water leak boiler

[sgull]

Mother-in-law has obsolete model 68-V Weil-McLain hot water boiler installed in her home. Water drops are leaking out of the bottom of the round "heater cover", (part 11 as shown in diagram at following site):
http://www.weil-mclain.com/downloads/obsolete/68/68manual.pdf

I suspect a leak in the tubes, or perhaps worse. Any better guesses than mine as to what may be leaking, and advice on proceeding to investigate further to make possible repair would be appreciated.

[Moose]

Replace is probably best solution. Efficiency is paramount these days, due to fuel costs.

[sgull]

That would be fine and dandy to just run out and buy a nice brand new fuel-efficient boiler, but unfortunately the cost for me to do so right now is the prohibitive factor. Any suggestion(s) on how I might proceed to further investigate the actual cause of the leak as I described as well as what might be involved in getting it repaired is my inquiry here. thanks

[hall of flame]

Your Rainbow gasket is rottend out. Send me your address and I'll mail you a new one

[sgull]

Hall of Flame, thanks for offering to send me what I need! But what is your email address or (other contact info outside this forum thread) please?


Your Rainbow gasket is rottend out. Send me your address and I'll mail you a new one

[oil lp man]

I don't know what you mean by part 11.
It sounds like the gasket on the "coil plate" or "blank plate" is rotted.
If you have a tankless coil, its a lot of work(3 hours) for an experienced tech and I would probably replace the tempering valve if it is old.
If it is a plate only, it may be only an hour or 2. With boiler drained I usually replace leaking hyvents and inspect expansion tank, also inspect circulator gaskets. If a tankless coil that is old and not working very well you should replace the whole coil now.
If you have and need antifreeze in the system then add more time and money.
If the boiler is in real tough shape, rather than throwing a ton of money at it over the next couple of years, I would consider replacing the whole boiler.

[oil lp man]

I don't know what you mean by part 11.
It sounds like the gasket on the "coil plate" or "blank plate" is rotted.
If you have a tankless coil, its a lot of work(3 hours) for an experienced tech and I would probably replace the tempering valve if it is old.
If it is a plate only, it may be only an hour or 2. With boiler drained I usually replace leaking hyvents and inspect expansion tank, also inspect circulator gaskets. If a tankless coil that is old and not working very well you should replace the whole coil now.
If you have and need antifreeze in the system then add more time and money.
If the boiler is in real tough shape, rather than throwing a ton of money at it over the next couple of years, I would consider replacing the whole boiler.

[oil lp man]

I scrolled the manual and part #11 is the plate or coil plate. The coil is the expensive one, it comes with a gasket.
If its just a plate, you're going to need the gasket too, Part #12

[beenthere]

You said its your mother in laws boiler.

Have her contact her local CAP.

They nay pay for a new boiler for her. Then she'll have smaller heating bills in the winter.

Repairng that leak, can become more involved, and difficult then what you might think.

[sgull]

Oil lp man,
I don't see the actual "coil" shown in the manual, do you? I wonder why it doesn't seem to be shown.
One guy said the "rainbow gasket" is probably rotted out. Is that the gasket shown as part #12? Why would he call it a rainbow gasket, it doesn't look like a rainbow shape to me... thanks.


I scrolled the manual and part #11 is the plate or coil plate. The coil is the expensive one, it comes with a gasket.
If its just a plate, you're going to need the gasket too, Part #12

[oil lp man]

Oil lp man,
I don't see the actual "coil" shown in the manual, do you? I wonder why it doesn't seem to be shown.
One guy said the "rainbow gasket" is probably rotted out. Is that the gasket shown as part #12? Why would he call it a rainbow gasket, it doesn't look like a rainbow shape to me... thanks.

Theres no rainbow gasket. He was pulling your leg.
The coil is copper finned tubes about a foot or more long that is welded to the plate.
If you have copper pipes coming out of the plate that go to your hot water fixtures then you have a coil behind the plate. If not then don't worry about it, its just a blank plate that may have a tapping for the aquastat.

[oil lp man]

This isn't a do it yourself project by any means. Your going to need someone with experience to do the work. Sometimes the bolts are rotted out too and are very difficult to remove once they snap.
We make the homeowner sign a disclaimer in case the boiler can't be saved once the bolts are snapped, if they can't be extracted.

[sgull]

Thanks everyone for your input/replies to my inquiry with this issue. I think the best route with this old and generally neglected boiler then is to bite the bullet and find a way to afford getting a new one, as it seems to be in pretty tough shape all around anyway. Either that I or could just replace the rainbow gasket...:mad:

[hall of flame]

Red rubber gasket material was originally called rainbow gasket material. And yes more often than not the bolts will break off when you attempt to extract them. They are not a hardend bolt, not even a grade 5 so drilling them out is not all that difficult but a project like this is not for the average joe. If you haven't gotten into drilling and tapping threads or have access to all the tools, I would suggest finding someone that has done it before. I have done way too many so I don't give it a thought.

[rohalon]

Often the efficiency upgrade reduces the monthly operateing cost enough that it covers the payment on a loan needed to buy the equipment.

[jrbenny]

Thanks everyone for your input/replies to my inquiry with this issue. I think the best route with this old and generally neglected boiler then is to bite the bullet and find a way to afford getting a new one, as it seems to be in pretty tough shape all around anyway. Either that I or could just replace the rainbow gasket...:mad:
You could let her live with you when it gets cold next winter. :)

(I'd be buying a new boiler long before that ever happened. ;))

[Noel Murdough]

Since nobody has commented on the actual efficiency of the current boiler (which is in the 80's) compared to any specefic NEW oil boiler (most have efficiencies in the 80's), changing THIS oil boiler out might be a DROP in efficiency.

Changing an oil boiler just for the sake of changing it won't always make the operating cost go down. If the operating cost goes up from using an inexpensive boiler, the payback could be a long time.....

Another point to make; there is a certain amount of homework to be done by the customer before an acceptable installation is completed. Some customers do this work before the contract is signed, and quite a few try their luck and wait till the boiler is installed and paid for. When the fuel bill goes up, the homework begins.....

At some point, though, the customer will find out just what kind of installation he paid for, one that is sized and installed correctly for his system, or some other thing altogether.

Noel

[oil lp man]

Red rubber gasket material was originally called rainbow gasket material. And yes more often than not the bolts will break off when you attempt to extract them. They are not a hardend bolt, not even a grade 5 so drilling them out is not all that difficult but a project like this is not for the average joe. If you haven't gotten into drilling and tapping threads or have access to all the tools, I would suggest finding someone that has done it before. I have done way too many so I don't give it a thought.

Sorry about the confusion.:o
I've always called that stuff red gasket material. It is junk and I can see why you would want to get rid of it though.
I've seen that stuff start to crack after a few years.
I've never had any trouble drilling out the bolts either. Its just more work and you've got to have good drill bits.
I have seen the face (machined part) of the boiler that mates onto the plate rusted really badly that you have to chisel it smooth.
I wonder if that might be more of a reason to not be able to save a boiler than the bolts.

[oil lp man]

Since nobody has commented on the actual efficiency of the current boiler (which is in the 80's) compared to any specefic NEW oil boiler (most have efficiencies in the 80's), changing THIS oil boiler out might be a DROP in efficiency.

Changing an oil boiler just for the sake of changing it won't always make the operating cost go down. If the operating cost goes up from using an inexpensive boiler, the payback could be a long time.....

Another point to make; there is a certain amount of homework to be done by the customer before an acceptable installation is completed. Some customers do this work before the contract is signed, and quite a few try their luck and wait till the boiler is installed and paid for. When the fuel bill goes up, the homework begins.....

At some point, though, the customer will find out just what kind of installation he paid for, one that is sized and installed correctly for his system, or some other thing altogether.

Noel

Absolutely correct on the efficiency.
I think some might be thinking gas boiler when they think the efficiency is going to go way up.
When its time to replace an oil fired boiler that seems to be the first question the homeowner asks. And the answer is not much increase in efficiency(unless its 1960s-70s, but you won't be spending money all the time on an old clunker.

[KD30]

I happen to be searching the internet on these Oil-Fired Boilers. I was just about to post a Weil-McLain 68V Oil-Fired Boiler, Top Flue Outlet along with Amtrol WH-7P Boiler Mate Series Residential Hot Water Maker, Indirect-Fired Water Heaters on Ebay for sale. I am tearing down a house I just bought for major renovations and selling everything out of it. I happen to have the same boiler for sale. It is in Excellent Condition!! Attached is a picture of the unit. This definitely may save you money rather then going out and purchasing new. I am not sure where you are located but I am located in NJ. Let me know if you are interested.

[KD30]

Thanks everyone for your input/replies to my inquiry with this issue. I think the best route with this old and generally neglected boiler then is to bite the bullet and find a way to afford getting a new one, as it seems to be in pretty tough shape all around anyway. Either that I or could just replace the rainbow gasket...:mad:
I happen to be searching the internet on these Oil-Fired Boilers. I was just about to post a Weil-McLain 68V Oil-Fired Boiler, Top Flue Outlet along with Amtrol WH-7P Boiler Mate Series Residential Hot Water Maker, Indirect-Fired Water Heaters on Ebay for sale. I am tearing down a house I just bought for major renovations and selling everything out of it. I happen to have the same boiler for sale. It is in Excellent Condition!! Attached is a picture of the unit. This definitely may save you money rather then going out and purchasing new. I am not sure where you are located but I am located in NJ. Let me know if you are interested.

[beenthere]

No warranty if the boiler cracks 2 monthes later.
Or are you including a warranty to who ever buys it.

[KD30]

No warranty if the boiler cracks 2 monthes later.
Or are you including a warranty to who ever buys it.
No warranty. Just a suggestion for sgull for an inexpensive way to fix the problem. I don't care if he buys it, someone will purchase it who is looking for a good bargain and doesn't like to pay full price. I think this unit was purchased in 1996 and is in excellent condition.

[sgull]

Looking at the picture of the boiler you have for sale, mine is different in that it has the small gray tank (whatever that's called) but does not have any kind of indirect fired hot water maker or tank similar to the blue one shown in the picture. So what is the main difference, please, between my (mother in laws) setup and the boiler for sale. I've always wondered why there is no hot water tank in her house, how it works, please clarify, someone. thanks.

[beenthere]

You either got a tank some where, or your boiler has a tankless coil.

[sgull]

You either got a tank some where, or your boiler has a tankless coil.

Okay, must have a tankless coil. What's the advantage or disadvantage of having a tankless coil vs indirect fired hot water tank? And what is the smaller gray colored tank shown (as shown in that picture)? An expansion tank?

[beenthere]

Yep, expansion tank.

A tankless coil in a boiler only saves floor space.

An Indirect provides more water.

[sgull]

A tankless coil in a boiler only saves floor space. An Indirect provides more water.

If saving floor space is the only advantage of a boiler with a tankless coil then I see no reason why she (mother in law) has one in her house. The boiler is in the basement of her big old house with plenty of room all around it. Maybe it was originally less expensive to get that one rather than one with an indirect tank? seems goofy to me.

[beenthere]

An Idirect does cost more.

[KD30]

If saving floor space is the only advantage of a boiler with a tankless coil then I see no reason why she (mother in law) has one in her house. The boiler is in the basement of her big old house with plenty of room all around it. Maybe it was originally less expensive to get that one rather than one with an indirect tank? seems goofy to me.
Sorry I can't answer any questions. I am a girl and have no idea about any of this stuff. I bought this house which will be torn down and am selling this unit. If you are interested and have questions about my specific unit, then my father may be able to answer the questions for me. I just wrote the description directly from the manual that the previous homeowner kept on the unit.