Cleland to Cheney: “Where the hell were you in the Vietnam War?”

[tinknocker44]

Where the hell were you in the Vietnam War? If you had gone to Vietnam like the rest of us, maybe you would have learned something about war. You can't keep troops on the ground forever. You gotta have a mission. You gotta have a purpose."

You can't keep sending 'em back and back and back with no mission and no purpose. As a matter of fact, the real enemy is Al Qaeda, it's Al Qaeda stupid, it's not in Iraq.

LOL :D :D :D


http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/03/12/cleland-to-cheney-where-the-hell-were-you-in-the-vietnam-war/

[James 3528]

You also shouldn't fall on your on grenade after getting drunk. Unless that was Cleland's purpose

[tinknocker44]

You also shouldn't fall on your on grenade after getting drunk. Unless that was Cleland's purpose

Cleland took that grenade and shoved it up cheneys arse.

[James 3528]

Go ride your skate board. Another post of yours de-boned. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[chillbilly]

You also shouldn't fall on your on grenade after getting drunk. Unless that was Cleland's purpose


LOL

I respect Max Cleland's service to his country but I don't respect his accusations about the Bush administration over the 9/11 Commission fiasco and I don't think he's doing the country any good deed by attacking the VP.
Apparently, Cleland's mistaken identification of a live grenade has influenced his sentiments about who is and who isn't a Patriot.
The Vice President has been a faithful servant to his country.
Listening to a disgruntled old soldier who ended up getting booted out of office at the hands of a republican makes ole' Max look foolish and angry.
Maybe Max shoulda' got a clue when his boy Kerry lost to Bush is spite of ole' John's insistence on propping up Max at every campaign rally he went to.

[glennac]

Max Cleland is a total joke. Hanoi Jane has been financially supporting him for decades. It all started back in the summer of 84 when Cleland was secretary of the GA Sec of State. He sent a letter to the local paper in Action MA chastising the local vets up there for protesting the commie Mayor of Action for giving Hanoi Jane the key to the city. They made national headlines. He told them to forgive and forget and to get a life and he did it on the letter head of the Sec. of the State of GA. The news paper printed the whole letter, letter head and all. Max only apologized for using his letter head. He was injured while horse playing with some troops at a fire base by throwing a grenade back and forth and the pin either fell out or was pulled out and he got the **** blown out of him. I read this account in an article in the newspaper. Cleland will tell you he was on “patrol” and a grenade fell down in front of him and went off. Artillery troops much less Arty officers do not go out on combat patrols. He did not receive a Purple Heart and has tried to join but the Military Order of the PH but we won’t let him in since he does not have one. He was defeated in his last run for office in GA for Senator. It wasn’t even close. He is no Southern Democrat. He is as far left and liberal as you can get. He loves the traitor Jane Fonda and I personally know some personal dirt on him but I won’t go into it. It’s beneath my principles.


http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/8/26/85323.shtml

[majormickey]

Any leader becomes unpopular when the conflict lengthens. Most people want questions that are easily answered. For example, conspiracy theories offer easy answers for "tough" questions.

[chillbilly]

Any leader becomes unpopular when the conflict lengthens. Most people want questions that are easily answered. For example, conspiracy theories offer easy answers for "tough" questions.


Words of Wisdom there.

[tinknocker44]

[QUOTE=majormickey;1406519]Any leader becomes unpopular when the conflict lengthens.


When a conflict lengthens? Dumbya and Co. told us it wouldnt take longer than 6 months and its gone on longer than WWII. Also we were told its only a "few" insurgents. This Admin has gotten nothing right about this optional war and peeps are still nuthugging.


Most people want questions that are easily answered

Thats why Dumbya wouldnt allow Dems at his campaign stops. He cant and wont answer the tough questions.

[James 3528]

About 12 conflicts going on in the world...all Muslim related. Iraq is not a war...it is a battle in a war.

[majormickey]

Tin, I think we agree on alot of things. Here is one of those tough questions; what would you do [if you were the leader of the free or non-free world] about maintaining a relatively safe world?

[geerair]

Where was Cheney?

In Cheney's own words: "I had other priorities."

[geerair]

About 12 conflicts going on in the world...all Muslim related. Iraq is not a war...it is a battle in a war.Actually Iraq is a bloody quagmire that has proven to be a serious distraction and hindrance to the real war on terror.

[James 3528]

Actually Iraq is a bloody quagmire that has proven to be a serious distraction and hindrance to the real war on terror.Why don't you describe to everyone the real war on terror? And what a victory would be ?

[The Doctor]

Actually Iraq is a bloody quagmire that has proven to be a serious distraction and hindrance to the real war on terror.

like they say in real estate. location, location, location.

what better a place to induce the saudi/sunni vs. syrian/iranian(shiite) bloodletting. it's a bold move, thinking that this millenia-old region would take to the whole "democratic principle" thing.
let's hope it actually works.

BTW, where or what is "the real war on terror" ,if not there?
or shall we wait with bated breath our whole lives?

[James 3528]

Geer's war on terrorism would be a war on Christians, not Muslims. He's in a quagmire himself. Here is a war on religion that is being fought and it's not against his enemy. You don't think he's concerned about the country do you?

[geerair]

Why don't you describe to everyone the real war on terror? And what a victory would be ?
Destroy those who actually were involved in 9/11

Force Saudi Arabia and Pakistan to crack down on terrorist factories in their countries

Make a serious effort to resolve the Israel/Palestinian situation

Stop supporting corrupt dictatorships


Stop or reduce the flow of arms and other military support the U.S provides to Israel


Avoid quagmires which bog down our ground forces, split the American citizenry and provides a recruiting tool for terrorists


Quit electing Presidents more concerned about their legacies than the welfare of the U.S.



Get rid of military bases in the ME.



Victory? Accomplish all of the above.

[geerair]

Geer's war on terrorism would be a war on Christians, not Muslims. He's in a quagmire himself. Here is a war on religion that is being fought and it's not against his enemy. You don't think he's concerned about the country do you?Actually an ideal war on terrorism would be Christian fundies fighting Muslim fundies with the desired result that both groups are wiped out.

[James 3528]

Destroy those who actually were involved in 9/11

Force Saudi Arabia and Pakistan to crack down on terrorist factories in their countries

Make a serious effort to resolve the Israel/Palestinian situation

Stop supporting corrupt dictatorships


Stop or reduce the flow of arms and other military support the U.S provides to Israel


Avoid quagmires which bog down our ground forces, split the American citizenry and provides a recruiting tool for terrorists


Quit electing Presidents more concerned about their legacies than the welfare of the U.S.



Get rid of military bases in the ME.



Victory? Accomplish all of the above.

Then why do you rush to defend democrats who have no plan except to warn our enemies 6 months in advance that we are going to attack and then 6 months in advance that we are going to give up?

Avoiding a quagmire to a liberal is doing nothing. That was the only answer you should have posted. The truth.

[chillbilly]

Actually an ideal war on terrorism would be Christian fundies fighting Muslim fundies with the desired result that both groups are wiped out.

Well, there you have it folks.
Geerair, in the spirit of the Nazi, Hitler has delivered his message of hate and intolerance toward not one, but two major religions.
Also note that anyone who believes in a deity is considered a "fundie", so be sure to kill them all.


Zi Papers Pleeze

[chillbilly]

Then why do you rush to defend democrats who have no plan except to warn our enemies 6 months in advance that we are going to attack and then 6 months in advance that we are going to give up?

Avoiding a quagmire to a liberal is doing nothing. That was the only answer you should have posted. The truth.

I smell more smoked a$$.

[James 3528]

Originally Posted by geerair View Post
Actually an ideal war on terrorism would be Christian fundies fighting Muslim fundies with the desired result that both groups are wiped out.

Good sig line material

[geerair]

Then why do you rush to defend democrats who have no plan except to warn our enemies 6 months in advance that we are going to attack and then 6 months in advance that we are going to give up?

Avoiding a quagmire to a liberal is doing nothing. That was the only answer you should have posted. The truth. First step: When you find yourself in a hole ................stop digging.

[geerair]

Good sig line materialYep, I might use it.

Fundies knock each other off 85% of the world's problems go away.


Some experts peg it even higher..............99%

[chillbilly]

Geer The God Nazi
Zee Papers Please!

1217

[chillbilly]

geerair;1407627]Yep, I might use it.
Fundies knock each other off 85% of the world's problems go away.
Some experts peg it even higher..............99%

Please do use it.
I don't think you have the balls.

[James 3528]

Yep, I might use it.

Fundies knock each other off 85% of the world's problems go away.


Some experts peg it even higher..............99%


What do the experts say about the 12 Muslim conflicts going on in the world?








Geer in a rare insight shows his colors...well not really. We knew what they were.


Geer trust the world in the hands of stinky old men with beards and towels on their heads.....that would off him in a instant

[geerair]

What do the experts say about the 12 Muslim conflicts going on in the world?Send the Christian fundies after them. Do the world a fAVOR.









Geer in a rare insight shows his colors...well not really. We knew what they were.


Geer trust the world in the hands of stinky old men with beards and towels on their heads.....that would off him in a instantThis from a true believer who puts poltitcal expediency and legacy protection above the security of his country.

James doesn't want a real, effective war on terrorists, he wants his political party to have power so that he can prop up this sagging ego that was damaged in the midterm elections.

In search of this power he is willing to support an unjustifed bloody quagmire which is consuming men and treasure while providing a recruiting tool for terrorism, doing the dirty work of Iran and Osama bin Laden, enriching favored Bush cronies, stretching the Army and Marines to the breaking point.

Sad, but hey, stay the course, right? :eek: :eek: :eek:

[isitfixedyet]

its real simple , he gave the post u give the reply, dont switch issues or subjects, like chicken little jr/bush
focus on the real issues!
cheney is a traitor to his country, promoting communism, like bush, among promoting anti american democracies, instead of to preserve the US Constituional rights of the individual!
Welcome to the real America - and not the fake, idealised dream propagated by the media, the crypto-fascist government currently controlled by neo-conservatives (and not TRUE conservatives) like George W. Bush (the first American Emperor), and the anti-American economy controlled by the multi-national corporations. The real America, which I propose to advocate, is a multi-colored affair, stranger than India, riotous, secretive and hermetic, un-optimistic (in spite of our official ideology), and containing - in the words of William Burroughs - a "dark psychotic heart

pay close attention to detail, whimmy!

[James 3528]

Send the Christian fundies after them. Do the world a fAVOR.








This from a true believer who puts poltitcal expediency and legacy protection above the security of his country.

James doesn't want a real, effective war on terrorists, he wants his political party to have power so that he can prop up this sagging ego that was damaged in the midterm elections.

In search of this power he is willing to support an unjustifed bloody quagmire which is consuming men and treasure while providing a recruiting tool for terrorism, doing the dirty work of Iran and Osama bin Laden, enriching favored Bush cronies, stretching the Army and Marines to the breaking point.

Sad, but hey, stay the course, right? :eek: :eek: :eek:

There are Christians in our military fighting those Muslims. You want them dead also by your own words. Don't pretend you know what I want and what I believe. From what you have written , you are idealistically in heart and mind aligned with the objectives of Al Queda and Bil Laden.

[chillbilly]

EXACTLY

Greer has gone on record in this thread as wishing for Christians and Muslims to be eradicated.

Reminds me of the rants produced by the Master Race.
:eek: :eek:

[geerair]

There are Christians in our military fighting those Muslims. You want them dead also by your own words. Don't pretend you know what I want and what I believe. From what you have written , you are idealistically in heart and mind aligned with the objectives of Al Queda and Bil Laden. Oh dear, another attempt by james, supporter of sending our boys into a bloody meatgrinder quagmire to please Bush, to play the you don't support the troops card.

James instead of actually destroying the 9/11 terrorists and go after the people involved in terrorism,wants to keep throwing our boys and our money at an unjustified quagmire of a civil war that is doing nothing more than the dirty work of Iran and Osama bin Laden. Support the Troops indeed.


That being said, Christian fundies and Muslim fundies need to face off and do the world a favor by wiping each other out.

Add in all the armchair generals and war cheerleaders who send others off to fight unjustified wars in their places, the doomsday televangelists and Deadeye Dick "I had other priorities during the Vietnam War" Cheney and send them off to do battle with the loonie fundy Muslims.


Get rid of those folks and the rest of the rational world can live in peace and harmony.

[zzonko]

RUBY SLIPPERS

PINK FONTS



still



LMFAO

http://img4.glowfoto.com/images/2007/03/12-1655006686T.gif (http://www.glowfoto.com/viewimage.php?img=12-165500L&y=2007&m=03&t=gif&rand=6686&srv=img4)

[ga-hvac-tech]

Oh dear, another attempt by james, supporter of sending our boys into a bloody meatgrinder quagmire to please Bush, to play the you don't support the troops card.

James instead of actually destroying the 9/11 terrorists and go after the people involved in terrorism,wants to keep throwing our boys and our money at an unjustified quagmire of a civil war that is doing nothing more than the dirty work of Iran and Osama bin Laden. Support the Troops indeed.


That being said, Christian fundies and Muslim fundies need to face off and do the world a favor by wiping each other out.

Add in all the armchair generals and war cheerleaders who send others off to fight unjustified wars in their places, the doomsday televangelists and Deadeye Dick "I had other priorities during the Vietnam War" Cheney and send them off to do battle with the loonie fundy Muslims.


Get rid of those folks and the rest of the rational world can live in peace and harmony.

OOOOOOOHHHOOO!!!!!!!!!!

This thread is just too good to not get in on... :D

I think Geer is afraid he will get drafted and be a target.

Study history Geer! Lots of folks over the centuries have tried to end war. It did not work. Why are you smarter? Do you really think just because you do not like something it will go away?

I do not like lowered speed limits on roads that are wide open (speed traps)... did they go away? I also do not like it that after a grueling hot attic install I am tired and sore. Did it go away?

Why do you think things will just 'go away' if you blow enough smoke? Because Bill Clinton got away with it? Look at him... Would you like to be married to Hillary? Before you answer that, look at what happens to folks that cross Hillary.

IMO Geer, while I like you and am looking forward to a seriously FUN debate with you and your looser liberal friends at the Convention this August (of course this would be a team effort including Chill, Boot, James and myself), I think your conversation says you have childish beliefs and views. BTW: That debate will be followed by a really great steak dinner and some serious lieing about how rich and famous we are... :D:p:cool: Are you up for this Geer???

Grow up Bro. Get out there and tuff it out like the rest of us did. You might be surprised what you would learn... And you might even realize some of our conservative talk makes sense. And you might even mature into a conservative/libertarian... :D

[James 3528]

Oh dear, another attempt by james, supporter of sending our boys into a bloody meatgrinder quagmire to please Bush, to play the you don't support the troops card.

James instead of actually destroying the 9/11 terrorists and go after the people involved in terrorism,wants to keep throwing our boys and our money at an unjustified quagmire of a civil war that is doing nothing more than the dirty work of Iran and Osama bin Laden. Support the Troops indeed.


That being said, Christian fundies and Muslim fundies need to face off and do the world a favor by wiping each other out.

Add in all the armchair generals and war cheerleaders who send others off to fight unjustified wars in their places, the doomsday televangelists and Deadeye Dick "I had other priorities during the Vietnam War" Cheney and send them off to do battle with the loonie fundy Muslims.


Get rid of those folks and the rest of the rational world can live in peace and harmony.
Geer is trying to put up a charade with a extra dose of drama that Christians are as bad as the 12 conflicts going on in the world that Muslims are at the center of. I can't think of one secular Christian head of state who government is ran on the verses of the bible that is threating the entire population of another one with total destruction.

[acmanko]

Geer 9 vs James 3,chilly 1/2

[ga-hvac-tech]

Geer 9 vs James 3,chilly 1/2

Posts?... Or verifiable truth??? Truth that will withstand the test of time???

[acmanko]

Posts?... Or verifiable truth??? Truth that will withstand the test of time??? You know the answer, don't play dumb. You seem to be a little smarter than the average

[ga-hvac-tech]

You know the answer, don't play dumb. You seem to be a little smarter than the average

Yeah my friend, but this is the ARP forum (Argue, Rant, and Pick... :D ) Like Chill says: If you are gonna dish it out, you gotta take it...

Now that I have had a little fun... I agree there are some rants here that make less than realistic sense. And I have written more than one of them. But some of us just need to blow off a little steam every now and then.

I hope the libs here know that while I think they choose views that qualify as somewhere between childish and just plain un-informed; they are still HVAC guys. And as such, if they truly needed some Help I would give it to them. But they probably would have to suffer through a few comments along the way... :D:p:cool::D

[acmanko]

Yeah my friend, but this is the ARP forum (Argue, Rant, and Pick... :D ) Like Chill says: If you are gonna dish it out, you gotta take it...

Now that I have had a little fun... I agree there are some rants here that make less than realistic sense. And I have written more than one of them. But some of us just need to blow off a little steam every now and then.

I hope the libs here know that while I think they choose views that qualify as somewhere between childish and just plain un-informed; they are still HVAC guys. And as such, if they truly needed some Help I would give it to them. But they probably would have to suffer through a few comments along the way... :D:p:cool::D agreed, i've been gone voluntarily from here for a few days, trying to refomulate, yet Still get blasted by the same old bunch, but like you I take it all as best as I can and try like heck to dish it out.

[chillbilly]

agreed, i've been gone voluntarily from here for a few days, trying to refomulate, yet Still get blasted by the same old bunch, but like you I take it all as best as I can and try like heck to dish it out.


Try as you might, you're still a dumbass.
And geer is your daddy.....and your daddy's a dumbass too.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Chill is a tuff one... I am looking forward to meeting him (as well as all you guys and gals--both liberal and conservative--on ARP) in August in N Carolina.

Lets give Ack a little slack until he starts to chewing on his shoeleather again... :cool:

[chillbilly]

ga-hvac-techChill is a tuff one... I am looking forward to meeting him (as well as all you guys and gals--both liberal and conservative--on ARP) in August in N Carolina.
It'll be grand. I'll buy the first round of beers and shots.
BTW, I don't really believe the dudes here are complete dumbasses.
We all have our moments.
I just like the way the guy from that 70's show calls everyone a dumbass.
It's so comical.


Lets give Ack a little slack until he puts he starts to chewing on his shoeleather again... :cool:
Mankows alright..............for a dumbass! LOL ha!#$$^^&&&$##@

[ga-hvac-tech]

It'll be grand. I'll buy the first round of beers and shots.
BTW, I don't really believe the dudes here are complete dumbasses.
We all have our moments.
I just like the way the guy from that 70's show calls everyone a dumbass.
It's so comical. Mankows alright..............for a dumbass! LOL ha!#$$^^&&&$##@

You are on for the first round! I am looking forward to associating names and faces!

BTW: My hobby is photography. I will be bringing along a camera to capture the fun moments. I think we need an ARP group shot... Then we can all laugh (together) at the one we are 'name calling'... :D I will post them to my website for all to enjoy!

[geerair]

RUBY SLIPPERS

PINK FONTS



still



LMFAO

http://img4.glowfoto.com/images/2007/03/12-1655006686T.gif (http://www.glowfoto.com/viewimage.php?img=12-165500L&y=2007&m=03&t=gif&rand=6686&srv=img4)james has a homo inside just crying to get out. :D :D :D :D

[geerair]

Geer is trying to put up a charade with a extra dose of drama that Christians are as bad as the 12 conflicts going on in the world that Muslims are at the center of. I can't think of one secular Christian head of state who government is ran on the verses of the bible that is threating the entire population of another one with total destruction.Can't you?

Bush says god told him to invade Iraq. Shrub had racked up an impressive kill total including women and babies.

Old god hasn't changed much from the days when he ordered mass killings, rapings and animal buggery.
:eek: :eek:

[ga-hvac-tech]

Can't you?

Bush says god told him to invade Iraq. Shrub had racked up an impressive kill total including women and babies.

Old god hasn't changed much from the days when he ordered mass killings, rapings and animal buggery.
:eek: :eek:

Question there Geer: If you and God were sitting side by side; who would be smarter? You or God?

[chillbilly]

LOL
Greer doesn't understand biblical scripture any more than he understands what is happening around the world.
He once insisted that the Temptation of Man contained in Genesis was a part of creation.
After several attempts to show him the difference between the two and the noted breaks in the text, he still couldn't understand the story and the differences.
It's not so much that he can't understand religion but rather that he won't understand it because it would show a degree of humility...and I'm afraid if greer is short on anything, it's that he cannot be humble.
Of course he's got other issues as well, but we won't go there.

I'm afraid we have our own version of a talking snake right here on ARP.

[k-fridge]

With all due respect to Mad Max for his military service (which I will not challenge), he's an idiot! He was a terrible secretary of state, the office under him was terribly unorganized and corrupt. He as even worse as a US senator. He makes a habit of shooting his mouth off and is always full of crap.

Yes, I'm from Georgia and I know this firsthand.

[chillbilly]

With all due respect to Mad Max for his military service (which I will not challenge), he's an idiot! He was a terrible secretary of state, the office under him was terribly unorganized and corrupt. He as even worse as a US senator. He makes a habit of shooting his mouth off and is always full of crap.

Yes, I'm from Georgia and I know this firsthand.


Hey there K. Where ya' been?

[k-fridge]

Hey there K. Where ya' been?
Hey Chill. Been a busy boy, not much time to get on line nor the energy to argue with liberals. Business is good, anyone want a job in Atlanta? :D

[James 3528]

Can't you?

Bush says god told him to invade Iraq. Shrub had racked up an impressive kill total including women and babies.

Old god hasn't changed much from the days when he ordered mass killings, rapings and animal buggery.
:eek: :eek:
You're pretty much fu*ked up.

[k-fridge]

Old god hasn't changed much from the days when he ordered mass killings,
If God was behind it I expect it'd be open season on atheists and liberals. :D

[tinknocker44]

If God was behind it I expect it'd be open season on atheists and liberals. :D


Why? Jesus was a liberal.

[k-fridge]

Why? Jesus was a liberal.
How so? Because he looked like a hippy? :D

Seriously, define liberal and explain in what context you're defining.

[James 3528]

If God was behind it I expect it'd be open season on atheists and liberals. :D

LOL

[obxdist]

Geer 9 vs James 3,chilly 1/2

Update James 10 Chilly 3 Greer 0 aconker -1:eek:

[tinknocker44]

How so? Because he looked like a hippy? :D

Seriously, define liberal and explain in what context you're defining.

I wonder if he's the only guy born in the ME who looks like he's from California.

He respected who and what people are. Pugs dont do that.

[chillbilly]

Why? Jesus was a liberal.

LOL How so?The liberals I see on this forum and in the real world wouldn't be qualified to wash Christ's feet, although I'm sure he would allow them to do so. Jesus advocated men getting back to a place where they love one another and practice forgiveness, while rejecting hate.
Jesus Christ was a visionary and the ultimate prophet. Comparing him to a liberal shows how abysmal your understanding of Christ's life is.
Why should I be suprised? You could easily read about his life in the New Testament, but that would require that you actually read and understand.
I'm not sure you're up for all that.




Jesus also counseled thieves and robbers. Are those the liberals you were referring to?

:D :D :D

[chillbilly]

You're pretty much fu*ked up.


Uh, yeah. He's a sick puppy.

1280

[k-fridge]

I wonder if he's the only guy born in the ME who looks like he's from California.
LOL


He respected who and what people are. Pugs dont do that.Au contrare my bedwetting little buddy, we respect people enough to let them decide how to spend their money instead of confiscating it and letting the government spend it for them.

We respect people enough to want a system where they can send their kids to the school of their choice and pay for it with the tax money that is taken from them.

We respect people enough to allow a person to leave their estate to their children without it being subject to an unreasonable "death tax".

We respect them enough to let powers not specifically given to the federal government stay at the state level so the people of a given state can have the opportunity to vote on their laws.

We respect people enough to allow the constitutional process work in presidential elections instead of petitioning the court to recount ballets only in certain counties that are known to vote for the liberal candidate.

Shall I go on?

[chillbilly]

tinknocker44
I wonder if he's the only guy born in the ME who looks like he's from California.
Don't hurt your head wondering about it. It's fairly obvious you don't want to learn about anyone. You'd just rather bash and complain like the wussy that you are.


He respected who and what people are. Pugs dont do that.

How profound. Christ didn't walk on the Earth because he respected people.
He preached love and forgiveness and died for his beliefs.
He was a warrior and you do nothing but a disservice to his life and memory by pretending to know anything about him.

Do some reading and then get back to us..........or not.

[acmanko]

Jesus said the rich should take care of the poor. sounds liberal to me

[mrs reb77]

Jesus said the rich should take care of the poor. sounds liberal to me

I think you are paraphrasing (and badly).
“You will be made rich in every way so that you can be generous on every occasion, and through us your generosity will result in thanksgiving to God” (2 Corinthians 9:11). The ideal envisioned in the Scriptures is an equality accomplished by voluntary sharing (2 Corinthians 8:13), not by forced redistribution. So we can say, at least, that God entrusts wealth to the few so that they will share it with the many.
Voluntarily. Within our own communities. Not through our 'government'. I certainly don't consider my family monetarily rich but we are rich in many other ways. We are very generous within our community as well. And no-one is forcing that.

[acmanko]

Jesus said 'give unto caesar that which is caesar's and give unto God that which is God's'. by this He meant pay your taxes to caesar and let ceasar do with it what he wants, wether he spent it on war or the poor or paid political favors.

[James 3528]

Jesus said the rich should take care of the poor. sounds liberal to me
Work hard and become a leader; be lazy and never succeed. (Proverbs 12:24)

[ga-hvac-tech]

Jesus said the rich should take care of the poor. sounds liberal to me

BUT: Jesus did not make it a law and force it upon these "rich". He suggested that they choose to do it out of the goodness of their hearts. And if within their heart there was no goodness, then they did not.

You see: This is one of the major things about Christianity: It is meant to be a positive choice and experience. And I will paint a target on myself here: I believe that any religious organization that calls itself Christian, yet tries to shove anything down someone's throat is neither following Christ, nor do they understand the Scriptures.

Have you ever spent a Saturday doing charity with nothing but a good feeling as a reward (yes, leave your business cards at home)? There is special reward one gets for giving of themselves for others. I believe this is what Christ was talking about.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Jesus said 'give unto caesar that which is caesar's and give unto God that which is God's'. by this He meant pay your taxes to caesar and let ceasar do with it what he wants, wether he spent it on war or the poor or paid political favors.

IMO: read the entire context carefully. The local religious leaders (that were BTW also political leaders) were trying to trick Jesus into saying something they could use against Him. When he said "give unto Ceaser what is Ceaser's" He was saying to pay your taxes (do not actively cheat on them).

Now I would like to ask you to show me where it says the rest of what you inver: Letting Ceaser do as he chooses....

No, I do not think you will be able to find Scripture that says to be a wuss about political involvement. What I do think you will find is lots of Scripture that helps us understand how to make sense and order of our lives. The problem IMO is that most folks do not want to follow God's leadership. They want to be independent.

Show me where following a Scriptural principle will mess up your life?

[acmanko]

how about an Eye for an Eye or splitting a baby in half like Solomon wanted to do

[coolwhip]

I think jesus was a communist:eek: :D and a hippie to boot! (not Boots).

Kinda like John Lennon.

[acmanko]

The Davidians followed Scripture, but none are left and Jim Jones followers are not around to talk about it

[bootlen]

The Davidians followed Scripture, but none are left and Jim Jones followers are not around to talk about it


Whose Scripture?

[bootlen]

Jesus said the rich should take care of the poor. sounds liberal to me

That's because you have interpreted what He said incorrectly. The way He said to help the poor is to give them jobs to earn a living. He also said, "He who will not work, neither shall he eat."

[bootlen]

Jesus said 'give unto caesar that which is caesar's and give unto God that which is God's'. by this He meant pay your taxes to caesar and let ceasar do with it what he wants, wether he spent it on war or the poor or paid political favors.

And "Caesar", in our case is the people. We are supposed to be a government of, for, and by the people.

I realize you probably cannot correlate all this so maybe you should be quiet till you can.

[bootlen]

how about an Eye for an Eye or splitting a baby in half like Solomon wanted to do

Ah, yes. The old "eye for an eye" issue. The text had to do with punishment of the guilty administered by teh government. In other words, the punishment should fit the crime.

Over yer head, ac? Yah. I thought so.

[tinknocker44]

He preached love and forgiveness and died for his beliefs. by Childbill

Hey stupid, does this sound like a pug to you? Loving and forgiving a chimp doesnt count.

[tinknocker44]

IMO: read the entire context carefully. The local religious leaders (that were BTW also political leaders) were trying to trick Jesus into saying something they could use against Him. When he said "give unto Ceaser what is Ceaser's" He was saying to pay your taxes (do not actively cheat on them).

Now I would like to ask you to show me where it says the rest of what you inver: Letting Ceaser do as he chooses....

No, I do not think you will be able to find Scripture that says to be a wuss about political involvement. What I do think you will find is lots of Scripture that helps us understand how to make sense and order of our lives. The problem IMO is that most folks do not want to follow God's leadership. They want to be independent.

Show me where following a Scriptural principle will mess up your life?

Jesus didnt believe in taxes? I never seen a pug politician not want them. More hypocrisy from the right. Their just using Jesus to get what they want from you.

[acmanko]

Whose Scripture? Most of it was scripture from what we know as the Old Testament

[acmanko]

That's because you have interpreted what He said incorrectly. The way He said to help the poor is to give them jobs to earn a living. He also said, "He who will not work, neither shall he eat." my interpretation is just as valid as yours

[acmanko]

Caesar was the Emporer, he could do what he wanted.

[bootlen]

my interpretation is just as valid as yours

I agree. But the interpretation to which I referred was God's as found in other Scripture.

You continue to post ignorantly.

[bootlen]

Most of it was scripture from what we know as the Old Testament

Nope. Wrong. For instance, nowhere in OT Scripture do you find Koresh is Savior.

Now, maybe YOU think he was but you would be quite incorrect.

[chillbilly]

tinknocker44
Hey stupid, does this sound like a pug to you?


Here's a rubicks cube for the retard.
If libs are so respectful, how do we account for the higher poll numbers we observe as it relates to name calling on this forum? And on both polls, no less.
Is name calling not a sign of disrespect?....dumbass? :D :D
(Also note that I don't respect you)
How do we account for people like you who show contempt and disrespect for everyone you deem a "pug" with every single post you puke?
So, if liberals aren't disrespectful you must be a pug....or just a horribly bad liberal. :D

If you can't grasp simple concepts and produce thoughts of your own, you'll always be considered a standing joke on this forum.

[ga-hvac-tech]

how about an Eye for an Eye or splitting a baby in half like Solomon wanted to do

An Eye for an Eye is not actually Scriptural, just like your inferred example of Kind Soloman and splitting a baby in half is not either. One needs to read Scripture in context, rather than taking out a phrase and mis-interpreting it.

Example: The story about King Soloman: Two sisters that lived together had babies. One rolled over and suffocated her baby in sleep. Then the one stole the baby from the other. The other cried foul. They took the problem to King Soloman.

At this point, we need to divert for a minute: When Soloman was a young lad, God asked him in a vision what he wanted. Mind you, he coudl have said wealth, power, women, etc. But no, Soloman said he wanted wisdom, he wanted to be one of the wisest men alive, so he could serve God better. So God gave him wisdom. BTW: Soloman was the offspring of King David and Bathsheba, the lady he stole in an adultrous affair. Jesus Christ came from that blood line also... Figure that one out...

OK, back to the story of two mothers and one baby: King Soloman, being the wise person he was; saw that he could solve this problem easily. The real mother would instinctly love the child more than the other. So Soloman faked the idea of killing the child to see which mother loved the life of hte child more than her own selfish desires.

Easy lesson there: Look deep within the heart of someone, you will find the truth about their motivations, desires, and goals.

You see, one needs to read the WHOLE story to understand Scripture.

Now, as I mentioned earlier: Can anyone show me where they followed a Biblical principle in their life and it caused them harm???

[bootlen]

An Eye for an Eye is not actually Scriptural,


I think I understand you correctly to mean that taken out of context, it is not Scriptural. Am I? Because Lev. 24:20 speaks to the "eye for an eye" issue. But it MUST be taken in context to understand what was being said. Of course, the same holds true in the threatened dissection of the baby.

And naturally, all of this is way over ac's head.

[tinknocker44]

Here's a rubicks cube for the retard.
If libs are so respectful, how do we account for the higher poll numbers we observe as it relates to name calling on this forum? And on both polls, no less.

Hey stupid its like 3 to 1 con to dem on this board. Duh.


Is name calling not a sign of disrespect?....dumbass? :D :D
(Also note that I don't respect you)

Ya it is, stupid.

How do we account for people like you who show contempt and disrespect for everyone you deem a "pug" with every single post you puke?
So, if liberals aren't disrespectful you must be a pug....or just a horribly bad liberal. :D

I used to be a pug. I smartened up. You should try it.

If you can't grasp simple concepts and produce thoughts of your own, you'll always be considered a standing joke on this forum.

Then we have something in common, stupid.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Jesus didnt believe in taxes? I never seen a pug politician not want them. More hypocrisy from the right. Their just using Jesus to get what they want from you.

Well Tink, you and I dis-agree on a lot of things... but this is one we agree on. But then, I have seen all kinds "use" religion to pad their "smoke machine".

What about this: If one really understood Scripture, would they be able to sort out the smoke and the truth???

[tinknocker44]

Well Tink, you and I dis-agree on a lot of things... but this is one we agree on. But then, I have seen all kinds "use" religion to pad their "smoke machine".

What about this: If one really understood Scripture, would they be able to sort out the smoke and the truth???

With so many interpretations i'm not sure anyone really understands it. Shouldnt that tell us something?

[ga-hvac-tech]

I think I understand you correctly to mean that taken out of context, it is not Scriptural. Am I? Because Lev. 24:20 speaks to the "eye for an eye" issue. But it MUST be taken in context to understand what was being said. Of course, the same holds true in the threatened dissection of the baby.

And naturally, all of this is way over ac's head.

I agree with you Boot. As I remember it (probably should get out THE book and check), what you are referring to is part of the Mosaic Law. Back in the days before Christ, the children of Israel were under the Law. Now we as Christians are under Grace. It does not nullify the law, it justifies the law. But not from a perspective of performance (I am ok in God's eyes because I do this and do not do that). God says we are righteous because of what Christ did on the cross. End of discussion. And like a parent, if we screw up God will discipline us. But the difference is that our acceptance by God does NOT depend on us, it depends on God's character. BIG difference here.

Now I am NOT saying we can have a sloppy attitude towards sin. Sin reaps a reward, and that does not change. But it does not separate us from God. Yes, we may not be able to appreciate His grace; but the grace, as well as His presence are still there.

We tend to think it is about us, but it is not. It is about HIM!!!!!!!!!!!

[ga-hvac-tech]

With so many interpretations i'm not sure anyone really understands it. Shouldnt that tell us something?

Well, IMO yes (but I suspect not what you were referring to). If I was confused because I saw too many interpretations of something, I would look until I found a way to sort them out and find the truth.

I think I have done that. Here is what happened to me: I will not go through the long series of events, but suffice it to say I was more than over the edge emotionally. I was ready to jump off a bridge, and SCREAMED some things at God that are funny now.

God met me at the bottom of my life and taught me that knowing 'about' Him was one thing; but 'knowing' Him was another! What I am referring to is a relationship with Him.

Here is an example: Lets say you wanted to write a Doctoral Thesis for your Political Science graduate degree. And you (liberals) chose Bill Clinton as your subject (the conservatives can choose Ronald Reagan). Question: Would you learn more about Bill Clinton (or Ronald Reagan) the person by reading a dozen books about him, or by spending a few months with him day and night? Of course the later.

Well, this is what I learned: I stepped out and started talking to God day and night about literally everything in my life. And I had these 'gut' instincts that I thought were Him responding. But I was not sure. So I prayed long and hard over months for God to teach me how to hear His voice. And He did. Now I cannot describe it to you, but I will tell you that I KNOW that voice better than I know the voice of my best friend. It is just one of those things that does not lend itself to logic.

I will also tell you that what I did is absolutely Scriptural, and hearing His voice is also absolutely Scriptural.

Each of us comes to a point of 'God-consciousness'. And each of us makes a decision. Some of us follow, and some reject. Those that follow see and experience things that the world just does not know or understand. It is a special place, one that only those that go there can understand.

O K, I will step down from the podium. But I can assure you this is truth. But at the same time, you will not see it until you choose to pursue it with ALL of your heart!

[bootlen]

I'm with you there, Brother. But the Leviticus passage was how those accused of crimes should be sentenced. It is not in contradiction to Christ's admonition to "turn the other cheek".

The former has to do with nation/crimes while the latter has to do with one person/another person.

[ga-hvac-tech]

I'm with you there, Brother. But the Leviticus passage was how those accused of crimes should be sentenced. It is not in contradiction to Christ's admonition to "turn the other cheek".

The former has to do with nation/crimes while the latter has to do with one person/another person.

Hi Boot,

I would probably best divert to you on this one. Honestly, after that 'experience' I had back in 1990, I have mostly camped out in the Pauline Epistles. I am a GRACE person through and through. Guess it shows after a while...

THX for the comments.

[bootlen]

Well, if you're gonna camp out, the Pauline epistles are a great campground! My favorite has always been Romans, and particularly the 8th chapter. But the whole letter just lays everything out so well. For me, it answered every single question I had about our relationship with God...saved or unsaved.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Well, if you're gonna camp out, the Pauline epistles are a great campground! My favorite has always been Romans, and particularly the 8th chapter. But the whole letter just lays everything out so well. For me, it answered every single question I had about our relationship with God...saved or unsaved.

I like Romans also. There is a profound truth in that book. I particularly like the part in CH 5-6-7 about my 'death' and Christ as my life. Tuff for most to grasp, but it really gave me hope. And having my hope in Christ rather than (anything) else, there is a lot of peace.

The person that God used to 'bring me around' was a firm believer in Romans and the Pauline Epistles, guess that is where I got that bent from.

Have you ever read:

1) GraceWalk
2) The Rest of the Gospel
3) LifeTime Guarantee
4) Freedom in Christ

These are all contemporary books that present the principle in Galatians 2:20.

Some more traditional books are written by:

Watchman Nee
A W Tosier
Anna Whitehall Smith
Hudson Taylor
G Campbell Morgan
And a host more.

They were seeking God with ALL their heart, and God revealed things to them that are absolutely profound. I consider myself to be very blessed (and outside of Christ, not worthy) to have been allowed to see just a little of what these folks were privy to.

Hey Boot, Do you ever get over my way? Would like to catch lunch sometime.

[tinknocker44]

Here is an example: Lets say you wanted to write a Doctoral Thesis for your Political Science graduate degree. And you (liberals) chose Bill Clinton as your subject (the conservatives can choose Ronald Reagan). Question: Would you learn more about Bill Clinton (or Ronald Reagan) the person by reading a dozen books about him, or by spending a few months with him day and night? Of course the later.


With all due respect, all you did was read a book and you never spent any time conversing with him. Lets be realistic. I went to Church school for 5 years. Thats where I got my views of religion from.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Here is an example: Lets say you wanted to write a Doctoral Thesis for your Political Science graduate degree. And you (liberals) chose Bill Clinton as your subject (the conservatives can choose Ronald Reagan). Question: Would you learn more about Bill Clinton (or Ronald Reagan) the person by reading a dozen books about him, or by spending a few months with him day and night? Of course the later.


With all due respect, all you did was read a book and you never spent any time conversing with him. Lets be realistic. I went to Church school for 5 years. Thats where I got my views of religion from.

Tink, you do not know!!!!!!!!!!!

One CAN have a real and two way relationship with God. But not on your terms, it MUST be on God's terms.

I do not want the next statement to be interpreted as slamming you, but I must be direct: If you knew 10% of what you claim to know about Scripture, you would know that God does indeed speak to those HE chooses to. And many folks have learned to hear that voice. But only those that seek God with ALL their hearts (on God's terms) hear Him.

And the rest, well they have not chosen to seek... Some will, and some will not.

It is not for me to say whether you will or will not hear Him. But I can assure you that until you seek Him, you will NOT hear him.

[tinknocker44]

Tink, you do not know!!!!!!!!!!!

One CAN have a real and two way relationship with God. But not on your terms, it MUST be on God's terms.

I do not want the next statement to be interpreted as slamming you, but I must be direct: If you knew 10% of what you claim to know about Scripture, you would know that God does indeed speak to those HE chooses to. And many folks have learned to hear that voice. But only those that seek God with ALL their hearts (on God's terms) hear Him.

And the rest, well they have not chosen to seek... Some will, and some will not.

It is not for me to say whether you will or will not hear Him. But I can assure you that until you seek Him, you will NOT hear him.

So you believe that Dumbya got his orders from God like he said?

[James 3528]

Better than the fruit cake on the democrap ticket that talks to Elanor Roosevelt.

[ga-hvac-tech]

So you believe that Dumbya got his orders from God like he said?

I do not know what God told GW Bush. I was not privy to that conversation.

But I will cite you this Scripture (both are God speaking):

"... I will never leave you nor forsake you... "

"... I will provide all your needs according to My riches in Christ Jesus..."

Now lets think for a minute: This is the King of the universe speaking. He has power and wisdom and glory beyond our imagination. And He made this promise to ALL his children (Christians).

These are two promises that God wrote in Scripture have been proven to me in my life so many times I lost count years ago. And I have many friends that would literally stake their physical lives (as I would) on this truth.

Faith this strong does not come from a post on an internet forum. It comes from years of experiences that seal beyond any doubt what the real truth is.

Until you have been there my friend, you just do not know.

As far as your comment on GW Bush; I am not too worried about it either way. My source of life is beyond this world or what this world can or cannot do to me.

Now argue with that my friend... :)

[tinknocker44]

Well I think you are ducking the question GHT. Do you think Dumbya got his orders from God to invade? Its a simple question. Yes or no?

[James 3528]

Bush never said it so the question doesn't matter. If you think he did say it, prove it.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Well I think you are ducking the question GHT. Do you think Dumbya got his orders from God to invade? Its a simple question. Yes or no?

How would I know the details of a conversation I was not privy to?

I understand that it is important to you to know this answer. But what I am not sure of is why this answer is of importance to you?

As far as answering your question as you ask me to, no I can not do that. I can only answer it in the context of my faith. And the answer is not a yes or no answer. Because I do not think it is that simple. I would answer your question with the Scripture below. But that is me, because of my faith and trust in God as mentioned in a previous post.

"... God causes ALL things to work together for good for those that love Him..." (Romans 8:28) And BTW: Read a few verses before and after if you choose. There is a wealth of truth there.

So you see, I am really not that concerned with the (yes/no) answer. Because I know it will all work out.

Remember my friend:

"... Faith is the substance of things hoped for, and the evidence of things not seen..." And I think 'seen' here can be both with ones physical eyes and also with the eyes of their soul. In simpler words: I do not have to be able to see it to believe in it... There, does that make it easier to understand?

BTW: Are you going to the convention in August? I would like to meet you and all the other libs and conservs, and say HI... And as Chill and I have laughed about: Arrange "The Great Debate" over a good steak dinner! Should be loads of fun!

[tinknocker44]

Where and when is the convention? There's a few guys I wanna beat up. Joking of course, well maybe not.

[bootlen]

Have you ever read:

1) GraceWalk
2) The Rest of the Gospel
3) LifeTime Guarantee
4) Freedom in Christ

These are all contemporary books that present the principle in Galatians 2:20.

No, I haven't had the pleasure of reading any of these. Here lately, I've spent a tremendous amount of time in Scripture rather than commentaries.

Some more traditional books are written by:

Watchman Nee
A W Tosier
Anna Whitehall Smith
Hudson Taylor
G Campbell Morgan
And a host more.

They were seeking God with ALL their heart, and God revealed things to them that are absolutely profound. I consider myself to be very blessed (and outside of Christ, not worthy) to have been allowed to see just a little of what these folks were privy to.

I've read Nee, Toser (a typically difficult read), and Taylor. My favorite writer, though, is C.S. Lewis. He has really given me perspective I could find nowhere else.

Hey Boot, Do you ever get over my way? Would like to catch lunch sometime.

Not very often at all. The occasional Promise Keepers event but otherwise, I don't. But if I see a trip to Atlanta, I'll give you a "heads up". I'd enjoy the fellowship, I'm sure. And if you ever get to Beaufort, look me up. I'll give you a tour via the waterways.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Have you ever read:

1) GraceWalk
2) The Rest of the Gospel
3) LifeTime Guarantee
4) Freedom in Christ

These are all contemporary books that present the principle in Galatians 2:20.

No, I haven't had the pleasure of reading any of these. Here lately, I've spent a tremendous amount of time in Scripture rather than commentaries.

Some more traditional books are written by:

Watchman Nee
A W Tosier
Anna Whitehall Smith
Hudson Taylor
G Campbell Morgan
And a host more.

They were seeking God with ALL their heart, and God revealed things to them that are absolutely profound. I consider myself to be very blessed (and outside of Christ, not worthy) to have been allowed to see just a little of what these folks were privy to.

I've read Nee, Toser (a typically difficult read), and Taylor. My favorite writer, though, is C.S. Lewis. He has really given me perspective I could find nowhere else.

Hey Boot, Do you ever get over my way? Would like to catch lunch sometime.

Not very often at all. The occasional Promise Keepers event but otherwise, I don't. But if I see a trip to Atlanta, I'll give you a "heads up". I'd enjoy the fellowship, I'm sure. And if you ever get to Beaufort, look me up. I'll give you a tour via the waterways.

What is taught in the 4 books at the top is similar to Watchman Nee.

It is the Grace camp my tent is pitched in... :)

I have not been to a Promise Keepers in a long time. I did 'walk down counseling' at the meetings in 94, 95, and 96, as well as the Billy Graham gathering in 94. Then kinda drifted away. A friend if mine was there last time (fall?) doing security.

Where is your area (Beaufort)? I assume it is SC, but where in the great state are you? My 'ex' was from Spartinburg, that is about all I know of your state.

And are you planning on attending the HVAC talk convention in August? I hope we can get most of the ARP regulars up there for some fun! Even the liberals: I may dis-agree with them, but I am getting to see them as neighbors anyhow. Funny how that goes... :rolleyes:

[bootlen]

ga-tech: Where is your area (Beaufort)? I assume it is SC, but where in the great state are you? My 'ex' was from Spartinburg, that is about all I know of your state.

Beaufort is about 30 miles north of Savannah and 75 miles south of Charleston. We're at the south end of US21 about 15 miles east of US 17.

And are you planning on attending the HVAC talk convention in August? I hope we can get most of the ARP regulars up there for some fun! Even the liberals: I may dis-agree with them, but I am getting to see them as neighbors anyhow. Funny how that goes... :rolleyes:

Wasn't planning on it. We had a breast cancer scare a little over a year ago calling for 2 trips to Mayo in JAX. While we had insurance, covering 80%, we still dug deep into savings to pay the 20%. Very expensive experience but the news turned out to be good (Praise GOD!). My oldest son is getting married in September of this year and we just paid for a new roof. (When it rains, it pours, no?) So you can see an HVAC-Talk convention is pretty low on the priorities list as trips go. But if something broke so I could make it, I'm there.

I bet you will do just fine without me.;)