System does not always start

[gesler0811]

Hi,

I have a question about my air conditioning system. I don't know a whole lot about air conditioning in general, but I will give the best description I can.

The problem is that several times each day, when the outdoor unit (a Goodman CPLE36-1 HEat Pump) kicks on, the fan indoors for some reason will not kick on. The unit outside is running and running, but no air is blowing indoors. We remedy the situation by turning the unit off at the thermostat and waiting a few seconds, and then turning it back on. At least six to eight times per day this happens, at least three of those times occur in the middle of the night, forcing us to get out of bed to tend to the system.

I can hear air or water or whatever it is that flows through the indoor system, but it's like the fan just isn't turning on.

The outdoor unit is a Goodman CPLE36-1 heat pump.
The thermostat model is a Janitrol HPT18-60

The wiring on the thermostat is as follows:
Color Wire ----- Connected to
Yellow-----Y
Green-----G
Red-----R
Brown-----O
Blue-----C
White-----E---W2

By the way, is it common to have one wire connected to two terminals? The white cable wraps around the E terminal, then continues on to the W2 terminal.

Somebody suggested that I buy a new (digital) thermostat, but I wanted some expert opinions. I don't mind buying a new thermostat, but if that's not the most obvious cause of the problem, I would rather start with whatever is the most obvious cause of the problem.

And no, I don't think the unit is freezing up. That was a suggestion also, but it doesn't seem to be the case.

Can anybody help?

Thanks!

[pateman29]

when you cut the unit on and it doesnt start have you been down by the indoor unit to listen? Do you here a hmmm click sound coming from it?

[comfortdoc]

Call a service company to inspect the unit and troubleshoot. There are several things that can cause this and only someone onsite can troubleshoot it.

[skwsproul]

when you cut the unit on and it doesnt start have you been down by the indoor unit to listen? Do you here a hmmm click sound coming from it?
Agreed. I tell you this only in hopes that you use the information so you do not get ripped off. First if it runs sometimes and "hmmms" other times there is a good chance that you have a weak indoor blower motor capacitor. Again not recommended that a diyer change or test without a strong electrical knowledge. Second sometimes when a motors bushings/ bearings are getting gummed up/ worn out a motor will act intermittent due to the excess strain on it this can sometimes be remedied with a few drops of lubricant. If you are not familiar enough with the workings of the system call a pro you can post to find a reputable one in your area. WARNING: A MOTOR NOT RUNNING PROPERLY, CAN AND DOES CAUSE FIRES, IF YOU KNOW YOUR MOTOR HAS PROBLEMS SHUT IT OFF AND CALL A HVAC TECHNICIAN.

As far as the question for having one wire on two terminals. It is normal on heat pumps to use w2 and e as w2 is the second stage of heat and e is for emergency heat and on heat pumps w1 is for the heat pump or stage 1 and w2 is many times for the auxilary or emergency heat such as electric banks. w2 generally is not needed unless outside temperature is to low for a heat pump to heat efficiently or effectivly or if the heat pump has ran to long and will not heat space to set point possible a problem with the heat pump itself reason to bring on emergency heat.

[gator8]

Leaving an intermittent failure undiagnosed will turn it into an easier, if not more expensive problem to fix. You are at the least expensive end of this problem right now, since hopefully nothing expensive has been damaged so far.

Why are you starting off with t-stat wiring in your question? The thermostat rarely is the cause of problems unless you rewired it incorrectly just before the problems started.

Yes, E to W2 turns on the electric backup when you select "Emergency" heat, so it's not an uncommon connection for some system configurations.

[jjer]

This is a common problem with Goodman air handlers. I am sure a service company will have the correct part

[pateman29]

Agreed. I tell you this only in hopes that you use the information so you do not get ripped off. First if it runs sometimes and "hmmms" other times there is a good chance that you have a weak indoor blower motor capacitor. Again not recommended that a diyer change or test without a strong electrical knowledge. Second sometimes when a motors bushings/ bearings are getting gummed up/ worn out a motor will act intermittent due to the excess strain on it this can sometimes be remedied with a few drops of lubricant. If you are not familiar enough with the workings of the system call a pro you can post to find a reputable one in your area. WARNING: A MOTOR NOT RUNNING PROPERLY, CAN AND DOES CAUSE FIRES, IF YOU KNOW YOUR MOTOR HAS PROBLEMS SHUT IT OFF AND CALL A HVAC TECHNICIAN.

As far as the question for having one wire on two terminals. It is normal on heat pumps to use w2 and e as w2 is the second stage of heat and e is for emergency heat and on heat pumps w1 is for the heat pump or stage 1 and w2 is many times for the auxilary or emergency heat such as electric banks. w2 generally is not needed unless outside temperature is to low for a heat pump to heat efficiently or effectivly or if the heat pump has ran to long and will not heat space to set point possible a problem with the heat pump itself reason to bring on emergency heat.


yes blowers running improper is a dangerous situation. I was trying to see if it was cycling on the overload.

[gator8]

Agreed. I tell you this only in hopes that you use the information so you do not get ripped off. First if it runs sometimes and "hmmms" other times there is a good chance that you have a weak indoor blower motor capacitor. Again not recommended that a diyer change or test without a strong electrical knowledge. Second sometimes when a motors bushings/ bearings are getting gummed up/ worn out a motor will act intermittent due to the excess strain on it this can sometimes be remedied with a few drops of lubricant. If you are not familiar enough with the workings of the system call a pro you can post to find a reputable one in your area. WARNING: A MOTOR NOT RUNNING PROPERLY, CAN AND DOES CAUSE FIRES, IF YOU KNOW YOUR MOTOR HAS PROBLEMS SHUT IT OFF AND CALL A HVAC TECHNICIAN.
.


Mostly a fan motor not running will cut it self off on internal thermal, but given the lack of fuses other than the 60 Amp breaker inside, anything is possible. More likely is damage to the outdoor section when the indoor fan fails to start. A drop of oil could get it going again. But many of these blowers are lubricated to last the life of the unit. I have three blowers and none ever failed to start or run even though they were never oiled.

A low capacitor and dry bearings could cause intermittent starting if the old one is dried out, so low in capacitance. Capacitors get flakey enough with age that I would almost put them on a five to eight year prevention maintenance cycle if they were still USA made, lol. These days you could pull a good part and put in a bad one. Some of the better techs mark the date on capacitors with a marking pen when they replace them.

Mentioned earlier, neglect the cause of this problem, it will only get more expensive. Don't ask how I know.

[skwsproul]

Mostly a fan motor not running will cut it self off on internal thermal, but given the lack of fuses other than the 60 Amp breaker inside, anything is possible. More likely is damage to the outdoor section when the indoor fan fails to start. A drop of oil could get it going again. But many of these blowers are lubricated to last the life of the unit. I have three blowers and none ever failed to start or run even though they were never oiled.

I agree as stated not sure that G...G...Goodman has internal overloads on their motors and if they do would they not have to be manually reset before it runs or does g...g...Goodman have auto resets. Still does not explain why it restarts from a stat recycle. Even though most lifetime lubricated motors do well sometimes due to excess use or environment (such as pet hair, dirt, etc..) can cause the bushing/ bearing to gum up prematurely.

[skwsproul]

yes blowers running improper is a dangerous situation. I was trying to see if it was cycling on the overload. I understand but overload would not remedy by off/on at the thermostat. Sorry I did not mean to seem like I was yelling at you about dangerous motor conditions I meant that for the homeowner.

[skwsproul]

Call a service company to inspect the unit and troubleshoot. There are several things that can cause this and only someone onsite can troubleshoot it.Despite all that I have already stated this is the best recommended solution by far.

[model m-man]

Call a service tech yesterday! You are killing your unit by doing what you are doing.

[beenthere]

Call a service company. This is not a DIY site. Please read the rules, thank you.

What you have happening is common on that unit, and any good service tech will be ale to fix it.
The longer you wait to get a service tech out. The better the chance that you will cause serious damage to your outdoor unit. That will cost you a lot more then this repair.