Trane ClimaTuff Compressor

[RyanHughes]

So is it actually designed and manufactured by Trane or are they scroll or reciprocating compressors with an orange coating? Did Trane used to make their own compressors but switch to scroll or reciprocating compressors? Thanks, I'm just curious to get this straight.

[beenthere]

Trane makes them
They have a plant in the USA, and down in Mexico.
Trane and Copeland have a joint venture plant that only makes compressors for Trane.



For as much as you tout Trane. Shouldn't you have asked this question along time ago. :)

[RyanHughes]

So Trane makes the reciprocating compressors, too?

I got a bit confused as I've been hearing about certain models using reciprocating compressors and certain models using scroll compressors. Then I see on the website they are all being called ClimaTuff compressors.

I tout Trane? I guess I did in the past a bit, but I'm not so much anymore. It's hard for me to advocate Trane heat pumps anymore, taking into mind their efficiency and capacity numbers.

[beenthere]

Trane is JUST another brand, nothing more, nothing less.

[RyanHughes]

Of course it is, but that doesn't get rid of the fact that the efficiency and capacity numbers are unappealing. Take a look at some ARI match-ups using Trane heat pumps and air handlers. Is Goodman just another brand name for you compared to Trane or York? Would you use Goodman in a commercial situation? I don't dislike Trane one bit, in fact, I like Trane for any situation, but looking at some of the numbers more closely, you have to be careful.

[mark beiser]

All Trane compressors, that are painted orange, are "Climatuff" compressors.

The scroll compressors are made in a joint venture with Copeland. For the most part they are the same as regular Copeland scroll compressors, just with rotolock fittings and an orange paint job. Some of them have slightly different specs than Copeland's regular products though.

All the machined parts and castings for the recip compressors are manufactured by Trane at the plant in Tyler. The parts are then shipped to their plant in Mexico for assembly.
Trane claims that the warranty failure rate went down slightly when they moved the assembly to Mexico.
Supposedly no US jobs were lost, because other operations at the Tyler facility were expanded.

[RyanHughes]

Thanks Mark, that clears things up a lot.

[mark beiser]

Forgot to mention, it is just the recip compressor assembly that is in Mexico. The compressors are then shipped back to Tyler where all of the 1-5 ton split system outdoor units are assembled, and to wherever it is they assemble the package units and commercial split system outdoor units, I think New Jersey.

[RyanHughes]

Do you have a preference between Trane's scroll compressor versus Trane's reciprocating compressor? I know you are a big Trane guy, so I thought maybe you might have a preference.

[beenthere]

Is Goodman just another brand name for you compared to Trane or York? YES.


Would you use Goodman in a commercial situation? YES




I've sold and installed Goodman for private residence, and apartment complexes.

I've used Goodman in some small commercial applications.
Along with all the other popular brands.

It just like comparing Ford, Chevy, its just a brand name.

[mark beiser]

Do you have a preference between Trane's scroll compressor versus Trane's reciprocating compressor? I know you are a big Trane guy, so I thought maybe you might have a preference.

I favor scroll compressors over recips, but it is not a deal breaker for me.
The same issues kill both types of compressors.

In the last 6 years we have had a total of 4 warranty compressor "failures", 2 recips and 2 scrolls.

The 2 recips were both in the same XL1800 heat pump in the first summer of operation, first stage compressor both times. Ended up finding that the indoor TEV was sometimes staying wide open when the system changed from 2nd stage to 1st stage in the cooling mode. The compressor locked up both times.
Changed out the TXV, and haven't had had a lick of trouble from it since. Still has the original 2nd stage compressor.

The 2 scrolls were in 2 different units, replaced due to the hideously loud noises they were making, both within a month of the system installation. The cause of the noise was never determined, Trane didn't want either one back. I still have one of the compressors, but have been to lazy to get around to cutting it open. ;)
Neither unit has shown any signs of trouble in the 2-3 years since the compressors were replaced.

As for being a big "Trane guy", Trane has some poo that stinks just as bad as anyone elses poo. ;)

After looking over the extended performance data for some of the newer Goodmana products, the warranties, performance ratings, and installing a couple of Goodmana heat pumps for people that already had newer Goodmana air handlers, and a Goodman furnace under the heat exchanger program, we decided to start offering Amana products it to our customers, starting next month.

I have been wanting to make that move for a while, as well as offering one of the Nordyne brands with the IQ Drive. By his own admission, my boss "fears change", so it is going in baby steps.

[hivacjack]

[QUOTE=beenthere;1708165]I've sold and installed Goodman for private residence, and apartment complexes.

I've used Goodman in some small commercial applications.
Along with all the other popular brands. [/QUOTE



......and don't forget that GOODMAN beat out TRANE to take second place
in the J D POWER survey of both homeowners AND install contractors. It was LENNOX, GOODMAN, and TRANE in that order. CARRIER was in last place. ;)

[mark beiser]

......and don't forget that GOODMAN beat out TRANE to take second place
in the J D POWER survey of both homeowners AND install contractors. It was LENNOX, GOODMAN, and TRANE in that order. CARRIER was in last place. ;)

The JD Power survey didn't involve homeowners in any way, just contractors, and the one you are talking about was from 2006. :p

The 2007 one ranks Trane #1
http://www.jdpower.com/corporate/news/releases/pdf/2007135.pdf

Note that the 2006 survey gave warranty and repair service, ordering proccess, and sales/marketing support more weight than and product quality.

The 2007 survey gave product quality the most weight, followed by warranty and repair service, credit/billing proccess, delivery, ordering process, price, marketing/advertising materials, and sales representative.

[gary_g]

Of course it is, but that doesn't get rid of the fact that the efficiency and capacity numbers are unappealing. Take a look at some ARI match-ups using Trane heat pumps and air handlers. Is Goodman just another brand name for you compared to Trane or York? Would you use Goodman in a commercial situation? I don't dislike Trane one bit, in fact, I like Trane for any situation, but looking at some of the numbers more closely, you have to be careful.

One thing a do like about my 3-ton, 14 SEER Goodman is the performance numbers. A full 36,000 btu cooling, 34,600 btu heating at 47F, 12 EER, and 9 HSPF. These #s are with a 3-speed fan motor in the air handler, a TXV, and R22.

Take care.

[RyanHughes]

I too am impressed with Goodman/Amana numbers. A 3.5 ton (my size currently) ASZ14 heat pump with a variable-speed air handler (AEPF) gets 13.00 EER and 15.00 SEER, which are, as you know, excellent ratings. If you match the ASZ14 with a multi-speed air handler (ARUF), you get 12.00 EER and 14.00 SEER, which is still decent.

I'm still a Trane fan (I just think Trane equipment is solid and durable - that's just my opinion), especially for commercial, but one has to be careful when matching up Trane equipment.

[hivacjack]

The 2007 one ranks Trane #1
http://www.jdpower.com/corporate/news/releases/pdf/2007135.pdf

Note that the 2006 survey gave warranty and repair service, ordering proccess, and sales/marketing support more weight than and product quality.

The 2007 survey gave product quality the most weight, followed by warranty and repair service, credit/billing proccess, delivery, ordering process, price, marketing/advertising materials, and sales representative.[/QUOTE]



......interesting, I wonder how many points in a standard deviation........
or if they rotate 1st place among the major players by according different weights to ranking criteria. But one thing is for sure: very few dealers of
TRANE, LENNOX, or CARRIER have anything good to say about GOODMAN.

[RoBoTeq]

I've sold and installed Goodman for private residence, and apartment complexes.

I've used Goodman in some small commercial applications.
Along with all the other popular brands.

It just like comparing Ford, Chevy, its just a brand name.

Just wait till you hear these guys scream when they see the new Goodman commercial line up to 25 tons:eek:

[RyanHughes]

Just wait till you hear these guys scream when they see the new Goodman commercial line up to 25 tons:eek:

Goodman's version of a Voyager? ;)

[dash]

So is it actually designed and manufactured by Trane or are they scroll or reciprocating compressors with an orange coating? Did Trane used to make their own compressors but switch to scroll or reciprocating compressors? Thanks, I'm just curious to get this straight.

Snowball is dead!!