Out of State General Contractors and Subs.....go home.

[Six]

I live in Houston where unlike the rest of the Country we're experiencing quite the economic boom due to people with money moving from bankrupt states calling our huge sprawling city home now.

We're also seeing a large influx of contractors, general contractors and workers come in and take Construction work away from the local Contractors and GC's.

Last week during the commissioning of 9 VAV's for a build out done by a California GC I got to listen to the GC and his workers whine about the heat and humidity and pine for their bankrupt home city in California while atop a six foot ladder with a mini-mag light in my teeth.

45 minutes of it and that was all that I could take. Most guys here no me well enough to know that I can't resist a good fight.....uhm debate...so I finally told them "well why don't you go back .....now ?"

I DO try to consider a certain level of professionalism which usually stops my mouth from over-riding my intelligence when on a job sight but this was weird.

It was like an out of body experience, a reflex that I had no more control over than my reflex to take my next breath. For a half second I almost looked around to see who was so bold to say something like that to the GC and 6 of his employees.

Just little ole' me. :grin2:

Realizing what I just started I climbed off my ladder and walked up to the GC and looked him in the eyes from about 2 feet away. ( This is a psychological tactic I learned to do years ago to actually defuse a confrontation....) Believe it or not it works.

Not in a threatening way, not even angry, just look directly in to their eyes with a slight grin with all the confidence in the world and it will usually cause them to retreat to a defensive posture psychologically and some times physically.

Anyway after the expected awkward pause he responded " cuz there aint no money there" to which I replied " Who's fault is that " ???

We wen't back and forth for a few minutes with some of his guys chiming in their expected responses....Californian GC's ( I know what they're going to say before they start their sentence..and finally I explained WHY Houston still has an economy, and a good one.

Point being Texas and Houston is attracting out of state residents, businesses and money because of our Conservative approach to taxes and giving corporations and small businesses incentives.

BUT our Company and others like us are starting to campaign to give local contractors, subs or General Contractors first shot even if they're the high bid and it's also starting to filter up to the larger businesses and corporations.

We here had nothing to do with the mess your State is in financially.

You people elected your liberal politicians who don't have the two brains cells to rub together to realize low taxes, NO STATE INCOME TAX and incentives for Companies that relocate here is how you increase revenues..... NOT taxing the holy hell out your residents, passing restrictive draconian regulations and passing out social services to every illegal that crosses your borders like they're door prizes.

DUH...

What's worse than a Californian native relocating to Texas ???? A Michigan native..

We hired a helper...no HVAC experience, just a mule a month out of Michigan who felt the need to inform me while we were setting 10 new package units with that adorable "accent"....*sigh* that " Texas sucked, but it's where the money's at..." GRRRR....

I fired him....Lol ! Yep just "You're fired get your sh** and go" and I don't even head up OUR construction Crew, I'm our Companies Service Manager AND I run Commercial service calls.

I let him crawl off the roof and talk to our Construction manager and of course he was "rehired", I don't have the authority to let run those guys off.

Our Construction Manager called me 30 minutes later while I was installing a pneumatic receiver controller in one of the package units and it went something like this.....

CM: Chris, ( My name ) Did you fire Phillip ?
Me: Yes, Yes I did.
CM: Can I ask Why ?? ( knowing I had no authority but for the sake of conversation.)
Me: He Slandered our Great State, said "Texas sucks but it where the money's at"
CM: HE SAID THAT ??!!!
Me: Yup
CM: Ok, I'll take care of it. I have some duct wrap with his name on it.

Point is Texans are very proud of our State. If you have to move here be respectful to the natives.

I'm at least 8th generation Texan BTW with Comanche Indian mix.

If you're a out of State Contractor or Sub or General Contractor we didn't screw up your State economy so DO UNDERSTAND if you're treated like interlopers when you come in to Texas and undercut Texas Contractors.

[printer2]

You don't get it do you? This freedom for companies to move to a location where they have a lower cost structure from, say, California. It also comes with the same freedom for people in California to move to the same location as those companies. And you want to get the contract even if you have a higher bid? That is unreal, almost sounds like a liberal idea.

[classical]

You don't get it do you? This freedom for companies to move to a location where they have a lower cost structure from, say, California. It also comes with the same freedom for people in California to move to the same location as those companies. And you want to get the contract even if you have a higher bid? That is unreal, almost sounds like a liberal idea.

Sorry Printer but on this one you cannot have a clue it is A TEXAS THING. This has happened many times over the years the worst was in the late 70's early 80's when the rust belt crumbled.

We had this kid from Mich. go to work for us he was worthless lazy as hell and dumb as a brick, came down in his rust bucket GM car with his Union work ethic and just could not cut it. He came to work one day and I had a hangans noose hanging from the ceiling he asked what it was (Yankee Nectie) he quit that week. I was going to fire him anyway and I did have the authority.

[Tool-Slinger]

It is not like Texans do not like californians canadians yankees okies mexicans and others. But it is annoying to hear people here from other places here for a better job b1+ching about Texas and reciting how good things are where they came from.

Firstly, it sounds wimpy. Secondly, it is kind of insulting. Immigrants need to either assimilate or go back to where they came from.

"when in rome, do as the romans do" .

I am saying this as an immigrant, I was actually born and raised in Oklahoma but have basically spent my adult life in Texas. Texas is a great state and has been good to me. I have heard people come here and complain about the heat, complain about lack of government aid, complain about racism which I think is a false accusation as Texans are about the nicest folks you will ever meet, and just generally praise other places. I am easy. OKAY, go back there to your utopia and stop complaining about Texas. Idiots.

As for personal heritage if it matters, my ancestors were among the first in Texas, when it still was a Mexican state, relocated from Tennessee.

[Elfshadow]

Six, from a former upstate New Yorker, who has watch his home state crumble under its state taxes, think it passed california, good for you.

Printer, he is not complaining about their freedom to move, hes complaining about their attutide.

[printer2]

I have no problem with telling some jerk that his attitude would be better served elsewhere. What I was commenting on was Six's belief that a state can undercut another state to lure companies there but when they are there they should be required to take the home grown talent even if the bid is higher.

[printer2]

Six, from a former upstate New Yorker, who has watch his home state crumble under its state taxes, think it passed california, good for you.

Printer, he is not complaining about their freedom to move, hes complaining about their attutide.

I did not have a problem with that part as you can see I never even commented on it. It was this part that I found ironic. If the companies that are moving there did the same, well they would not have moved there.


BUT our Company and others like us are starting to campaign to give local contractors, subs or General Contractors first shot even if they're the high bid and it's also starting to filter up to the larger businesses and corporations.

[Elfshadow]

I did not have a problem with that part as you can see I never even commented on it. It was this part that I found ironic. If the companies that are moving there did the same, well they would not have moved there.

As long as they are not trying to get the state or local governments to regulate that, that is those businesses decision. One of the main reasons texas is booming is because they do have pride in their state, so it makes sense that alot of them would want locals making money before people that are just showing up for the money. I would be nice if more states had that type of pride. It makes sense from a business sense as well, if they don't keep the money in local hands, it leaves the state, and local spending falls, which will destory their local economy. Its a big part of whats wrong in the united states at the moment. People don't make enough money to pay off their debts, thus they can't afford to buy new items, which causes a stagnat economy.

[printer2]

As long as they are not trying to get the state or local governments to regulate that, that is those businesses decision. One of the main reasons texas is booming is because they do have pride in their state, so it makes sense that alot of them would want locals making money before people that are just showing up for the money. I would be nice if more states had that type of pride. It makes sense from a business sense as well, if they don't keep the money in local hands, it leaves the state, and local spending falls, which will destory their local economy. Its a big part of whats wrong in the united states at the moment. People don't make enough money to pay off their debts, thus they can't afford to buy new items, which causes a stagnat economy.

I understand all that. But basically Texas is trying to undercut other states to lure the wealth there. And when the wealth leaves the other states there is great incentive for those without a job to follow where it went.

[Tool-Slinger]

I understand all that. But basically Texas is trying to undercut other states to lure the wealth there. And when the wealth leaves the other states there is great incentive for those without a job to follow where it went.

How so? By not taxing every business move to death??? You say that as if there is something wrong with that, are you saying something is wrong with that?

Texas has a great business environment. It works. I don't understand the hostility.

[Tool-Slinger]

I have no problem with telling some jerk that his attitude would be better served elsewhere. What I was commenting on was Six's belief that a state can undercut another state to lure companies there but when they are there they should be required to take the home grown talent even if the bid is higher.

Texas policies are not made to lure anybody here. Policies are made for maximum function, even though Texas is also over-regulated in my opinion. We have our own businesses to do our own stuff. If out of state businesses want to come here for work they are welcome to do so,.. but they and employees need to pack the attitude.

Love it or leave it, don't just come here for money and whine about how much you hate it here.

I just don't understand people sometimes. But that is rude.

[printer2]

How so? By not taxing every business move to death??? You say that as if there is something wrong with that, are you saying something is wrong with that?

Texas has a great business environment. It works. I don't understand the hostility.

Not hostility, but I guess it is a more family view of a nation. Cutting taxes is not a bad thing, my country has been on that path for some time now. It is more a comment of it is OK to take money in from other parts of the US but don't think about moving here. Actually had a thought as I went out to buy groceries. You know the bad rap Americans have across the world for being rude and obnoxious? Well it might have been these Californian types that seem to rub just about anyone the wrong way spoiling it for the rest of you. I can't say for sure as I only spent a day there but was in Texas for a couple of weeks. Absolutely nothing bad to say about that state. I will say one thing though, when it pours it really pours.

[Six]

You don't get it do you? This freedom for companies to move to a location
where they have a lower cost structure from, say, California. It also comes with the same freedom for people in California to move to the same location as those companies. And you want to get the contract even if you have a higher bid? That is unreal, almost sounds like a liberal idea.

Sorry print but it has more to do

[Tool-Slinger]

Not hostility, but I guess it is a more family view of a nation. Cutting taxes is not a bad thing, my country has been on that path for some time now. It is more a comment of it is OK to take money in from other parts of the US but don't think about moving here. Actually had a thought as I went out to buy groceries. You know the bad rap Americans have across the world for being rude and obnoxious? Well it might have been these Californian types that seem to rub just about anyone the wrong way spoiling it for the rest of you. I can't say for sure as I only spent a day there but was in Texas for a couple of weeks. Absolutely nothing bad to say about that state. I will say one thing though, when it pours it really pours.

I may misunderstand, but Texas is a net contributor and not taking from other states.

[Six]

You don't get it do you? This freedom for companies to move to a location
where they have a lower cost structure from, say, California. It also comes with the same freedom for people in California to move to the same location as those companies. And you want to get the contract even if you have a higher bid? That is unreal, almost sounds like a liberal idea.

No Print, you dont get it. I can give a very detailed explanation as to why the liberal approach of high taxes and burdensome regulations has cost the State of California so many jobs.

But there is more to it than bidding wars and the right to relocate to which ever part of the Nation that currently has an economy.

This is really an issue of culture and of politics. You out of all people should recognize that.

When a mindset moves into your area and threatens to take away bussiness from the local Contractors and also threatens to inject a political narrative that has proven to be economically destructive we as Texans who have decided on a Conservative approach to running an economy have every right to be defensive and watch out for our own.

Out of the 4 Californian GCs Ive run into 3 lived in California, had their store front in California and were only here with their crews to underbid the locals and get their foot into the door.

Also from a HVAC standpoint they're not too bright.

NO !! Swamp coolers and economizers dont work in Houston and if you're going to bid a 5 ton unit for a 1300 sq foot space dont pump in make up air off a 130 degree roof through a 14" duct straight into the return.

We have a culture war in America and the future of our great Nation depends on the outcome.

I can see why the resident Canadian might think that a liberal approach is the way to go but honestly I consider it a cancer.

A Cancer that has to be rooted so the redt of our Nation doesn't end up like California.

Hey Print ask the Californians here about their gas dilema. Amost 6 bux a gallon and stations are closing.

We have every right to vet these contractors as local guys struggle while out of state visitors come in and low bid their way into our State.

[bigtime]

No Print, you dont get it. I can give a very detailed explanation as to why the liberal approach of high taxes and burdensome regulations has cost the State of California so many jobs.

But there is more to it than bidding wars and the right to relocate to which ever part of the Nation that currently has an economy.

This is really an issue of culture and of politics. You out of all people should recognize that.

When a mindset moves into your area and threatens to take away bussiness from the local Contractors and also threatens to inject a political narrative that has proven to be economically destructive we as Texans who have decided on a Conservative approach to running an economy have every right to be defensive and watch out for our own.

Out of the 4 Californian GCs Ive run into 3 lived in California, had their store front in California and were only here with their crews to underbid the locals and get their foot into the door.

Also from a HVAC standpoint they're not too bright.

NO !! Swamp coolers and economizers dont work in Houston and if you're going to bid a 5 ton unit for a 1300 sq foot space dont pump in make up air off a 130 degree roof through a 14" duct straight into the return.

We have a culture war in America and the future of our great Nation depends on the outcome.

I can see why the resident Canadian might think that a liberal approach is the way to go but honestly I consider it a cancer.

A Cancer that has to be rooted so the redt of our Nation doesn't end up like California.

Hey Print ask the Californians here about their gas dilema. Amost 6 bux a gallon and stations are closing.

We have every right to vet these contractors as local guys struggle while out of state visitors come in and low bid their way into our State.

Kind of ironic. Yins are busy because out of state folk are moving to your state, but your complaining cause out of state contractors are bidding on the work.:whistle:

[Tool-Slinger]

Kind of ironic. Yins are busy because out of state folk are moving to your state, but your complaining cause out of state contractors are bidding on the work.:whistle:

In state businesses are thriving, not newbie imports from other states, out of state contractors and workers are coming here as a result. We are not thriving because out of state workers and contractors are coming here.

[bb]

Six you must understand that Liberals are like locust. They vote Democratic who bankrupt the state (eat up the harvest of their state) and then move to the prosperous Conservative states to destroy them in the same manner.

[printer2]

I may misunderstand, but Texas is a net contributor and not taking from other states.

Depends on how you look at it. If companies up and move from one state to another with low taxes or a relaxed business environment, then the products they sell to the people in the other states flow to them. I did not mean to imply Texas is getting money from the other states, sorry for the confusion.

[printer2]

No Print, you dont get it. I can give a very detailed explanation as to why the liberal approach of high taxes and burdensome regulations has cost the State of California so many jobs.

But there is more to it than bidding wars and the right to relocate to which ever part of the Nation that currently has an economy.

This is really an issue of culture and of politics. You out of all people should recognize that.

When a mindset moves into your area and threatens to take away bussiness from the local Contractors and also threatens to inject a political narrative that has proven to be economically destructive we as Texans who have decided on a Conservative approach to running an economy have every right to be defensive and watch out for our own.

Out of the 4 Californian GCs Ive run into 3 lived in California, had their store front in California and were only here with their crews to underbid the locals and get their foot into the door.

Also from a HVAC standpoint they're not too bright.

NO !! Swamp coolers and economizers dont work in Houston and if you're going to bid a 5 ton unit for a 1300 sq foot space dont pump in make up air off a 130 degree roof through a 14" duct straight into the return.

We have a culture war in America and the future of our great Nation depends on the outcome.

I can see why the resident Canadian might think that a liberal approach is the way to go but honestly I consider it a cancer.

A Cancer that has to be rooted so the redt of our Nation doesn't end up like California.

Hey Print ask the Californians here about their gas dilema. Amost 6 bux a gallon and stations are closing.

We have every right to vet these contractors as local guys struggle while out of state visitors come in and low bid their way into our State.

Actually I do understand a difference in culture and politics, it is the same thing with us when a Quebec company comes out west here to bid on work. And the same things apply, we have operating conditions that are specific to the region and certain methods that work other places do not function well here. We have a roof that periodically needs to be de-iced in the winter, guys with axes chopping at the roof (tell me that is a good thing) because the heat recovery coil sucks all the heat out of the exhaust air and rather than harmlessly returning to the atmosphere ends up in a rock hard mess.

http://i406.photobucket.com/albums/pp142/printer2_photo/ARP/SR.jpg

As far as being liberal, does it not really come down to supply and demand what the price companies set for their services? In the land of free markets I would think so. If there are less companies to bid on the work the price goes up and with competition the price goes down. We had provincial barriers here to keep outside companies from bidding on jobs or workers from taking work in other parts of the country. It increased the cost to businesses and they complained how can we have a free trade deal with the U.S. but not have free trade across Canada? How will you be able to compete with China if you increase costs by only allowing local companies to win bids with their higher prices? While the quality of work and the ability to do the job are things to keep in consideration I am not sure if it is in your nation's best interest to limit trade between your states. Might be good for the individual states though.

[hearthman]

Mexicans infested America because it was better than what they had. Simple physics really, like hot to cold, high pressure to low pressure, etc. People will tend to gravitate towards greener pastures, even when those pastures have longhorn cattle and feral hogs loose. ;-)

People are free to move across state lines in the US (for now). However, what was revealed here is the death of work ethic in this country. The Great Society has destroyed a man's ability to work hard, be honest, be conscientitious and resourceful, and actually give a damn about his performance all without begrudging the boss at the top and being content with his paycheck and socio-economic status. I call it "unionitis" but it centers around being selfish, envious and never satisfied with anything while expecting everything yet giving little in return.

If you want to relocate to Texas, blend into society, respect their customs and tradition, respect your fellow man and be content at doing a really good job, I'd say 'go'. If you can't, stay in the armpit you're currently living in. Thank God Texas has as many liberals as it does. If they really fixed all the corruption and insanity by gettign rid of these policies, the place would look at NY City, LA, and Frisco all in one from the mass immigration and it would ruin a flower. So, aside from wheel chocks, liberals can serve a useful purpose.

Six, I strongly suggest your company market itself by distinguishing itself from this so called competition. Advertise you are a traditional Texas company with Texan values and will hire only people who reside in Texas and respect their local customs, traditions and reflect those work ethics.

[supertek65]

This is kinda funny to me!

Every single big project in kansas city.
Texas companies end up getting about half.

For 5 years we had 500 texans working at iatan.

I would guess we have tens of thousands of texan workers here every day.

I just figured there was no work there?

I dont really care and never thought about it????

Funny how many texas longhorn shirts hats and license plates you see on big jobs.

[corny]

Eating up the harvest one place and moving on to greener pastures is capitalism.... Stopping those cali and yankee business from coming to texas and taking your work would be anti capitalist.

Do better quality work than them is all I can say.....

Or get you some axe handles and pay them a visit when they are coming out of the bars.....

[exreo]

I talked with a fellow who works at my local Kroger store here in Ft. Worth, TX a couple nights ago. He works night shift stocking shelves. He had been there 3 years, and he was leaving. He described to me how brutal Kroger's treats their employees both at the store he works at and especially at the distribution warehouse just up I-35 in Keller, TX. He said at the warehouse, they have to pull X amount of stock per shift (measured in square feet I think) or they are fired immediately after their shift is over. This is how employees are being treated now as we live in a very tight economy. Everything has gotten cut throat and the completitionf or jobs is intense. Mexicans are getting a lot of them--both legal and illegal. Wal Mart treats their people the same way. Ever notice Wal Mart stockers at night? They are busting tail man or they get in trouble. It was not like this when I first moved to Ft. Worth in 1979.

[classical]

I talked with a fellow who works at my local Kroger store here in Ft. Worth, TX a couple nights ago. He works night shift stocking shelves. He had been there 3 years, and he was leaving. He described to me how brutal Kroger's treats their employees both at the store he works at and especially at the distribution warehouse just up I-35 in Keller, TX. He said at the warehouse, they have to pull X amount of stock per shift (measured in square feet I think) or they are fired immediately after their shift is over. This is how employees are being treated now as we live in a very tight economy. Everything has gotten cut throat and the completitionf or jobs is intense. Mexicans are getting a lot of them--both legal and illegal. Wal Mart treats their people the same way. Ever notice Wal Mart stockers at night? They are busting tail man or they get in trouble. It was not like this when I first moved to Ft. Worth in 1979.

I fail to see the problem when you take on job their are standards that you must maintain if not good-bye and that is how it should be. The last thing we need is a union mentality that allows you to lolly-gag around and not produce but retain your job. I do not think illegal workers should be hired but having to hustle on the job is a standard that should be applied universally.

I have canned many a tech and installer that had a cavalier work ethic!!!!!!!!!

[netsalt]

Just keep in mind when you move to Texas - "It's a whole nother country" just like the commercial says.

[exreo]

I fail to see the problem when you take on job their are standards that you must maintain if not good-bye and that is how it should be. The last thing we need is a union mentality that allows you to lolly-gag around and not produce but retain your job. I do not think illegal workers should be hired but having to hustle on the job is a standard that should be applied universally.

I have canned many a tech and installer that had a cavalier work ethic!!!!!!!!!

These folks I'm talking about are strong and intelligent. They are good workers, but they say it is almost impossible to do what is required of them every night. They are asked to do 11 hours of work in 8 hours. Employers are demanding more of their employees in this economy because the employers know they have the upper hand with jobs being so tight. I have a friend of mine in the HVAC business, and he does say it is hard to find good help. I don't know why that is in the HVAC field. I've seen some really crappy installs too. BTW, how many illegals do you have working for you?

[classical]

Double post

[classical]

How do you determine an eleven hour work workload compared to an eight hour are you in the Grocery business are you an efficiency expert.

Over the years I have found very few that measured up to my work ethic or stamina.

I do not hire illegal's, have never tolerated them in any company I have worked for I do not even allow them on the crews that do my yard work.

[DeltaT]

Am I the only one here that picked up the real problem?

"Our Construction Manager called me 30 minutes later while I was installing a pneumatic receiver controller in one of the package units and it went something like this....."

A pnuematic receiver controller on a package unit!

[Six]

Am I the only one here that picked up the real
problem?

"Our Construction Manager called me 30 minutes later while I was installing a pneumatic receiver controller in one of the package units and it went something like this....."

A pnuematic receiver controller on a package unit!

Ha ! Someone picked up on that. I'll explain.

Large 25 ton package units w/o VFD option connected to VAVs with side pocket heaters.

Pnuematic reciever controller re-used from old unit to control static by outputting branch signal to dump damper.

[corny]

and take those dang munsters with you.....

[corny]

^^^ Just working on the old post count.

[supertek65]

ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!



^^^ Just working on the old post count.

[precision hvac]

Oh, how ironic.
During the Reagan era, when new construction was booming here, The floodgates opened for out-of-state contractors.
I don't remember whining about out-of state contractors taking our jobs then.