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tinknocker44
06-30-2007, 01:31 PM
Iraq ambush caps bloodiest months for US

By ROBERT H. REID, Associated Press Writer
Fri Jun 29, 7:52 PM ET



BAGHDAD - A huge bomb explosion followed by a hail of gunfire and grenades killed five U.S. soldiers, the military said Friday. The attack climaxed the deadliest three-month period for the Americans since the war began.


Seven soldiers were wounded in the attack Thursday in the Rasheed district, a mixed Sunni-Shiite area of southern Baghdad where U.S.-led forces recently stepped up pressure on extremists. The commander of U.S. forces in Baghdad suggested the ambush could be part of an escalating backlash by Sunni insurgents.

Those deaths brought to 99 the number of U.S. troops killed this month, according to an Associated Press count. The toll for the past three months — 329 — made it the deadliest quarter for U.S. troops in Iraq since the March 2003 invasion. That surpasses the 316 soldiers killed during November 2004 to January 2005.

Maj. Gen. Joseph F. Fil Jr., who heads U.S. forces in the Iraqi capital, said U.S. casualties had mounted because Sunni extremists are "starting to fight very hard" as U.S. forces press into areas of the capital where militants once had free rein.

"This is a skilled and determined enemy. He's ruthless. He's got a thirst for blood like I've never seen anywhere in my life," Fil told reporters. "And he's determined to do whatever he can."

During a teleconference with Pentagon reporters, Fil described the Thursday attack as "very violent," displaying a "level of sophistication that we have not often seen so far in this campaign."

He said a blast from a "very large" bomb buried deep in the ground triggered the attack, which was followed by volleys of small-arms fire and rocket-propelled grenades. Four soldiers were killed in the attack and a fifth died Thursday night of his wounds, Fil said.

"As far as the assessment, we believe that we are into an area" of south Baghdad "where we're seeing a very strong al-Qaida cell," Fil said. "Those areas are now denied to them ... They are starting to fight very hard and that's what we saw yesterday."

Sunni insurgents have used similar "swarming" tactics for years, mostly in rural areas to the north and west of the capital. Militants have also been burying explosives deep in the ground, making them difficult to detect and triggering them as vehicles pass by.

Such "deep buried bombs" have been especially effective against U.S. vehicles, including Humvees, Bradley fighting vehicles and Strykers, prompting commanders in some areas to shift to foot patrols to avoid losing so many soldiers in a single blast.

U.S. casualties have been rising since President Bush ordered nearly 30,000 more troops to Iraq in a major push to pacify Baghdad and surrounding areas. The goal was to curb the violence so Iraq's Shiite, Sunni and Kurdish leaders can strike agreements to share power in this fractious country.

But progress toward agreements to share oil wealth, provide a greater political role to the Sunni minority and shore up local governments has been slow because of deep suspicions after four years of bloodshed.

In a hopeful sign, radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr called off a July 5 march to a bombed shrine in Samarra north of Baghdad after appeals from the government, which feared Sunni extremists would attack marchers along the way.

Sheik Asad Al-Nassiri, an aide to the cleric, told a congregation at Friday prayer services in Kufa that al-Sadr canceled the march because of "the government's inability to secure the route and many officials' appeals for a postponement."

At the same time, however, anger has been welling up among Sunni Arabs, who complain they are being marginalized in the Shiite-dominated government.

A Sunni political party said Friday that four Sunni Cabinet members will refuse to attend government meetings to protest the way Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki handled legal proceedings against the fifth Sunni minister.

Earlier this week, an arrest warrant was issued for Culture Minister Asad Kamal al-Hashimi and security forces raided his Baghdad home after allegations he masterminded an assassination attempt against a politician two years ago.

Sunni politicians considered the move politically motivated and asked al-Maliki, a Shiite, to do something to stop it. The prime minister refused, saying he would not intervene in the work of the judiciary.

"The ministers have decided to suspend their participation in government meetings because they consider the stance of the prime minister and the government unsuitable," Ayad al-Samarraie, a leading member of the Sunni bloc the Iraqi Accordance Front, told AP.

"Had this minister been a member of his (al-Maliki's) party, would he have dealt with the matter the way he did?" al-Samarraie asked.

Muhannad al-Issawi, a spokesman for Accordance Front leader Adnan al-Dulaimi, said the boycott of the 37-member Cabinet "will continue until a compromise is reached."

Al-Issawi said the Sunnis were also protesting the dismissal this month of the Sunni speaker of parliament, who was voted out by the legislators because of erratic behavior.

In April, six Cabinet ministers loyal to al-Sadr quit the government to protest his refusal to call for a timetable for American troops to leave. They have not been replaced.

The boycotts are likely to complicate efforts to enact key "benchmark" legislation that the U.S. is demanding, since the Cabinet must sign off on such proposals before they go to parliament.

Even if the other Shiite and Kurdish members give their endorsement, the absence of key constituencies from the decision-making process would raise doubts whether such legislation would contribute to the goal of national reconciliation.

Elsewhere Friday, a suicide truck bomber attacked an Iraqi army post 20 miles north of the capital Friday, killing six soldiers and wounding five others, police said. Two civilians were also killed in a barrage of gunfire that followed, they said.

The blast occurred at a railway station in Mishada, an officer said on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to release the information.

Iraqi police said a bomb exploded under a pipeline south of Baghdad, spilling crude oil and sparking a huge fire. The pipeline carries oil from Iraq's southern oil fields to the Dora refinery in the capital.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070629/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

Tool-Slinger
06-30-2007, 02:15 PM
Okay, so how do you fix it.

chillbilly
06-30-2007, 02:24 PM
LOL
The entire troop surge is barely in place and we have the spammeister parroting.
Gen. Patreus is not due to report to the president until September.
We aren't even in July yet.

Report spam. It's lame.

oloenneker
06-30-2007, 02:27 PM
Report spam. It's lame.

LOL!!

Tool-Slinger
06-30-2007, 02:33 PM
I am no fan of "the Surge",i prefer busting iraq into 3 smaller nations.

That said,they just got the troops there a few weeks ago, it needs some time to work. It is politically motivated idiocy to be proclaiming failure already. They declare failure no matter what happens,failure is their policy.

chillbilly
06-30-2007, 03:10 PM
LOL!!
It really was just a joke. :D :D :D
I would never report it...even if it does come from tink.

Diceman
06-30-2007, 04:50 PM
Okay, so how do you fix it.
You don't you just leave.
:cool:

chillbilly
06-30-2007, 04:54 PM
You don't you just leave.
:cool:

And when they attack our allies or us....do we just leave then too? :rolleyes:

James 3528
06-30-2007, 05:54 PM
Cut and run never solved anything except making another place to cut and run from.

Tool-Slinger
06-30-2007, 06:41 PM
You don't you just leave.
:cool:
We cannot just leave, simpleton. Iran and syria would have it in 3 weeks, that is,... if china and russia do not decide to step in and impose 'order'.

glennac
06-30-2007, 06:42 PM
Bann the press and cameras from Iraqi and let our boys do their job. We never had press interference like we have in Iraqi. In Nam they mainly stayed in Sagion and got briefings from the Army.

bb
06-30-2007, 07:09 PM
Bann the press and cameras from Iraqi and let our boys do their job. We never had press interference like we have in Iraqi. In Nam they mainly stayed in Sagion and got briefings from the Army.

I agree . Then lock and load and put the fear of Allah into them. They and their families will quickly become submissive and fly straight, because they understand force.

Or we could send belching Kennedy and Jean Claude Van Damme Kerry to talk to them.:D

tinknocker44
06-30-2007, 10:29 PM
Bann the press and cameras from Iraqi and let our boys do their job. We never had press interference like we have in Iraqi. In Nam they mainly stayed in Sagion and got briefings from the Army.

Its everybodies fault except the incompetent liars that started this optional war. Be a man for once and have some ethics.

Tool-Slinger
06-30-2007, 10:41 PM
Its everybodies fault except the incompetent liars that started this optional war. Be a man for once and have some ethics.
You would let saddam have kuwait? that is where it began.

glennac
06-30-2007, 10:42 PM
Its everybodies fault except the incompetent liars that started this optional war. Be a man for once and have some ethics.

Get a life Tink, the only way to fight a war is to win and not have the press and guys with cameras recording and second guessing your every move. It's good that you never served in the millitary in combat becasue I believe that you might have become a casualty of "friendly" fire. :D :D :D

tinknocker44
06-30-2007, 10:52 PM
Get a life Tink, the only way to fight a war is to win and not have the press and guys with cameras recording and second guessing your every move. It's good that you never served in the millitary in combat becasue I believe that you might have become a casualty of "friendly" fire. :D :D :D

When you dont know how to win a war I guess you better blame it on someone else.

Tool-Slinger
06-30-2007, 11:23 PM
When you dont know how to win a war I guess you better blame it on someone else.
So tell us, tinky, how will yuo defeat the islamofacists who are trying to kill us all. Do you have a better plan?

James 3528
07-01-2007, 08:16 AM
The democrats are even scared of FOX news and freedom of speech on talk radio

chillbilly
07-01-2007, 09:39 AM
Tinky is using geer's "optional war" mantra again. LOL

Does he ever have an opinion that's not on loan from crooks and liars or geer?

tinknocker44
07-01-2007, 10:16 AM
Tinky is using geer's "optional war" mantra again. LOL

Does he ever have an opinion that's not on loan from crooks and liars or geer?

What difference does it make? When you're right you're right.

chillbilly
07-01-2007, 10:19 AM
Grow a hair, goofball.

tinknocker44
07-01-2007, 10:23 AM
Grow a hair, goofball.

You boys should start a new club. "Its alright if American troops die as long as the chimp doesnt look bad" club.

chillbilly
07-01-2007, 10:29 AM
Nah, they'd just shut it down because hairless goofballs like you would whine and complain about it. Besides, it's a stupid title.....on second thought, maybe you should start it since you named it.
Quite befitting for a hairless chihuaha. :D :D :D

tinknocker44
07-01-2007, 10:31 AM
Nah, they'd just shut it down because hairless goofballs like you would whine and complain about it. Besides, it's a stupid title.....on second thought, maybe you should start it since you named it.
Quite befitting for a hairless chihuaha. :D :D :D

This is why I'm against homeschooling. You were obviously left home alone.

James 3528
07-01-2007, 11:53 AM
Nah, they'd just shut it down because hairless goofballs like you would whine and complain about it. Besides, it's a stupid title.....on second thought, maybe you should start it since you named it.
Quite befitting for a hairless chihuaha. :D :D :D



:D :D :D :D :D

The Doctor
07-01-2007, 12:48 PM
After General Petraeus' report in September, we should begin bringing troops home. Our national interest is not being protected, forwarded, increased, enhanced, etc.
It's up to the Iraqis.
THen we should no longer be the enforcer of UN resolutions. While we're at it, withdrawal from the UN is something to consider. Let the debate club hang out in the Muzzie EU.

chillbilly
07-01-2007, 06:06 PM
This is why I'm against homeschooling. You were obviously left home alone.

Nah sonny. I've got a diploma and a degree which puts me 6-8 years ahead of you. ;)

chillbilly
07-01-2007, 06:22 PM
After General Petraeus' report in September, we should begin bringing troops home. Our national interest is not being protected, forwarded, increased, enhanced, etc.
It's up to the Iraqis.
THen we should no longer be the enforcer of UN resolutions. While we're at it, withdrawal from the UN is something to consider. Let the debate club hang out in the Muzzie EU.

The content of the report itself will determine whether we start withdrawing troops.
Ever since we implemented the surge we have been inundated with media asking about it's effectiveness.
The president was answering questions about surge effectiveness from the media before the troops were even fully deployed.
It's a no win scenario if we decide to withdraw before seeing results, which is exactly what the bleeding hearts want.

tinknocker44
07-01-2007, 06:45 PM
The content of the report itself will determine whether we start withdrawing troops.
Ever since we implemented the surge we have been inundated with media asking about it's effectiveness.
The president was answering questions about surge effectiveness from the media before the troops were even fully deployed.
It's a no win scenario if we decide to withdraw before seeing results, which is exactly what the bleeding hearts want.

He hasnt had an answer since the start of his optional war so why should he have one for that.

chillbilly
07-01-2007, 06:48 PM
It's the hairless chihuaha again. :rolleyes:

tinknocker44
07-01-2007, 06:52 PM
It's the hairless chihuaha again. :rolleyes:

I thought that was you peeping into my window when I was taking a leak. Mines got more bite though.

chillbilly
07-01-2007, 06:56 PM
spamma-lamma ding-dong.

The Doctor
07-01-2007, 07:08 PM
The content of the report itself will determine whether we start withdrawing troops.
Ever since we implemented the surge we have been inundated with media asking about it's effectiveness.
The president was answering questions about surge effectiveness from the media before the troops were even fully deployed.
It's a no win scenario if we decide to withdraw before seeing results, which is exactly what the bleeding hearts want.

I'd like to know what it is about Wilsonian foreign policy that appeals to us so. Is it a sense of exceptionalism. Must we promote democracy worldwide at the point of a gun?.
It is not our job to enforce U.N. resolutions.
It is not in our national interest to splinter the already ugly situation in "Iraq" by removing Saddam.
And while I hope that the surge works, I hope that we can just leave those people alone. Believe me, I got lots of Second Amendment here just waiting for the day when some clowns come HERE and try something, but until then....we've got about 2000 miles of border to patrol to our south...

chillbilly
07-01-2007, 07:11 PM
We cannot and should not wait "until then".
We have a duty to address it now and we certainly are not doing it because of UN mandates.

Tool-Slinger
07-01-2007, 07:20 PM
I'd like to know what it is about Wilsonian foreign policy that appeals to us so. Is it a sense of exceptionalism. Must we promote democracy worldwide at the point of a gun?.
It is not our job to enforce U.N. resolutions.
It is not in our national interest to splinter the already ugly situation in "Iraq" by removing Saddam.
And while I hope that the surge works, I hope that we can just leave those people alone. Believe me, I got lots of Second Amendment here just waiting for the day when some clowns come HERE and try something, but until then....we've got about 2000 miles of border to patrol to our south...
We have to keep the markets free. Economic reality.

glennac
07-01-2007, 11:32 PM
I thought that was you peeping into my window when I was taking a leak. Mines got more bite though.

LOL, using my old jokes I see Tink. At least you weren't like Ace who lost his cookies over that one a few months ago when I asked if that was you or Ace looking through my bathroom window.:D :D :D

The Doctor
07-02-2007, 06:54 AM
We cannot and should not wait "until then".
We have a duty to address it now and we certainly are not doing it because of UN mandates.

I can still hear Gen. Colin Powell laying out the case against Iraq, as he directly linked the impending military action to Saddam's non-conpliance with the U.N. resolutions. Would you suggest that our military action there is otherwise motivated?

I should like to examine our duty and the Constitution of the United States of America. We are now doing it because the big prize has not yet been won--the real reason for this exercise, the country which is now nearly surrounded by U.S. military action--the Islamic republic of ...the head of the snake.
And what will we gain? There will still be violence on their part around the world, idiots who drive cars into airport doorways, subways, etc.
My "until then" includes CCP(concealed carry). It's not just the Wild West anymore. It's the Wild World. No problem--but that does not obligate us to police the Middle East.
Meanwhile, our national guard is spread out in this action. ANd approximately 50 illegals on average cross our border an hour. That's approx. 1 per minute. How about we guard our border?

James 3528
07-02-2007, 07:05 AM
I can still hear Gen. Colin Powell laying out the case against Iraq, as he directly linked the impending military action to Saddam's non-conpliance with the U.N. resolutions. Would you suggest that our military action there is otherwise motivated?

I should like to examine our duty and the Constitution of the United States of America. We are now doing it because the big prize has not yet been won--the real reason for this exercise, the country which is now nearly surrounded by U.S. military action--the Islamic republic of ...the head of the snake.
And what will we gain? There will still be violence on their part around the world, idiots who drive cars into airport doorways, subways, etc.
My "until then" includes CCP(concealed carry). It's not just the Wild West anymore. It's the Wild World. No problem--but that does not obligate us to police the Middle East.
Meanwhile, our national guard is spread out in this action. ANd approximately 50 illegals on average cross our border an hour. That's approx. 1 per minute. How about we guard our border?

Powell should have done a batter job of finishing the job during Desert Storm.

The illegals crossing the border interwoven into the Iraq argument don't fly.

geerair
07-02-2007, 01:35 PM
Iran and syria would have it in 3 weeks, that is,... if china and russia do not decide to step in and impose 'order'.They can have it.

All we have gotten out of it is thousands of dead and maimed soldiers and a a loss of billions of dollars.

geerair
07-02-2007, 01:53 PM
He hasnt had an answer since the start of his optional war so why should he have one for that.Bush's answer is to throw more troops and money at it in the hope that things will get better.

Problem is that Bush has tried surges before with little success.

This latest surge is more of the same "stay the course" nonsense that has proven to be a failure in the past.


Even staunch Republican supporters of Bush and his optional excursion are starting to hop off the bandwagon.

glennac
07-02-2007, 05:14 PM
Bush's answer is to throw more troops and money at it in the hope that things will get better.

Problem is that Bush has tried surges before with little success.

This latest surge is more of the same "stay the course" nonsense that has proven to be a failure in the past.


Even staunch Republican supporters of Bush and his optional excursion are starting to hop off the bandwagon.

Don’t get excited geer the band hasn’t played the final tune yet the "victory march". Stick around for the grand finally. :D :D :D

chillbilly
07-02-2007, 05:17 PM
Hey tinky. Geer's calling it an "optional excursion" now.
Please make note of that for your future use.

Tool-Slinger
07-02-2007, 06:17 PM
They can have it.

All we have gotten out of it is thousands of dead and maimed soldiers and a a loss of billions of dollars.
Consider this angle:

There are millions of muslim immigrants from places 'over there' here among the rest of us. We cannot let 'over there' just run amock due to the influence they have on our local muslims. We are tied to the riegon for a variety of reasons, but think about that one.

chillbilly
07-02-2007, 06:44 PM
Yeah, geer's idea of sound foreign policy in that region is to give the Ponderosa to the Chinese and Russians. LOL
We have vital interests in the region. Duh.

geerair
07-02-2007, 06:54 PM
Don’t get excited geer the band hasn’t played the final tune yet the "victory march". Stick around for the grand finally. :D :D :D There will be no grand finale. This optional war will grind on to a sad end with no winners and no cheering.

Least of all from the families of the killed and wounded on both sides.

geerair
07-02-2007, 06:56 PM
Consider this angle:

There are millions of muslim immigrants from places 'over there' here among the rest of us. We cannot let 'over there' just run amock due to the influence they have on our local muslims. We are tied to the riegon for a variety of reasons, but think about that one.Wait, you mean they are already here?

Bush has continuously insisted that they would only come over here after we left.


I always thought that assertion was a bit goofy.

chillbilly
07-02-2007, 07:20 PM
Of course there are already terrorists here, both homegrown and imported.
What he meant was that by adopting a policy of cut'n run, the terrorists and their supporters will be emboldened.
It's not too hard to figure out for those who are eager to listen to experts instead of constantly believing political figurines whose only agenda is to get themselves elected.

Tool-Slinger
07-02-2007, 08:52 PM
Wait, you mean they are already here?

Bush has continuously insisted that they would only come over here after we left.


I always thought that assertion was a bit goofy.
We are fighting an ideology, more than an army. Don't play stupid, stupid.

geerair
07-02-2007, 10:01 PM
We are fighting an ideology, more than an army. Don't play stupid, stupid.Fighting an ideology? Hmmmmmm............So in Iraq we are fighting a civil war, not an ideology and since you say the terrorists are already here, then we can start bringing the troops home.

Tool-Slinger
07-02-2007, 10:18 PM
Fighting an ideology? Hmmmmmm............So in Iraq we are fighting a civil war, not an ideology and since you say the terrorists are already here, then we can start bringing the troops home.
Saddam is gone, that is good. Iran is another problem, we may have to fight there too. Islamic radicals are all over the area over there. They can influence muslims here. We have to defeat armies, but also have to defeat the radical influence. We must lock-down the entire region, politically, not just USA military control.

You cannot just whine and go home. It is hard.

James 3528
07-02-2007, 10:40 PM
Fighting an ideology? Hmmmmmm............So in Iraq we are fighting a civil war, not an ideology and since you say the terrorists are already here, then we can start bringing the troops home.

The US military mission is not to defend the continental USA. It is to deploy and fight.

geerair
07-03-2007, 12:52 AM
Saddam is gone, that is good. Iran is another problem, we may have to fight there too. Islamic radicals are all over the area over there. They can influence muslims here. We have to defeat armies, but also have to defeat the radical influence. We must lock-down the entire region, politically, not just USA military control.

You cannot just whine and go home. It is hard.So, we just sit in the middle of a quagmire civil war losing soldiers and treasure and this defeats radical influence how?

geerair
07-03-2007, 12:57 AM
The US military mission is not to defend the continental USA. It is to deploy and fight.Not even if the Iraqi's load up their two river boats with soldiers and their Toyota Pickup Truck Tanks, sail across the oceans and attack the Eastern seaboard of the continental U.S.?

chefid
07-03-2007, 04:08 AM
seems like the mission is to sit and wait to get blown up. muslims are not the problem, radicals are the problem.

The Doctor
07-03-2007, 06:41 AM
Powell should have done a batter job of finishing the job during Desert Storm.
Agreed. Since that's come and gone, how about we put pressure on the Iraqis to take care of themselves?

The illegals crossing the border interwoven into the Iraq argument don't fly.

50 strangers per hour may not concern you, but our National Guard could maybe guard OUR nation. Our liberty here is not mature enough to assume that we can just ignore our own border.

Now our use of a generation to install democracy over there--face it, that's where this timeline is headed unless we apply direct pressure--our use of even the better part of a generation over there will not console us when one of these Muslim extremists does something on our soil.

So when does it end? I say after September, we use that occasion to begin drawdown.