Variable Copeland Compressor!

[Random Guy]

I was poking around on Copeland's site and I noticed that they make a modulating compressor that can modulate from 10-100%. Why doesn't anyone use this? A Ruud condenser with one of those paired with one of their modulating furnaced would make an awesome dual fuel system, wouldn't it?

Since the site is Flash based, I cannot link to the product page, but poke around and you should find it.

http://www.copelandscroll.com/

[beenthere]

I think most are waiting to see if Nordyne runs into any pit falls with the modulating rotory compressor they are using.

Don't forget that the condenser fan will have to be variable also. Plus, might need to have TXV's special designed for them. Then theres the communication with the VS controller, and new programing for the VS modules.

[Puff-noeyebrows]

Not to mention a signal to control the evaporator fan that would probably have to be matched brand specific.

[BaldLoonie]

Seems to me I read that comp wouldn't get the efficiency needed in an A/C application :confused:

[beenthere]

Seems to me I read that comp wouldn't get the efficiency needed in an A/C application :confused:
That bites. :(

[inhoth2o]

some duct-less split use them, there inverter unit

[beenthere]

some duct-less split use them, there inverter unit
I though those were rotory compressors, not scrolls.

[mchild]

The Asian manufacturers on their variable refrigerant flow systems (NOT mini-splits) use their own controls, 500+ step electronic expansion valves on the indoor and outdoor units, modulate the condenser fan(s) as needed, and monitor/maintain SC and SH.

With several circuit boards within a system, the electronic controls are significantly more sophisticated than the typical heat pump. Daikin uses a scroll compressor (Sanyo uses a rotary not sure about Mitsu and others). EER will run from 10 - 12 at rated capacity and go up to 20+ at part load.

[tinknocker service tech]

i havent heard of this yet but trane had one back in the early ninetys and it didnt to to well. Was very costly to repair and hard to find anyone willing to work on it. It IMO was a great design and worked well. Just to far ahead of its time. Probably a take off of tranes design

[geodude]

i havent heard of this yet but trane had one back in the early ninetys and it didnt to to well. Was very costly to repair and hard to find anyone willing to work on it. It IMO was a great design and worked well. Just to far ahead of its time. Probably a take off of tranes design

The biggest problem Trane had with them as you mentioned is the dealers couldn't get their heads into it. I have some customers with them and they work great! The comfort link zoning system was designed for that unit. Too many people use buttcrack sizing and over the thumb design methods for their installs and with these units most of them were improperly applied. That compressor is coming back under a new improved cover, And should be very impressive in a heat pump platform!

[kuryakin]

On the mini splits, they are pretty much all rotaries. And most of the multisplit, including the two zone Daikins, are rotaries as well. Last I checked, only the bigger multizone Daikins use scrolls. And even those are inverter driven.

Not sure what the deal is with the Copeland modulating scroll. It would seem to me, it would be better to simply use an inverter and vary the speed of the motor.


The Asian manufacturers on their variable refrigerant flow systems (NOT mini-splits) use their own controls, 500+ step electronic expansion valves on the indoor and outdoor units, modulate the condenser fan(s) as needed, and monitor/maintain SC and SH.

With several circuit boards within a system, the electronic controls are significantly more sophisticated than the typical heat pump. Daikin uses a scroll compressor (Sanyo uses a rotary not sure about Mitsu and others). EER will run from 10 - 12 at rated capacity and go up to 20+ at part load.

[jkish]

That compressor is coming back under a new improved cover, And should be very impressive in a heat pump platform!

Do Tell!

Is there any timeframe for this?

[geodude]

All I have been told is that its coming back, no time table has been disclosed. I do know that they are working on it.:D:D

[mark beiser]

All I have been told is that its coming back, no time table has been disclosed. I do know that they are working on it.:D:D

They have been hinting at this for more than 4 years. At the Comfort Link2 class I went to, they finally dropped more than hint/rumor.
I think the Charge Assist on the new communicating outdoor units is most likely something that came out of the development for the variable capacity system.
Incorrect refrigerant charging did more XV1500 compressors in than anything else.
Parts swapper techs gave that system a bad rap. A tech rep once told me that at one point, close to 90% of the "bad" boards they got back for those systems checked out fine...

I'm interested in what compressor the new system will use. I can't imagine it being another variable capacity recip......but ummm, it is Trane we are talking about....