true. I'd like to see evidence myself. Please produce.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Yeah, him and geer reminded me of Spy Vs. Spy.:D

That was some of the best entertainment this forum has had in a while... I hope James is doing well. Geer, well I hope he has wised up about some things... :D

[ga-hvac-tech]

I heard Justice Suter has requested proof by DEC 1, 2008.

Go research some, and quit defending a Communist who has not freely shown evidence. Why hasn't he signed permission for the media to have copies of the original if it is real?

Think man think.

Too many thoughts that scare me... like Mr Obama being disqualified, and Hillary getting in somewhere's... If Mr Obama was disqualified and Joe Biden became POTUS, then it would be easy and rational to place Hillary as VP... dangerous ground if you ask me.

But as I have said many times... not to worry much; in 2010, one or both houses of Congress will be back in the hands of the GOP. And we can get back to straightening out the government.

[RoBoTeq]

I heard Justice Suter has requested proof by DEC 1, 2008.

Go research some, and quit defending a Communist who has not freely shown evidence. Why hasn't he signed permission for the media to have copies of the original if it is real?

Think man think.
Are you really this dullwitted? Did you not just read my post stating that at best a copy of President Obama's birth certificate, the one that has been posted all over the Internet since July, "may" need to be provided to a Supreme Court?

You make the statement that President Obama has refused to provide his birth certificate, are shown to be wrong in several ways, and now you want to attempt to claim some sort of victory by parroting what I posted? Are you even allowed to feed yourself?

Ironically, it is your basic mentality that allows ideals such as Communism even exist. You need someone to watch over you.

[5 star]

Are you really this dullwitted? Did you not just read my post stating that at best a copy of President Obama's birth certificate, the one that has been posted all over the Internet since July, "may" need to be provided to a Supreme Court?

You make the statement that President Obama has refused to provide his birth certificate, are shown to be wrong in several ways, and now you want to attempt to claim some sort of victory by parroting what I posted? Are you even allowed to feed yourself?

Ironically, it is your basic mentality that allows ideals such as Communism even exist. You need someone to watch over you.Conversing with you is like conversing with a homeless drunk on a park bench.

Did you not see where I stated Justice Suter requesting proof.

And Obama FOUGHT, HE FOUGHT Berg's lawsuit instead of providing proof. I know that doesn't raise flags to someone with a low IQ like you, but gees man, think, think with what little you must have.

[x-wrenchturner]

I heard Justice Suter has requested proof by DEC 1, 2008.



Robo,
there is your proof,
back in post #84.

How did you miss it?
:D

[RoBoTeq]

Robo,
there is your proof,
back in post #84.

How did you miss it?
:D
That was after I posted the possible December date and after 5 star made the statement that Obama had already defied the Supreme Court. He's a fool and I have no need for for fools. I'm done with him.