View Full Version : Ductless quality disparity?
04-15-2008, 04:24 PM
Hello, first post here. I have owned a 1000 sq foot workshop for the past year. I have been renovating it, and still have not made a decision concerning my HVAc system. It is located in Toronto, Ontario, which gets a mild winter by Canadian standards and a pretty hot summer. Originally I was going to get a roof top mounted Gas heating system, but I found out that the gas company will not provide service to my building. I did extensive insulation on the building and managed to get through the winter with minimal plug in heaters.
I am leaning towards a ductless system with two head units (1 for each room) One room is a workshop where I will be doing woodworking and metal work. The other half is an auto area.
Do the heat pumps work well in ductless systems?
Can a ductless system work in a dusty environment? (I have a good dust collection system, so it hopefully won't be too dusty...but it is not a home)
Can you suggest two or three high quality mfgr's? Any to avoid? Reliability and longevity are the two most important factors in my decision rather than price.
Finally, are Ductless systems as efficient as other electrically powered systems? I will be supplementing the heat on very cold days with a stand alone electrical heater.
04-16-2008, 10:58 PM
Sanyo makes a high quality unit, as does Mitsubishi. I prefer Sanyo and have never had a problem with them. Im in the Northeast and the Sanyo heatpumps work as well as heat pumps can be expected to work in the cold.
I believe they come with a back up resistance heater also for those days when you can't wring any heat out of the outdoor air.
04-16-2008, 11:43 PM
Thanks, I will look into them..
04-17-2008, 09:08 AM
In your workshop I believe all the wood dust cold cause a problem with clogging the air filter of a ductless unit. When the filter gets clogged the unit will get to cold in a/c and freeze up or go off on high pressure in winter. I'm thinking a ducted heat pump would work better.
04-17-2008, 09:10 AM
Look at Fujitsu as well - we used a few of them now, and they work well. I went to a service school a while back, and consulted with another contractor here who has several successful installations.
Fujitsu uses a VFD setup to optimize efficiency, and they are also set up to work in colder ambients - make sure you get a R-410a refrigerant system while you are at it, and find a respected contractor.
And NO, I do not work for Fujitsu !! :D
04-17-2008, 04:28 PM
I would agree with Ed, except that regardless of ducted or not dust gets into the machinery. How much your shop generates will dictate how often you change or clean the filters. There are 2 things that count against ductless in this situation, 1. is that you are limited to the type of filter used in them,( that being similar to fine sreen door mesh). 2. If you do a lot of metal grinding/ cutting, the dust from this might mess up the electronics housed in the indoor section.
I worked for a small machine shop, that did enough aluminum parts that we filled 8 – 10 55 gal drums with shavings every couple weeks. Point is my insta teller card got ate by the machine because of the dust that got into my wallet and onto the card. Just something to consider.:eek:
04-27-2008, 10:06 PM
I would be very reluctant to install a heat pump in a cold climate such as Canada. If you choose to do so, be sure to verify it's operational range and consider low-ambient control.
04-28-2008, 04:34 PM
Well Toronto is not all that cold. Only in January Feb does it get much less than Zero C I will bebackingthe heat pump up with baseboard heaters for when it does. As for dust, the shop has a very good dust control system. Overhead filters, duct collector on all tools. Since I breathe this air, I am taking precautions with this. The unit I was quoted on gives off 15,00 BTU cooling and 18,000 BTU heating. At the back of my head this seems on the small side for about 850 Square feet. Thanks for the comments so far.
04-28-2008, 08:04 PM
Forget the mini-splits for your application. No matter how good you’re dust control system is you’re still looking at more then they can handle.
Look into a small gas or oil fired duel fuel system. Have you're contractor design a filter system for this application.
04-28-2008, 08:54 PM
Unfortunately, the gas company will not supply my builkding with gas, the propane company will not deliver gaz, and the water utility won't even give me water, despite my building being zoned residential. Oh well. I had a wood burning stove before.
04-29-2008, 05:39 PM
I wouldn't expose a mini to a dusty environment aether. While the coil could be cleaned the fan is another deal.
Sounds like a natural for a wood burner. My son bought a pellet and is very happy with it. It's temperature controlled. Although a burner where you could recycle scrap might be better.
04-29-2008, 09:06 PM
Well, I often go away in the winter and wouldn't be there to tend it. Also...not going to cool me off in the summer! Just wondering, would a ducted system on the roof with a combo AC, heat pump and auxiliary heater be better suited to a semi dusty enviroment. Again, I have very high end dust collection and air filtration in the shop . These seem to cost quite a bit more as far as I can tell.
Thanks for all the suggestions.
04-30-2008, 07:18 PM
pecmsg is right, the mini will give you lots of problems in your enviroment because of the scimpy filters. Their parts aren't cheap incase you encounter problems due to the air quality.
04-30-2008, 07:28 PM
with the roof top unit you can put high efficiency filters and supplement them with other types to really cleanse the air you'll be breathing, not to mention it will protect the coil and fan better
the savings on your lung health and ease of system maintenance will more than pay for the extra cost
furthermore, if you do lose a fan motor down the line due to the higher level of solids in the air, they're easy to find and replace as opposed to the odd ball fans that come in the ductless
If all you are concerned with is heat why not a Garage unit heater ? ADP'S FSA series has worked well here
04-30-2008, 08:15 PM
he wants cooling in the summer
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