? for professionals about home warranty companies

[JJhill]

I figured a repair person would probably be the best person to ask about home warranty companies since you probably have to deal with them frequently in your profession. Can you tell me which ones you'd recommend (if any) and which ones to steer clear from?

[timebuilder]

Folks I know often provide a warranty from this company to people who purchase the homes they had listed for sale.

http://homewarranty.firstam.com/

[davefr]

I'll let the Pros tell you about HVAC specific warranties.

As to general home warrantees they only serve one purposes and that's to help sell homes. (realtors get their commissions quicker, home warrantee companies get a high margin contract and the homeowner usually gets a false sense of security as to what's actually covered).

The warrantees are usually drawn up by teams of lawyers that create a clever loophole for any situation that could likely occur.

There are horror stories about how the warrantee companies "slither" out of actually paying claims. Even if they do determine your claim is legit they go to great lengths to do only the absolute bare minimum and they subcontract the work out to the most desperate and hungry "hacks" they can find.

The best home warrantee is yourself. Take the $'s you normally spend on these foolish schemes and put the money in the bank. Pay for repairs out of this fund and you'll likely develop a substantial balance over the years.

Before I get flamed remember I'm talking about general home warrantees like AHS vs. the HVAC extended warrantees.

[smokin68]

band-aid or cheapest repair to anything that breaks, regardless of whether it's worth repairing. I would never purchase one myself, nor do I recommend them. If something breaks, I want the option of replacing it if it justifies the cost. JMO.

[hetrola]

We only use one company here in Wisconsin.
Universal Home Protection, they pay us on time and they give the option of taking the cost of the repair off of a new unit.

American Home Shield has screwed us in the past

[hvaclover]

Heh, everytime we use an extened warranty they go bankrupt.

[timebuilder]

I'll let the Pros tell you about HVAC specific warranties.

As to general home warranties they only serve one purposes and that's to help sell homes. (realtors get their commissions quicker, home warrantee companies get a high margin contract and the homeowner usually gets a false sense of security as to what's actually covered).

The warrantees are usually drawn up by teams of lawyers that create a clever loophole for any situation that could likely occur.

There are horror stories about how the warrantee companies "slither" out of actually paying claims. Even if they do determine your claim is legit they go to great lengths to do only the absolute bare minimum and they subcontract the work out to the most desperate and hungry "hacks" they can find.

The best home warrantee is yourself. Take the $'s you normally spend on these foolish schemes and put the money in the bank. Pay for repairs out of this fund and you'll likely develop a substantial balance over the years.

Before I get flamed remember I'm talking about general home warrantees like AHS vs. the HVAC extended warrantees.

Notice: as a person with experience, I want to note that Dave is not correct. The purpose of the home warranty is NOT to "sell homes faster." The purpose is to protect the buyer from unforeseen repairs that no home inspector could predict, and for which someone who has just purchased a property is not well prepared to undertake.


The warrantees are usually drawn up by teams of lawyers that create a clever loophole for any situation that could likely occur.

I have never seen a warranty company of which this is true. No real estate professional will risk their reputation with a company that will not come through for the client.

[JJhill]

Thanks for the replies. We currently have AHS and I do not like them at all. I've had two major problems happen since we bought our house 8 months ago that cost thousands of dollars to repair and we barely recouped our $500 we had to pay for the stupid warranty in the first place. Thank goodness for homeowner's insurance. I am glad we have a warranty, but I don't like their "band aid" approach to repairing stuff and I don't understand how they find contractors to do work at the rates they reimburse them at.

[Senior Tech]

Home warranty companies are probably great for the homeowner but hated by contractors. Why? They add 1-2 hours on a call, they whine when you give them the price of repair...and even when it makes good sense to replace equipment they will repair it or ask if you will install their (low, low, end) equipment. I don't like dealing with them on the contractor end but can see from a homeowners point of view where it may be advantageous to have it.
Bottom line is they are in business to make money...and I'll bet they make plenty of it.

[timebuilder]

Home warranty companies are probably great for the homeowner but hated by contractors. Why? They add 1-2 hours on a call, they whine when you give them the price of repair...and even when it makes good sense to replace equipment they will repair it or ask if you will install their (low, low, end) equipment. I don't like dealing with them on the contractor end but can see from a homeowners point of view where it may be advantageous to have it.
Bottom line is they are in business to make money...and I'll bet they make plenty of it.

Not only that, the warranty is purchased by the seller, so for the new homeowner, it's good thing, 100% of the time.

For the contractor, you get to make a new friend, and if you are lucky, they keep calling you because you satisfied their needs during the term of the warranty.

Win-win.

[davefr]

Not only that, the warranty is purchased by the seller, so for the new homeowner, it's good thing, 100% of the time.


I disagree. Even if the seller hands over a warranty to the new homeowner it's not necessarily a good thing:

1. The new homeowner will have been decieved as to the extent of repairs or replacements the warranty covers. Like I said before, these contracts have enough carefully crafted fine print to get out of most anything.
2. The new homeowner will often be subject to the worst of the trades. I've heard countless stories about how the real Pros defuse to deal with these companies.
3. The new homeowner is often subject to repair delays to the extent that they often have to just give in and have something repaired without the warranty. (ex: hot water heaters)

Maybe there are a handful of reputable warranty companies but most of them thrive only based on their relationship with realtors vs. satisfied homeowners.

[timebuilder]

I disagree. Even if the seller hands over a warranty to the new homeowner it's not necessarily a good thing:

1. The new homeowner will have been decieved as to the extent of repairs or replacements the warranty covers. Like I said before, these contracts have enough carefully crafted fine print to get out of most anything.
2. The new homeowner will often be subject to the worst of the trades. I've heard countless stories about how the real Pros defuse to deal with these companies.
3. The new homeowner is often subject to repair delays to the extent that they often have to just give in and have something repaired without the warranty. (ex: hot water heaters)

Maybe there are a handful of reputable warranty companies but most of them thrive only based on their relationship with realtors vs. satisfied homeowners.

Let me be plain, and not to sound mean:

1) BS

2) BS

3) BS

No offense, but you have no idea what you are talking about.

[davefr]

Let me be plain, and not to sound mean:

1) BS

2) BS

3) BS

No offense, but you have no idea what you are talking about.

I'm not alone. Pick your favorite search engine and read all you want:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.home.repair/browse_thread/thread/67e5ef3c68cae3ef/0dd5b68af17e165d?lnk=st&q=american+home+shield&rnum=2#0dd5b68af17e165d

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.hvac/browse_thread/thread/6c7d286f8316cce9/b1af6567322ca575?lnk=st&q=american+home+shield&rnum=3#b1af6567322ca575

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.hvac/browse_thread/thread/5ab87a1f4a32b415/b9da5a41a3d35eaf?lnk=st&q=home+warranty&rnum=9#b9da5a41a3d35eaf

[aircooled53]

Home warranty is just what it states in the policy. If you don't maintain your system or it wasn't installed properly then you won't get paid by American Home Shield or Old Republic or First American or Broward or any other warranty service.

If your system is maintained and serviced regular by HVAC company and you have a compressor go out on 12 year old system and your policy has 13.0 S.E.E.R. coverage then you will get new indoor coil and 13.0 condenser. But, if your systems is NOT up to codes and needs additional secondary pan, mastic , permits and recovery and your policy doesn't cover those items then you will be charged for HOME Owner Resposiblity Charges.

If the customer would read his policy and purchase the up-grades he would not pay anything.Most just pay monthly 45.00 and grip because they don't have full coverage.

New AHS policy coming out nexted month covers everything , coil cleanings and no denial for anything.Cost a little more but covers all.:cool:

[hvaclover]

Can't address the cos you mentioned, but personal experience has shown HW to be shot thru with deductibles and exclusions.

[billva]

I find HW's to be a big Payne.

[Senior Tech]

I disagree. Even if the seller hands over a warranty to the new homeowner it's not necessarily a good thing:

1. The new homeowner will have been decieved as to the extent of repairs or replacements the warranty covers. Like I said before, these contracts have enough carefully crafted fine print to get out of most anything.
2. The new homeowner will often be subject to the worst of the trades. I've heard countless stories about how the real Pros defuse to deal with these companies.
3. The new homeowner is often subject to repair delays to the extent that they often have to just give in and have something repaired without the warranty. (ex: hot water heaters)

Maybe there are a handful of reputable warranty companies but most of them thrive only based on their relationship with realtors vs. satisfied homeowners.

1. Decieved is a strong word. I will agree however that the cap pay out on all policies I've dealt with is a fraction of what replacement cost is. (cap is usually $1500 on each piece, $3000 for ac, coil and furnace.)

2. They are no more subject to the worst of the trades then they would be if they let their fingers do the walking and pick the wrong company because they choose not to investigate.

3. Delays are usually not bad on our end. They do however get second opinions on diagnosis of costly repairs/replacement just as any responsible homeowner would working with a company that they are not familiar with.

[mroy3]

My inlaws had their condensor rupture on a 20 year old unit- they bought the house 6 months ago. The co. sent out agreed to replacement but would need to pay for a pad, electrical extension, removal of old unit and copper extension. I told my father in law to cash out with the warranty co and I would set him up with a high end unit. They offered 1/2 what I can by a unit for so I told him to have them do it. Copper lines were shorter than before, original disconnect and fuses. I geuss they had to trump up the bill since the warranty co wont pay an honest dollar to cover their customers. But still he did get a new 13 seer payne. My company will not do home warranty unless the owner pays us and then gets reimbursed. I here a lot of complaints from owners on the type of company that "works" the warranty gig.

[billva]

But still he did get a new 13 seer payne.


I rest my case.

Did he get the matching evaporator coil?

[deq1269]

My own personal experience. I bought a house and the seller included a home warranty to "sweeten" the deal. Six months later my dishwasher broke. Repairman came out and said not worth repairing I got a new dishwasher out of the deal with no cost to me. I was extremely happy with the warranty. Then my ac broke and normally I would have fixed it myself but I figured I have a warranty why not use it, and plus it was a 16 year old system that I planned to replace in a few months and didnt want to put in my own money into it till then. They sent out a hack who took 3 hours to figure out the thermostat was bad. Then they tried to tell me the warranty would only replace the digital with a mecury thermostat. I called the warranty company who informed me that was not true. They guy was trying to pocket the extra money. Finally I told the warranty to forget it I would take care of it myself. I have a home warranty on my new house and I will let them take care of everything else but the AC.

[hvaclover]

. bare minimum and they subcontract the work out to the most desperate and hungry "hacks" they can find.

.

Why are you constantly defaming the people in this business?


I know plenty of fine companies that do work for HW.

You start every post with a disclaimer of "I'll let the experts tell you more..' and then you come off like a frickin' expert.

Self contradiction seems to be high on your talent list.

If you don't like this industry than bug off this forum.

Every post you put up has been one indictment or another of the tradesman here and they smack of elitist rhetoric.

You ain't so high and mighty just because you have a small knowledge of HVAC, even if it's an engineering degree. There are plenty here who could put you easily in your place in any field work or design work, my self included and i forgot a lot of what I knew due to a stroke..

Lay off the regular guys, Know-it all.

[mark beiser]

I just had a call yesterday from a customer that had a company come out under their home warranty for a no cooling call.
They found no refrigerant in the system due to leaks in the indoor coil.
The coil was "covered", but they came up with "non covered" items that totaled up to within $200 of my book price to install a new Trane slab coil when the existing transition and plenum will fit, which they will on this job.

At the beginning of the heating season the same customer had the same situation with the furnace when the HX was found to be cracked.
The contractor for the home warranty company was going to install a low end furnace under the warranty, but the "non covered" items totaled up to within $400 of our retail to install a Trane XL80 2 stage furnace. And believe me, we are NOT cheep, lol.

[davefr]

Why are you constantly defaming the people in this business?

If you don't like this industry than bug off this forum.

Every post you put up has been one indictment or another of the tradesman here and they smack of elitist rhetoric.



hvaclover,
Re-read my post. I did not single out any trade in particular and my comments were regarding home warrantees in general.

I did not "indict" any particular tradesman or trade.

Some of your own group of tradesmen even fess up that they don't do home warrantee work due to all the problems and hassles.

The OP wanted opinions on home warrantees. I think they got a wide spectrum of opinions to help make an informed decision.

[timebuilder]

1. Deceived is a strong word. I will agree however that the cap pay out on all policies I've dealt with is a fraction of what replacement cost is. (cap is usually $1500 on each piece, $3000 for ac, coil and furnace.)

2. They are no more subject to the worst of the trades then they would be if they let their fingers do the walking and pick the wrong company because they choose not to investigate.

3. Delays are usually not bad on our end. They do however get second opinions on diagnosis of costly repairs/replacement just as any responsible homeowner would working with a company that they are not familiar with.

I agree.

Because a good agent (who could be, but might not be a Realtor®) has a reputation to protect, he won't offer a home warranty on a home from a company that other agents he knows will say has been problematic, other than regarding the typical limitations imposed by any form of "insurance." Instead, a local rep will become the one whose company is the clear choice for satisfying customers in a particular area, both from the way that rep deals with their company on behalf of the client and the choices the company makes for the professionals who will evaluate the covered items and make the repairs.

Whether you are an HVAC or real estate professional, or both, your business is satisfying customers. Now, I can sympathize with anyone who thinks that they were entitled to a top of the line replacement machine when the policy did not offer that coverage. We all want the "best." In the case of a new home owner, the coverage was purchased by the seller, so he is out no money for the coverage he does have. No matter what, that new home owner WILL receive value for having the coverage, and it will mean that he will be spending less in out of pocket expense to have the system in question restored to a functional state.

That's a benefit.

If a company was unworthy of a policy purchase by home sellers, their business would quickly dry up due to word of mouth negative advertising, and agents would avoid that company like month-old bread.

[tuncos]

My own personal experience. I bought a house and the seller included a home warranty to "sweeten" the deal. Six months later my dishwasher broke. Repairman came out and said not worth repairing I got a new dishwasher out of the deal with no cost to me. I was extremely happy with the warranty.
I had the same exact scenario, seller bought the warranty.

Our dishwasher went kaput a few months before the warranty ran out. I did have to pay something like a $50 deductible, but that's not bad for a new, installed dishwasher :)

[Special Ed]

As part-owner of a business I wouldn't do HW work. HW co.'s are always trying to get you to lower your prices, they only seem to authorize the bare-minimum repair to get the thing going & when they're tired of dealing with you they move on. They are too fickle for my blood.

And, besides, I'm doing just fine without them. IMO, you are denigrating the trade if you do work for them. All you are to them is labor not a pro that deserves the prices we charge.

That said, do I think it's a good deal for the HO? Yes, of course, but only for the short-term. Is it a good deal for the contractor? Absolutely not. And for those of you that are hoping to use HW co.'s to get their foot in the HO's door: Forget about it, 'cause the HO is going to forget about you the moment you drive away. Unless, of course, you do a terrible job for them.

JMHO.

[hetrola]

hvaclover,
Re-read my post. I did not single out any trade in particular and my comments were regarding home warrantees in general.

I did not "indict" any particular tradesman or trade.

Some of your own group of tradesmen even fess up that they don't do home warrantee work due to all the problems and hassles.

The OP wanted opinions on home warrantees. I think they got a wide spectrum of opinions to help make an informed decision.

Actually he wanted opinions on which warranty companies were good, which to steer from....from a repair man's perspective.

Besides that who heats up hot water(ex. hot water heater)

[timebuilder]

Besides that who heats up hot water(ex. hot water heater)

Ba-dum-dum!!

[hetrola]

Ba-dum-dum!!

wasn't trying to be mr. funnypants
someone who uses that phrase shouldn't give out HVAC info(pep-peeve of mine)

[timebuilder]

wasn't trying to be mr. funnypants
someone who uses that phrase shouldn't give out HVAC info(pep-peeve of mine)

There are a lot of phrases like "hot water heater" that make one scratch their head. Some product lables are the same way.

I was immediately recalling a George Carlin comedy routine that mentioned a feminine cleansing product that was labled as being "disposable."

He'd then ask the audience. "who the h*** would want to keep it???"

[timebuilder]

And for those of you that are hoping to use HW co.'s to get their foot in the HO's door: Forget about it, 'cause the HO is going to forget about you the moment you drive away. Unless, of course, you do a terrible job for them. JMHO.

Or, you can explain the work, the compensation dynamic of a warranty plan, the difference between what is covered and what you would recommend as a professional, and that you would like them to become one of your customers when the warranty expires. The impression you leave with someone is determined by you.

[rdave]

Have been doing buisness with several warranty co. for quite a few years and I can tell you they are not all bad, If you (home owner) read you contracts, they state quite clear for me anyway the terms for service, basicly you need to maintain the equipment, regular maintenance, cleanings and filters, and if you have failure most will give you like for like equipment.
If you have a standing pilot machine its upgraded to a minimum 80%, yes it usually is a Payne machine, if you have a 90+ it will most likely be a Carrier unit, some of the warranty co. have a upgrade plan if you choose to purchase or they allow the contractor to advise the ho their equipment can be upgraded to what ever for an additional charge. Granted there will be non covered charges with a retrofit but depending on the equipment you choose and the coverage you have will determine the out of pocket expense.
And for the record not all hw contractors are bad, or never see repeat buisness

[hvaclover]

Have been doing buisness with several warranty co. for quite a few years and I can tell you they are not all bad, If you (home owner) read you contracts, they state quite clear for me anyway the terms for service, basicly you need to maintain the equipment, regular maintenance, cleanings and filters, and if you have failure most will give you like for like equipment.
If you have a standing pilot machine its upgraded to a minimum 80%, yes it usually is a Payne machine, if you have a 90+ it will most likely be a Carrier unit, some of the warranty co. have a upgrade plan if you choose to purchase or they allow the contractor to advise the ho their equipment can be upgraded to what ever for an additional charge. Granted there will be non covered charges with a retrofit but depending on the equipment you choose and the coverage you have will determine the out of pocket expense.
And for the record not all hw contractors are bad, or never see repeat buisness

God post. rdave

You think you are one of those "desperate hacks" that davefr describes that "needs so work so bad y"ou have to "stoop to new lows" (paraphrased but u get it) to get HW work?

These are davefr's words not mine.

Davefr, c'mon man, cool the abuse.