The libs have destroyed the country...

[bootlen]

Got this in an email a bit ago and totally agree. The liberal Congress of the last 2 years has wrecked this nation.

Read it. Believe it.

I am by NO means saying that George W. Bush is free from
responsibility but I can't stand by and listen to the
liberal Dem's try and shirk their irresponsible actions
in the mortgage and financial crisis that was pushed into
law in the Clinton administration with regards to subprime
lending policies that were passed by a Dem. congress and a
Dem. president.

Subject: 7-1/2 yrs of George Bush
TO ALL MY FRIENDS and RELATIVES....LIBERAL OR
CONSERVATIVE...FYI only.

George Bush has been in office for 7-1/2 years. The first six the economy was fine.

A little over one year ago :
1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high;
2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon;
3) the unemployment rate was 4.5%.
4) the DOW JONES hit a record high--14,000

5) American's were buying new cars, taking cruises, vacations overseas, living large!...

But American's wanted 'CHANGE'! So, in 2006 they voted in a Democratic Congress and yes--we got 'CHANGE' all right. In the PAST YEAR:
1) Consumer confidence has plummeted;
2) Gasoline is now over $4 a gallon & climbing!;
3) Unemployment is up to 5.5% (a 10% increase);
4) Americans have seen their home equity drop by $12 TRILLION DOLLARS and prices still dropping;
5) 1% of American homes are in foreclosure.
6) as I write, THE DOW is probing another low~~
$2.5 TRILLION DOLLARS HAS EVAPORATED FROM THEIR STOCKS, BONDS & MUTUAL FUNDS INVESTMENT PORTFOLIOS!

YES, IN 2006 AMERICA VOTED FOR CHANGE...AND WE SURE GOT IT!
....

REMEMBER THE PRESIDENT HAS NO CONTROL OVER ANY OF THESE
ISSUES , ONLY CONGRESS.

AND WHAT HAS CONGRESS DONE IN THE LAST TWO YEARS, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

NOW THE DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT CLAIMS HE IS GOING TO REALLY GIVE US CHANGE ALONG WITH A DEMOCRATIC CONGRESS!!!!

JUST HOW MUCH MORE 'CHANGE' DO YOU THINK YOU CAN STAND?

[tunnel_rat]

Yep, it's time that We The People, start holding these dirtbags accountable.:mad:

If Obama supporters really want a change to socialism, try moving to Laos. See what is so great about it....;) Then try and come back and explain it to the rest of us.:D

[acmanko]

what a joke
The First six years of Bush's economy were fine. Any pea brained person believing that need to go back to 3rd grade. The last 2 years of Bushs' economy are whats blowing up in our face. six and 1/2 years to get the DJI back to its 52 week high and set a record high of 14,000 and now its lost. This has to be the dumbest thread I've read in awhile:p

[forged alloy]

What is sad is that with todays culture, if you say something often enough and loud enough a majority of people will believe it without regard to facts. All that is required is to taint a candidate.

Look at how we are being bombarded by the Obama campaign and his minions in the media. No details about his "changes", simply attack ads. There is a full court press being staged as we speak. And you see the polls turning with the indoctrination. Bush and Cheney are now cannon fodder. Palin caught them by surprise but they are busy chipping away.

I fear McCain is too weak a candidate to deflect such an attack in so short of a timeframe. He seems out of his league with old-time dirty politics.

[whec720]

You got that right about chipping away at Palin. This SNL lady makes her look like the biggest dope on the planet. I must admit, she does look like her and the skits are very funny. Here's the most recent one.

http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/clips/couric-palin-open/704042/

[sline-dawg]

Guess W lost his veto pen after that stem cell vote....:o



Both parties should be held responsible for this mess....

[whec720]

Not with the two party system, which BTW, needs to go. They're in the tank for big business. All of big business has been socialized. Not much hope, short of a tea party.

[wolfstrike]

it's been going on for a lot longer than 2 years

[rango]

what a joke
The First six years of Bush's economy were fine. Any pea brained person believing that need to go back to 3rd grade. The last 2 years of Bushs' economy are whats blowing up in our face. six and 1/2 years to get the DJI back to its 52 week high and set a record high of 14,000 and now its lost. This has to be the dumbest thread I've read in awhile:p


Let's see...the housing bubble and bad financing started, oh, 15 years ago or so. Who was the pres. then?

[ozone drone]

If there wasn't libs ... We would still be an English colony

[acmanko]

Let's see...the housing bubble and bad financing started, oh, 15 years ago or so. Who was the pres. then?the problem is with the housing built in the last 3 years. we built 25 years worth of housing in 2 years and now its rotting away empty due to bad loans fron 2005-2006 resetting their interest rates. get a grasp about whats going on, OK:cool:

[glennac]

the problem is with the housing built in the last 3 years. we built 25 years worth of housing in 2 years and now its rotting away empty due to bad loans fron 2005-2006 resetting their interest rates. get a grasp about whats going on, OK:cool:

Well you get a grasp as to how folks who couldn't afford those homes got their loans. Thank you Democrats who set it up so they could and now we are all paying for it. Can't you understand that? Of course not because Democrats are responsible that's why. You can never understand that they are bad ones here.:confused::rolleyes: Give us a break.

[acmanko]

Well you get a grasp as to how folks who couldn't afford those homes got their loans. Thank you Democrats who set it up so they could and now we are all paying for it. Can't you understand that? Of course not because Democrats are responsible that's why. You can never understand that they are bad ones here.:confused::rolleyes: Give us a break.
Phil Gramm and Allen Greenspan were not Democrats. This is Bushs' house of cards collapsing.:rolleyes:

[forged alloy]

Phil Gramm and Allen Greenspan were not Democrats. This is Bushs' house of cards collapsing.:rolleyes:

Everyones hands are dirty on this one. It is short-sighted and inflammitory to blame it strictly on President Bush or the Democratic legislature alone.

We should be standing outside of both houses demanding their ouster. But no, we are so polarized that loyal votors like you will keep pulling the party lever come November.

[acmanko]

Everyones hands are dirty on this one. It is short-sighted and inflammitory to blame it strictly on President Bush or the Democratic legislature alone.

We should be standing outside of both houses demanding their ouster. But no, we are so polarized that loyal votors like you will keep pulling the party lever come November. Do a search of my posts and you'll find I support a third party candidate.
I do agree that we should be marching on DC to kick congress' collective butt and take back our country

[Pneuma]

In 2004 the Bush administration decreed all state anti predatory lending laws to be null and void. All 50 states attorneys general protested. When this happened the gloves came off and mortgage brokers went on the hunt shoving unaffordable mortgages on people who were either to naive or too greedy to figure out if they could actually be able to amake the payments. You can google elliot spitzer and lending laws and read all about it.

The other gift we got from Bush was relaxing the rules on leverage by the now failed financial institutions, from 12 times to 40 times. This means they can loan up to 40 tines the actual collateral in their portfolios. They did and that is much of the reason credit is frozen.

It seems my fellow americans who view everything in this world through their "clinton hater glasses" will require another decade to move on. I never voted for Bill and I don't defend him but come on he was an avergae run of the mill politician. Get over it already you so called republicans.

There is not a democrat or republican in government who is qulaified to fix this mess. The sooner we stop hating in the name of "our" party the better we will be and I'm talking about both sides. I just get particuarly frustrated with the clinton haters, it's so over done.

found a link http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/13/AR2008021302783.html

[ga-hvac-tech]

You know, we can argue until the cows do not come home what happened, who was on watch, and who is to blame... BUT

What are we going to do about it? It is time to make wise decisions about tomorrow, and quit fretting about yesterday. SOOO:

Who says they are a beaurocracy (sp) buster, and who says they want more and more government spending? Remember, every $$$ the federal government spends goes into the national debt, and is ultimately the responsibility of the taxpayer (you). There is no free lunch.

And here is another tidbit: This $700B debt will have to be monetized... that works out to short term price delfation, followed by long term price inflation. This means that for a few months or so, things will be cheap... Then prices will go up for a L O N G time. Is that what we want???

I think it is time to quit worrying about spilt milk... we need to get another gallon, in a safe jug, and drink it carefully and wisely.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Oh, BTW:

We were told the sky was falling and this bailout was mandatory...

Here we are the next day and the markets are going where???

DOWN!

Sounds to me like someone lied... :eek:

[BigJon3475]

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E06E3D6123BF932A2575AC0A9659C8B 63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2

Published: September 11, 2003

The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.
__________________________________________________ ______

Fannie Mae, which was previously known as the Federal National Mortgage Association, and Freddie Mac, which was the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation, have been criticized by rivals for exerting too much influence over their regulators.

''The regulator has not only been outmanned, it has been outlobbied,'' said Representative Richard H. Baker, the Louisiana Republican who has proposed legislation similar to the administration proposal and who leads a subcommittee that oversees the companies. ''Being underfunded does not explain how a glowing report of Freddie's operations was released only hours before the managerial upheaval that followed. This is not world-class regulatory work.''

Significant details must still be worked out before Congress can approve a bill. Among the groups denouncing the proposal today were the National Association of Home Builders and Congressional Democrats who fear that tighter regulation of the companies could sharply reduce their commitment to financing low-income and affordable housing.

''These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''

Representative Melvin L. Watt, Democrat of North Carolina, agreed.

''I don't see much other than a shell game going on here, moving something from one agency to another and in the process weakening the bargaining power of poorer families and their ability to get affordable housing,'' Mr. Watt said.

[BigJon3475]

In 2004 the Bush administration decreed all state anti predatory lending laws to be null and void. All 50 states attorneys general protested. When this happened the gloves came off and mortgage brokers went on the hunt shoving unaffordable mortgages on people who were either to naive or too greedy to figure out if they could actually be able to amake the payments. You can google elliot spitzer and lending laws and read all about it.

The other gift we got from Bush was relaxing the rules on leverage by the now failed financial institutions, from 12 times to 40 times. This means they can loan up to 40 tines the actual collateral in their portfolios. They did and that is much of the reason credit is frozen.

It seems my fellow americans who view everything in this world through their "clinton hater glasses" will require another decade to move on. I never voted for Bill and I don't defend him but come on he was an avergae run of the mill politician. Get over it already you so called republicans.

There is not a democrat or republican in government who is qulaified to fix this mess. The sooner we stop hating in the name of "our" party the better we will be and I'm talking about both sides. I just get particuarly frustrated with the clinton haters, it's so over done.

found a link http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/13/AR2008021302783.html


Hey no offense but your not even close to what actually happened. See Andrew_Cuomo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Cuomo) in the Clinton admin.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/11/AR2008091102841.html

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=s109-190

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/14/business/14fannie.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&oref=slogin&adxnnlx=1222963582-aT1GdnltzKtZoNaylBnM2w

http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2008/09/update-fannie-mae-and-freddie.html

http://banking.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Information.Membership


And Mr. Clinton was hardly your average president.

http://mutualfunds.about.com/cs/history/p/crash10.htm

"This crash required the longest recovery time of all crashes in this list. The combination of the tech bubble bursting and the September 11th terrorist attack served a deadly blow to the stock market, but relative to markets past, this was a minor one.
10th Worst Stock Market Crash: Date Started: 1/15/2000
Date Ended: 10/9/2002

Total Days: 999
Starting DJIA: 11,792.98
Ending DJIA: 7,286.27
Total Loss: -37.8% "

[Pneuma]

Hey no offense but your not even close to what actually happened.

BigJon, exactly how is it you leave out the first few paragraphs of your article. In particular where Bush moves regulation of Fannie Mae into Tresaury, a department which the Presidnet appoints the leader. How in the world is your artcle evidence that shifts blame to democrats? The artcile shows Bush put these two agencies within a cabinet of the executive branch and so from 2003 until now had oversight!

As far as your other links I'll read them, but I'm already quite convinced that both parties have been asleep at the switch and I am also convinced it will not change until the majority of citizens hate both dems and repubs with equal furor!

Here is what you did not quote in your post.

Reflecting the changing political climate, both Fannie Mae and its leading rivals applauded the administration's package. The support from Fannie Mae came after a round of discussions between it and the administration and assurances from the Treasury that it would not seek to change the company's mission.

After those assurances, Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae's chief executive, endorsed the shift of regulatory oversight to the Treasury Department, as well as other elements of the plan.

''We welcome the administration's approach outlined today,'' Mr. Raines said. The company opposes some smaller elements of the package, like one that eliminates the authority of the president to appoint 5 of the company's 18 board members.

Company executives said that the company preferred having the president select some directors. The company is also likely to lobby against the efforts that give regulators too much authority to approve its products.

Freddie Mac, whose accounting is under investigation by the Securities and Exchange Commission and a United States attorney in Virginia, issued a statement calling the administration plan a ''responsible proposal.''

The stocks of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae fell while the prices of their bonds generally rose. Shares of Freddie Mac fell $2.04, or 3.7 percent, to $53.40, while Fannie Mae was down $1.62, or 2.4 percent, to $66.74. The price of a Fannie Mae bond due in March 2013 rose to 97.337 from 96.525.Its yield fell to 4.726 percent from 4.835 percent on Tuesday


http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E06E3D6123BF932A2575AC0A9659C8B 63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2

[BigJon3475]

http://www.villagevoice.com/content/printVersion/541234?ref=patrick.net


The opensecret website tells it all 342 of 542... :rolleyes:

[Pneuma]

http://www.villagevoice.com/content/printVersion/541234?ref=patrick.net


The opensecret website tells it all 342 of 542... :rolleyes:

I especially like this line of that article. "But the near-collapse of these dual pillars in recent weeks is rooted in the HUD junkyard, where every Cuomo decision discussed here was later ratified by his Bush successors."

Did you catcht this one???

where every Cuomo decision discussed here was later ratified by his Bush successors!

Another good point in the article is that both Bush and Clinton wanted to expand home ownership, to get votes of minorities, and both were influenced by lobbyist.

The blood is on all hands dude. It's time to bring out the long forgoten "don't tread on me snake" and get rid of the elephants and donkeys!

[royc]

Nothing is going to change until we realize that this goverment is a criminal enterprise, and their goal is to steal as much money as they can from us, with the pretense that its done for our good.

The question is...


What are we going to do about it

The proper answer would be for all of us to not even go to the voting boot, it would show a "No Confidents" in this goverment as is. But it will never happen, cause all one has to do is read the posts in here. Seems most are more interested to blame each others party, instead of realizing that this problem can be traced way back to 1913, and needs to be laid squarely at our feet. We let it happen, and only we in Solidarity going change it.

Our goverments motto is "divide and conquer", and its been working well for them so far, so why would they want to change it now??

Roy

[chaard]

Got this in an email a bit ago and totally agree. The liberal Congress of the last 2 years has wrecked this nation.


Well I have to disagree....


































They have been wrecking the nation for decades.;)

[ga-hvac-tech]

I have a question:

How many coats of paint do we put on rotten wood before we admit it is rotten and has to be replaced?

[chaard]

The question is...


What are we going to do about it

Roy

My belief is that we need to overhaul Congress. Everyone involved in the economic mess, Repubs and Dems need to be recalled.

Reduce the pay of all Congressmen.

Next we form a committee, yes another one, that creates the budgets. No Sen., No Reps., No Politicians. Only financial wizards to decide where our tax money goes. Sounds simple, but of course Congress would never let go of deciding where to spend our money, unless America revolts.

[BigJon3475]

I have a question:

How many coats of paint do we put on rotten wood before we admit it is rotten and has to be replaced?

Can we try some of that wood hardener first?

[frozensolid]

In 2004 the Bush administration decreed all state anti predatory lending laws to be null and void.

The other gift we got from Bush was relaxing the rules on leverage by the now failed financial institutions, from 12 times to 40 times.

Jimmy Carter lit the match Reagan, Bush 1, and Clinton all kept it smoldering. Then GW threw gasoline on it.

But you can't expect the partisans in ARP to ever let GW take the blame for anything. They are too busy pointing fingers at the commie DEMs. WE ARE TO BLAME. And the attitudes in the ARP crowd is WE REP ARPies ARE HOLIER THAN THOU.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Can we try some of that wood hardener first?

OK, I think you lost me there;

How would you define wood hardener in relation to politicians that need to be removed from power?

[BigJon3475]

OK, I think you lost me there;

How would you define wood hardener in relation to politicians that need to be removed from power?

It was sarcasm......we always try everything but the right thing until it's almost no chance at all of ever working.


Would use wood hardener on Small spots that were impossible to get to if a very small amount of rot was present.

[acmanko]

Can we try some of that wood hardener first?
I thought he was refering to Palin in a two piece swimsuit:D