Texas to secede from the union?

[coolwhip]

If this happens, Im moving to Texas! Great work Texas...you RAWK!
http://blog.chron.com/txpotomac/2012/11/the-petition-to-let-texas-secede-from-the-u-s-to-be-reviewed-by-the-white-house/

[jmac00]

uuum don't get to excited there. These petitions are started by private citizens. They have no merit and no traction.

any petition to leave the union would have to start with a State Legislature.

Right now, I think, There are at least 15 petitions in 15 states to secede.

http://now.msn.com/15-states-start-petitons-to-leave-the-usa

Good luck with that

[coolwhip]

One can hope! :)

[jmac00]

Hell if they DO succeed, Im with you, I'll be outa the Peoples Republic of NY in a heart beat.

I heard there is a serious petition to have NYC become the 51st State, that would be awesome.

[AStudent]

I knew it wouldn't be long before Texas became part of Mexico again. Without the backing of the USA and with all the immigrants already inside their border a takeover would not be difficult.

[hearthman]

One way to dodge the impending UN sanctioned confiscation of guns is to secede. Then the Republic of Texas would not be held to the UN sanctions. The biggest hurdle would be how to deal with the military complex located within the borders. The RoT would be free to enforce borders, regulate taxes, negotiate trade agreements with the US and deport US citizens who don't have the proper photo ID, passports and visas. They could fence in the entire Republic and set up sliding boards over the fences where rejects could be deported by sliding them back into the US. No air travel, no customs hassles, no court battles--just effective control and let the other countries, such as the US cry.

[coolwhip]

I like the way hearthman thinks!

[netsalt]

Just you traitors remember







































Don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya!

[A/C guy's chick]

I love Texas ...with that being said ...when you cry for certain thing"s that you can't get anymore because it's made here , you'll understand ...I love Texas...born & raised ...will fight till I die

[chaard]

Great work Texas...you RAWK!
http://blog.chron.com/txpotomac/2012/11/the-petition-to-let-texas-secede-from-the-u-s-to-be-reviewed-by-the-white-house/

Don't tease us.

[chaard]

Just you traitors remember
Don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya!

I guess you believe our founding fathers were traitors.


We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

[corny]

I guess you believe our founding fathers were traitors.

In a way I suppose they were. Otherwise they wouldnt have had to have fought the revolutionary war.

Anyhow... Texas nor any other state is going to succede from the union.... Seriously.... think about what that would take.

I see those petitions as merely a protest........ "We are not satisfied so instead of doing something tangible to help further our cause we are all just going to sign a petition and waste time and resources talking about how great it would be to succede from the union"

And yes.... those yellow bellied mud wallerin redneck southern rebels were traitors also.....

I put that last line in just give Glenn something to hoot and hollar about....lol

[netsalt]

I guess you believe our founding fathers were traitors.

Maybe not in our eyes,but in the eyes of the crown they were. It all depends on your perspective.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Well... it appears my thoughts of moving back home (GA is from Texas) might be a good idea...

All they (we) have to do is bring the head of a few big oil co's to Dallas, then we can export gasoline to the USA... Wash DC has held the country hostage for decades... Time for Texas to hold the country hostage for a while.

I imagine living in Texas would be a premium thing... there would probably be a waiting list to immigrate.

Problem is: I heard on the radio this morning Gov Rick Perry is against it. Gotta have the state govt on board to make it happen.

And GeerAir will have to be deported... his liberal stances just will not fit... <grin>

[tunnel_rat]

Wait until the realities of Dear Leader Care kick in..... Even the Obama phone holders will be standing there scratching their heads.........Texas won't be alone.

[AStudent]

So you all think Texas can hold it's own against Mexico as well as the millions of illegals already living there?

[dsprice]

Although Texas has the legal ability to succeed, its not going to happen. Born and raised, these petitions have been circulated my whole life.

[chaard]

So you all think Texas can hold it's own against Mexico as well as the millions of illegals already living there?

I can't see any state seceding without a fight.
But if you took a fraction of the 25+mil people, I'd guess 1/5 would be locked and loaded and ready to defend. That would be about 5million armed citizens.
Just playing with the numbers.

[qwerty hvac]

Hell if they DO succeed, Im with you, I'll be outa the Peoples Republic of NY in a heart beat.

I heard there is a serious petition to have NYC become the 51st State, that would be awesome.

Same here. That would be awesome!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[ga-hvac-tech]

I can't see any state seceding without a fight.
But if you took a fraction of the 25+mil people, I'd guess 1/5 would be locked and loaded and ready to defend. That would be about 5million armed citizens.
Just playing with the numbers.

In Texas... I would say at least HALF of them would be itchin' to get FREE! Just their nature... :)

[chaard]

In Texas... I would say at least HALF of them would be itchin' to get FREE! Just their nature... :)
just trying to be conservative with the numbers. Btw, that's 3x's the number of our military.
Honestly I don't think it'll happen.

[ga-hvac-tech]

This is a few years old... however: There were more hunting licenses issued in W.VA, PA, OH, IO than there are trained soldiers in all 5 branches of the US military (national guard being #5).

Now add in there the LOVE of FREEDOM that is a 'right' in Texas... well I do not give the military much of a chance... :)

However as you say... probably not gonna happen.

IMO TPTB enjoy 'milking' the US economy... they are not gonna do anything to screw that up.

[AStudent]

This isn't a game of numbers like it was in the olden days of line up and fire.

[hydra]

Everyone is forgetting one important point. Allowing Texas or any other state to secede,would surely cause panic on wall street and crash our fragile economy, sending investors scrambling and leaving Republicans, Democrats, and Independents penniless and destitute. I personally would not want that on my conscience. Also imagine the Taxes that Texas would need to collect to maintain interstates, bridges, schools, social security etc. Sorry to be Debbie Downer but let's face it, unless you have 40 acres and a mule and know how to use it and mason jars full of bullion buried beneath it, you are a slave to wall street and big government just like the rest of us!

[corny]

I heard a guy in the store on the way home tonite whining about he was going to canada or australia.... I just wanted to take a big stick and beat him senseless.... him and the stupid redneck yokels agreeing with him.....

Yes, things are not going our way......lets cut ourselves off from the rest of the nation.......lol Just think about the complexity that it would involve....and the previous poster is right.....just think of the taxes that would have to be raised to match the federal money that pours into texas.

Texas couldnt get rid of the illegals either......there is just too many of them. They couldnt muster the manpower or the resources to even round up a fraction of them. Thats why the US doesnt get serious about it...... For every 5 we deport another 100 come crawling in.

You would have to shoot them on sight to make a dent in the numbers and even texans aint got the guts the just start shooting people....even if the government did condone it.

[chaard]

Looks like 11 more states including Missouri have jumped into the fray.

What I don't get is why the WH is getting the petitions.

http://www.ky3.com/news/ky3-some-missouri-arkansas-residents-file-petitions-to-secede-from-the-united-states-20121113,0,3426957.story

[AStudent]

Looks like 11 more states including Missouri have jumped into the fray.

What I don't get is why the WH is getting the petitions.

http://www.ky3.com/news/ky3-some-missouri-arkansas-residents-file-petitions-to-secede-from-the-united-states-20121113,0,3426957.story

So far only Texas has the required amount of signatures.

[chaard]

And I'm sure Obama is going to start a nice bonfire with them.

[mcjo tech]

Hey Texas

Go For It!!

See I can agree with the Conservs on some things. :grin2:

I think it is a GREAT idea!

Probably won't be allowed in the NFL if they do.

Which is ok with me since I can't stand them Cowboys anyway.

Now the NFL can get a team in LA without expansion.

[hearthman]

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/wh-petition-calls-stripping-citizenship-and-exile-anyone-who-signs-petition-secede_663282.html

Evil does not take a holiday.

[chaard]

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/wh-petition-calls-stripping-citizenship-and-exile-anyone-who-signs-petition-secede_663282.html

Evil does not take a holiday.

I thought you could not strip a US citizen of their citizenship?

[hearthman]

When you have a dictator in power, he can do whatever he wants.

[AStudent]

So you are complaining that the people of a state that no longer wants to be part of the USA will be stripped of citizenship?

I mean....yeah they cant take your citizenship away, but you are giving it away when you decide to seceed.

Am I missing something here?

[glennac]

So you are complaining that the people of a state that no longer wants to be part of the USA will be stripped of citizenship?

I mean....yeah they cant take your citizenship away, but you are giving it away when you decide to seceed.

Am I missing something here?

Yeah you sure are. They wouldn't be giving it away until and unless Texas does succeed and is recognized by the US as a sovereign country.

If the US does not recognize the succession then they by default are still citizens of the US including those who exercised their first Amendment rights in signing the petition and who live in Texas. Pretty simple. Comprendi?

However with a communist dictator for our President I guess anything can happen. Thank you, thank you very much

[ga-hvac-tech]

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/wh-petition-calls-stripping-citizenship-and-exile-anyone-who-signs-petition-secede_663282.html

Evil does not take a holiday.


I thought you could not strip a US citizen of their citizenship?


When you have a dictator in power, he can do whatever he wants.

This is kinda a long read... however if one looks at what the govt has done recently... there seems to be a pattern... and a SCARY pattern if one thinks they still have any Constitutional rights left...

Read and weep for what we lost in our country:

http://www.silverbearcafe.com/private/12.10/judo.html

[ga-hvac-tech]

So you are complaining that the people of a state that no longer wants to be part of the USA will be stripped of citizenship?

I mean....yeah they cant take your citizenship away, but you are giving it away when you decide to seceed.

Am I missing something here?

What you are missing is if someone is stripped of their citizenship... they no longer have any constitutional rights... As in the govt can treat you like a dog and there is nothing legal that can be done about it. Note the petition only said if you signed the petition... not anything more. Might want to think real hard about what a less than honest person would do with that power?

[Sicofthis]

Everyone is forgetting one important point. Allowing Texas or any other state to secede,would surely cause panic on wall street and crash our fragile economy, sending investors scrambling and leaving Republicans, Democrats, and Independents penniless and destitute. I personally would not want that on my conscience. Also imagine the Taxes that Texas would need to collect to maintain interstates, bridges, schools, social security etc. Sorry to be Debbie Downer but let's face it, unless you have 40 acres and a mule and know how to use it and mason jars full of bullion buried beneath it, you are a slave to wall street and big government just like the rest of us!

They already pay for the roads schools and such.

[glennac]

What you are missing is if someone is stripped of their citizenship... they no longer have any constitutional rights... As in the govt can treat you like a dog and there is nothing legal that can be done about it. Note the petition only said if you signed the petition... not anything more. Might want to think real hard about what a less than honest person would do with that power?

How can they be stripped of their citizenship when they did not break a law. The first Amendment guarantees the right of free speech and the right to sign petitions. They did not take up arms. Thank you, thank you very much

[AStudent]

Yeah....that won't happen, just like these secessions won't happen.

I hope.

[AStudent]

What you are missing is if someone is stripped of their citizenship... they no longer have any constitutional rights... As in the govt can treat you like a dog and there is nothing legal that can be done about it. Note the petition only said if you signed the petition... not anything more. Might want to think real hard about what a less than honest person would do with that power?

Sorry, missed the whole taking their citizenship before they secede part....that's just stupid and won't happen.
It's been a long day.

[ga-hvac-tech]

How can they be stripped of their citizenship when they did not break a law. The first Amendment guarantees the right of free speech and the right to sign petitions. They did not take up arms. Thank you, thank you very much

Hmmm... the way I read the exec order... it was simple: If you sign a petition, you loose your citizenship... And after all, it IS an exec order... supposedly those are above the law.
So if one is gonna take the worst possible interpretation... then anyone who signs a petition is screwed. OTOH: the politics of that move would be drawing a line in the sand which would be severely tested by many a TRUE American. I seriously doubt even the 'super-majority' in California could stand up to that test.

Student is probably right... both sides of this discussion are really just smoke: That is; No state will succeed, and the current administration will not do anything punitive to the folks who try.

Now OTOH: If a state were to secceed forcefully... well that might be a different story. Lets cross that bridge when we get close enough to see it.

Now for GA's opinion: The SOUTH SHALL RISE AGAIN... <grin>

And with that little tidbit of folklore... it is time for some sleep. There is this thing called work, and there is some to do the rest of this week... :)

[chaard]

So if I sign the petition I get a free trip out of the country? Where do I sign.?
:grin2:

[jmac00]

Executive Orders are not above the law, the Executive Order is a means by which the President can "get things done" without going through the hassle of consulting Congress. Whatever the EO is, it can be challenged in court

One thing we should keep in mind: A state legislature needs to approve any Secession from the Union.

[printer2]

The petition to strip someone of citizenship is stupid and would be ignored as it should. In terms of a state actually leaving the U.S., well that is more a pipe dream than anything else. With us and Quebec wanting to leave every once in a while, I can say one thing.

You think divorce can be messy? Hah!

[ga-hvac-tech]

Executive Orders are not above the law, the Executive Order is a means by which the President can "get things done" without going through the hassle of consulting Congress. Whatever the EO is, it can be challenged in court

One thing we should keep in mind: A state legislature needs to approve any Secession from the Union.

Yes, and gov Rick Perry says no so far...

[exreo]

Hell if they DO succeed, Im with you, I'll be outa the Peoples Republic of NY in a heart beat.

I heard there is a serious petition to have NYC become the 51st State, that would be awesome.

I liked Rochester when I went to visit on my Harris Corp interview a few years ago. I wish I would have taken the job, and I made a mistake not to move there.

Only 2 things maybe not so good:
1. The brutal 10% state income tax in addition to high sales tax
2. cold in the winter

[coolwhip]

With the division of people in this country increasing all the time, I see nothing wrong with states seceding from a communist future to preserve our constitutional rights.

All the liberals can live under dictators in their states.

The moderates can have their soil as well.

And patriots can live in their states under morality and true constitutional law.

So lets divide this country up! ...we can still be neighbors if that makes you happy.

[jmac00]

I liked Rochester when I went to visit on my Harris Corp interview a few years ago. I wish I would have taken the job, and I made a mistake not to move there.

Only 2 things maybe not so good:
1. The brutal 10% state income tax in addition to high sales tax
2. cold in the winter

the taxes are a huge problem. Rochester also has the highest rate of students that DO NOT graduate. We have one of the highest property taxes in the country. We have one of the highest poverty rates in NY. AND we get Lake effect snow.

70 years ago this was the place to be, HQ for Eastman Kodak, Xerox, Bausch & Lomb, Delco and Rochester Products to (they made an awesome 4 bbl carburetor for GM)

Small business is being hammered by regulations on a daily basis. Workmans Comp ins. is the highest in the country. Dept of Labor will come right out and tell you, "as a small business owner you have no rights, if a former employee files a complaint, just pay it or we'll tie you up in court for so long you'll go bankrupt" (thats actually what a DOL guy told my wife)

But the place has come unglued. It's decaying faster than most want to believe.

You made the right choice NOT to move here <sad to say>

[coolwhip]

Looky here!:patriot:


http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=14e_1352865627

[kls-ccc]

Isn't it great we have such a uniting president.

It seems more nad more states are getting on the bandwagon. If you go back and look at the electoral map most of the states that want out are red states in the middle of the country. If they all left it split the blue states. Pretty hard to hold a country together when they are physically divided, unlike the red states in the center of the country that would be all together. Also back to the map in several of the swing states that went blue it was only the large cities that swung the vote the majority of the state geographicly was red so it wouldn't take much to bring them along. That doesn't leave alot left for Bronco to run does it.

[coolwhip]

Look at who feeds those blue states. IMO, the doers could starve the takers and have a coastal cleansing of America. No more honey for the takers and no more blues for the givers. :)

[chaard]

Looky here!:patriot:


http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=14e_1352865627

Interesting video. But he didn't answer the question. One POTUS in the 1800's signed an executive order that said states cannot secede.

[clifpaul]

If Texas won't be allowed to secede maybe we can get Mexico to declare war on the US and re-annex the southwest. Viva la reconquista!

[netsalt]

Look at who feeds those blue states. IMO, the doers could starve the takers and have a coastal cleansing of America. No more honey for the takers and no more blues for the givers. :)

You need to get your facts straight. The states that voted R for the most part are the takers and the ones that voted D are the makers. If you insist I can cite many sources but a simple Google search would confirm that the red states in general get more fed money back than they pay.

[acmanko]

That silly person that started the petition did so by using the Rank of Texas economy compared to the Countries of the World. He failed to realize the massive Military spending that Texas gets for Jets helicopters and other militay goods that would just disappear.

As for these people that want to leave, I've been looking into the Countries with Conservative governments and almost everyone will not allow citizens to possess fire arms.

And last but not least

The word is Secede not succeed.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Probably it will not happen... however a message is being sent... and with that message being sent is the rallying of the folks who send the message!

Somehow (and I still do not understand) not enough folks thought it important enough to vote out the idiots... IMO they were not motivated (yet). Movements like this secession thingy are motivators... what we need to do is put out this fire by throwing gasoline on it... <grin>

Lessee if the 2014 election will throttle back the DEMS and their goofiness...

[ga-hvac-tech]

That silly person that started the petition did so by using the Rank of Texas economy compared to the Countries of the World. He failed to realize the massive Military spending that Texas gets for Jets helicopters and other militay goods that would just disappear.

As for these people that want to leave, I've been looking into the Countries with Conservative governments and almost everyone will not allow citizens to possess fire arms.

And last but not least

The word is Secede not succeed.

OK Ace... I can have a little fun with you... Are you gonna tell me you have never done a typo... come on now Ace... stick your neck out... I have a meat cleaver waiting... <grin>

The countries you are looking at are not TRUE conservative nations... as usual you judge with surface details. There has to be NO govt operated safety nets for a country to truly function as a conservative nation.

There is more than enough oil revenues in Texas to pay for a goodly part of those military contracts... Now if this secession thingy really flew (which we know it will not)... half the country (most of the red states) would be on it... That much RE could set up an economy that would tick. Problem is; folks would have to go back to work...

[acmanko]

I really don't buy into the red state blue state division. I see it more as reddish purple or blueish purple.

The muslim conservative states don't have safety nets

As fir oil , yes Texas has oil. But the US could apply sanctions and then they could not sell it

And no. I've never made a typo. So put the cleaver away

[chaard]

You need to get your facts straight. The states that voted R for the most part are the takers and the ones that voted D are the makers. If you insist I can cite many sources but a simple Google search would confirm that the red states in general get more fed money back than they pay.

Dang that's a lot of red.:whistle:

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r219/chaard/countymaprb512.png

Notice most of the blue is near the water. Wonder what they were drinking.

[netsalt]

Dang that's a lot of red.:whistle:

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r219/chaard/countymaprb512.png

Notice most of the blue is near the water. Wonder what they were drinking.

That is a county map - the state map really does look different.
Oh by the way desalination is not a major source of drinking water in the US.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Dang that's a lot of red.:whistle:

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r219/chaard/countymaprb512.png

Notice most of the blue is near the water. Wonder what they were drinking.

Now we know why they are terrified of imaginary global warming... they would have to move to a RED state and learn to work for a living.

Another thing to observe: If one researched county by county, they would find the LARGE majority of federal safety net spending goes to the blue counties. Now it does not even take a grade school student (much less an A student... LOL) to realize what is going on here.

[chaard]

That is a county map - the state map really does look different.
Oh by the way desalination is not a major source of drinking water in the US.

I'm quite aware of that.

[ga-hvac-tech]

I really don't buy into the red state blue state division. I see it more as reddish purple or blueish purple.

The muslim conservative states don't have safety nets

As fir oil , yes Texas has oil. But the US could apply sanctions and then they could not sell it

And no. I've never made a typo. So put the cleaver away

Ace, you REALLY need to get back on your meds... this post is OUT THERE... <grin>

[coolwhip]

If we played out my scenario, I guarantee 2/3rds of all liberal mucks would starve to death. Nothing but concrete where the libs live...maybe they could eat that after eating each other?

[acmanko]

You could find nirvana in India. They have a caste system. You could walk amongst the untouchables

[glennac]

Ace if Texas secedes you would have to move or face a trial for treason. LOL. Thank you very much

[acmanko]

Governor Perry thinks it's a bad idea. That should end speculation for you

[jmac00]

Looky here!:patriot:


http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=14e_1352865627

you did notice that all most every single instance that a secession was attempted was when the states government started the secession process and it took a number of years to accomplish the task of with drawing from the Union.

although I am hopeful Texas does secede, my son lives there so I'll have a place to stay when I move there LOL

[AStudent]

you did notice that all most every single instance that a secession was attempted was when the states government started the secession process and it took a number of years to accomplish the task of with drawing from the Union.

although I am hopeful Texas does secede, my son lives there so I'll have a place to stay when I move there LOL

What's scary is that IF Texas doesn't get taken over by Mexico, will they allow immigration into their "country"....would you have to denounce US citizenship? Would you like the new Texas once you did all that?

[ga-hvac-tech]

What's scary is that IF Texas doesn't get taken over by Mexico, will they allow immigration into their "country"....would you have to denounce US citizenship? Would you like the new Texas once you did all that?

Interesting questions...

I would think if we indeed had the Republic of Texas (actually was such a country back when... look it up), then yes, one would have to become a citizen of Texas (or live as a non-citizen immigrant). I would suspect, as it is now, as long as one is a US citizen (regardless of where they live), they have to pay income tax to the US govt (regardless of what tax they pay anywhere else). SOOO

One would not make the decision to move to the Republic of Texas lightly... because it would require applying for citizenship as well as renouncing one's citizenship in the USA. Over the years, GA has thought about leaving the USA for one reason or another... and actually did some online research on this. Couple of things:
*There is NOWHERE in the current world where one has near the freedom or rights at the USA... even including the losses we have suffered to date.
*As noted above: One has to pay taxes to the USA unless one renounces their US citizenship.
*If one ever chooses to re-enter the USA and apply for citizenship again... they cannot vote or own a firearm. Now a new immigrant can... but someone that left and came back cannot. Wonder what is up with that...
SOOO: The decision to leave is kinda a one-way decision... more or less.

Now if Texas DID succeed in seceding and forming the Republic of Texas... I would have to take a HARD look at what I was getting into before I went... probably go anyhow... as long as FREEDOM was still the foundation of the state. The one issue that would loom in my mind would be: What if the RoT (Republic of Texas) does not make it, the USA takes it over by force... and I am left without the rights I used to have as a US citizen? Hmmm... I guess under those circumstances I could live as a greencard immigrant in the USA... acting like I was poor (regardless of the truth), and live off govt services. HMMM may not be a bad deal... let those arrogant libs pay my way... <grin>

Having said all this... I think Texas could put Mexico to shame in a fight... You just have to know the determination a Texan has... Ever wonder what it means "Don't mess with Texas"... well try it and see what happens. It is not the state, it is the folks who live there... they are motivated folks who love their freedom enough to fight for it!!! BTW: That is a good example of the founding fathers; they loved freedom enough to fight for it... that was the way the USA was formed. I guess in a round-about way... A Texan is similar to the founding fathers. OK you libs... there is something to think about!

[corny]

I find it sort of hilarious and sad at the same time that many of the ones on here who talk like they love the USA so much....... would leave it at the drop of a hat if they could......

If the chinese ever invade.....which they wont....but I got to use this as my example....

But if the chinese ever invade I bet everyone here....US posters that is......will all be sporting "Id rather be RED than DEAD" t shirts and bumper stickers....probably some signs in their yards....

Cause it looks like this place is full of people who would rather switch than fight.....

It would probably just me and Glenn fighting side by side killing as many of those commie bastards as we can before they finally wear us down to the point where we are physically unable to beat another commie to death....

While the rest of you cower in fear with the your "id rather be RED than DEAD tshirts on....and those silly chinamans caps on too.... standing their with your rice bowl and your chopsticks in your hand wondering when the food wagon is going to be by with your moldy rotten rice with rat droppings in it......and then when they scoop some of that sh*t in your bowl you will thank them.

[jmac00]

I find it sort of hilarious and sad at the same time that many of the ones on here who talk like they love the USA so much....... would leave it at the drop of a hat if they could......

If the chinese ever invade.....which they wont....but I got to use this as my example....

But if the chinese ever invade I bet everyone here....US posters that is......will all be sporting "Id rather be RED than DEAD" t shirts and bumper stickers....probably some signs in their yards....

Cause it looks like this place is full of people who would rather switch than fight.....

It would probably just me and Glenn fighting side by side killing as many of those commie bastards as we can before they finally wear us down to the point where we are physically unable to beat another commie to death....

While the rest of you cower in fear with the your "id rather be RED than DEAD tshirts on....and those silly chinamans caps on too.... standing their with your rice bowl and your chopsticks in your hand wondering when the food wagon is going to be by with your moldy rotten rice with rat droppings in it......and then when they scoop some of that sh*t in your bowl you will thank them.

your out of pot again aren't you, you get delusional when that happens:rolleyes:

[AStudent]

Interesting questions...

I would think if we indeed had the Republic of Texas (actually was such a country back when... look it up), then yes, one would have to become a citizen of Texas (or live as a non-citizen immigrant). I would suspect, as it is now, as long as one is a US citizen (regardless of where they live), they have to pay income tax to the US govt (regardless of what tax they pay anywhere else). SOOO

One would not make the decision to move to the Republic of Texas lightly... because it would require applying for citizenship as well as renouncing one's citizenship in the USA. Over the years, GA has thought about leaving the USA for one reason or another... and actually did some online research on this. Couple of things:
*There is NOWHERE in the current world where one has near the freedom or rights at the USA... even including the losses we have suffered to date.
*As noted above: One has to pay taxes to the USA unless one renounces their US citizenship.
*If one ever chooses to re-enter the USA and apply for citizenship again... they cannot vote or own a firearm. Now a new immigrant can... but someone that left and came back cannot. Wonder what is up with that...
SOOO: The decision to leave is kinda a one-way decision... more or less.

Now if Texas DID succeed in seceding and forming the Republic of Texas... I would have to take a HARD look at what I was getting into before I went... probably go anyhow... as long as FREEDOM was still the foundation of the state. The one issue that would loom in my mind would be: What if the RoT (Republic of Texas) does not make it, the USA takes it over by force... and I am left without the rights I used to have as a US citizen? Hmmm... I guess under those circumstances I could live as a greencard immigrant in the USA... acting like I was poor (regardless of the truth), and live off govt services. HMMM may not be a bad deal... let those arrogant libs pay my way... <grin>

Having said all this... I think Texas could put Mexico to shame in a fight... You just have to know the determination a Texan has... Ever wonder what it means "Don't mess with Texas"... well try it and see what happens. It is not the state, it is the folks who live there... they are motivated folks who love their freedom enough to fight for it!!! BTW: That is a good example of the founding fathers; they loved freedom enough to fight for it... that was the way the USA was formed. I guess in a round-about way... A Texan is similar to the founding fathers. OK you libs... there is something to think about!

I agree.

These people wanting to leave the union....do they really know what they are getting themselves into? Or is this just another well anything is better type deal like the Obama thing.

I mean hell... I've heard people speak of leaving for Canada since Obama got reelected....until someone mentions that Canada has the same "socialism" system that they are trying to escape from.....and the person talking of leaving country has a dumbfounded look on their face.

When I see things like this happening, I can't help but question the mentality of our people in this country....are they really that ignorant?

What am I saying....of course they are...I work with the public.

[acmanko]

This secession thing has happened before. As recently as 2008 &. 2004. Why are y'all just now commenting on it

[printer2]

Would you keep the U.S. dollar? Would you take your share of the national debt? How would you split it up? Are there any federal assets in the country and who gets to keep them? If the state can succeed from the U.S. can a city succeed from the stat and remain in the U.S.A.?

While the terms of the split are being negotiated what will happen to the value of the U.S. dollar? Will China allow the assets be pulled out of their reach? Will the rest of the U.S. come to the states aid that succeeded if China decides to protect their investment?

What if negotiations on succeeding do not result in an amiable split and one side decides to protect their position militarily? Will history repeat itself? Can you name more than a handful of countries that have split up with no ill feelings?

Will the states that split have to renegotiate trade treaties? Will trade treaties have to be drawn up between the states that split and the ones that remain? (You do trade a lot between yourselves) Will other countries treat the states favourably when it comes to trade?

I could go one but you get the idea.

[acmanko]

That's what I meant when I saud the US could put sanctions on Texas and then they could mot sell the oil. Just like Iran

[syndicated]

I agree.


I mean hell... I've heard people speak of leaving for Canada since Obama got reelected....until someone mentions that Canada has the same "socialism" system that they are trying to escape from.....and the person talking of leaving country has a dumbfounded look on their face.

Canada as a socialist country? That's weird. Our corporate tax rate is nearly 1/3 of yours, capital gains tax is lower....
And our country is much better fiscally managed than yours. Just because we don't pay tens of thousands a year for private medical insurance that ends up screwing us over, doesn't make it socialist.
You guys get fed a lot of bull$hit down there about Canada.
If this is socialism, you should be so lucky.
It's a shame too, because where I live, we can't find enough HVAC guys, a lot of you would do well here I'm sure.

[AStudent]

Canada as a socialist country? That's weird. Our corporate tax rate is nearly 1/3 of yours, capital gains tax is lower....
And our country is much better fiscally managed than yours. Just because we don't pay tens of thousands a year for private medical insurance that ends up screwing us over, doesn't make it socialist.
You guys get fed a lot of bull$hit down there about Canada.
If this is socialism, you should be so lucky.
It's a shame too, because where I live, we can't find enough HVAC guys, a lot of you would do well here I'm sure.

You would just have to understand the mindset down here, most people are referring to the healthcare bill being passed...and that's why the word socialism gets passed around a lot.

I was not referring to your country as socialist.

[AStudent]

You would just have to understand the mindset down here, most people are referring to the healthcare bill being passed...and that's why the word socialism gets passed around a lot.

Edit

[printer2]

Canada as a socialist country? That's weird. Our corporate tax rate is nearly 1/3 of yours, capital gains tax is lower....
And our country is much better fiscally managed than yours. Just because we don't pay tens of thousands a year for private medical insurance that ends up screwing us over, doesn't make it socialist.
You guys get fed a lot of bull$hit down there about Canada.
If this is socialism, you should be so lucky.
It's a shame too, because where I live, we can't find enough HVAC guys, a lot of you would do well here I'm sure.

We are forced to pay for each others health care with little opportunity to use our money to get better treatment than anyone else, that makes us socialist. We can not shoot each other with our handguns so that makes us socialist. We allow gays to marry each other, need I say the obvious. And then there is... ...trying to think another one but it is not coming to me. Glenn, could you help a guy out?

[ga-hvac-tech]

Yes, however the refining capacity of Texas is a significant part of the USA... Texas could cut off gasoline from the USA also... Tit for Tat kind of thing.

Polecats tend to work out these things... as they do in today's world.

I am watching that series on History about the men who build America... Seems to me we do not have that kind of vision and drive in America anymore. And as a result we are loosing markets to other countries who do.

[printer2]

Yes, however the refining capacity of Texas is a significant part of the USA... Texas could cut off gasoline from the USA also... Tit for Tat kind of thing.

And the USA could take them stating national interest.


Polecats tend to work out these things... as they do in today's world.

And now you have faith in politicians where normally you do not. Excuse me while I take a break to laugh.


I am watching that series on History about the men who build America... Seems to me we do not have that kind of vision and drive in America anymore. And as a result we are loosing markets to other countries who do.

Oh I don't know, between Microsoft and Apple alone you are talking about a lot of wealth between two people with vision. Now with them being able to do business all over the world rather than if it were a couple of hundred years ago with them afforded the technology and the communications of the time, they would seem like U.S. Barons rather than World Wide Barons.

[AStudent]

Yes, however the refining capacity of Texas is a significant part of the USA... Texas could cut off gasoline from the USA also... Tit for Tat kind of thing.

Polecats tend to work out these things... as they do in today's world.

I am watching that series on History about the men who build America... Seems to me we do not have that kind of vision and drive in America anymore. And as a result we are loosing markets to other countries who do.

No one wants to do manual labor anymore...and who could blame them....go home physically and mentally exhausted everyday making pocket change....when nowadays its the office jobs that pay.

Who is to blame when you can sit in air conditioning and make more than you can getting calluses and bruises...the companies that pay the wages?

Myself, I've never been able to sit inside, I need a challenge everyday...plus everyone I've ever worked for hired me for the heavy lifting....it sucks being built big.

[ga-hvac-tech]

No one wants to do manual labor anymore...and who could blame them....go home physically and mentally exhausted everyday making pocket change....when nowadays its the office jobs that pay.

Who is to blame when you can sit in air conditioning and make more than you can getting calluses and bruises...the companies that pay the wages?

Myself, I've never been able to sit inside, I need a challenge everyday...plus everyone I've ever worked for hired me for the heavy lifting....it sucks being built big.

Other than age (I am on the down hill part of life, I truly wish I had the strength of my youth), you and I have similar traits.

Having said that: One does better to work SMART than hard.

[hydra]

Just because a state is painted red on some cute little map does not mean that every human being in that state agrees with the extremist views expressed here. The vast majority do not. While secession may be a wonderful utopian dream, in the melting pot that is America, it is just a dream. These are the cards we are dealt. Since the invention of the steam ship and later the airplane, the world has become a global melting pot. Races, cultures, religions and OPINIONS are co- mingling more and more and it will not stop. I don't make the rules, I just play by them. So let's focus our energies on constructive ideas that build this country up rather than tear it apart. Just my two cents!

[glennac]

Just because a state is painted red on some cute little map does not mean that every human being in that state agrees with the extremist views expressed here. The vast majority do not. While secession may be a wonderful utopian dream, in the melting pot that is America, it is just a dream. These are the cards we are dealt. Since the invention of the steam ship and later the airplane, the world has become a global melting pot. Races, cultures, religions and OPINIONS are co- mingling more and more and it will not stop. I don't make the rules, I just play by them. So let's focus our energies on constructive ideas that build this country up rather than tear it apart. Just my two cents!

Well glad to hear that you don't want to tear it apart. I guess we can then assume you did not vote for the Marxist whose agenda is to tear this country apart. Thank you, thank you very much

[kls-ccc]

I just want to remind people to be careful and think about it before you sign one of those on-line petitions. It could be a data mine to come up with a list of those against our beloved liar-in-chief.

[acmanko]

I think we need to hunt them down and put them on the guillitine, off with their heads. That will shut them up.

[acmanko]

On second thought that may be a little extreme. After all, the Latinos might need them to do yard work. At the least , they should have to show a drivers license to sign

[ga-hvac-tech]

I think every time that power monger gets away with something.... he will get bolder... until enough folks have had enough and put pressure on their congresscritter to do something.

Kinda like the playground bully: Sooner or later someone decides to deal with it... And as we all know: The barbie-doll teacher does not. Understand?

[glennac]

We are forced to pay for each others health care with little opportunity to use our money to get better treatment than anyone else, that makes us socialist. We can not shoot each other with our handguns so that makes us socialist. We allow gays to marry each other, need I say the obvious. And then there is... ...trying to think another one but it is not coming to me. Glenn, could you help a guy out?

Well let's see here printer. The first thing coming to my mind is your lack of a statue guaranteeing "freedom of speech" in your Constitution or laws. Instead you have statues suppressing freedom of speech in issues that are not politically correct.

This would cover certain subjects in History, Religion, Race, Culture and beliefs if it criticizes (true or not) any group of "protected" folks. I believe you know what I am talking about here since it has been discussed before.

While this is not an exclusive issue with socialist countries it is a definer of how free a country is and your country doesn't score very high here I'm afraid. Glad to assist you in your otherwise excellent post. Thank you, thank you very much

[acmanko]

Perry has been in power longer than any Texas Governor, maybe that's why he is agin it

[AC5096]

Perry has been in power longer than any Texas Governor, maybe that's why he is agin it

My condolences. I thought the GOP was for term limits? Maybe just for Democrats???

[acmanko]

Some quirky law , but we've had him since GWB was selected President. I thought we might get lucky if he had won the GOP nomination. He would have had to resign

[clifpaul]

It'll be nice when Governor Goodhair gets out of office.

[tunnel_rat]

It'll be nice when Governor Goodhair gets out of office.
Why? Had enough of responsible government? Yea, Vote Dem. maybe you can wind up like Detroit, or New Orleans, run by Dems into the ground and then below it.

[tinman]

or california

[clifpaul]

Don't get me wrong, I like what he's done. I just don't like him.

[coolwhip]

Why? Had enough of responsible government? Yea, Vote Dem. maybe you can wind up like Detroit, or New Orleans, run by Dems into the ground and then below it.

If you only knew how right on this is!:yes:

[acmanko]

Prior to Perry, Texas had no highway debt. Today, with whats he's done has left us billions in debt. Good fiscal conservative my ass

[tunnel_rat]

Don't get me wrong, I like what he's done. I just don't like him.
You don't have to date him, or go to the prom with him. If he's good for the state, that's what he was elected for.

[tunnel_rat]

Prior to Perry, Texas had no highway debt. Today, with whats he's done has left us billions in debt. Good fiscal conservative my ass
Check Obama.....it would have been Trillions in debt if Perry was a dem,.......

[acmanko]

Obama has nothing to do with Perry adding highway debt to the State of Texas

[chaard]

Obama has nothing to do with Perry adding highway debt to the State of Texas

isn't it the federal govt that pays for the interstates?

[acmanko]

Interstates yes. I'm refering to the toll roads being built

[AC5096]

Interstates yes. I'm refering to the toll roads being built
Hell, Texas should be making a killing. I paid $9+change to take 130 around Austin. On the other hand there was myself and maybe four other cars on the toll road, on a Sat. afternoon.

[printer2]

Well let's see here printer. The first thing coming to my mind is your lack of a statue guaranteeing "freedom of speech" in your Constitution or laws. Instead you have statues suppressing freedom of speech in issues that are not politically correct.

This would cover certain subjects in History, Religion, Race, Culture and beliefs if it criticizes (true or not) any group of "protected" folks. I believe you know what I am talking about here since it has been discussed before.

While this is not an exclusive issue with socialist countries it is a definer of how free a country is and your country doesn't score very high here I'm afraid. Glad to assist you in your otherwise excellent post. Thank you, thank you very much

Ah, but on the flip side if the 'freedom of speech' part that you say we do not have is used to promote hatred against those protected folk is it all that a bad thing? Good of you for pointing that one out for me, I knew if there was some things that you would be the one to ask. While I am a little more tolerant to speech against one group or the other my country has decided where the line is between acceptable and what we feel is not. I do not see this being a socialist issue though as the same lack of free speech freedom has occurred in non-socialist countries. In our case we see it as a tradeoff. But as you said we have debated this topic before and there is no need to dis-rail this discussion with it. Thanks for the thumbs up on the post.

[acmanko]

Hell, Texas should be making a killing. I paid $9+change to take 130 around Austin. On the other hand there was myself and maybe four other cars on the toll road, on a Sat. afternoon.

If Texas had built the road they would be, but Perry farmed them out.

[ga-hvac-tech]

If Texas had built the road they would be, but Perry farmed them out.

I wonder if farming them out was a business decision to avoid going into DEEP debt building roads. New and better roads are always good for commerce... Seems to me Texas got the benefits without having to pay for them... Tell me what is bad about that? The market-place will regulate the tolls... folks will not pay what they do not want to... and if the private owners over-price the tolls... they might end up going broke and the state gets to keep the roads... sounds like a win-win for the citizens if they will just open their spoiled little child eyes and look into the future rather than the pain today.

Toll roads are the future... whether we like it or not. Maintenance of roads is a KILLER, because govts cannot do it efficiently. The idea of a private company doing it as an investment is fine with me... Ya know if the private co gores broke... the govt gets to keep the roads... So tell me what is wrong with that?

[geerair]

Perry has been in power longer than any Texas Governor, maybe that's why he is agin itPerry's agin' it because he made a fool of himself over this issue in the past.

They must not offer courses in Civics and Texas History at A&M.

[geerair]

Hell, Texas should be making a killing. I paid $9+change to take 130 around Austin. On the other hand there was myself and maybe four other cars on the toll road, on a Sat. afternoon.There have been times I would have gladly paid ten times that amount to bypass I-35 in Austin.

[AStudent]

I wonder if farming them out was a business decision to avoid going into DEEP debt building roads. New and better roads are always good for commerce... Seems to me Texas got the benefits without having to pay for them... Tell me what is bad about that? The market-place will regulate the tolls... folks will not pay what they do not want to... and if the private owners over-price the tolls... they might end up going broke and the state gets to keep the roads... sounds like a win-win for the citizens if they will just open their spoiled little child eyes and look into the future rather than the pain today.

Toll roads are the future... whether we like it or not. Maintenance of roads is a KILLER, because govts cannot do it efficiently. The idea of a private company doing it as an investment is fine with me... Ya know if the private co gores broke... the govt gets to keep the roads... So tell me what is wrong with that?

Longer waits sitting in line while someone digs for change?

Some people not getting to work because they forgot their wallet or are broke till payday?

We would be leasing parts of our country out to foreign countries?

Hell....we are outsourcing everything else, might as well send some more jobs and money overseas

We can't keep selling our country...it is worth more than money....especially nowadays.

I know I know....money is all that matters in this world.

[AStudent]

.

[AC5096]

There have been times I would have gladly paid ten times that amount to bypass I-35 in Austin.

I hear you. Was hung up on I35 through Austin for over 2hrs once.

[acmanko]

I35 in Austin can't hold a candle to IH 35 or IH 635 in Dallas

[ga-hvac-tech]

Longer waits sitting in line while someone digs for change?

Some people not getting to work because they forgot their wallet or are broke till payday?

We would be leasing parts of our country out to foreign countries?

Hell....we are outsourcing everything else, might as well send some more jobs and money overseas

We can't keep selling our country...it is worth more than money....especially nowadays.

I know I know....money is all that matters in this world.

Hmmm... not sure if you have them where you live... however here in GA the toll roads have 'speed passes'. You buy and put this little thingy on your winshield (really small), and you drive through the toll booth at the speed limit and it charges your CC. Works GREAT, most of the folks using the toll roads have them.

If one is soooo irresponsible they cannot even keep enough $$$ in their pocket to pay tolls... well they deserve to suffer. This is not a nation of children... it is a nation of Freedom. Being a child and taking advantage of that freedom is self destructive.

AS to the rest.... you are a student... how about doing some research:
Go back to the late 1970's and early 1980's... you will see Japan was rising as a world power. While they did not have a military, they did (past tense) have a HUGE economic engine. There was a point where the US$ was in the tank and Japan had endless $$$'s. They came to the USA and bought literally everything they could... AT TOP PRICE. What happened next is a history lesson ALL should know and remember: Japan went BUST. Now fast forward to any point in history from then to now: Japan STILL has not recovered from that irresponsible choice.

I have been saying for years (on this forum also) one needs to study history or they will be a victim of it... well it appears other countries in the world are about to be a victim of history. Just watch...

Moral of the story: Never bet against Wall Street or the US govt... you WILL loose.

[acmanko]

Good post. I have to agree. I remember well how everyone was freaking out about Japan buying up properties back in the 70's. they have not recovered yet from it

[ga-hvac-tech]

Good post. I have to agree. I remember well how everyone was freaking out about Japan buying up properties back in the 70's. they have not recovered yet from it

Yes, and I have predicted for a year now the US (and Wall Street) will stick it to China the same way. And NO, China does not have enough military to do anything about it.

Back in the early 1980's... literally NOBODY wanted US$'s... then it changed and everyone WANTED US$'s. When one takes the short term view... they miss the longer term facts. Those longer term facts are really a better picture (bigger picture), and one learns more from them. Example:
One 'could' say their life was toast because they lost a job... however in a few weeks they find another one... and life goes on. Many a time, the new job is better.
We really should learn to apply this long term view to politics and the economy.

[acmanko]

I avoid toll roads like the plague. But here they did away with tool booth personnell and everything is speed pass. Even if you do not have a toll tag, they just look up your tag and send you a bill.

[printer2]

Japan got caught up in a real estate bubble and have not been able to shed the results.

How are you guys doing?

[acmanko]

I'm doing fine. Thanks for asking. But i was smart enough to put money down and buy how much of a home I knew I could afford instead of what they told me I could afford

[clifpaul]

My place has been paid off for some time.

[acmanko]

Cool, it must be nice. We had a home in old Mesquite that was paid off, but then the hood went down hill and we had to get out, especially after someone broke in and stole my loaded shotgun.
My place has been paid off for some time.

[madhat]

Can you imagine if Romney had of won and Blue States started signing petition to succeed? Congress would have the Mililtary, just on the other side of the state lines, with Humvees, Tanks, and Armored Personel Carriers waiting to go in.

The Islamic Terrorist must be dancing in the streets over this, as Bin Laden Prophecies are coming true, via the Republican Party.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Can you imagine if Romney had of won and Blue States started signing petition to succeed? Congress would have the Mililtary, just on the other side of the state lines, with Humvees, Tanks, and Armored Personel Carriers waiting to go in.

The Islamic Terrorist must be dancing in the streets over this, as Bin Laden Prophecies are coming true, via the Republican Party.

Why would the islamists (enemies of the USA) think that? Please explain.

If Rmney had been elected, blue states would not have stepped up for secession... they are too lazy to go it alone.

[tunnel_rat]

Can you imagine if Romney had of won and Blue States started signing petition to succeed? Congress would have the Mililtary, just on the other side of the state lines, with Humvees, Tanks, and Armored Personel Carriers waiting to go in.

The Islamic Terrorist must be dancing in the streets over this, as Bin Laden Prophecies are coming true, via the Republican Party.

Last I heard, Obama has been our Dear Leader. Any Islamo fantasies comming true are thx to him. He is their greatest ally. Can you say Ben Gazi? Obama wants this country knocked down and he is doing him best to see that it happens. Talk to the Ambassador's family, see how they think Dear Leader is not the best friend the Islamo Terrorists ever had.....

[54885488]

I think i have figured out the difference between the dems and the repubs . It took a week on this forum but i have come down to the dems are a glass half full and repubs are glass half empty .

[ga-hvac-tech]

I think i have figured out the difference between the dems and the repubs . It took a week on this forum but i have come down to the dems are a glass half full and repubs are glass half empty .

I thought it was the other way around...

Personally: The glass is always at 50%... it is the viewpoint one takes that motivates or procrastinates... :)

[54885488]

Personally: The glass is always at 50%... it is the viewpoint one takes that motivates or procrastinates... Thats a good one ill have to remember that .