Pls,give me your opinion

[Michelle66]

Hi,
I am in a process of installing a new A/C unit, I live in FL. I was offered Carrier Comfort 25HCA 336 (outside unit) and indoor unit FV003 (varriable speed).It suppose to be 3 ton,14 seer,heat pump.The price is <removed>
As you can see I have no clue what I am doing :) so I would deeply appreciate your opinion.I need to know if this is a good A/C and what you think about the price.I was a little shocked,I was hoping for the price about $3K.
Thank you very much for your help.

[heatkits]

You got to be kidding about the 3K price... Perhaps you should buy one on ebay and install it yourself. After all what can be so hard about that? What could possibly go wrong? Oh ya, it’s the license thing, the tools, the truck, the gas and of course the insurance. But what’s the big deal with that, an enterprising person can find a way around those little obstacles.

Here’s a good rule of thumb: look up the trade price of the equipment on line then double it and you’re close to the installed price. But that doesn’t include incidentals like, wiring changes, duct modifications or other related items.

One last thing: most equipment manufactures’ warrantee loop hole is, “Installed by a competent (licensed) tech”.

[smittyii]

while heatkits may be a little harsh the point he is making is legit. in this day and age 3k isnt going to buy anything but a jake leg hack job. everything associated with the hvac trade is costly these days,copper ,silver,refrigerant,labor, and the list goes on and on. the purchase you are making is for "durable goods". it should last for many years if its installed correctly.

[Michelle66]

Thank you for your opinion....well, the "dreamy" price was given to me 6 months ago by linced A/C guy but apperently things are changed since that :-)

[bmathews]

He might have been dealing with some hot equipment or you are comparing apples to oranges. That equipment isn't cheap, by the time he buys the equipment, puts labor in it and miscellaneous materials and pays insurance and taxes, he would be in the hole on the $3000 price. If you want it closer to $3000, you need to put in a straight cool A/C, no heat pump, a 13 SEER. A fixed speed air handler, no variable speed with strip heat only for heat. Pretty much the cheapest way to do it.

[cmajerus]

Thank you for your opinion....well, the "dreamy" price was given to me 6 months ago by linced A/C guy but apperently things are changed since that :-)
I wouldn't call him again, that was too cheap even back then:(

[Michelle66]

thank you for your explanation

[Michelle66]

I just have to reply...you made me smile...he actually is not returning my calls now :-)) so you guys are right

[BigJon3475]

How do you select a contractor? (http://www.acca.org/Files/?id=186)

[Michelle66]

WOW! Thanks a LOT! :-)

[BigJon3475]

thank Jr.....I stole it. :D

[Michelle66]

:-)))

[Gotassman]

I've been coming here for a few months now and reading. Decided to register because I'm going to have some questions (planning a new home build).

The information on Selecting A contractor is a good link.......but it's only half the battle, isn't it.

I don't want to just select a contractor.....I want to select a EXCELLENT contractor who knows the equipment and does an excellent installation.

Our current home has a 17 year-old furnace and probably on it's last legs. I only bring this up because over the years I've seen a LOT of different servicemen....usually just for routine cleaning and maintanance (with the occasional emergency call). What I quickly noticed was that there was a fairly large discrepency in the work performance of these guys.

I think you Pro guys know what I'm talking about, not all HVAC installers are created equal.

As a CONSUMER, I have the right to want and demand that I have the right equipment and installed with perfection. Anything less is just not acceptable. Not when I'm spending $15-20K or more.

Some might say "Ask for references", but we all know references will be satisfied customers only. Does a consumer select the HVAC company with the largest yellow pages ad? Don't laugh, the yellow pages salesman would tell you that is one of the most effective ways to solicit new business. Do you get the older guy with lots of experience but may not be up to speed on the latest technologies. Or do you get the younger guy with a few years under his belt but knows all the latest stuff?

[billva]

"Do you get the older guy with lots of experience but may not be up to speed on the latest technologies. Or do you get the younger guy with a few years under his belt but knows all the latest stuff?"

A combination of both would actually be better.

[BigJon3475]

ask for the phd in thermal dynamics.

[Gotassman]

ask for the phd in thermal dynamics.

I assume that comment was meant to be witty and humorous. We are talking about a lot of money hear and comments like that from a PRO member aren't really helping.

Here are a few comments from various posts on this forum just to illustrate my point:

Quotes:

"Anything beyond the service tech himself is just another tool in his tool box IMO, do these tools make him a better hands on person or better tech probably not, think about it "some" folks can pass tests and join association's and still not know how to install a system right or even do a simple repair."

"I have an 11 year old two story house that has a single 5 ton Carrier that had a butchered installation that wouldn't pass code today."

"Any installer that puts in a 3 vent zone and never adds a bypass is not very schooled in the art of zone systems."

"I would only add that you should insist that the service company send a more experienced technician as I know that some technicians -- having caused further damage to the system through their own ignorance -- will cover up their mistakes by passing it on to the customer via a new, mysterious and expensive diagnosis."

"Contactors are cheap to replace compaired to the problems they cause"

"It sucks man I Know, but now you know that there are hacks out there! Do your homework when hiring the guy who's gonna fix it. good luck."

.................................................. ..................

Maybe I don't have the right to expect a proper installation. Judging by just these comments (and there are a lot more similar ones), do I just need to keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best?

[BigJon3475]

Not meant to be witty. I agree educate yourself as best you know how and ask questions. If they are using that check list and it's filled out correctly it will weed a lot of folks out.....might even leave you with no one.


Just like any business some are there for the money some are there because they love it .....I'm sure you can guess which would hopefully be the better choice.


Could go searching around the neighborhood looking at different installs....then maybe introduce yourself to the neighbor and ask who they used.....there is no set in stone way to verify what your jumping into....inform yourself and make the best decision you know how. get it inspected and make sure they have insurance in case something does happen.



If you were to buy a $20,000 car would you buy it on just looks or would you do some research.


I love cars when I went to start looking at buying a new one talking to the sales people were a joke. Pretty funny listening to someone selling or trying to sell me a 20-30k car and they don't even know anything besides the sticker on the window.....it was actually easier for me to act like I was looking and not buying then once I made a decision I forced myself to listen to their technique long enough to buy the vehicle.....I don't even use my vehicle as much as my air.....If I knew nothing about cars I would be relying on these jokers who apparently were in the same boat....so in that case crossing my fingers and hoping for the best would have been my only choice.

[udarrell]

My advice to those looking for the right HVAC contractor is to take notice to what they are trying to sell you. Is it merely product & SEER Ratings, or is it the ultimate in overall customer service?

The contractor's focus should always be on satisfying the customer's comfort & energy conservation needs, NOT focusing on selling you the highest SEER Rated equipment.

"The customer service satisfier," - will present an overview of all the important things to be performed, "prior to selecting equipment," toward reducing energy consumption,while delivering decades of optimal efficient comfort level performance.

Depending on the specific climate, the ductwork & airflow conditions, - Ultra High SEER equipment may not deliver high SEER performance unless all those other energy conservation factors are optimized. That includes doing everything that provides longterm cost-effective payback to the customer.

The contractor will always place first & foremost the customer's interest' &
provide the information that will help each customer achieve those objectives.

Narrow tunnel vision, "mere SEER product selling" is the worst thing that can happen to a contractor, for the simple reason that if ductwork, airflow & other problems are not resolved the Ultra High SEER may result in unsatisfied customers' that could do 'needless' damage to our HVAC industry.

Forget focusing on selling the bells & whistles & simply provide the ultimate in customer SERVICE. I plan to do a web page on this critical matter ASAP.
http://www.udarrell.com/air-conditioning-total-heat-enthalpy-latent-heat.html
- udarrell

[beenthere]

If your worried about performance, or efficiency. You can always ask for them to include their verbal claims in the written contract.

Usually, those makng false claims won't do it, and then you know you have selected the wrong contractor.