Carrier Evaporator Coils

[Doubled8]

I am a fairly large Carrier dealer in Midwest. I am familar with the law suit on the variable speed furnaces. What bothers me is the factory is getting away with a way more serious problem making evaporator coils that are garbage. Just recently we have had a rash of them 12-18 months old with long time customers. We can not bill these people and we have to eat the labor meanwhile while it is hot we can be doing a profitable job. I have heard that Trane has had the same problem. Dealers (the little guys) ought to unite and bill the distributor or the factory for our time. I have been in the business since 1972 and the only product I can remember having this amount of problems where Lennox heat pumps in mid 70's.

I would like other dealer comments on this to make sure it is a widespread problem.

[dash]

Coil failures seem to be up for all brands from years ago.manufacturers still say 33% of coils returned aren't leakers.

Carrier now has tin plated coils availale,should help.

[aircooled53]

I think that , when manufactures see $$$$$ signs they build cheap coils,we also have had a few Carrier coils bad and these are in the past 2 years, but, I think that Carrier's product line change had allot to do with coil problems.And they do have tin plated coils available now.

I worked on Trane/American Standard for several years and also had problems with 2.0-3.0 coils, and Commandaire 2.0 coils ;I can't count how many of them I replaced.

Quick fix is pump down , install drier in 3/8" line at coil and use a b-tank torch with small oxy rig, with nitrogen flow, using torch to locate small leaks works everytime.:D

[classical]

I am a fairly large Carier dealer in Midwest. I am familar with the law suit on the variable speed furnaces. What bothers me is the factory is getting away with a way more serious problem making evaporator coils that are garbage. Just recently we have had a rash of them 12-18 months old with long time customers. We can not bill these people and we have to eat the labor meanwhile while it is hot we can be doing a profitable job. I have heard that Trane has had the same problem. Dealers (the little guys) ought to unite and bill the distributor or the factory for our time. I have been in the business since 1972 and the only product I can remember having this amount of problems where Lennox heat pumps in mid 70's.

I would like other dealer comments on this to make sure it is a widespread problem.

Carrier has had problems with their coils for years; hopefully the new tin plated coils have addressed the problem. Trane has also had serious evap. coil problems mostly the TXC, they have pinned their hopes on all aluminum technology.

There is a remedy for your losing money on replacing them but it is too late for you. I sell a 10-year P&L warranty on every job it is not an option. It is a good option for your customer but more importantly protects you. I feel for you being stuck with this problem but I see at you being shortsighted. Many contractors including those on this site think that long term warranties are bad for our industry. I don't I see it as a way to lock in a customer to you long time, protects their interest and the contractors interest. You will not get rich off the warranty rates but you don't lose money or lose a customer.

[Tony0945]

I have a Carrier variable speed furnace. What's this about a law suit? Is it likely to go up in flames like the Aprillaire air cleaners?

[billva]

Is it likely to go up in flames like the Aprillaire air cleaners?


The Aprilaires didn't "go up in flames".

I don't know about the Carrier thing, anyone have a link?

[adrianf]

doubled8 i don't know what fairly large means but if you get the carrier news letter you've at least read/know dash. his relationship with carrier will probably be significantly differant than yours and mine. are you having more problems with r410a product or r22? i have had my rump stretched over a 55 gallon drum with my long time customers over coil leaks. we've had the carrier factory field tech to more than one of our problem installs. they have yet to be able to hang anything on our workmanship(system design)

as of last month we are no longer a carrier dealer because of my contempt for their lack of responsibility. as to the percentage of leakers all of our warranty claims are scrap in field but i'll put a millon dollar home on the water in naples florida up against their findings and our failures.

i feel like that guy from th x-files sometimes. the truth is out there.:(

[gsxrsquid]

I have been asking the same question about the carrier slab coils. One poor customer had the first evap changed at 2 years and that coil started leaking at the same area 11 months later.
All 410 evaps making me wonder WTF is going on. Most of the evaps are under 2 years old. when did carrier start tin plating the evaps. I am sure carrier knows about it, just like Rheem/Ruud knew about the expansion valve problems but pretended not to.

[adrianf]

I have been asking the same question about the carrier slab coils. One poor customer had the first evap changed at 2 years and that coil started leaking at the same area 11 months later.
All 410 evaps making me wonder WTF is going on. Most of the evaps are under 2 years old. when did carrier start tin plating the evaps. I am sure carrier knows about it, just like Rheem/Ruud knew about the expansion valve problems but pretended not to.

Tinned coils have been available for sometime now but because of the limited market of air handlers they were the last to come on line. Furnace coils and package units were available first. Then couple this with the factory and factory owned florida distributor having a pi$$ing contest over the cost differance. Up until 2007 carrier was the largest revenue generator of UT. UT a Fortune 100 (in the top 50) company, UT a Fortune Global 500 (in the top 150)company. But who bears the burden of their moral and ethical bankrupcy? The unwitting consumer and contractor. How energy efficienct is this really? Carrier North America needs to wake up and smell what they're shoveling. I'm up to the challenge if they are on any front.

[gsxrsquid]

The owner has made it a point to let the local carrier rep know what is going on and he wants carrier to pay for the coil and installation.
To add insult to injury this poor customer had a leaking line set before the first coil went bad and had to pay for a new one. he doesn't think he wants another carrier. lol

[heatingairman]

The first hot spell this year we had 12 leaking coils. No more Carrier garbage going in!!! They had their chance...

[Skip 2 my lou]

The first hot spell this year we had 12 leaking coils. No more Carrier garbage going in!!! They had their chance...

The old ce3axa thin copper garbarge. The strange thing is Carrier offers an upgraded version of this same coil for about 30 bucks more that doesn't leak. BUT, YOU CAN'T GET THE UPGRADE COIL IF IT IS A WARRANTY. So, you have to put in another leaker till they run out of the d#@m things.

[heatingairman]

The old ce3axa thin copper garbarge. The strange thing is Carrier offers an upgraded version of this same coil for about 30 bucks more that doesn't leak. BUT, YOU CAN'T GET THE UPGRADE COIL IF IT IS A WARRANTY. So, you have to put in another leaker till they run out of the d#@m things.

EXACTLY!!! Why would you put in another BAD coil. I guess you have to buy "the best" coil they have to offer...????

[bmathews]

Carrier copper coils will leak. Not a question of if, but rather when. If you have a leaking copper coil, demand that they warranty it with a tin plated one. If they won't. Give the customer the number to call and demand. It is a problem they have known about for a while and they neglected to fix the issue. All they sell in my area now is tin plated. No copper coils left.

[mark beiser]

I don't have a problem with leaking Carrier coils, but I've never worked for a company that installed Carrier equipment. $$$$$:D

Coil leaks are up with all manufacturers, but Carrier seems to have the worst problems with it.

[EatingPie]

The Aprilaires didn't "go up in flames".

I don't know about the Carrier thing, anyone have a link?

I have an AprilAire installed. What's the deal with them??

Also, is there a difference in quality between Copper/Tin vs. Stainless Steel? IE is Carrier just using copper/tin to cut price, or is it actually a better coil?

-Pie

[fitterchick]

Can anyone tell me what are the mfg. dates or install dates of these problematic carrier evap coils? :D

[21degrees]

I have been a Carrier dealer for sometime and as far as coil problems, I have been fortunate(only a couple). Yet I still think you guys are asking too much.
They r made in mexico. They still have not found a engin:eek::eek:r bright enough to make a coil fits there own furnaces and now they want to play with aluminum.

[REFERJMAN]

i've been doing some small time mostly residential contracting on the side from my normal union gig in so cal for about eight year now. first couple of years was strictly a carrier guy, had numerous problems with their evaps with txv's and without. one of their salesman turned me on to ADP evaps to be honest i'm not even sure who makes them but next 200 or so installs havn't had one problem so i'm sold plus i was told their over sized a 1/2 ton for effiency, my distrbutor recently switched to york but they still sell adp coils, all i will install plus they fit perfect on carrier & york funaces. you know the old saying about opinions being like a******* everyone has one but i'm sold

[RoBoTeq]

While coil issues have been an increasing problem over the years, we may be a bit harsh blaming only the manufacturer's of the faulty coils. Please keep in mind that aftermarket coils do not need to be manufactured to perform as well as coils made by the manufacturer's that also make the rated outdoor units.

There is a 5% margin of error for manufacturer's of heat pumps and condensing units for their matched and rated coils to perform for energy ratings. Also, these manufacturer's must actually run test real system components with one another.

After market coil manufacturer's only need to do computer simulation calculations of energy efficiency and are allowed to be within a 10% margin of error. This allows after market coil companies a little more lee way in the manufacturing of their coils.

The need for higher efficiencies has created a need for coil manufacturer's to use thinner walled and rifled tubing. This reduction in tubing quality is for heat transfer not to be cheap. Add to the lighter tubing the fact that formicary corrosion is on the rise due to tighter built houses using more chemical laden products and you have a real set up for coil leakage.

I would not be surprised to see some sort of plastic tubed coils being produced in the future. That is unless the micro-channel technology can be made to work better and be made to be able to shed condensate properly.

[Tony0945]

EatingPie, here is the recall notice:

http://www.aprilaire.com/themes/aa/en/manuals/AprilaireModel5000_SafetRecall.pdf

I call units catching fire "going up in flames". Apparently there were only six reported, but having once had a house fire caused by a defective (McGraw Edison) humidifier, I'm gunshy.

[Tony0945]

duplicate post, server reset

[Tony0945]

another duplicate post. Server went berserk apparently

[Tony0945]

Sorry about the triple reply. I only clicked once, then the server went crazy for about 15 seconds and dropped out.

[castillo7411]

I work for a Carrier dealer in my area and have not had any issues with coil leaks since around 2000. It seems that this year I am running into 2 year old coils that have leaking TXV's on both r22 and r410a models? Being that we are a Carrier dealer we do get a labor credit for our work, granted it is not what one would normally charge for the work but then again they give a five year warranty on the coils! I hope that this ends soon because it sucks when homeowners replace equiptment because of leaks in the coils only to find leaks in 2 year old coils:mad:

[smittyii]

where is bald loonie on this one? aspen coils are a.r.i. rated and don't have a high failure rate. even mortex mobile home coils are a.r.i. rated and work fine imo.

[RyanHughes]

So, Carrier dealers on this site, are you all experiencing the same problems that the OP and other posters on this thread are having? That's a shame for Carrier, but it's good to know that the ATA coils are better. Are the ACA coils manufactured today any better? I assume this is for the cased N and A coils as well as the slab coils?

Do the air handlers use the tin-plated coils now?

I guess all manufacturers have had issues at one point or another.

[dash]

No more Carrierfailures then other brands ,from what we can tell,it partially dependson what's installed in what quantity.


We track the permits,so best we can tell,no issues wt air handlers ,not enough furnaces here to tell.If anything Rheem is the worst,from what we see and track.

[adrianf]

The leaky indoor coil issue is a multi-headed Medusa. We've experienced more Carrier coils issues than with other brands some of which can be linked to the fact we've installed more Carrier equipment with the majority being R410a.

Carrier didn't produce the formicary corrosion document for 10 or 12 coils failing. Carrier's not tin plating coils now because Dash's company is the only one in the nation not having coil problems. You can tell the coils that have been exposed to the gases in the air, you can tell the coils that have had insufficient air flow for an extended period of time and you can tell the coils that have just out right failed. They look brand new and don't exhibit the rusting or discoloration of the other failed coils.
Trane is seeing more coil failures as more R410a product comes on line. In fairness we have seen an increased number of coil failures in most all brands.

[Mr Bill]

Well I guess some folks are just Blessed with the good coils "OR" have to much pride to admit any problems, but we all already know about the problems rather some want to admit it or not, "the proof is in the pudding". http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l286/mrbillpro/other_thankyou.gif

[dash]

The leaky indoor coil issue is a multi-headed Medusa. We've experienced more Carrier coils issues than with other brands some of which can be linked to the fact we've installed more Carrier equipment with the majority being R410a.

Carrier didn't produce the formicary corrosion document for 10 or 12 coils failing. Carrier's not tin plating coils now because Dash's company is the only one in the nation not having coil problems. You can tell the coils that have been exposed to the gases in the air, you can tell the coils that have had insufficient air flow for an extended period of time and you can tell the coils that have just out right failed. They look brand new and don't exhibit the rusting or discoloration of the other failed coils.
Trane is seeing more coil failures as more R410a product comes on line. In fairness we have seen an increased number of coil failures in most all brands.

Not saying there's no coil problem.What we see in our southern office is more Trane failures,,in or northern office Carrier and Rheem.

What we know is Trane is the number one brand in RNC in the southern area,and Carrier and Rheem are are top brands in RNC in the northern area.

Right or wrong I think all brands are failing in greater numbers then years ago.



Like I said on page one;
"Coil failures seem to be up for all brands from years ago.manufacturers still say 33% of coils returned aren't leakers.

Carrier now has tin plated coils availale,should help."

Well I Guess, some people want to read, and some want to put words in other people mouths.

[adrianf]

Not saying there's no coil problem.What we see in our southern office is more Trane failures,,in or northern office Carrier and Rheem.

What we know is Trane is the number one brand in RNC in the southern area,and Carrier and Rheem are are top brands in RNC in the northern area.

Right or wrong I think all brands are failing in greater numbers then years ago.



Like I said on page one;
"Coil failures seem to be up for all brands from years ago.manufacturers still say 33% of coils returned aren't leakers.

Carrier now has tin plated coils availale,should help."

Well I Guess, some people want to read, and some want to put words in other people mouths.

I don't think any reasonable person would consider my statements a contridiction or putting words in anyone's mouth. That's the problem with the written word it can be mis-construed.

We've never met but we have shared common contacts through the years. You are one of the more successful, dedicated individuals in this industry but at the same time you are no fool.

I stated that we are seeing increased failures in all brands as well.

Dash it's like I told the Carrier field rep that now works for a company based south of you when he told me the two Infinity coils (in the same home) failed in less than two years because of chorlrine. This was in a home we had air conditioned 20 years prior with a Carrier product. Carrier is building a unit that I can't install in the average american home.

Now if this is an efficiency mandate issue (coil problems existed well prior to the 13 seer mandate) I would think the manufacurers should band together and take this to the D.O.E. at least to go on record rather than fabricate documents blaming the new tight homes or gremlins for that matter.

[Mr Bill]

That's the problem with the written word it can be mis-construed.

Amen! on that Brother, but bottom line is that when we all in this trade don't share "honest" issues with any mfg. parts and let our pride take over it hurts us all. If I knew so and so mfg. were having tons of problems with this certain part and not tell anyone "because the mfg. sure is not" at least not soon enough, I personally would be doing a dis-service to all my tradesmen. You might be surprised how many let there pride take over and are afraid it might hurt there business to tell someone, If someone is doing that just to protect the mfg. or there product they sell it's just wrong period and shows you the kind of integrity they have for the industry.

[21degrees]

What percentage of coils are failing. We do about 130 to 180 A/Cs in a year and 100% Carrier and have had less than 3 evaporators leak. We have had probably had 12 Under charged condensors and probably 2 condensor leaks. Not bad for the record. Carrier is going down hill quick with quallity and bad engineering practices. They better watch out or china will make a coil out of Recycled Fords.:eek:

[adrianf]

What percentage of coils are failing. We do about 130 to 180 A/Cs in a year and 100% Carrier and have had less than 3 evaporators leak. We have had probably had 12 Under charged condensors and probably 2 condensor leaks. Not bad for the record. Carrier is going down hill quick with quallity and bad engineering practices. They better watch out or china will make a coil out of Recycled Fords.:eek:


My personal home has an 8 year old R22 FV series air handler and like the majority of the R22 Carrier system's we've installed has not leaked. Sitting at my office ready to be installed yet this week is another R410a coil for a unit that is less than 4 years old. We did one last week also. Carrier has given more than one customer complete new air handler units after MULTIPLE coil failures in the same home.

We only deal with air handlers; plus the problem seems to be some what geographic. My ACCA MIX Group is mostly Carrier dealers. The dealers in Texas, California and Florida see more coil (R410a) failures than the dealers in Wisconsin and Mass. Heck in Wisconsin they don't even insulate the sheet metal coil case.

And again in fairness a builder we use to do work for just told one of the field techs last week that he is experienceing the same problem with their other brand (Trane) of equipment now.

[gsxrsquid]

We handle carrier and rheem. have not installed a rheem 410a system but have not had a single evap leak. Carrier we have been installing 410a unless customer absolutely has to have 22 ( and some of them do) We have not had a single r-22 evap leak. all of the evap leaks have been carrier 410a slab coils. I thin it must be the process because the other coils don;t seem to have the problem.

We have made it a point to alert our carrier rep (who of course was very surprised) and tell him that if the problem continues we will drop the line.

[Tony0945]

Maybe it's the R410? Maybe it's corrosive? Reminds me of aluminium wire. It was supposed to be the hot thing to do 40 years ago, then they found the corrosion problem and had to rip out the wiring.

Seems like leaving Freon to "save the ozone" was not such a good idea. I wonder about "carbon pollution", too.

[canesfanforlife]

I also work for a CFAD and we are replacing e-coils like crazy in the atlanta area. We were told the ATA coils were not going to stop formicary corrosion they would just slow it down. The most problematic were the ck5bx coils. I still like carrier products but they do need to do more research. Its getting old. :confused:

[fulferac]

I am a fairly large Carrier dealer in Midwest. I am familar with the law suit on the variable speed furnaces. What bothers me is the factory is getting away with a way more serious problem making evaporator coils that are garbage. Just recently we have had a rash of them 12-18 months old with long time customers. We can not bill these people and we have to eat the labor meanwhile while it is hot we can be doing a profitable job. I have heard that Trane has had the same problem. Dealers (the little guys) ought to unite and bill the distributor or the factory for our time. I have been in the business since 1972 and the only product I can remember having this amount of problems where Lennox heat pumps in mid 70's.

I would like other dealer comments on this to make sure it is a widespread problem.


i have experinced 2 bad r410a carrier coils both at the same house recently. they are about 30 months old. still under warranty i took them back to carrier and recieved the same kind of coils in place of them. i will see how long these will last. if they last another 30 months then the warranty will be expired and then after that i guess its on a 1 yr warranty from then on. i detected the leaks with a new inficon dtek select. i did not install these units. these were installed in a new home by a company chosen by the builder. the builder sent the ac company back out to check them out but said they could not find any leaks. the homeowners got tired of not getting something done so they called me referred by their friends. they recieved permission from the builder for me to replace the coils.

[RoBoTeq]

Well, it's been a year since this thread was started. In checking out the coil leakage problems nationwide it seems that the two manufacturer's with the most problems were Carrier and York. Both companies had the faulty coils manufactured in Mexico. York has moved their coil manufacturing back to the states and the leak issues have resided. Carrier coils are still manufactured in Mexico.

Then there are the condensate leak issues with the Carrier "N" style coils. In the words of a most famous H-Talker; Carrier....what a mess!;)

[21degrees]

Well, it's been a year since this thread was started. In checking out the coil leakage problems nationwide it seems that the two manufacturer's with the most problems were Carrier and York. Both companies had the faulty coils manufactured in Mexico. York has moved their coil manufacturing back to the states and the leak issues have resided. Carrier coils are still manufactured in Mexico.

Then there are the condensate leak issues with the Carrier "N" style coils. In the words of a most famous H-Talker; Carrier....what a mess!;)

Robo, Thats funny I have not had 1 problem with A coils and N coils made by Carrier. I swear in the last 2 years, so are you getting desperate to convert some dealers, are you just dreaming again that wish you had stayed with Carrier and wished you had not lowered your standards in selling the other crap.

[RoBoTeq]

Robo, Thats funny I have not had 1 problem with A coils and N coils made by Carrier. I swear in the last 2 years, so are you getting desperate to convert some dealers, are you just dreaming again that wish you had stayed with Carrier and wished you had not lowered your standards in selling the other crap.
Are you just ignoring all of the other posters? I sell luxaire, made by York. I've had to deal with this problem as much as the Carrier guys have. You can't just claim that problems don't exist. Carrier still has several problems with their coils as they have had for years. Why else would Carrier have had after market vendors such as Superior manufacture their rated coils for them for so long?

At least other manufacturer's own up to their issues.

[21degrees]

I do over 180 units last year and No coil problems that I can remember. I have seen their hydronic coil being built in Indy and the QA that goes with it, but not the mexican A/C coils. I am not trying to say that I have not heard of any coils problems, just they are no higher than anyone elses. I wish they never had left the state, but Carrier is moving lots of their factories south or over seas inwhich we will probably see quality drop. The tin coated coils have a 10 year warranty. I thought you were a Goodman TM

[RoBoTeq]

I haven't worked for Goodman in over a year.

I sell several different brands of equipment now, in air to air, wet stuff, geothermal and solar.

The point is that Carrier and York have both had more coil leak issues then any other of the brands. It happens. Every brand has it's pit falls.

[Swampfox]

Lots of Carrier leakers here also, around the 10 year mark, but they have fancy thermostats, so that makes them better, right? :rolleyes:

[21degrees]

Actually that fancy controller is a big part of comfort. What do you think the most important think people are thinking of efficiency and comfort. :confused:

[jerryd_2008]

I am trying to get dual fuel bids and just had a York dealer tell me he just this week decided to give them up. Unfortunate, because I really wanted to talk to York due to the nice features in their high end systems.

I realize that the posts come from many different dealers of different brands and their prejudices will show, but I am CONFUSED. First Carrier coil problems then York problems. What does a customer have to insist on when making high 4 figure investments? What kind of warranties do we need to cover ourselves for at least 10 years on this amount of money?

HELP!

[canesfanforlife]

The leak problems are on all brands. I would look into 10 year parts and labor.

[smittyii]

I am trying to get dual fuel bids and just had a York dealer tell me he just this week decided to give them up. Unfortunate, because I really wanted to talk to York due to the nice features in their high end systems.

I realize that the posts come from many different dealers of different brands and their prejudices will show, but I am CONFUSED. First Carrier coil problems then York problems. What does a customer have to insist on when making high 5 figure investments? What kind of warranties do we need to cover ourselves for at least 10 years on this amount of money?

HELP!

any brand can leak mister, get the recommendation of neighbors, co workers, friends etc... if they like what they have or like the installation they got, thats 90% of the sweat factor right there. there isn't a magic answer to your question any more than there is a magic brand. practice patience and don't forget to get a 10 year p&l on any system you decide on. maybe then your mind will give you some peace.:cool:

[RoBoTeq]

Actually that fancy controller is a big part of comfort. What do you think the most important think people are thinking of efficiency and comfort. :confused:
No doubt that comfort from controlling temperature and humidity simultaneously is a good thing. That is why I just love the new Honeywell wireless controls that turn any two stage variable speed system even better control then the Infinity does and with easier set up.

[RoBoTeq]

I am trying to get dual fuel bids and just had a York dealer tell me he just this week decided to give them up. Unfortunate, because I really wanted to talk to York due to the nice features in their high end systems.

I realize that the posts come from many different dealers of different brands and their prejudices will show, but I am CONFUSED. First Carrier coil problems then York problems. What does a customer have to insist on when making high 4 figure investments? What kind of warranties do we need to cover ourselves for at least 10 years on this amount of money?

HELP!
I don't really know why it would make a difference but both York and Carrier coils with issues have been manufactured in Mexico. Now that the York coil production has been moved back to the U.S., the coil issues for York have greatly decreased. Maybe that Mexican water makes coils as crappy as it makes people;)

[21degrees]

No doubt that comfort from controlling temperature and humidity simultaneously is a good thing. That is why I just love the new Honeywell wireless controls that turn any two stage variable speed system even better control then the Infinity does and with easier set up.

It is the exact same features yet Infinity will do alittle more and half the price. I just read information and theyare $400 + The high definition is nice and I like the wireless outdoor sensor and room control. But the Infinity is also a service tool and shows alittle more features on furnace and a/c status. Oh can you acces you house temp and control it via, phone or internet. I can also adjust any fan speed or staging for better humidity removal. I didn't see that feature on the honeywell wireless control. I thought honeywell was a controls company and Carrier was a equipment company, not bad for a equipment company.

[RoBoTeq]

It is the exact same features yet Infinity will do alittle more and half the price. I just read information and theyare $400 + The high definition is nice and I like the wireless outdoor sensor and room control. But the Infinity is also a service tool and shows alittle more features on furnace and a/c status. Oh can you acces you house temp and control it via, phone or internet. I can also adjust any fan speed or staging for better humidity removal. I didn't see that feature on the honeywell wireless control. I thought honeywell was a controls company and Carrier was a equipment company, not bad for a equipment company.
You are looking at the higher costing system for zone control. You can get the wireless controls with wireless outdoor stat witout the high def screen for a lot less.

[21degrees]

You are looking at the higher costing system for zone control. You can get the wireless controls with wireless outdoor stat witout the high def screen for a lot less.

Yah but thats the only reason why I would Install them.;)The Infinity has zone control and ready and are still cheaper by alot. They are nice and am going try try one here soon.

[RoBoTeq]

Yah but thats the only reason why I would Install them.;)The Infinity has zone control and ready and are still cheaper by alot. They are nice and am going try try one here soon.
Unfortunately you still have to use the Infinity control with a leaky Carrier:D.

[21degrees]

Unfortunately you still have to use the Infinity control with a leaky Carrier:D.

Has not been a problem and will continue to monitor, are you sure you guys in the south are not using 3/4" screw and are piercing them and blaming the manufacture.:D

[RoBoTeq]

Has not been a problem and will continue to monitor, are you sure you guys in the south are not using 3/4" screw and are piercing them and blaming the manufacture.:D
Well, you know those of us who don't sell Carrier products do sell a lot of longer screws to Carrier dealers;)

[21degrees]

I figured that was the preoblem!;)