Another terror plot foiled

[chillbilly]

http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070603/REPOSITORY/706030425/1013/NEWS03

This one originated in the Carribean and by all accounts, would have been more devastating than 9/11. It also contained at least one American who had converted to Islam.

If terrorist organizations are branching out to all areas of the world, how will our withdrawal from engaging them abroad make us safer?
Will they simply stop attempting to attack the US because we decide not to war against them?

[tinknocker44]

chillbilly;1504166]http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070603/REPOSITORY/706030425/1013/NEWS03

This one originated in the Carribean and by all accounts, would have been more devastating than 9/11. It also contained at least one American who had converted to Islam.

Dont they know their supposed to be in Iraq?



If terrorist organizations are branching out to all areas of the world, how will our withdrawal from engaging them abroad make us safer?
Will they simply stop attempting to attack the US because we decide not to war against them?


This proves our Army in Iraq has nothing to do with terror. Lets put them where it matters and get the bad guys.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Let me tell you what was/is scary about that potential attack scenario:

JFK airport is one of the major international airports in the NE. If it were shut down, it would hurt the business world VERY badly; in that folks that needed to visit NYC for professional reasons could not get there. This would cripple the entire world's economy, and it is not that great now... If this act of terrorism had happened, it could have very well caused a recession that would have hit most all of us in the wallet... My thanks to the government for catching these fools before it happened.

But to the details: There is just not enough room at JFK airport for adequate fuel storage to re-fuel those huge jets. One Boeing plane capable of crossing the Atlantic can take on as much as 10,000 gallons or more of fuel each time it goes through the airport (to get a perspective, a gasoline tanker that delivers to your local station carries around 7000 gallons). And planes depart about every 2 minutes or more... Do the math...

The fuel is sent to the airport through underground pipelines. The terrorists wanted to take out both the small tanks at the airport, and also the pipelines under residential neighborhoods in Queens that supply those tanks... It would have been a mess MANY, MANY times worse than 911.

We should all be VERY glad this one was caught before it happened.

And BTW: Tinker: Just coming home from Iraq will not make it any better. By continuously posting that childish rubble, you repeatedly prove that you do not understand the bigger picture. You need to do a LOT of reading from many sources (and not all of them liberal) to understand. Until you do, nobody will take you seriously, and they will pick and tease at you... It is your decision as to whether you grow in your understanding, or drift sideways believing/telling rubbish.

[tinknocker44]

And BTW: Tinker: Just coming home from Iraq will not make it any better. By continuously posting that childish rubble, you repeatedly prove that you do not understand the bigger picture. You need to do a LOT of reading from many sources (and not all of them liberal) to understand. Until you do, nobody will take you seriously, and they will pick and tease at you... It is your decision as to whether you grow in your understanding, or drift sideways believing/telling rubbish.

You mean read the numerous Generals right done to the privates who hate walking around babysitting? How about the ISG report. I know you think its a Kansas fleamarket with Mickey Mouse handing out candy. Its you and the 30% who dont see the big picture. You just keep coming back for a beating.

[ga-hvac-tech]

You mean read the numerous Generals right done to the privates who hate walking around babysitting? How about the ISG report. I know you think its a Kansas fleamarket with Mickey Mouse handing out candy. Its you and the 30% who dont see the big picture. You just keep coming back for a beating.

No, I mean study history and learn the BIG picture. Tinker, you talk like a child. When will you grow up??

And no, nobody is taking a beating but you, you are just too dumb to understand.

[tinknocker44]

No, I mean study history and learn the BIG picture. Tinker, you talk like a child. When will you grow up??

And no, nobody is taking a beating but you, you are just too dumb to understand.


Some day I hope to be as mature as you.:rolleyes: Then I can respond to everything with " You dont understand" or "you dont see the big picture". Those responses everytime you dont have a legit answer shows how ignorant you are.

Its clear you read the same history book Dumbya did. "Whats a Shiite? and Whats a Sunni?" To bad you twits waited to read after the quagmire started.

[geerair]

Dont they know their supposed to be in Iraq?What in the hell is wrong with these people?

Do they not understand plain English or are they just dense?

"Fight them there so we don't have to fight them here."


Could Dear Leader have put it anymore clearly?


I say we just ignore all of these terrorist plots because obviously they are not following the script laid down by Dear Leader and continuously parroted by his groupies.


Just ignore them until the lightbulb goes on and they get back to Iraq where they are supposed to be.


This is making Dear Leader and those who spout the "fight them there" mantra look silly.

We can't have that.

[James 3528]

Quoting Tinnuts Geer only makes you look dumber. It's a shame you don't have a little friend with a brain.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Some day I hope to be as mature as you.:rolleyes: Then I can respond to everything with " You dont understand" or "you dont see the big picture". Those responses everytime you dont have a legit answer shows how ignorant you are.

Its clear you read the same history book Dumbya did. "Whats a Shiite? and Whats a Sunni?" To bad you twits waited to read after the quagmire started.

O K Tinker, let me explain:

Have you read "The rise and fall of the Roman Empire"

Or have you studied the Spartain empire?

Perhaps you might have studied the great Ceasers of Ancient Egypt?

Have you read the manifesto of Communism by Carl Marx?

What about visiting the libraries of the presidents of this great nation you think you are fixing?

Or have you studied both Rommel and Patton? To learn who really out-foxed the other?

Or have you studied the Biblical accounts of the nation of Israel when they were conquered by other armies and went off into captivity; and then fought their way to freedom, and then less than 100 years later did the same thing???

My point is that human nature is human nature. And ALL humans do pretty much the same thing. To study history is to understand the patterns of behavior that humans will repeat. It is proven over and over again that we will do the same stupid things.

You see Tinker, when one has studied this material in depth and one has experienced military duty, and one has fought for what they believe in and want, and when one has suffered hardships and learned how to grow beyond them; ONLY then do they start to understand what life is all about. It is the tuff times that grow us from boys into men. And your behavior makes it clear to all of us that have walked in those shoes, that you have not.

Tinker, you have NOT learned anywhere enough (both education or experience) to be spouting off your mouth as an authority. You are nothing more than a (manipulated) mouthpiece for an organization that is using you to promote their agenda, which is not good for the country, it is only good for the wallets of the folks promoting the agenda.

You remind me of a welfare momma: You would vote for anyone that would promise more free goodies to you. And you probably would pop out babies if it meant more $$$ (if you had the ability).

You see, REAL MEN do not see life as 'what is in it for me'. They see it as 'what contribution can I make to make the world a better place'. And to be able to make a contribution, one has to mature beyond thinking with their thumb in their mouth.

Come back when you have an education, that is, from the school of hard knocks.

[geerair]

No, I mean study history and learn the BIG picture. The optional Iraq invasion has:

Provided a training ground for terrorists......

Been a boon for terrorist recruitment......

Provided a diversion from the real threat; those who attacked us on 9/11 and continue to spread terrorism around the world.....

Destabilized the region.....


Neutered Iran's principal enemy and has elevated Iran to the key player in the ME......


Played right into the hands of Osama Bin Laden by turning a secular nation into an Islamic state.....


Opened the door for a bloody sectarian civil war with our people sitting right in the middle of it bleeding lives and treasure with no progress or end in sight......



What would be the big picture as you see it?

[geerair]

Perhaps you might have studied the great Ceasers of Ancient Egypt?:confused: :confused: :confused:

[tinknocker44]

Yet you're an idiot with no common sense, and after reading all those books you claim. All you got from those books was a good brain washing.

Our Army in Iraq and the terrorists plotting everywhere else. I'll put it too you the only way I know how...























DUH

[geerair]

O K Tinker, let me explain:

Have you read "The rise and fall of the Roman Empire"

Or have you studied the Spartain empire?

Perhaps you might have studied the great Ceasers of Ancient Egypt?

Have you read the manifesto of Communism by Carl Marx?

What about visiting the libraries of the presidents of this great nation you think you are fixing?

Or have you studied both Rommel and Patton? To learn who really out-foxed the other?

Or have you studied the Biblical accounts of the nation of Israel when they were conquered by other armies and went off into captivity; and then fought their way to freedom, and then less than 100 years later did the same thing???

My point is that human nature is human nature. And ALL humans do pretty much the same thing. To study history is to understand the patterns of behavior that humans will repeat. It is proven over and over again that we will do the same stupid things.

You see Tinker, when one has studied this material in depth and one has experienced military duty, and one has fought for what they believe in and want, and when one has suffered hardships and learned how to grow beyond them; ONLY then do they start to understand what life is all about. It is the tuff times that grow us from boys into men. And your behavior makes it clear to all of us that have walked in those shoes, that you have not.

Tinker, you have NOT learned anywhere enough (both education or experience) to be spouting off your mouth as an authority. You are nothing more than a (manipulated) mouthpiece for an organization that is using you to promote their agenda, which is not good for the country, it is only good for the wallets of the folks promoting the agenda.

You remind me of a welfare momma: You would vote for anyone that would promise more free goodies to you. And you probably would pop out babies if it meant more $$$ (if you had the ability).

You see, REAL MEN do not see life as 'what is in it for me'. They see it as 'what contribution can I make to make the world a better place'. And to be able to make a contribution, one has to mature beyond thinking with their thumb in their mouth.

Come back when you have an education, that is, from the school of hard knocks.Damn GA, lots of bandwidth wasted with more than the usual amount of insipid content normally found in your posts.

[bootlen]

Damn GA, lots of bandwidth wasted with more than the usual amount of insipid content normally found in your posts.

Got to ya, huh?

:D :D :D :D

[chillbilly]

Dont they know their supposed to be in Iraq?
Your childish sarcasm just proves what an infant you are and how abysmally uninformed you remain.
There are terrorist organizations all over the globe.
Didn't you know that? :rolleyes:



This proves our Army in Iraq has nothing to do with terror.
LOL You are just pathetic.
Have you not been reading the military and media reports daily for the last 4 years? Terrorist organizations are all over the ME. In Iraq and all adjacent countries. They are attacking us daily there. And we are pushing back.
The Taliban and Al-Queda no longer have free rein in the ME inside Iraq and Afghanistan.Their beloved leader has no choice other than to organize in other parts of the world because out military has rendered his ass a cave dweller.



Lets put them where it matters and get the bad guys.
Spoken like a true pre-schooler.

[chillbilly]

You jackasses can try to hijack the thread all you'd like, but I won't let ya'.
The fact remains, a terror plot that could have killed your fellow citizens was thwarted by officials here in the United States in conjunction with a department the president helped create, the DHS.
Put that in your juice box and drink it.

[geerair]

Got to ya, huh?

:D :D :D :DYes it did.

The great Ceasars of Egypt was curious.


http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/rotflol.gif

[geerair]

Its clear you read the same history book Dumbya did. "Whats a Shiite? and Whats a Sunni?" To bad you twits waited to read after the quagmire started.http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/rotflol.gif

[Carnak]

http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070603/REPOSITORY/706030425/1013/NEWS03

This one originated in the Carribean and by all accounts, would have been more devastating than 9/11. It also contained at least one American who had converted to Islam.

If terrorist organizations are branching out to all areas of the world, how will our withdrawal from engaging them abroad make us safer?
Will they simply stop attempting to attack the US because we decide not to war against them?

The article makes it sound like it was a homegrown terrorist plot, not a plot originating eleswhere. Well the guy was a naturalized citizen anyways, probably a paki from guyana.

They mentioned a Black Muslim group, but those guys hate hindus and pakis.The guys they want extraditied sound like they are pakis too.

[tinknocker44]

chillbilly;1504516]Your childish sarcasm just proves what an infant you are and how abysmally uninformed you remain.
There are terrorist organizations all over the globe.
Didn't you know that? :rolleyes:

Ya THINK SHERLOCK? OBVIOUSLY YOU DONT UNDERSTAND SARCASM.



LOL You are just pathetic.
Have you not been reading the military and media reports daily for the last 4 years? Terrorist organizations are all over the ME. In Iraq and all adjacent countries. They are attacking us daily there. And we are pushing back.

Would you fight against a country that invaded ours?



The Taliban and Al-Queda no longer have free rein in the ME inside Iraq and Afghanistan.Their beloved leader has no choice other than to organize in other parts of the world because out military has rendered his ass a cave dweller.

This is what makes pugs lying POS. They ignore the fact that AQ wasnt and couldnt get into Iraq to push their own agenda.




Spoken like a true pre-schooler


Spoken like the catcher of the Gayas$ club.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Well, here we are again: The same old routine, just different details... I wonder why I bother trying to teach rebellious children (liberals) how to listen and learn... Honestly, I wish we could figure out a way to get these rebellious youths (liberals) drafted... it would pound some sense into their heads... maybe...

Lets try this one more time: Every time a conservative types some truth, it is just too much for the liberals to understand. Kinda like trying to teach algebra to a first grader... just over their heads.

But instead of being mature adults (that is, listen and learn), they react like little children that think it is all about blowing smoke. (I would like to see what the resident liberals would say about the smoke from the business end of a terrorist rifle or suicide bomber...) They (the liberals) are just not mature enough to see the big picture. And if someone takes the time to try and paint it for them, all their little selfish minds can do is pick a sound-bite that means nothing and yell about it. There are uneducated children in poverty stricken parts of the world with more maturity than our resident liberals...

O K, one more time: The big picture: The big picture is what is in the best interest of America. The big picture is NOT what is easiest, sounds good today, or feels good today.

Example: What feels good today to a high school graduate is beer, parties, and sex... right??? But what is the big picture: skip the parties, go to college, get an education; and then you will have 4 or 5 or maybe 10 times the money to do as you choose. So will the person make the choice to discipline themselves and do the wise thing? You tell me...

Now lets apply this to a nation that wants to live in freedom, yet has another group of religious radicals that want to kill them off. The easy way out is to run and hide, the right way is to deal with it.

Now in a previous post, I asked if one of the resident liberals if he had read a few books written by/about history and military strategy. If they had, then perhaps they would understand a little about conflict on the battlefield. But since they have not, they they are not qualified to speak.

However, the author if this post has read those books, so he is qualified to speak.

In application, those that understand military are qualified to speak about it... Those that are not qualified are just wasting hot air... And we do have a global warming issue, so why are you adding to the problem???

So when you goofy liberals become qualified to speak, us qualified (by learning and experience) conservatives will listen. Until then, as far as I am concerned, you are nothing more than a smoke generator. And I think I just found a bucket of water... :D

Just to be fair, Here is a little history lesson: The Roman Empire was probably the only nation in the history of the world that ever tried the experiment of freedom like the USA has. And if you had read "The Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire" by Gibbons, you would know that liberal thinking, and the permissive society that comes along with it, was the downfall of Rome. So if history repeats itself (and it does), then our country is destined to go down the tubes if we tolerate liberals...

Now I have proven my statements with historical references and facts... Do likewise, or shut-up.

[chillbilly]

They ignore the fact that AQ wasnt and couldnt get into Iraq to push their own agenda.
Sure they could and they did. Show me something that points to any such "fact" that multiple terror cells and organizations weren't in Iraq and elsewhere in the ME. Put up or shut up.
Maybe this can help you learn how to search for something other than favorable spam from radical left wing web sites, but probably not.
Reaearch and intelligent debate aren't your strong points.

Do you have any strong points?



NO

[mark42202]

Sure they could and they did. Show me something that points to any such "fact" that multiple terror cells and organizations weren't in Iraq and elsewhere in the ME. Put up or shut up.
Maybe this can help you learn how to search for something other than favorable spam from radical left wing web sites.

Whenever it's brought up, they start chanting their "Bush Lied" lyrics and claim that, although there in fact WERE terrorist training camps in Iraq, they were in parts of Iraq that Saddam couldn't control so therefore, they don't count.

[Carnak]

I don't thimk bush lied, I think the guys in the shadows lied to him

[tinknocker44]

Sure they could and they did. Show me something that points to any such "fact" that multiple terror cells and organizations weren't in Iraq and elsewhere in the ME. Put up or shut up.
Maybe this can help you learn how to search for something other than favorable spam from radical left wing web sites, but probably not.
Reaearch and intelligent debate aren't your strong points.

Do you have any strong points?



NO

B/c you have no debating skills you'll just blow it (GA club) off as a lib source.
If you have the balls to read it, prove it wrong.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A47812-2004Jun16.html

[chillbilly]

It's not my responsibility to prove an opinion wrong.
It's your responsibilty to prove that it's accurate and factual.
You can't because it isn't.
The question is not that there weren't "contacts" between Iraqi leadership and terrorist organizations.
There was and is overwhelming evidence that terrorist organizations were there long before 9/11.
Prove that wrong without using opinion.

[James 3528]

It's not my responsibility to prove an opinion wrong.
It's your responsibilty to prove that it's accurate and factual.
You can't because it isn't.damn straight!





Don't you feel safe knowing John Edwards, Hillary and Obama Hussein may be protecting you? They will do a great job in killing the terrorist at Smith & Wesson, Exxon and the tobacco companies

[ga-hvac-tech]

Well, well, well...

Neither Geer nor Tinker, and not even both of them together (scary thought...) could handle the truth about the Roman Empire, and that loose liberalism was the fall of said nation.

Smoked their sorry A$$e$$ with facts yet again!!!!!!!! And away they go...

I humbly submit this victory for the greater gain of the KA group, and will take no personal credit beyond the $200 prize that I have duelly earned today... :cool:

[whec720]

Ya see ga, what libs hate more than facts is an attack on their perceived, "moral high ground". Remember, they believe they are the good guys. You slayed them with your analogy. Good job. However, you and I know, they will be back with more Soros propaganda. Just keep exposing their weaknesses.........perceived moral high ground. Drives them nuts!:D

[Carnak]

Well, well, well...

Neither Geer nor Tinker, and not even both of them together (scary thought...) could handle the truth about the Roman Empire, and that loose liberalism was the fall of said nation.

Smoked their sorry A$$e$$ with facts yet again!!!!!!!! And away they go...

I humbly submit this victory for the greater gain of the KA group, and will take no personal credit beyond the $200 prize that I have duelly earned today... :cool:

The Roman Republic was over long before the Western Empire fell. Maybe there is a lesson there also.

What chapters in Gibbons's book blames it all on liberalism? Any chapters on Christianity?

In the days when Rome was still a republic, those that were citizens would not 'ask what their country could do for them, but what they could do for their country'.

[ga-hvac-tech]

The Roman Republic was over long before the Western Empire fell. Maybe there is a lesson there also.

What chapters in Gibbons's book blames it all on liberalism? Any chapters on Christianity?

In the days when Rome was still a republic, those that were citizens would not 'ask what their country could do for them, but what they could do for their country'.

Good questions and a good observation there Carnak!

The statement about doing for one's country is GREAT!

But my goal here is for Geer and/or Tinker to be required to speak for themselves, and speak accountably towards the question. If anyone answers for them, they are released from taking responsibility for their statements (or lack thereof). So how about lets make them stand their ground or sink away... Fair enough?

[oloenneker]

I don't thimk bush lied, I think the guys in the shadows lied to him

That's pretty plausible. TheY (the shadows) also gave hime the tools to sell the damn thing too.

[Carnak]

The statement about doing for one's country is GREAT!


And a dem coined it

[geerair]

Well, here we are again: The same old routine, just different details... I wonder why I bother trying to teach rebellious children (liberals) how to listen and learn... Honestly, I wish we could figure out a way to get these rebellious youths (liberals) drafted... it would pound some sense into their heads... maybe...

Lets try this one more time: Every time a conservative types some truth, it is just too much for the liberals to understand. Kinda like trying to teach algebra to a first grader... just over their heads.

But instead of being mature adults (that is, listen and learn), they react like little children that think it is all about blowing smoke. (I would like to see what the resident liberals would say about the smoke from the business end of a terrorist rifle or suicide bomber...) They (the liberals) are just not mature enough to see the big picture. And if someone takes the time to try and paint it for them, all their little selfish minds can do is pick a sound-bite that means nothing and yell about it. There are uneducated children in poverty stricken parts of the world with more maturity than our resident liberals...

O K, one more time: The big picture: The big picture is what is in the best interest of America. The big picture is NOT what is easiest, sounds good today, or feels good today.

Example: What feels good today to a high school graduate is beer, parties, and sex... right??? But what is the big picture: skip the parties, go to college, get an education; and then you will have 4 or 5 or maybe 10 times the money to do as you choose. So will the person make the choice to discipline themselves and do the wise thing? You tell me...

Now lets apply this to a nation that wants to live in freedom, yet has another group of religious radicals that want to kill them off. The easy way out is to run and hide, the right way is to deal with it.

Now in a previous post, I asked if one of the resident liberals if he had read a few books written by/about history and military strategy. If they had, then perhaps they would understand a little about conflict on the battlefield. But since they have not, they they are not qualified to speak.

However, the author if this post has read those books, so he is qualified to speak.

In application, those that understand military are qualified to speak about it... Those that are not qualified are just wasting hot air... And we do have a global warming issue, so why are you adding to the problem???

So when you goofy liberals become qualified to speak, us qualified (by learning and experience) conservatives will listen. Until then, as far as I am concerned, you are nothing more than a smoke generator. And I think I just found a bucket of water... :DOne long ad hominem.



Just to be fair, Here is a little history lesson: The Roman Empire was probably the only nation in the history of the world that ever tried the experiment of freedom like the USA has. You sure about that? Are you really sure about that?


I didn't realize that the United States was ruled by Emperors however much Bush has tried to make himself into one.




And if you had read "The Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire" by Gibbons, you would know that liberal thinking, and the permissive society that comes along with it, was the downfall of Rome. So if history repeats itself (and it does), then our country is destined to go down the tubes if we tolerate liberals... Really? Gibbon lists Christianity as one of the leading reasons for the fall of Rome.


Now I have proven my statements with historical references and facts... Do likewise, or shut-up.Proven? All you have done is post a long ad hominem and scrambled history.

[James 3528]

WoW..all that and you did not use "myth"

[geerair]

Well, well, well...

Neither Geer nor Tinker, and not even both of them together (scary thought...) could handle the truth about the Roman Empire, and that loose liberalism was the fall of said nation.

Smoked their sorry A$$e$$ with facts yet again!!!!!!!! And away they go...

I humbly submit this victory for the greater gain of the KA group, and will take no personal credit beyond the $200 prize that I have duelly earned today... :cool:I doubt that anyone who not only can't spell Caesar and places them in Egypt, thinks the United States is ruled by emperors, thinks Rome and the U.S. are the only nations to ever dabble with freedom and presents nothing more than an edited version of history has anywhere near enough credibility in historical studies to claim a victory.

[geerair]

WoW..all that and you did not use "myth" Well it fits your posts so much better than anybody else's.

[ga-hvac-tech]

I doubt that anyone who not only can't spell Caesar and places them in Egypt, thinks the United States is ruled by emperors, thinks Rome and the U.S. are the only nations to ever dabble with freedom and presents nothing more than an edited version of history has anywhere near enough credibility in historical studies to claim a victory.

Well my friend, until you debate me with your facts and prove me wrong; I think you are only blowing smoke to avoid loosing face. Besides, any of the presidents of the USA that have served in your lifetime (and many before) have mis-spelled words and missed a detail or two.

Your arguements are as limp as your brain. Try again little brother.

[geerair]

Well my friend, until you debate me with your facts and prove me wrong; I think you are only blowing smoke to avoid loosing face. Besides, any of the presidents of the USA that have served in your lifetime (and many before) have mis-spelled words and missed a detail or two. Describing the Caesars as Egyptian is more than a detail. It is a symptom of a ridculously poor understanding of history.

Leaving out the fact that Gibbon considered Christianity a leading cause of the Decline of the Roman Empire is a symptom of selective intepretation of history.

Son, your grasp of history is not only shamefully inadequate and your selective intepretations dishonest but your claims of victory are not supported and downright laughable.

[oloenneker]

Just to be fair, Here is a little history lesson: The Roman Empire was probably the only nation in the history of the world that ever tried the experiment of freedom like the USA has.

You sure about that? Are you really sure about that?




Yeah he is sure about that. He is among those that believe that the USA is the only nation in the world where one has personal freedoms, despite the fact that there are countries in the world where their constitutions provide even more freedoms than our US constritution grants.

Oh, yeah, I almost forgot, those countries also tend to have fairly liberal governments too...

[hvactech13]

Sure they could and they did. Show me something that points to any such "fact" that multiple terror cells and organizations weren't in Iraq and elsewhere in the ME. Put up or shut up.
Maybe this can help you learn how to search for something other than favorable spam from radical left wing web sites, but probably not.
Reaearch and intelligent debate aren't your strong points.

Do you have any strong points?

NO


Pure speculation.

Intelligence agencies have consistintly stated there were no operational ties between Iraq and al-qaeda.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hvactech13
No ties between the Iraqi Government and Al-Qaida, but they have never said anything about smaller groups. Is it improbable to think that he had no friends or family members involved in the organization before 2005?

No evidence of it.

Do you have evidence of this that the CIA, the DOD, the State Department somehow overlooked?


It's a dead horse if you start with him on this one CB. The only argument you will get is that the terrorist camps were in the Kurdish controlled area of Iraq, and that the intelligence community (same ones who were wrong about WMD) didn't find any links between Iraq and terrorist organizations.

[chillbilly]

It's a dead horse if you start with him on this one CB. The only argument you will get is that the terrorist camps were in the Kurdish controlled area of Iraq, and that the intelligence community (same ones who were wrong about WMD) didn't find any links between Iraq and terrorist organizations.


Yeah, I know. These goons just don't get it.
Decades worth of intel clearly show and implicate terrorists and their organizers in Northern and Southern Iraq as well as on both east and west borders with Syria and Iran, and these guys think a Washington Post editorial opinion somehow disproves all that.
Amazing.

[geerair]

It's a dead horse if you start with him on this one CB. The only argument you will get is that the terrorist camps were in the Kurdish controlled area of Iraq, and that the intelligence community (same ones who were wrong about WMD) didn't find any links between Iraq and terrorist organizations.Yes, we are all still waiting for your evidence.

Poor old Bush would be eternally grateful for your evidence as he has none to support his claims.

Go ahead, help Bush out, he is sinking deeper and deeper into his optional quagmire as we speak.


http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/rotflol.gif

[chillbilly]

Yes, we are all still waiting for your evidence.
Poor old Bush would be eternally grateful for your evidence as he has none to support his claims.
Go ahead, help Bush out, he is sinking deeper and deeper into his optional quagmire as we speak.

Well, it's like your beloved dem candidate, Kucinich said at the debate last night,
"The people voted for change because they wanted the war to end and elected the democrats and they are still funding the war. It's their fault as much as it is George Bush's fault".

He hit it dead on the arse.
A true patriot would have advocated NO funding instead of putting political damage control ahead of what's really important, right? We can sure see that the elections are coming, can't we? Give me a break.
And also note that more than one of those candidates referred to the fact that they voted for the resolution, some without even reading the info.
Although Hillary's got alot of nuts, she couldn't fix her mouth to use the word, "cherrypicked" last night.
Break your smiley face out for that one, goob.

[hvactech13]

Yes, we are all still waiting for your evidence.

Poor old Bush would be eternally grateful for your evidence as he has none to support his claims.

Go ahead, help Bush out, he is sinking deeper and deeper into his optional quagmire as we speak.

Well we are still waiting for you to stop thinking the state-appointed shrink is your friend.

[scrogdog]

Gibbon's work is actually called "The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire". The unabridged version is 6 volumes - and is quite a read.

To condense the issues of Rome down in to 6 books was difficult enough. To state it simplistically is even more difficult. But to say that any one thing was a "leading" cause simplifies a very complex situation. Rome wrestled with many of the interesting questions that we do today... particularly on the moral front.

Now, to say that Christianity, for example, was a leading cause certainly begs a deeper look at the situation itself. The philosophies of Christianity itself were readily accepted by the lower class but far less so by the ruling elite. It was the split itself that was the problem, not the existence of Christianity per se. It all depends on how you look at things sometimes. Christianity was not formed to cause power struggles.... but that is essentially what happened.

However, one could say that the belief in a better future after death caused indifference to the present among the common peoples of Rome. Of course, this is a theory... which is why Gibbon's work is considered great. It is difficult to disseminate the actual cause due to the lack of written record on the subject.

Same deal with "liberal ideas" destroying the empire. Again, this is way to simplistic - the empire fell for complex reasons that take six books to properly explain. One sentence or idea is just not going to make it.

In my mind, you really need to look at one central over-arching flaw to start this discussion. And that flaw was an absolute monarchy pretending to be something else. If we want to be simplistic, we could say that since this *was* flawed government from the start and was never corrected... that the idea that the empire would fall was a given from the word go.

In practice, Rome became lazy and soft and ambivilant to the civic virtue they once held so dear. They outsourced military problems to the barbarians which allowed them to become so numerous and ingrained that a takeover was just about inevitable.

[geerair]

I would agree with most of what Scrogdog has written.

The reasons for the decline and fall were varied but I think we should be guided as to Gibbon's thinking with one of his quotes:

"In discussing Barbarism and Christianity, I have actually been discussing the Fall of Rome."

[whec720]

Yeah he is sure about that. He is among those that believe that the USA is the only nation in the world where one has personal freedoms, despite the fact that there are countries in the world where their constitutions provide even more freedoms than our US constritution grants.

Oh, yeah, I almost forgot, those countries also tend to have fairly liberal governments too...

I'm game......name one.:cool:

[ga-hvac-tech]

Yeah he is sure about that. He is among those that believe that the USA is the only nation in the world where one has personal freedoms, despite the fact that there are countries in the world where their constitutions provide even more freedoms than our US constritution grants.

Oh, yeah, I almost forgot, those countries also tend to have fairly liberal governments too...

Yes Ollie, that is true... And there are places like David Karresh's cult where folks have unlimited freedom, and they are liberal. Do you want to live there?

[James 3528]

I am for starting a fund to send Wanker back to climbing mountains back in the old country. For a rump ranger that sleeps under the blanket of freedom other Americans have provided, he sure likes to find fault with this one.

[chillbilly]

I am for starting a fund to send Wanker back to climbing mountains back in the old country. For a rump ranger that sleeps under the blanket of freedom other Americans have provided, he sure likes to find fault with this one.

LOL:eek: :eek: :eek:

[ga-hvac-tech]

I would agree with most of what Scrogdog has written.

The reasons for the decline and fall were varied but I think we should be guided as to Gibbon's thinking with one of his quotes:

"In discussing Barbarism and Christianity, I have actually been discussing the Fall of Rome."

I note here that Barbarism AND Christianity are mentioned in Geer's quote. Is Geer relating the two as the same? Does he understand the psychology of what he is saying? Does he read the psychometrics of it? I would be interested to hear Geer (only Geer) comment on the behavorial part herein... :rolleyes:

Now back to the author of the post: This is not surprising as a statement from Geer. We need to remember that Geer has publicly stated that he grew up in a Southern Baptist Church, but now is enlightened because he no longer believes that God exists. Geer has chosen to be a publicly professing Atheist (or should I call him an A$$theist?).

In keeping with both Geer's style of spinning everything to his own good (irregardless of the facts), his picking out a little and obscure detail and making it the foundation of the world (like a liberal does to divert attention away from what they cannot deal with), and adding to that the public profession of atheism... Is it any wonder that Geer is trying to blow the smoke cloud that the Roman empire died because of Christianity??? Not in my mind...

I have said this before, and will say it again: Once someone is a Christian, they are. They can reject it and rebel all they want to, but they are God's Child. And sooner or later, every one of them comes back... I bet Geer a beer back in the winter that he would come back before his body stops ticking... the bet stands.

Oh, BTW: My compliments to Scrog on the description of the writings to which I referred. It is indeed a complicated read, but well worth it if one has the determination to take it on. Thank you, fellow KA, for the clarity (and support)!

[geerair]

I note here that Barbarism AND Christianity are mentioned in Geer's quote. Is Geer relating the two as the same? Does he understand the psychology of what he is saying? Does he read the psychometrics of it? I would be interested to hear Geer (only Geer) comment on the behavorial part herein... :rolleyes:

Now back to the author of the post: This is not surprising as a statement from Geer. We need to remember that Geer has publicly stated that he grew up in a Southern Baptist Church, but now is enlightened because he no longer believes that God exists. Geer has chosen to be a publicly professing Atheist (or should I call him an A$$theist?).

In keeping with both Geer's style of spinning everything to his own good (irregardless of the facts), his picking out a little and obscure detail and making it the foundation of the world (like a liberal does to divert attention away from what they cannot deal with), and adding to that the public profession of atheism... Is it any wonder that Geer is trying to blow the smoke cloud that the Roman empire died because of Christianity??? Not in my mind...

I have said this before, and will say it again: Once someone is a Christian, they are. They can reject it and rebel all they want to, but they are God's Child. And sooner or later, every one of them comes back... I bet Geer a beer back in the winter that he would come back before his body stops ticking... the bet stands.

Oh, BTW: My compliments to Scrog on the description of the writings to which I referred. It is indeed a complicated read, but well worth it if one has the determination to take it on. Thank you, fellow KA, for the clarity (and support)!So, besides the sermon, you have nothing.

The quote is not mine it's Gibbon's.

[Collin]

I'm game......name one.:cool:

Shall I post a picture holding a Cuban cigar?


BTW, excellent work by those involved to thwart the attempt at JFK.

[ga-hvac-tech]

So, besides the sermon, you have nothing. The quote is not mine it's Gibbon's.

Ahhh, Geer, but do you UNDERSTAND THE QUOTE? Or are you onlky parroting like TinerkBell? Show us your fantastic wisdom by EXPLAINING the quote in detail... That is, IF you can... :confused:

As usual, Geer cannot address things when they are not in his favor... just like a kid with selective hearing... Funny thing is, I would bet a beer that he knows EXACTLY what he is typing, he is just trying to see how far he can push it...

In the military, he would get his butt kicked so far up his spine that he would 'learn' a little respect for others... You know, there was a good thing about the draft: It kicked the butts of spoiled children in grown bodies...

Geer, you have not addressed what I typed.

When you do, you will regain the respect of the other posters... until then, your behavior is nothing more than childish... And since behavior is a CHOICE, then we can all believe (truthfully) that you indeed chose to behave like an A$$. Now are you mature and wise enough to admit it? Like the ever growing membership of the KA group? Or will you continue to behave like a spoiled liberal??? Your choice buddy...

[James 3528]

Shall I post a picture holding a Cuban cigar?


BTW, excellent work by those involved to thwart the attempt at JFK.

What about a AR-15 while holding a Cuban?

[geerair]

Ahhh, Geer, but do you UNDERSTAND THE QUOTE? Or are you onlky parroting like TinerkBell? Show us your fantastic wisdom by EXPLAINING the quote in detail... That is, IF you can... :confused:Quite simple. Gibbon considers Barbarism and Christianity as the leading factors in the D & F of Rome.

I would have thought a self-described historian could have figured that out all by yourself.


But then, you are the historian who claimed the great Caesars were Egyptian.



Geer, you have not addressed what I typed. You typed a sermon, a long ad hominem, some cracked history and then claimed victory.

What else did you want me to respond to?



When you do, you will regain the respect of the other posters... until then, your behavior is nothing more than childish...I'm not the one who claimed the great Caesars were Egyptian.

You are the one who should be worried about respect.





And since behavior is a CHOICE, then we can all believe (truthfully) that you indeed chose to behave like an A$$. Now are you mature and wise enough to admit it? Like the ever growing membership of the KA group? Or will you continue to behave like a spoiled liberal??? Your choice buddy...http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/ecomcity.gif

[ga-hvac-tech]

Quite simple. Gibbon considers Barbarism and Christianity as the leading factors in the D & F of Rome.

This my friend is NOT an explanation, it is blowing smoke. Explain HOW being a Christian caused the downfall of the Roman Empire. If it took Gibbons 6 volumes to explain the Roman Empire, do you really think it is so simple as a sound-bite? I hate to be a name-caller, but this shows the depth of your thought process.


But then, you are the historian who claimed the great Caesars were Egyptian.

Pretty lame there buddy if that is all the smoke you can generate this go around... At least I am capable of admitting publicly when I err... you have not displayed that quality as of yet!!!!!!!!


You typed a sermon, a long ad hominem, some cracked history and then claimed victory. http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/ecomcity.gif

Yes, I explained your request in detail. But did you appreciate it enough to respond in a respectful way? NO. And I am supposed to respect and appreciate you based on your behavior??? Is there anyone else here that would??? (Please DO answer!!!)

And that silly icon that was placed there... Shows an arrogant attitude to me. It says to me that the poster is so self absorbed that they would laugh AT someone, rather than laugh WITH someone. The former is a sign of a narscisstic personality, the latter is a sign of maturity. So which one is the true attitude of the poster? Or should I look at the behavior and decide for myself?

I am sure you remember this one: "...pride goeth before a fall..." I will be waiting to see the hole in the ground below you when you slip... :D And the beer bet is still good BTW...

Oh, one more thing GEER: Are you a true HVAC professional? And if so, will you be attending the convention in August? I hear there will be a special event for the ARP crowd, and since you are one of the 'regulars', you should be there to represent your liberal side... care to join us???

[geerair]

This my friend is NOT an explanation, it is blowing smoke. Explain HOW being a Christian caused the downfall of the Roman Empire. If it took Gibbons 6 volumes to explain the Roman Empire, do you really think it is so simple as a sound-bite? I hate to be a name-caller, but this shows the depth of your thought process.
Gibbon has already explained that.

Did you not read the book?




Pretty lame there buddy if that is all the smoke you can generate this go around... At least I am capable of admitting publicly when I err... you have not displayed that quality as of yet!!!!!!!!Go find an error and we will discuss it.




Yes, I explained your request in detail. But did you appreciate it enough to respond in a respectful way? NO. And I am supposed to respect and appreciate you based on your behavior??? Is there anyone else here that would??? (Please DO answer!!!)Respectful? Don't make me laugh. Your posts are stuffed with ad hominems.






And that silly icon that was placed there... Shows an arrogant attitude to me. It says to me that the poster is so self absorbed that they would laugh AT someone, rather than laugh WITH someone. The former is a sign of a narscisstic personality, the latter is a sign of maturity. So which one is the true attitude of the poster? Or should I look at the behavior and decide for myself? Shows you are excessively fond of empty verbosity


I am sure you remember this one: "...pride goeth before a fall..." I will be waiting to see the hole in the ground below you when you slip... :D And the beer bet is still good BTW...Oh hell boy, I've fallen many times, got back up without the help of ghosts or gods.


Oh, one more thing GEER: Are you a true HVAC professional? And if so, will you be attending the convention in August? I hear there will be a special event for the ARP crowd, and since you are one of the 'regulars', you should be there to represent your liberal side... care to join us???Well, my mechanical contractors license says I am.

Hell, Dice will be there, he is a flaming liberal and can represent the good guys quite well.

[scrogdog]

Hell, Dice will be there, he is a flaming liberal and can represent the good guys quite well.

True... just watch out for the 9mm when it gets ugly. ;)

Nothin' scarier than a gun-totin' lib, I say.

[Collin]

What about a AR-15 while holding a Cuban?

Not sure.

How about a CZ 858-2 (http://www.wolverinesupplies.com/default.asp?Pg=8&do=3&mcid=1&scid=12&pid=43) while smoking a cuban and drinking Canadian Club on the rocks?

While watching soft core porn on late night TV.
(with my wife of course) ;)

[mark42202]

Go find an error and we will discuss it.



If I may chime in here, I just can't pass this gaping open door....

Flak jackets!
Calling me a "self described expert"
Saying I claim to be the Iraq Media

All the above, which you have failed to show any proof of. The closest you came was cutting and pasting quotes from Soldiers using slang in interviews so the uninformed wouldn't be clueless as to what they were talking about. I have requested probably close to a hundred times that you show proof of your other claims, of which you have failed miserably and dodged outright.

Thank you for opening this door for me, geer. Your mental capacity doesn't allow you to admit when you're wrong, nor that you are a true a$$. You couldn't possibly be material for the KA's, because you're already locked down with the DA's. Have a good one, loser!

[ga-hvac-tech]

Gibbon has already explained that.

No Geer, I asked you to prove that you UNDERSTAND the quote. It is not enough to parrot things, one must understand the 'why' behind them. If they do not, they are no more than a 'bird that has the mentality of a pre-school child' (statement by a customer that raises parrots for a hobby/living).


Well, my mechanical contractors license says I am.

I have a question for the posters at ARP: If indeed Geer has a licensed HVAC company, would you seriously consider buying a system from him? Yes or no.

[geerair]

If I may chime in here, I just can't pass this gaping open door....

Flak jackets!
Calling me a "self described expert"
Saying I claim to be the Iraq Media

All the above, which you have failed to show any proof of. The closest you came was cutting and pasting quotes from Soldiers using slang in interviews so the uninformed wouldn't be clueless as to what they were talking about. I have requested probably close to a hundred times that you show proof of your other claims, of which you have failed miserably and dodged outright.

Thank you for opening this door for me, geer. Your mental capacity doesn't allow you to admit when you're wrong, nor that you are a true a$$. You couldn't possibly be material for the KA's, because you're already locked down with the DA's. Have a good one, loser!Ahahahahahahahahahah.

FLAK JACKETS, sorry Mr. Iraq media, there have been nothing but more references to FLAK JACKETS by military people since you first kicked up a fuss about this.

Expert and Iraq media? Of course, from the very first you have played the I've been there card and insisted you have the truth.

You even dismissed another member's post as secondhand because he was getting info from people stationed there when by your own admission you haven't been in I*raq since 2003 and were getting your info the very same way.

Yes, FLAK JACKETS, self=described expert and Iraq media.

[geerair]

No Geer, I asked you to prove that you UNDERSTAND the quote. It is not enough to parrot things, one must understand the 'why' behind them. If they do not, they are no more than a 'bird that has the mentality of a pre-school child' (statement by a customer that raises parrots for a hobby/living). Hmmmmmm.........I answered what the quote meant, I'm sorry if you don't accept that but then the ball is in your court to prove otherwise.

Just for grins, your dissertation of Gibbon consisted of a three sentence assertion which gave no supporting evidence and reeked of nothing more than parroting something you had heard.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Hmmmmmm.........I answered what the quote meant, I'm sorry if you don't accept that but then the ball is in your court to prove otherwise.

Just for grins, your dissertation of Gibbon consisted of a three sentence assertion which gave no supporting evidence and reeked of nothing more than parroting something you had heard.

Dodging as usual...

Show us you have the ability to discuss in depth the details of WHY... If you cannot, then it seems clear to me that your presence here is nothing more than a smoke generator (most liberals are).

[geerair]

Dodging as usual...

Show us you have the ability to discuss in depth the details of WHY... If you cannot, then it seems clear to me that your presence here is nothing more than a smoke generator (most liberals are).You mean in detail like the three sentences you posted?

[acmanko]

wow, we had a terrorist plot, How come the color for the day never changed, its been orange for some time noe, should it not have been red. someone in Bush's beauracracy is not doing the job. thousands , no millions, depend of the color changing. we are doomed.

[chefid]

liberals eat poop get er done we need to uncover more bogus plots so we can reinstate the draft saddam must have visited these new terrorists in a dream and told them to bomb an airport get real monkeys

[desto1]

our government are the terrorists,when are you reefer sniffers going to wake up?

[ga-hvac-tech]

You mean in detail like the three sentences you posted?

Geer, I asked you to explain in detail so it would be clear that you UNDERSTAND why. Is this too difficult to do?

Anyone: Did I make an unfair request? Did I ask something that is not doable? Would any of you like for Geer to explain in detail the question I asked on him?

If nobody cares, I will drop the request. But if other folks would like to hear Geer explain in detail, how about asking him to do so.

[oloenneker]

our government are the terrorists,when are you reefer sniffers going to wake up?

LOL!!


Reefer sniffers....

[mark42202]

Ahahahahahahahahahah.

FLAK JACKETS, sorry Mr. Iraq media, there have been nothing but more references to FLAK JACKETS by military people since you first kicked up a fuss about this.

Ok, more quotes of Soldiers using it as a slang term. You're still wrong. Thinking otherwise just proves you're a buffoon.


Expert and Iraq media? Of course, from the very first you have played the I've been there card and insisted you have the truth.

Yes, I said I've been there and had much more knowledge on the subject than you. You still haven't provided ANY proof of where I claimed to be an expert or the Iraq media. Nice try on a dodge, but again, as usual, you fail.


You even dismissed another member's post as secondhand because he was getting info from people stationed there when by your own admission you haven't been in I*raq since 2003 and were getting your info the very same way.

Can you show me where I dismissed this? Or did I simply state that I was also in contact with several Soldiers who were saying otherwise? Get your facts straight and maybe you won't be such an easy target, genius.


Yes, FLAK JACKETS, self=described expert and Iraq media.

Yes, S-L-A-N-G, my mentally deficient little friend. Slang does not mean fact. Someone with your "supposed" intellect should know the difference, but apparently that's too much to expect. Terminology used so the average person can understand what is being discussed does not prove you were even close to being correct. You hang desperately to this as though it is your great triumph, when in reality, you're still trying to get that danged square peg in the round hole. I'm beginning to think that along with Google, you have an online thesaurus bookmarked so you can use big words and sound intelligent on the internet, when in reality, your IQ is proving quite low. Keep trying though. You flailing about like a spastic retard trying desperately to make an intelligent post is quite amusing.:D

[hvactech13]

Can you show me where I dismissed this? Or did I simply state that I was also in contact with several Soldiers who were saying otherwise? Get your facts straight and maybe you won't be such an easy target, genius.

Yes, S-L-A-N-G, my mentally deficient little friend. Slang does not mean fact. Someone with your "supposed" intellect should know the difference, but apparently that's too much to expect. Terminology used so the average person can understand what is being discussed does not prove you were even close to being correct. You hang desperately to this as though it is your great triumph, when in reality, you're still trying to get that danged square peg in the round hole. I'm beginning to think that along with Google, you have an online thesaurus bookmarked so you can use big words and sound intelligent on the internet, when in reality, your IQ is proving quite low. Keep trying though. You flailing about like a spastic retard trying desperately to make an intelligent post is quite amusing.:D

I'd like to see this dismissal as well. As far as the square peg into the round hole it might work if he uses a bigger hammer. Maybe his head?

[geerair]

Geer, I asked you to explain in detail so it would be clear that you UNDERSTAND why. Is this too difficult to do?

Anyone: Did I make an unfair request? Did I ask something that is not doable? Would any of you like for Geer to explain in detail the question I asked on him? Let's review.

You posted a voluminous three sentence assertion that had no supporting evidence or quotes or excerpts.

I answered your question with a quote from Gibbon which is easily understandable and needs no interpretation but I still explained the quote.


The ball is in your court and you use it to demand a detailed dissertation on what this clearly understanable quote meant when you yourself post three sentences and claim that wraps the whole thing up.


Son, you demand from others what you yourself are not willing to do.








If nobody cares, I will drop the request. But if other folks would like to hear Geer explain in detail, how about asking him to do so.Now you are so desperate you are begging others to come your rescue.

Son, fight your own battles.

[geerair]

Ok, more quotes of Soldiers using it as a slang term. You're still wrong. Thinking otherwise just proves you're a buffoon. Yes, they are using the term. I think we all knew that but thanks anyway. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:



Can you show me where I dismissed this? Or did I simply state that I was also in contact with several Soldiers who were saying otherwise? Get your facts straight and maybe you won't be such an easy target, genius.Originally posted by mark42202

First off you don't have the means to get first hand info, only "Hearsay". You can only know what someone tells you about it because you won't see it for yourself.




Yes, S-L-A-N-G, my mentally deficient little friend. Slang does not mean fact. Someone with your "supposed" intellect should know the difference, but apparently that's too much to expect. Terminology used so the average person can understand what is being discussed does not prove you were even close to being correct. You hang desperately to this as though it is your great triumph, when in reality, you're still trying to get that danged square peg in the round hole. I'm beginning to think that along with Google, you have an online thesaurus bookmarked so you can use big words and sound intelligent on the internet, when in reality, your IQ is proving quite low. Keep trying though. You flailing about like a spastic retard trying desperately to make an intelligent post is quite amusing.:Dhttp://www.abestweb.com/smilies/ecomcity.gif

[ga-hvac-tech]

Let's review.

You posted a voluminous three sentence assertion that had no supporting evidence or quotes or excerpts.

I answered your question with a quote from Gibbon which is easily understandable and needs no interpretation but I still explained the quote.

The ball is in your court and you use it to demand a detailed dissertation on what this clearly understanable quote meant when you yourself post three sentences and claim that wraps the whole thing up.

Son, you demand from others what you yourself are not willing to do.

Now you are so desperate you are begging others to come your rescue.

Son, fight your own battles.

No Sir Geer....

You are trying desperately to dodge taking responsibility to say something that someone could hold you accountable to... You must have taken lessons from Bill Clinton. I think we need to change your name to slick gearhead, as you try your best to avoid anything sticking to you.

I will ask you one more time: Do you have th ability to explain something in detail so to prove that you UNDERSTAND THE WHY of what you say. And to review: The item I am requesting you to explain is why Christians caused the fall of the Roman Empire. Now either explain it in detail so us folks you claim are so simplistic can CLEARLY UNDERSTAND the why's of this statement, or it is evident that you are, yet again, just blowing smoke.

And while you are at it Mr licensed HVAC person, you never did answer two other questions:

1) Explain to me what psychometrics is in behavorial terms, and
2) Are you or are you not coming to the HVAC convention in August in NC??? You are the front and center liberal at ARP, are you too chicken to show your face around 14 conservatives? Or are you just a bog of hot air?
Show us some mettle, or just go away like a good little liberal does when cornered...

And I am not your son either... In fact, if you show your face in August, I have a bet of a beer that I am older than you are... care to take the bet... in other words, put your money where your mouth is, or shut-up.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Yes, they are using the term. I think we all knew that but thanks anyway. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:


Originally posted by mark42202

First off you don't have the means to get first hand info, only "Hearsay". You can only know what someone tells you about it because you won't see it for yourself.



http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/ecomcity.gif

One arrogant S*B isn't he Mark... If I were him, I would be afraid to show my face in August, probably get it pounded for choices in behavior.

[geerair]

No Sir Geer....

You are trying desperately to dodge taking responsibility to say something that someone could hold you accountable to... You must have taken lessons from Bill Clinton. I think we need to change your name to slick gearhead, as you try your best to avoid anything sticking to you. Ummmmmm.......no sir ga.

You brought the whole D & F up in the first place with an enormously non-detailed assertion which was maybe half the story. Shame on you.

Then you demand a detailed report from me.

Son, I'm just following your example.

At least I provided a quote from Gibbon.

You didn't even bother to do that much.

Hell boy, scrogdog even shot down your cherry-picked view.












I will ask you one more time: Do you have th ability to explain something in detail so to prove that you UNDERSTAND THE WHY of what you say. And to review: The item I am requesting you to explain is why Christians caused the fall of the Roman Empire. Now either explain it in detail so us folks you claim are so simplistic can CLEARLY UNDERSTAND the why's of this statement, or it is evident that you are, yet again, just blowing smoke.Look at your own post and see who is puffing the smoke. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:





And while you are at it Mr licensed HVAC person, you never did answer two other questions:

1) Explain to me what psychometrics is in behavorial terms. Do you not take yes for an answer? I said I had no clue.

Now, tell us in detail what it is and none of your usual hiding behind your momma's skirt.



Are you or are you not coming to the HVAC convention in August in NC??? You are the front and center liberal at ARP, are you too chicken to show your face around 14 conservatives? Or are you just a bog of hot air?
Show us some mettle, or just go away like a good little liberal does when cornered... Do you not take no for an answer?


And I am not your son either... In fact, if you show your face in August, I have a bet of a beer that I am older than you are... care to take the bet... in other words, put your money where your mouth is, or shut-up.What year were you born? I was born in 1952.

[hvactech13]

Originally posted by mark42202

First off you don't have the means to get first hand info, only "Hearsay". You can only know what someone tells you about it because you won't see it for yourself.

What thread is that out of geer? We want the thread. That little snippet shows nothing.

Originally posted by geerair

I think I know things that I might not. Find an error I have made and we will discuss it if I think it is an error. :D :D

See?:eek:

[ga-hvac-tech]

Ummmmmm.......no sir ga.

You brought the whole D & F up in the first place with an enormously non-detailed assertion which was maybe half the story. Shame on you.

Then you demand a detailed report from me.

Son, I'm just following your example.

At least I provided a quote from Gibbon.

You didn't even bother to do that much.

Hell boy, scrogdog even shot down your cherry-picked view.

Look at your own post and see who is puffing the smoke. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Do you not take yes for an answer? I said I had no clue.

Now, tell us in detail what it is and none of your usual hiding behind your momma's skirt.

Do you not take no for an answer?

What year were you born? I was born in 1952.

Geer, there is no way you are going to dodge the request to explain how Christianity caused the fall of the Roman Empire. That is the question I want to hear you explain so it proves you understand the why's.

And as far as the bet on age, it depends on you showing your face in August in NC. And if you win, you will get a free (domestic) beer. If you do not show your face, then, well, there is no proof...

And I will no longer accept any of your dodges... Either explain your point in YOUR words so we all will understand, or as far as I am concerned you do not have th ability to do so. So far, you have tried many ways to avoid the explanation I requested. For that reason, I will be leaving this thread because the opposing gentleman does not have the ability to substantiate his views.

And as far as Scorg shooting down my vies, I think you read him wrong.

As I mentioned in the other thread: I have tired of you never ending dodging of making clear and distinct statements of what you believe. I will resign from this thread, as there is nothing of interest in debating someone that cannot respond to questions and explain their point.

And as I mentioned in the other thread: leaving a thread does not constitute loss. I simply says that one has other interests.

I am going to deprive you of the one thing you crave the most: Attention. bye bye gearhead.

[geerair]

What thread is that out of geer? We want the thread. That little snippet shows nothing.

Originally posted by geerair

I think I know things that I might not. Find an error I have made and we will discuss it if I think it is an error. :D :D

See?:eek:Look it up. I did.

I'm not your lackey.

[hvactech13]

Look it up. I did.

I'm not your lackey.

Make a claim and back it with a link, or don't make your claim. Pretty simple way to possibly boost your credibility. But if you want others to continue to think you are nothing but a mouthpiece with no credible substance, so be it.

[geerair]

Geer, there is no way you are going to dodge teh request to explain how Christianity caused the fall of the Roman Empire. That is the question I want to hear you explain so it proves you understand the why's. Ditto Dodgeball.


And as far as the bet on age, it depends on you showing your face in August in NC. And if you win, you will get a free (domestic) beer. If you do not show your face, then, well, there is no proof... Typical.

You backtrack when confronted.

I posted the year I was born, in fact I'll post the complete thing 09/08/52.

I also share this exact DOB with Dice and we share Sept.8 with james 3528.

So, man up and post your birthdate.


And I will no longer accept any of your dodges... Either explain your point in YOUR words so we all will understand, or as far as I am concerned you do not have th ability to do so. Already done.

That you didn't accept it is your problem not mine.

Besides, it was your subject, show us you know anything at all about it besides what you read at some children's Vacation Bible School site.

Given your penchant for your sloppy command of factual data, I'm not expecting much from you.



And as far as Scorg shooting down my vies, I think you read him wrong.You think wrong.


As I mentioned in the other thread: I have tired of you never ending dodging of making clear and distinct statements of what you believe. I will resign from this thread, as there is nothing of interest in debating someone that cannot respond to questions and explain their point. So let it be written, so let it be done.



And as I mentioned in the other thread: leaving a thread does not constitute loss. I simply says that one has other interests.It says that you are clinically insecure.


I am going to deprive you of the one thing you crave the most: Attention. bye bye slick gearhead.Before you go post your birthdate.

[mark42202]

Make a claim and back it with a link, or don't make your claim. Pretty simple way to possibly boost your credibility. But if you want others to continue to think you are nothing but a mouthpiece with no credible substance, so be it.

He won't post a link because once again, he is cherry picking and to post the link would provide you with the knowledge that he is again in error.

His quote:

Originally Posted by geerair View Post
You even dismissed another member's post as secondhand because he was getting info from people stationed there when by your own admission you haven't been in I*raq since 2003 and were getting your info the very same way.

The link? http://www.hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread.php?p=1468211#post1468211

Post #22. I was talking to Smokin68. He said he would ask his cousin about how the war was going. He NEVER made a post about having info that I dismissed as secondhand. I simply pointed out that HE didn't have the means to get "first hand info" because he was unwilling to go see for himself (i.e., FIRST HAND). I didn't dismiss any part of ANY of his posts as second hand because he never made a post about anything his cousin who is serving in Iraq told him. You can read the thread and the posts leading up to it and see what I'm talking about. Like his tactics of the past, he only takes snippets from the conversation and twists them so they will back his argument. Here's my WHOLE quote for those who don't want to waste their time clicking the link:


First off, you don't have the MEANS to get first hand info, only hearsay. You can only learn what someone tells you about it because you won't see it for yourself.

Secondly, if you knew anything about me at all, you would know I'm not a Bush lover, just a strong supporter of the war. I believe it was justified and I was on the ground there. That's what I base my beliefs on... NOT propaganda. So get a clue before you start trying to pretend you know what I'm about.

You're truly ignorant enough that you pose a threat to your own safety geer. I hope you and tinky share the bicycle helmet when you go to Wal Mart.

[geerair]

He won't post a link because once again, he is cherry picking and to post the link would provide you with the knowledge that he is again in error.

His quote:

Originally Posted by geerair View Post
You even dismissed another member's post as secondhand because he was getting info from people stationed there when by your own admission you haven't been in I*raq since 2003 and were getting your info the very same way.

The link? http://www.hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread.php?p=1468211#post1468211

Post #22. I was talking to Smokin68. He said he would ask his cousin about how the war was going. He NEVER made a post about having info that I dismissed as secondhand. I simply pointed out that HE didn't have the means to get "first hand info" because he was unwilling to go see for himself (i.e., FIRST HAND). I didn't dismiss any part of ANY of his posts as second hand because he never made a post about anything his cousin who is serving in Iraq told him. You can read the thread and the posts leading up to it and see what I'm talking about. Like his tactics of the past, he only takes snippets from the conversation and twists them so they will back his argument. Here's my WHOLE quote for those who don't want to waste their time clicking the link:Ah, so you would have dismissed it as secondhand if he had reported back if it didn't conform with your views on Iraq.

So, anything that you post about Iraq after 2003 is secondhand as well.

[Carnak]

the former member of the guyanese government was a black, chemical engineer. Was reading that he had travelled to Venezuala to try and get a visa to enter Iran.

[bootlen]

Geer's nothing more than a troll. And not a very good one at that.

[mark42202]

Ah, so you would have dismissed it as secondhand if he had reported back if it didn't conform with your views on Iraq.

So, anything that you post about Iraq after 2003 is secondhand as well.

Where did I say that, genius? Never did I say I would dismiss anything he posted. I made a point about probability, to which he never responded with any kind of report back from his cousin. You're making a baseless ASSumption. Taking my post and ATTEMPTING to spin it, which unlike your head, is pointless.

Anything stated by anyone NOT there is of course second hand, whether it "conforms" or not. You're stuck on stupid, my little twit of an opponent.

To further the argument one more step, at least what I post about Iraq has some kind of credibility. You, as proven time and again, have none. The funniest thing is that your level of ignorance has you actually believing you're right about things, when you are soundly whipped every time you think you have a valid point. Is denial painful? I hope so...:D

[scrogdog]

And as far as Scorg shooting down my vies, I think you read him wrong.

You think wrong.

Just as clarification, I was actually stating that, IMHO, both views were a little simplistic in terms of actually explaining the cause of the downfall.

To say that Christianity was a leading cause might lead one to believe that all was hunky-dory... until one day Christianity came on the scene and its philosphies just ruined everything.

That would not quite be true. There were causal factors in play here - so what would need to be understoood would be the conditions which *allowed* what happened to happen. It is quite a complex scenario.

Same thing on the other side. To say that "liberal policies" ruined everything makes exactly the same mistake. What the exact liberal policies were and *why* they occured is FAR more important to undertand.

It is like the study of any other history... it is a never-ending regression. Once we find the cause of a thing then we want to know the cause of the cause... if you take my meaning.

The collapse of the empire is a very long and compex story which takes some academic patience and study to properly get a handle on.

To give an analogy, it would be like me saying that barbarians caused the fall. Well they did. :) But how... and why? These are the more important questions if true undertanding is to be acheived.

Again, imo.

[chillbilly]

Yes, S-L-A-N-G, my mentally deficient little friend. Slang does not mean fact. Someone with your "supposed" intellect should know the difference, but apparently that's too much to expect. Terminology used so the average person can understand what is being discussed does not prove you were even close to being correct. You hang desperately to this as though it is your great triumph, when in reality, you're still trying to get that danged square peg in the round hole. I'm beginning to think that along with Google, you have an online thesaurus bookmarked so you can use big words and sound intelligent on the internet, when in reality, your IQ is proving quite low. Keep trying though. You flailing about like a spastic retard trying desperately to make an intelligent post is quite amusing.:D

LOL The flak jacket retard again! :D :rolleyes:
Geer knows the difference between slang and fact, mark.
He's just too stupid to realize that there are others who know the difference too.

[chillbilly]

Where did I say that, genius? Never did I say I would dismiss anything he posted. I made a point about probability, to which he never responded with any kind of report back from his cousin. You're making a baseless ASSumption. Taking my post and ATTEMPTING to spin it, which unlike your head, is pointless.

Anything stated by anyone NOT there is of course second hand, whether it "conforms" or not. You're stuck on stupid, my little twit of an opponent.

To further the argument one more step, at least what I post about Iraq has some kind of credibility. You, as proven time and again, have none. The funniest thing is that your level of ignorance has you actually believing you're right about things, when you are soundly whipped every time you think you have a valid point. Is denial painful? I hope so...:D


Ouch. I smell smoked greer ass again.
:o

[geerair]

Just as clarification, I was actually stating that, IMHO, both views were a little simplistic in terms of actually explaining the cause of the downfall.

To say that Christianity was a leading cause might lead one to believe that all was hunky-dory... until one day Christianity came on the scene and its philosphies just ruined everything.

That would not quite be true. There were causal factors in play here - so what would need to be understoood would be the conditions which *allowed* what happened to happen. It is quite a complex scenario.

Same thing on the other side. To say that "liberal policies" ruined everything makes exactly the same mistake. What the exact liberal policies were and *why* they occured is FAR more important to undertand.

It is like the study of any other history... it is a never-ending regression. Once we find the cause of a thing then we want to know the cause of the cause... if you take my meaning.

The collapse of the empire is a very long and compex story which takes some academic patience and study to properly get a handle on.

To give an analogy, it would be like me saying that barbarians caused the fall. Well they did. :) But how... and why? These are the more important questions if true undertanding is to be acheived.

Again, imo.Oh hell, let's quit being politically correct.

The D & F of the Roman Empire was caused either by barbaric Christians or Christian Barbarians. ;) ;) ;)

[geerair]

Where did I say that, genius? Never did I say I would dismiss anything he posted. I made a point about probability, to which he never responded with any kind of report back from his cousin. You're making a baseless ASSumption. Taking my post and ATTEMPTING to spin it, which unlike your head, is pointless.

Anything stated by anyone NOT there is of course second hand, whether it "conforms" or not. You're stuck on stupid, my little twit of an opponent.

To further the argument one more step, at least what I post about Iraq has some kind of credibility. You, as proven time and again, have none. The funniest thing is that your level of ignorance has you actually believing you're right about things, when you are soundly whipped every time you think you have a valid point. Is denial painful? I hope so...:DWhat credibility? The info you get is secondhand just like everybody elses who is not there now.

[scrogdog]

The D & C of the Roman Empire was caused either by barbaric Christians or christian Barbarians.

lmao!

[mark42202]

What credibility? The info you get is secondhand just like everybody elses who is not there now.

I was clarifying the fact that I at least have some, whereas you have none. Pay attention and try to keep up. What an idiot. You can't even comprehend a simple post. I compared my credibility to your lack thereof. I think I hear your caretaker calling to give you your daily applesauce, Corky. LMAO, this is fun. I've had more intelligent arguments with my 11 year old daughter, and she's actually able to keep up. I think I should let her get on here and argue with you so she can feel what it's like to thoroughly smash a purported "adult's" supposed intellect.

You never answered a question I asked awhile back:

Did your parents have any children that lived?

[geerair]

I was clarifying the fact that I at least have some, whereas you have none. Pay attention and try to keep up. What an idiot. You can't even comprehend a simple post. I compared my credibility to your lack thereof. I think I hear your caretaker calling to give you your daily applesauce, Corky. LMAO, this is fun. I've had more intelligent arguments with my 11 year old daughter, and she's actually able to keep up. I think I should let her get on here and argue with you so she can feel what it's like to thoroughly smash a purported "adult's" supposed intellect.

You never answered a question I asked awhile back:

Did your parents have any children that lived?My daddy says you lived.

BTW-If you come across some black shoes under your parents bed, he would like them back.

http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/rotflol.gif

[ga-hvac-tech]

Just as clarification, I was actually stating that, IMHO, both views were a little simplistic in terms of actually explaining the cause of the downfall.

To say that Christianity was a leading cause might lead one to believe that all was hunky-dory... until one day Christianity came on the scene and its philosphies just ruined everything.

That would not quite be true. There were causal factors in play here - so what would need to be understoood would be the conditions which *allowed* what happened to happen. It is quite a complex scenario.

Same thing on the other side. To say that "liberal policies" ruined everything makes exactly the same mistake. What the exact liberal policies were and *why* they occured is FAR more important to undertand.

It is like the study of any other history... it is a never-ending regression. Once we find the cause of a thing then we want to know the cause of the cause... if you take my meaning.

The collapse of the empire is a very long and compex story which takes some academic patience and study to properly get a handle on.

To give an analogy, it would be like me saying that barbarians caused the fall. Well they did. :) But how... and why? These are the more important questions if true undertanding is to be acheived.

Again, imo.

Thank you Scrog!!!!

This was my point all along, that one needs to understand the why's behind a statement such as 'this' or 'that' caused something.

And repeatedly I asked Geer to explain the why's, but he just would not.

That was the reason I left the thread; I was tired of Geer refusing to explain so we all would know if he understood or not. Since he refused to explain, my conclusion is that he does not know, nor understand. Just another liberal that thinks all there is to life is blowing smoke.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Oh hell, let's quit being politically correct.

The D & F of the Roman Empire was caused either by barbaric Christians or christian Barbarians. ;) ;) ;)

Amazing IMO... Now that there is no mileage to get out of the arguement, Geer is ready to give up...

Proves that Geer is in it not for the knowledge, growth, or wisdom, but ONLY to promote himself. Typical liberal, they are like a child that thinks the whole world is their playpen...

But if he pees on the sandbox, he will have to take responsibility for it and clean it up...

[geerair]

Thank you Scrog!!!!
This was my point all along, that one needs to understand the why's behind a statement such as 'this' or 'that' caused something.Physician heal thyself.

Your three sentence ejaculation was a masterwork of brevity and vacuity.

[geerair]

Amazing IMO... Now that there is no mileage to get out of the arguement, Geer is ready to give up...

Proves that Geer is in it not for the knowledge, growth, or wisdom, but ONLY to promote himself. Typical liberal, they are like a child that thinks the whole world is their playpen...

But if he pees on the sandbox, he will have to take responsibility for it and clean it up...http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/ecomcity.gif

[ga-hvac-tech]

http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/ecomcity.gif

And all Geer can come up with is a snippy (and immature) icon...

When Geer went to the Trane classes in Tyler, he was so impressed he let them 'tranewash' him... now he does not have a brain anymore... :D

[chillbilly]

lmao!

What are you laughing at? You believe that kind of crap?
Or are you just laughing because any poke at religion is funny to you?

I'll apologize in advance for missing the humor.
I view that kind of babble as on par with the spam that tin upchucks here.....nonsensical and jaded.
Hell, if that's what gets you guys off, there are some good Yahoo chat sites you might be interested in to help you get your 'ridicule' fix.:rolleyes:

[ga-hvac-tech]

What are you laughing at? You believe that kind of crap?
Or are you just laughing because any poke at religion is funny to you?

I'll apologize in advance for missing the humor.
I view that kind of babble as on par with the spam that tin upchucks here.....nonsensical and jaded.
Hell, if that's what gets you guys off, there are some good Yahoo chat sites you might be interested in to help you get your 'ridicule' fix.:rolleyes:

I think he is laughing at the same thing I am laughing at:

Geer trying to re-write history to say the fall of the Roman Empire was ALL the fault of Christianity.

That is absolutely ridiculous. In fact, it is beyond funny, it is a sign of a sick mind. I think Geer needs to get some of Tinker's medication before he hurts himself.

Only an atheist with an ax to grind against God (and Geer is a Christian in rebellion, that is documented on this forum) could be that thick headed as to believe in their arrogance that they could pull that one off... Only in his dreams is Geer a worthwhile opponent... :p:D

[scrogdog]

Oh for cry-eye Chilly, I just defended Christianity in the post they both just quoted!

Lighten up, dude.

Geer made a comment in reply to my post that was *obviously* made only to draw... ah... comment. You'll note his use of winky smilies. He wasn't serious.

I found it funny. If that offended you I apologize, but geez Chill... don't get in a snit. ;)

[chillbilly]

Whatever gets you through the night. :rolleyes:

[mark42202]

My daddy says you lived.

BTW-If you come across some black shoes under your parents bed, he would like them back.

http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/rotflol.gif

LMAO! What are you? 12? Thank you for once again expressing your true IQ. But at least you didn't claim YOU were one of the children that lived. The fact that you put that little smiley at the end shows that you actually have a low enough mentality to think you're witty. That, my ignorant little friend, is worthy of your smiley.

At least I don't have to try and make an argument about your lack of any intelligence what so ever anymore (as if it was needed to begin with). You've once again proven to everyone here that you are a complete and utter moron. Mechanical contractor? I'm glad you don't work around here, but if you did, I'd be rich fixing all your moronic mistakes. Look me up when you grow an IQ and can have an intelligent conversation. Hell, look me up when you can make an intelligent post! Later loser.

[scrogdog]

All right, Chilly. Listen, I'm not sure why you are so offended.

The barbarian hordes were obviously NOT Christians. :) Even if they were... they were not very good ones.

Were Christian Romans barbarians? Of course not. In some ways, the adoption of Christianity in the empire was in some part (some think a very large part, in fact, as I do) in response to the government sponsored "barbarian games".

Perhaps not everyone knows that so perhaps Geer's humor is lost on some. What Geer said is clearly ridiculous. What is funny is that he knows it, and said it only to provoke response.

And you provided it. ;)

[geerair]

LMAO! What are you? 12? Thank you for once again expressing your true IQ. But at least you didn't claim YOU were one of the children that lived. The fact that you put that little smiley at the end shows that you actually have a low enough mentality to think you're witty. That, my ignorant little friend, is worthy of your smiley.

At least I don't have to try and make an argument about your lack of any intelligence what so ever anymore (as if it was needed to begin with). You've once again proven to everyone here that you are a complete and utter moron. Mechanical contractor? I'm glad you don't work around here, but if you did, I'd be rich fixing all your moronic mistakes. Look me up when you grow an IQ and can have an intelligent conversation. Hell, look me up when you can make an intelligent post! Later loser.http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/yellowsleep.gif

[geerair]

Perhaps not everyone knows that so perhaps Geer's humor is lost on some. What Geer said is clearly ridiculous. What is funny is that he knows it, and said it only to provoke response.
Some folks just ain't got no god bless it sense of humor. :D :D

[mark42202]

http://www.abestweb.com/smilies/yellowsleep.gif

Exactly