Inverter/variable speed compressors

[mhitim]

This technology really seems to be the way to go. Do you all agree? The problem is I can't seem to find many companies using it in their residential, full size AC systems.

I am aware of the Nordyne stuff in Maytag, Broan, Westinghouse and the like but I am hesitant to bet on these "lesser" known HVAC manufacturers. Plus they only offer it in heat pumos and only in 4 ton or less. I just discovered that Emerson has introduced the Copeland Scroll Variable Speed but nobody seems to offer it yet.

I am not too keen on heat pumps, which is another question to sort out so can anyone list the manufacturers that are using or about to introduce AC units with this technology?

[BaldLoonie]

Carrier has the scroll technology in a heat pump, I'd guess A/C coming soon. Nordyne has it in cooling only too using a Panasonic rotary.

[hvacvegas]

Some people would say that inverters were tried, and failed in convential systems in the past.

[joemach]

This technology really seems to be the way to go. Do you all agree? The problem is I can't seem to find many companies using it in their residential, full size AC systems.

I am aware of the Nordyne stuff in Maytag, Broan, Westinghouse and the like but I am hesitant to bet on these "lesser" known HVAC manufacturers. Plus they only offer it in heat pumos and only in 4 ton or less. I just discovered that Emerson has introduced the Copeland Scroll Variable Speed but nobody seems to offer it yet.

I am not too keen on heat pumps, which is another question to sort out so can anyone list the manufacturers that are using or about to introduce AC units with this technology?

Carrier/Bryant will be coming out with their version of the inverter in June or July of this year. I am sure that others will be following suite. But I do believe they are heat pump only.

Mitsubishi and other ductless manufacturers have ducted models that are quite efficient and are air conditioning only. Also their technology has the advantage of being time tested. The new guys entering that market have no track record.

Not sure if it is true or not, but I heard that Nordyne had a major recall on their inverter systems. Maybe someone can confirm this.

[comfortdoc]

Carrier Greenspeed and Bryant Extreme are available now Joe. Both are inverter driven heatpumps.

[mhitim]

Do you thinkk a heat pump, especially either the Greenspeed or Extreme would be the best choice for the climate near Sacramento, CA? Winter lows in the mid 30s with an occasional dip into the 20s and summer highs in the mid to high 90s with 7 - 10 days over 100. Low humidity and cool nights where I live (I use a whole house fan very effectively all summer).

[wahoo]

Not from that area, but the temps sound about ideal for a heat pump!:.02:

[comfortdoc]

When designed and installed properly the Greenspeed system gets very close to full nominal capacity at 17°F in high speed. Based on what you posted it would be ideal for your climate, but someone needs to do load and sizing calculations as well as duct assesment.

[Shophound]

I once lived in Roseville, near Sacramento. Those nightly delta breezes sure could take the edge off the hot days!

I would weigh the operating cost of natural gas, if it's available in your neighborhood, vs. the cost of operating a heat pump in winter. I remember California electric rates being high. Sacramento does not get real cold but I remember it taking awhile before the weather got really hot. So the heating season, just to take the chill out of the house, could extend into the spring a bit.

[mhitim]

I buy my electricity from the Sacramento Metropolitan Utility District (SMUD) at $0.17/KwH and even though that is expensive it is one third the cost of PG&E in my area. The real question is how do I determine if a heat pump at $0.17/KwH is more or less cost effective than using natural gas for heat? Of course if the price of electricity goes up, which it most certainly will especially relative to NG, am I painting myself into a corner?

Do you all agree that there are no ducted AC units out there that use true variable speed compressors? Are there any being talked about for release in the near future?

[beenthere]

At 17 cents per KWH, and a COP of 3. Your nat gas would have cost more then $1.58 per therm for a heat pump to be cheaper to use.

[duckman06]

Carrier Greenspeed and Bryant Extreme are available now Joe. Both are inverter driven heatpumps.

Comfortdoc... Is correct! While I am not a carrier dealer a good friend of mine is. I saw the greenspeed in action and I was impressed by how quiet it was. I remember when some other companies tried this in years past without very much luck. So the idea was put to the weight side. Now that carrier has started to use it again, I will be curious to see how it works out.


You can beat your last dollar that if this systems work good that the other big name brand HVAC companys will start to work on there on version again. I am a Trane dealer and remember when the comfort link t-stat came out that could control many things in your home along with the temp. In your homes. That all others jumped on board and made there own version.


Our sales rep. For Trane said due to the tax credits being gone, the housing market going in the toilet, and the economy being bad for us to expect customers to start wanting to go back to budget grade 13 seer equipment. The problem with that is that we have not seen this and people are excited with new tech. And are wanting it installed with 15-16 seer being the average.

So again, I am glad to see carrier take a Stand and make this system. I hope after all the bugs are worked out that all others will follow. Now the next thing is to have techs that have the proper training to work on this systems.

[joemach]

Carrier Greenspeed and Bryant Extreme are available now Joe. Both are inverter driven heatpumps.

I now work for a Carrier dealer, used to work for a Bryant dealer. Was told their inverter systems will not be available till June or July. Also I have not seen any installs with these units or worked on any.

I always shy away from manufacturer's first version of stuff.

My personal opinion is that since not no one I know has worked on them or installed them, go with the proven technology of Mitsubishi. Or go with a standard system if you already have duct owrk.

[comfortdoc]

I now work for a Carrier dealer, used to work for a Bryant dealer. Was told their inverter systems will not be available till June or July. Also I have not seen any installs with these units or worked on any.

I always shy away from manufacturer's first version of stuff.

My personal opinion is that since not no one I know has worked on them or installed them, go with the proven technology of Mitsubishi. Or go with a standard system if you already have duct owrk.

PM your contact info Joe. I have some info for you about the systems.

[woody19]

We have sold/installed several of the Carrier inverter units since last year and now Bryant has them available also. Every one of them has performed very well and the customers have been thrilled. The only issue I have heard about them is in areas where there is "dirty" voltage and it is sensed by the controls and shuts the unit down. There is a bulletin out to correct this although it isnt a problem with the unit itself but the provided electricity.

[hvac21]

Not sure if it is true or not, but I heard that Nordyne had a major recall on their inverter systems. Maybe someone can confirm this.

As a NORDYNE insider, I can positively say that this is NOT true.

[joemach]

As a NORDYNE insider, I can positively say that this is NOT true.

I did not mean to bash the brand. Just something my boss (at the time) said a few months ago.

So can you tell me the status of the Nordyne inverter system. Why is it not better known or heard of? The inverter technology is to compressors what ECM is to blower motors.

Please let us know what is up with this technology. I am very interested.

[jpsmith1cm]

HVAC/R-Wizard

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[hvacvegas]

I did not mean to bash the brand. Just something my boss (at the time) said a few months ago.

So can you tell me the status of the Nordyne inverter system. Why is it not better known or heard of? The inverter technology is to compressors what ECM is to blower motors.

Please let us know what is up with this technology. I am very interested.

I went and got "greenspeed certified", specifically so we could sell them.

We haven't put one in yet, probably for the same reason nordyne doesn't move alot of inverters.
Price.