Perplexed - Goodman/Ruud/Trane/Amana/American Standard/Carrier

[jon99]

Hi,

We need to replace a gas/electric package unit on my mother's second home. The house is a cottage-style, 1800 sq. ft. house in the Midwest so both heating and cooling are necessary. We've received bids from 4 reputable contractors. Any one of the contractors will do an excellent job. They are all highly recommended by their clients. Each contractor has recommended a different option. We would appreciate your expert advice in helping us determine the best unit.

Our goal is to find the unit that offers the best reliablity and performance with respect to cost. Since it is a second home for my mother, it's possible that she may decide to sell the home within the next five years. She travels between two homes so the unit needs to be reliable enough that we won't have to worry about the unit going out while she is away in the winter and the pipes freezing and bursting due to no heat.

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The Options are as follows (all options are for a 3-ton, 90,000 BTU unit except for the Rudd which is 78,000 BTU):

1. Goodman/Amana contractor recommends the Amana PDG Air Command 13 SEER, 80% AFUE. It has a lifetime warranty on compressor and heat exchanger. It has a 10 year warranty on parts. The heat exchanger is heavy-duty Million-Air™ stainless-steel. The compressor is a high-efficiency Copeland® scroll. The fully insulated cabinet is constructed of painted sheet metal.

We can upgrade to the APG13 for 350. The APG13 has safety circuits with self-diagnostics, copper tube/aluminum fin coils, direct-spark ignition system with a microprocessor-based control for the entire ignition sequence. The cabinet is heavy-gauge galvanized-steel which is fully insulated and has louvered condenser coil protection.


2. Goodman/Ruud/Carrier contractor recommends the Ruud RRNA-B Series (13 SEER, 80% AFUE)with a stainless steel tubular heat exchanger and a Copeland® Compliant Scroll® Compressor. It features a direct-spark ignition and remote flame sensors. He also recommends the 10 years parts and labor warranty. He also gave us bids on the Goodman GPC13 series and the Carrier unit. He said that the Goodman was the lower tier, the Rudd was the middle tier and the Carrier unit was the upper tier.

3. Trane contractor recommends either (13SEER, 80% AFUE) the XB13c or the XL13c. The XL13c is acutally slighter cheaper with the Trane rebate offer. The XL13c has a 20 year warranty on the heat exchanger, 10 year warranty on the compressor and condenser coil and 5 years on other parts. Add 400 for the extended warranty of 10 years and labor. The main difference between the two units appears to be in the cabinet and the warranty, is this correct?

4. Goodman/American Standard contractor recommended either the Goodman GPG13 series (13 SEER, 80% AFUE) or the American Standard 2/4YCC3 or the 2/4YCX3 for 200 more. The 2/4 YCX has a 20 year warranty on the stainless steel heat exchanger, 10 year warranty on compressor and condenser and 5 years on all other parts. The main difference between the YCC and the YCX appears to tbe cabinet, the aerospace-ducted fan and the warranty.

The Goodman GPG13 series has a 20 year heat exchanger, 5 year compressor and 5 year parts warranty. It features the heavy-guage, galvanized-steel, fully insulated cabinet, saefty circuits with self-diagnostics, direct-spark ignition, copper tube/aluminum fin coils and an aluminized-steel tubular heat exchanger. He recommends the extended warranty.

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The units rank as follows in terms of cost:

1. Goodman GPG13
2. American Standard 2/4YCC3 (+ 600 additional)
3. American Standard 2/4YCX3 (+ 200 additional)
4. Amana PGD Air Command (+ 350 additional)
5. Trane XLC13 (same cost as Amana PGD)
5. Ruud RRNA-B (+ 85 additional)
6. Trane XLB13 (+ 65 additional)

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On the main components, they all use the stainless steel heat exchanger except for the Goodman unit and they all have Scroll compressors.

The problem I'm having right now is in determining if all the compressors are equal and what other differences there are between the units that matter such as the burner assembly, controls, pressure protection and diagnostic modules. Is it true that the Goodman unit has "no-name" controls in it? Also, does it matter that the Goodman unit doesn't have the stainless steel heat exchanger as long as I have the extended warranty?

Does the Goodman lifetime warranty for furnaces with the alumninized tubular heat exchanger plus the 10-yaer replacement warranty apply to the GPG13 Series unit?

Should we use the newer R410a or stick with the R-22? The American Standard contractor recommends the R410a. The Trane contracctor recommends the R-22.

We would really appreciate any help you could provide in helping us understand the differences between the units inside the box!

[r22jjc]

ruud.

[mark beiser]

I'm kind of partial to Trane since thats all I sell, but They are all good units.

Trane uses spark ignition in the XL13c, so no hot surface ignitor to fail.

If looks matter, depends on unit location, the Trane XL13c is far and away the better looking unit.
It also has the best service access to all components. ;)

The American Standard 2/4YCX3 is the exact same unit as the Trane XL13c.

[Edited by mark beiser on 10-26-2006 at 11:55 PM]

[jon99]

Hi r22jjc,

Thanks for your reply. Why do you think the Ruud is the better choice? Thanks!

[jon99]

Hi Mark,

Thanks for the reply! The Trane XL13c and the American Standard YCX are our 2 top choices. We agree that those two units are the most attractive. One of the other features we really liked was the low noise factor. I'm glad you pointed out the difference about the direct spark ignition. That's important.

Do you prefer R-410a or R-22?

[BaldLoonie]

The idea of stainless HX is great because in a gas pack, it is in the cold air supply and don't last long. On the Rheem/Ruud, it is an option so the dealer would have to buy it that way. Amana & Trane say it is standard. True that with an extended warranty, you wouldn't have to pay for the repair in that period. Just the hassle of having it done.


As for compressors, couldn't see much info. The Ruud will be a Copeland scroll. Most Trane split 13s use recips, not sure what the packaged units use. Amana & Goodman don't say.

[htrguy]

RUUD sells an RQPW that is a 14 SEER Dual Fuel (Hybred Heat for Carrier washed) package unit that comes standard with a stainless steal heat exchanger. You get heat pump and gas heat with the option of selecting whats the best/most efficient. Reliability is in that if the heat pump goes out gas heat will kick in or vise versa. They're R-410A units. They also use x-13 motors that let the blower ramp up slow. Very quiet.

[Edited by htrguy on 10-27-2006 at 09:14 AM]

[cphc]

Ruud/Rheem Very reliable in the field. We've had very few failures on the new equipment.

[jon99]

Hi BaldLoonie!

Thanks for the information! The stainless steel heat exchanger is a must have component then. The American Standard/Trane also have stainless steel burners.

[jon99]

Hi htrguy,

That's an option we didn't know about. Thanks for the information! The point you made about the reliability of the heat pump system, b/c of the backup heat, clearly fulfills the criteria of not having to worry about heat failure during the winter.

[jon99]

Hi cphc,

A builder friend of mine also recommended the RUUD over the other systems based on his experience using them in the quality homes he builds along with Rheem water heaters. Thanks for your reply!

[RoBoTeq]

Pick the contractor you like trust the most and let them install what they recommend.

If efficiencies, features and warranties are about equal, the contractor is the only thing that makes a difference. A contractor is always going to be partial to the brand that is best supported by the wholesaler that contractor buys from.

[jon99]

Hello RoBoTeq,

Thanks for your reply! We began the process perhaps a little differently than most people. We were fortunate enough to know of 4 excellent contractors. Any one of them will do a great job. We trust each of them. Perhaps that's why the choice is so difficult.

We felt that we could use some expert help in teasing out the differences between the four recommendations. The replies of the very knowledgeable people on this board have helped us to understand more about the differences between the four bids and the different systems they recommended. We are very grateful to everyone who replied to our post.