Advice needed on letting go of a long time employee

[shadetree29]

I have an Installer that has been with the company for roughly 10 years. With the way the economy and sales are going there is a better than good chance we will have to let him go after the heating season. I was thinking about telling him now because this time of year he will have no problem getting another job. If I do it in late February or March there is a good chance there will be no one looking to hire.
He has been with the company for a while so I want to be fair to him and his family. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

[refer guy]

just goes to show what can happen when you throw away 10 years of your life with a mgr or company owner who is "business challenged", this is why i only worked for a small company for about a year and a half, i got the exposure i needed on certain equipment, made the company some money, and i got the hell out before i got the shaft. oh and im sure that your letting him go because your business is struggling and not because you found someone cheeper.:eek:

well for someone who invested that many years with you, the very least that you can do is let him know right now so that he can start looking, i think this is the most honorable thing that you can do.

[mustardman]

When times are tough hard decisions have to be made. I would suggest telling him now. If there is any way to use your contacts and find him another job with someone else I think you should do that. If he is a valued employee he will remember that and may return when things pick up.

[Wolfer]

Its always right before Christmas, hope the guy finds a job because Christmas without money sucks.

[bustawrench1]

Bring him in and sit him down for a talk. Tell him the way things are and what may have to happen...............If he's put in ten years with you, it's the least you can do for him. Maybe then when things pick up again, he'll be willing to come back............if you wait until Feburary and blindside him, he will never forget it.

Getting laid off out of the blue in Feburary sucks...........especially if he goes out and signs a loan for a new car or home improvements, thinking that he has stable employment, and with ten years on the job...........who wouldn't think that?

[maxster]

sit him down and go over the now or later lay-off situation.it would be better if he could put feelers out now,and still work there even to feb 09'.the sad thing with this is his quality of work will go down the toilet knowing they don't need him...and he might just get up and walk,and burn the bridges on the way out.if this guy is a lead installer for 10 years what is the deal with managment in there..can't they throw him over to service till spring.

[jpsmith1cm]

Bring him in and sit him down for a talk. Tell him the way things are and what may have to happen...............If he's put in ten years with you, it's the least you can do for him. Maybe then when things pick up again, he'll be willing to come back............if you wait until Feburary and blindside him, he will never forget it.

Getting laid off out of the blue in Feburary sucks...........especially if he goes out and signs a loan for a new car or home improvements, thinking that he has stable employment, and with ten years on the job...........who wouldn't think that?

This is the ONLY honest thing to do. You sound like a decent guy by wanting to do the right thing.

Just some thoughts...

Is he capable of doing service work? Can he be trained? Having an honest conversation with him is the best way to go. Maybe, just maybe, there is another spot in the company for him, outside of installation.

[21degrees]

I am sure theirs got to be someone you know whos looking for guys, if not tell him to come to Canada.

[vettehead]

Yea letting him know now is the honorable thing to do for him and his family. He'll have more opportunity to plan or shop his skills.

My 2 cents

[troyorr]

Any chance you anticipate installs to pick up later? If so, what will you do if you let him go and he finds work elsewhere? Can you afford to lose the experience? Could you offer him some reduced hours until this bump in the economy improves? Talk it over with the employee. Maybe he has a solution you could consider. Put him on unemployment for 26 weeks and then see how the economy is going. That will put you into April and things may have picked up by then.

[flange]

Get a big cigar, light it, call him in and tell him honestly that he is oing to be let go, all the while smoking the cigar, leaning back, and having your feet upon the desk! or you could do the right thing as suggested. We around here have a little network of contractors who each call one another first before a layoff to see if the other needs any help. We kinda have a no layoff pact, and try to keep our guys busy if at all possible. It is a rarety when one of us cannot find something for the other to do.

[Space Racer]

We laid off an installer a while back.
He was with the company for around
15 years.

He was a little rough around the edges.

Man was he PO'd.

He expected to retire from our company.

Next thing you know he got hired as a
lead man at a commercial hvac co
making about 50 a year.

He was just scraping by with us.

[BamaCool]

just goes to show what can happen when you throw away 10 years of your life with a mgr or company owner who is "business challenged", this is why i only worked for a small company for about a year and a half, i got the exposure i needed on certain equipment, made the company some money, and i got the hell out before i got the shaft. oh and im sure that your letting him go because your business is struggling and not because you found someone cheeper.:eek:

well for someone who invested that many years with you, the very least that you can do is let him know right now so that he can start looking, i think this is the most honorable thing that you can do.

Does it sound like he WANTS to let this guy go??? It sounds to me like it's more out of necessity. Put yourself in his shoes. Maybe, when you "got the hell out", you left that guy in a bind. Ever think of that?:(

[shadetree29]

just goes to show what can happen when you throw away 10 years of your life with a mgr or company owner who is "business challenged", this is why i only worked for a small company for about a year and a half, i got the exposure i needed on certain equipment, made the company some money, and i got the hell out before i got the shaft. oh and im sure that your letting him go because your business is struggling and not because you found someone cheeper.:eek:

well for someone who invested that many years with you, the very least that you can do is let him know right now so that he can start looking, i think this is the most honorable thing that you can do.

Wow seems like you have it all figured out...good for you.

[shadetree29]

Thank you for most of your thoughts...I am in agreement with most of you to lay my table on the cards now rather than blindside him. It's the first time in 15 years that I have had to let people go out of necessity rather than a lack of performance. There will most likely be others but he would be the only long time worker.
My biggest concern is that if he thinks he is going he will dog it.....Guess I will have to keep an eye out for that.

[21degrees]

Don't get me wrong but you gave this man a job for 10 years and he was getting paid. So do whats is best for the company. If you think he is not going to screw you, tell him. I jut always worry about them doing something stupid or getting hurt purposely for WCB. IT has happened to me when I was in Union. You would let guys know that they were getting laid off at the end of the week, so they could prepare themself and you always had 1 or 2 that would end up hurt.

[r404a]

Shadetree,
This situation is the precise reason that I would never want to be in the office. I have some thoughts on this, but first, I have to say that this is not an isolated case. All of us will be seeing more of this soon, I feel. Companies are doing what they have to do.
Now, to your issue at hand. As a worker, I feel that honesty is the gentlemanly thing to do. the man has worked for you for 10 years. Now, as said before, this has a been a mutually beneficial situation. I would never want to own my own business. I don't want to ever manage people. as a service tech, I am not worth a hoot without a shop to give me a job.
My boss just very recently was in your shoes. Had to tell our pipefitter things aren't looking good for his hours. The hall doesn't have anything, either. Boss said that he felt that he had to let the guy know what is going on.
He is pissed, but he has time to look around. if you are the sole owner, you have to make this decision. If not, ask management for guidance. I think the best answer for you would come from another owner on this site. good luck.

r404a

[The Penguin]

Getting laid off is a bitter pill to swallow - gets worse the more time in at a company.

treat them fairly and hopefully they will too.

HE will find something - like the rest of us working stiffs he has to there is no other option its the way it is

[neophytes serendipity]

...My biggest concern is that if he thinks he is going he will dog it.....Guess I will have to keep an eye out for that.

Typical owner response.

Yup, I guess that every employee out there is out to screw the boss at every opportunity.... What makes you think he hasn't been screwing you every day for the last 10 years?

I know the owner has that opinion at the company I am at now... They will get theirs when no good employee wants to work there, and all they get are transients between jobs.

[shadetree29]

Typical owner response.

Yup, I guess that every employee out there is out to screw the boss at every opportunity.... What makes you think he hasn't been screwing you every day for the last 10 years?

I know the owner has that opinion at the company I am at now... They will get theirs when no good employee wants to work there, and all they get are transients between jobs.

Yes it is a typical response because it happens. I guess owners shouldn't take inventory either? In a perfect world i would love to be able to go by some sort of an honor code but we can't. It's not that everyone is out to screw an owner it's the fact that all it takes is one dishonest person to set a company back.

[refer guy]

Does it sound like he WANTS to let this guy go??? It sounds to me like it's more out of necessity. Put yourself in his shoes. Maybe, when you "got the hell out", you left that guy in a bind. Ever think of that?:(

a couple of years back i realized to stop thinking like a sucker and start thinking like a company owner which is to...............are you ready.....................to start thinking of who is more important...........that right, its numero uno.

[refer guy]

My biggest concern is that if he thinks he is going he will dog it.....Guess I will have to keep an eye out for that.

this statement made me laugh my arse off, i almost choked on my snack. So all of a sudden you go from showing some sort of caring about this guy who has a family and has been a loyal employee for 10 years to now your biggest concern being that he is going to "dog it" what ever the heck that means. Did you dog it this past year instead of finding more accounts.

let me guess, one month from now you will announce to the rest of your employees that you no longer can afford to cover employee benefits, there will be no more paid vacation, if someone is up for a annual raise then they will not get it, a couple of weeks will go by and you will announce that all of sudden there is money in the budget to install tracking devices.:eek:

[acmech06]

This is the kind of company I won't miss :D, my only regret was why the hell did I work here for 13yrs, in my case I did not get laid off but resigned... my boss was a good man. but working for a private contractor you can only move up so far benefits is a joke 401k ? 401 what ? :mad: with the condition of the economy you might have nothing left by the end of the year! like father like son Mr. Bush did a good job on that, ok I want Mr. clinton back into the white house I don't give a sh*t if he had sex with that wonman :D.

if you are a good tech can do and learn quick move to commercial or gov. the world is big out there I'm glad that I did, work for a private contractor you'll have no future, they'll kick you out as a used rag when they need to.

I'm sure there are good companies out there value their hard working employees ...peace :D

[1972torino]

U have an employee that has shown you loyalty for the past ten years and you come on here and tell us you are going to "let him go". U actually seem surprised by the negative comments. You probly feel that what has been said to you was an insult, or u felt blind sided. How do you think your LOYAL employee is going to feel? Why not get rid of a couple of people in the office? Oh thats right, u cant very well get rid of your neice or your sister in-law can u? Hell man we all know it takes 7 or 8 people to run your office. So go ahead and spit in the face of the man that has bled for you and your company. As long as the office staff keeps enjoying thoes lunches paid for with the company credit card then all is well.

[BamaCool]

U have an employee that has shown you loyalty for the past ten years and you come on here and tell us you are going to "let him go". U actually seem surprised by the negative comments. You probly feel that what has been said to you was an insult, or u felt blind sided. How do you think your LOYAL employee is going to feel? Why not get rid of a couple of people in the office? Oh thats right, u cant very well get rid of your neice or your sister in-law can u? Hell man we all know it takes 7 or 8 people to run your office. So go ahead and spit in the face of the man that has bled for you and your company. As long as the office staff keeps enjoying thoes lunches paid for with the company credit card then all is well.

The man is not running Unicef or United Way! He's running a business. Maybe you should try that some day and you'd soon realize what a Jacka$$ you are for saying what you said. Your assuming he has all these office people (which is a rediculous assumption), and that he should get rid of these people first. It's HIS business and I would bet he knows how to best run it. At least from his posts, you can tell he is concerned about the employee he HAS to let go, and not just saying " Oh well, another one bites the dust". Give the man a break, he's trying to do the right thing. Maybe one day you'll have the nads to start your own business (It's obvious you don't now), and you'll see just how it is. Might even have to let your nephew go!:D

[flange]

I have stated this before, and still feel the same. As an owner, you need to do what is right for the business, but you also need to be a fair guy. This guy has bee nwith you for a long time, so you apparently like and trust him. The reality is that you already see the writing on the wall with work slowing down. Be honest with him. Let him know that you really want to keep him, and will try your best, but if it comes down to paying him for a long time with nothing to do, that is not fair to you. Give him the respect he has earned. This could give the man an opp to maybe get another job to hold his family over until things get better. He might even come back to you when things get better since he is a valued employee that would be good for both. As owners, we walk a fine line between being fair and being chumps. When things get tight around here, I give the guys a couple weeks notice of where we stand, where we are headed, and what I am doing about it. I "lend" my guys to other contractors, "find" work for them to do, and make an overall effort to keep them. They appreciate the honesty, and in only one case did I actually let someone go, but would have kept him if he didnt screw off when times were tight. Being a union shop, I do not have to do that, but i choose to do that. I feel it is my duty to try to keep the men working once I have hired them. Its a two way street.

[1972torino]

Jacka$$ eh? Why resort to name calling? Others have posted their opinions but u feel the need to single me out. Why? I takes more than "nads" to start a business. As of now I have $11,247.00 in an account that i will use to open my own business. And I can assure u "nads" will play a very small part in my business plan. Perhaps I should just buy a 20yr old van and paint HVAC on the side and start running service calls. Would that qualify as having "nads"?

[shadetree29]

The man is not running Unicef or United Way! He's running a business. Maybe you should try that some day and you'd soon realize what a Jacka$$ you are for saying what you said. Your assuming he has all these office people (which is a rediculous assumption), and that he should get rid of these people first. It's HIS business and I would bet he knows how to best run it. At least from his posts, you can tell he is concerned about the employee he HAS to let go, and not just saying " Oh well, another one bites the dust". Give the man a break, he's trying to do the right thing. Maybe one day you'll have the nads to start your own business (It's obvious you don't now), and you'll see just how it is. Might even have to let your nephew go!:D

No No he is right I am just getting rid of the guy so I can buy my 8 Secretaries lunch. :rolleyes:

[Space Racer]

Polarity. Hmm.

[I_bend_metal]

Jacka$$ eh? Why resort to name calling? Others have posted their opinions but u feel the need to single me out. Why? I takes more than "nads" to start a business. As of now I have $11,247.00 in an account that i will use to open my own business. And I can assure u "nads" will play a very small part in my business plan. Perhaps I should just buy a 20yr old van and paint HVAC on the side and start running service calls. Would that qualify as having "nads"?

Only if you named the company... "Nads Heating and Cooling"

"We have the balls to fix it right"
"Work for us...have a ball!!"

Damn....I need to put down the beer and take two steps back.....

[I_bend_metal]

No No he is right I am just getting rid of the guy so I can buy my 8 Secretaries lunch. :rolleyes:


I guess I need to ask a few questions before I comment....

Commercial or residential??
Is he your only installer??
Are you downsizing??
What is your percentage of install dollars to service dollars??
How many people do you have working for you total??
How did you get 8 secretaries?? (I only have 7) ;)

[shadetree29]

Polarity. Hmm.


No doubt but unlike others who post on this site I don't pretend to know what it is like to walk in someone elses shoes.

[refer guy]

so did you and your eight secretaries "dog it" for the past year?

[I_bend_metal]

I guess I need to ask a few questions before I comment....

Commercial or residential??
Is he your only installer??
Are you downsizing??
What is your percentage of install dollars to service dollars??
How many people do you have working for you total??
How did you get 8 secretaries?? (I only have 7) ;)

Or you guys can just argue back and forth about who has the bigger nads....:rolleyes:

....I love this site....:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[shadetree29]

Or you guys can just argue back and forth about who has the bigger nads....:rolleyes:

....I love this site....:rolleyes::rolleyes:

After reading some of these posts Im going to go with Option 3 Those that don't know what happened.....I have made this decision because I am now convinced Ignorance is bliss. ;)

[21degrees]

[QUOTE=1972torino;2015588]
The first thing you need to know, is how to stay in business. You have to do what is right for business and sometimes people arround you get the shaft. You try your best and let the people less valuble go first. Sometimes the people in the office are worth more than techs. When or if you start your own business you will see their is going to be alot of tough answers that you will have to make and this is only 1.

[temp rise]

well if you have been in business for at least 10 years then your doing something right so i would guess you have some capital and a decect net worth, i would take a look at expanding instead of down sizing if this guy is good it really would be a mistake to loose him in the long run. it sounds like your doing mostly residential if this is true go after the bigger market hire a commercial salesman and go after the maintenance agreements or maybe lower your prices include low cost maintenance agreements with your new installs, etc etc. if you don't feel any of this will work for you then call this guy into the office and let him know whats going on if he has been honest with you and has done a good job for for ten years at least give him a good bonus say 10,000 dollars so he can get through christmas and be able to afford his cobra benefits until he gets another job after all you said it your self the economy is slow its going to take him some time to find another job and he has made you a good amount of money over the last ten years. or ask him if he would take a temporary pay cut or maybe do service don't leave the guy hanging

[MRcoolingMAGIC]

I have an Installer that has been with the company for roughly 10 years. With the way the economy and sales are going there is a better than good chance we will have to let him go after the heating season. I was thinking about telling him now because this time of year he will have no problem getting another job. If I do it in late February or March there is a good chance there will be no one looking to hire.
He has been with the company for a while so I want to be fair to him and his family. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Absolutely man to man word....and it is better this way instead of letting him go when it is tough to find a job